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SEEKER55
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« on: June 08, 2009, 07:37:19 AM »

On one hand there is The Theory of Evolution - all about Science with no interest in God or religion.
On the other hand we have Intelligent Design – all about God and religion with a tiny interest in Science.
Both are extreme positions, totally opposite, with each side despising the other. What if BOTH are wrong?


Maybe this could be called the Theory of Creationist Evolution.

In the beginning God created the Universe in what is called The Big Bang.
After billions of years, a star formed on the edge of the Milky Way Galaxy called The Sun.
Eventually a planet formed around the Sun called The Earth.
God saw that it was PERFECT and when conditions were just right He initiated the Spark that created Life.
After carefully guiding the progression of life for billions of years, He saw that it had reached the desired result, Man; who was given a gift by God - The Soul.



Perhaps the Bible is not as historically accurate as most people believe.

from Ha'aretz Magazine, Friday, October 29, 1999
Following 70 years of intensive excavations in the Land of Israel, archaeologists have found out: The patriarchs' acts are legendary stories, we did not sojourn in Egypt or make an exodus, we did not conquer the land. Neither is there any mention of the empire of David and Solomon. Those who take an interest have known these facts for years, but Israel is a stubborn people and doesn't want to hear about it
This is what archaeologists have learned from their excavations in the Land of Israel: the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the God of Israel, YHWH, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai.

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog teaches in the Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Studies at Tel Aviv University. He took part in the excavations of Hazor and Megiddo with Yigael Yadin and in the digs at Tel Arad and Tel Be'er Sheva with Yohanan Aharoni. He has conducted digs at Tel Michal and Tel Gerisa and has recently begun digging at Tel Yaffo. He is the author of books on the city gate in Palestine and its neighbors and on two excavations, and has written a book summing up the archaeology of the ancient city.
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« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2009, 01:14:24 PM »

The Theory of Evolution, which is quite true, is not the same as Intelligent Design.
Evolution really makes no statement about Abiogenesis.
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« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2009, 01:14:24 PM »

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« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2009, 05:23:33 PM »

Perhaps the Bible is not as historically accurate as most people believe.

from Ha'aretz Magazine, Friday, October 29, 1999
Following 70 years of intensive excavations in the Land of Israel, archaeologists have found out: The patriarchs' acts are legendary stories, we did not sojourn in Egypt or make an exodus, we did not conquer the land. Neither is there any mention of the empire of David and Solomon. Those who take an interest have known these facts for years, but Israel is a stubborn people and doesn't want to hear about it
This is what archaeologists have learned from their excavations in the Land of Israel: the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the God of Israel, YHWH, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai.

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog teaches in the Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Studies at Tel Aviv University. He took part in the excavations of Hazor and Megiddo with Yigael Yadin and in the digs at Tel Arad and Tel Be'er Sheva with Yohanan Aharoni. He has conducted digs at Tel Michal and Tel Gerisa and has recently begun digging at Tel Yaffo. He is the author of books on the city gate in Palestine and its neighbors and on two excavations, and has written a book summing up the archaeology of the ancient city.
Am I the only one who'd like a little more bibliography on some of those claims?
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« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2009, 08:53:33 PM »

Did you want to defend the article or just your initial post?

And thanks for posting it. Smile
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SEEKER55
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« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2009, 10:25:53 PM »

The New Old Testament
by John Blanton

Scientist have gone head-to-head with creationists on the matter of Genesis for two hundred years. For a long time it has been apparent the first story in the Bible just does not add up. Neither does the second biblical story, Exodus, according to James Cunliffe.
James Cunliffe has a Ph.D. in geology from Rutgers University, and he dabbles in archeology. He has previously lectured on the "rock wall" that gave Rockwall, Texas, its name. At the July NTS meeting he explained what has been talked around in archeological circles for years and is now popping up in the popular press. Not only is the story of the escape of the Jews from Egypt a myth, but there is no evidence there was ever such a large number (in the order of 600,000) of ancient Jews in the land of the Nile, much less as slaves building the pyramids.
Daniel Lazare has recapitulated the current status of the story in the March issue of Harpers. 1 The gist of the July lecture was taken from that essay.
The traditional story of the Bible has the world being created about 6000 years ago and being destroyed by a world-wide flood a few hundred years later. Only eight people were saved from the flood, and they restarted the human race from the region of Mount Ararat in Turkey. A tribal leader named Abraham brought his people into what is now Israel and Palestine from Mesopotamia (land between the rivers), in what is modern Iraq. Thence there was a migration into Egypt where the ancient Hebrews worked as slaves for about 500 years before quitting and returning to Canaan (Israel/Palestine), where they had to conquer the Canaanites to get back in. Subsequently, the Hebrew tribes split into Israel in the north and the powerful kingdom of Judah to the south. Israel was conquered by the Assyrians in 722 BCE, and Judah was conquered by the Babylonians in 586 BCE Only Judah survived after a period of enslavement, and modern Judaism derived from the history of those people.
But it ain't necessarily so. Here are a few of the points of contention raised by recent archeological studies:

Use of camels. Abraham sent out a servant with camels to find a wife for his son, Isaac. This was about 2100 to 1800 BCE Actually, camels were not much used for transport in this area until after 1000 BCE

Isaac and Abimelech. Abimelech was king of the Philistines, and Isaac sought help from him, which could not be much later than 1800 BCE Problem is, there were no Philistines present until after 1200 BCE

Heshbon and Edom. Hebrews fought King Sihon at Heshbon and also the king of Edom. But these two cities did not exist at the time of the supposed battles.

Forty years in the Sinai. Archeologists cannot find any trace of such a large number of people living in the Sinai during the time the Jews were supposed to be wandering or camped there.

Invasion of Canaan. There is no indication of an invasion. It appears "a distinctive Israelite culture arose locally around 1200 BCE as nomadic shepherds and goatherds ceased their wanderings and began settling down in the nearby uplands" according to Lazare. 2 The Israelites were there all along and were much like other cultures in the area at that time. They differentiated themselves from the others by abstaining from pork, as evidenced by a lack of pig bones in the archeological digs.

Envy of the hillbillies. Supposedly David and Solomon of Judah built a great civilization and lived lavishly during the time 1005 to 931 BCE and also ruled over the kingdom of Israel to their north. Archeological evidence does not indicate the southern mountain tribes were all that prosperous. Evidence does exist for a prosperous and worldly tribe of Israel, and there is no indication the two nations were ever joined.

In short, it would seem the dominance of Judah was built into the written history after the demise of Israel through the Assyrian conquest. As mentioned previously, Judah survived the Babylonian conquest and went on to write the history.
Lazare is of the opinion the priests of Judah promulgated monotheism as a counter example to the polytheistic Israelites. If you don't want to go the way of the Israelites, you had better toe the party line and stick to the one true god. Yaweh (Jehovah) was the god of one of Solomon's wives, and Solomon made Yaweh the chosen deity and built the now famous temple. A lot of the accepted history seems to have been written to accommodate this result.
Religious adherents, both Jewish and Christian, are not comfortable with these findings. Forget about Genesis. The holy day of Passover is inextricably linked to flight of the Jews from Egypt, and the persecution and execution of Jesus are tied to the Passover celebration. Furthermore, the indication that monotheism appears to be an afterthought to the Jews will be discomforting to some. If Jehovah was just a god picked from a lineup, then who created the world and all the people and the animals? And who was the father of Jesus? God number three from the right?
The historical crises of the Old Testament is not being ignored by the mainstream religions. Many doing this research or otherwise taking it seriously are the pillars of the main faiths affected. In March of this year Rabbi David Wolpe told 2000 worshipers at the Conservative Sinai Temple in Los Angeles that "the way the Bible describes the Exodus is not the way it happened, if it happened at all." 3 His remarks made the front page of The Los Angeles Times. Most naturally, this does not go down well with some other people of faith. Rabbi Ken Spiro and others have responded to this unorthodoxy. According to Spiro:
As a science, we must understand what archaeology is and what it isn't.
Archaeology consists of two components: the excavation of ancient artifacts, and the interpretation of those artifacts. While the excavation component is more of a mechanical skill, the interpretive component is very subjective. Presented with the same artifact, two world-class archaeologists will often come to different conclusions — particularly when ego, politics and religious beliefs enter the equation.
In the subjective field of Biblical Archaeology, anyone making a definitive statement like "archaeology has proven..." has probably chosen to take sides and is not presenting the whole picture. When Los Angeles Times reporter Teresa Watanabe writes that "the rabbi was merely telling his flock what scholars have known for more than a decade" (emphasis added), she is revealing her anti-Biblical bias.
Spiro points out, as others have, that losers don't like to record their disgrace. One argument is that the Egyptians would have been so embarrassed at allowing the Jews to slip out in the middle of the night they would have erased all records of their presence. As Spiro tells it:
The British Museum in London displays inscriptions from the walls of the palace of the Assyrian Emperor, Sancheriv. These show scenes from Sancheriv's military campaigns from the 8th century BCE, including graphic depictions of destroyed enemies (decapitations, impalings, etc.). Sancheriv himself is depicted as larger than life.
But one element is missing from these inscriptions: There are no dead Assyrians! That is consistent with the ancient "historical" style — negative events, failures and flaws are not depicted at all. When a nation suffers an embarrassing defeat, they usually whitewash the mistakes and destroy the evidence.
This idea has significant ramifications for archeology and the Exodus. The last thing the ancient Egyptians wanted to record is the embarrassment of being completely destroyed by the God of a puny slave nation. Would the Egyptians ever want to preserve details of the destruction of fields, flocks, and first borns—plus the death of Pharaoh and the entire Egyptian army at the Red Sea?
In other words, we wouldn't expect to find prominent attention to Moses' humiliation of Pharaoh—even if it occurred.
According to Spiro, we would expect to see the same archeological record whether the Jews were ever in Egypt or not. Makes us wonder how the archeologists ever get anything accomplished. One thing we do know for sure. Historical revisionism was as alive over 2000 years ago as it is today
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SEEKER55
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« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2009, 11:23:21 PM »

HISTORY 1
In 1908 a violent flood ripped through the Paluxy River Valley, near Glen Rose, Texas. The next summer, a local teenager named Ernest "Bull" Adams was wandering in a tributary of the Paluxy called Wheeler Branch, when he came upon a series of large, three-toed footprints in the limestone floor of the creek.
 
HISTORY 2
Around 1910, another local youth named Charlie Moss and his brother Grady were fishing in the Paluxy River itself when they came across a trail of three-toed dinosaur tracks on a limestone shelf, along with a series of even more curious, oblong footprints. Described by Charlie as "giant man tracks," these large, elongate footprints (typically 15-18 inches long) were as yet unknown to geologists, but evidently were soon accepted as genuine human footprints by many of the townspeople. For many years most locals seemed to regard these tracks as minor curiosities evidently not realizing that the immense scientific implications of finding human and dinosaur footprints in the same rocks. Indeed, if confirmed, such a find would dramatically contradict the standard geologic timetable, which holds that dinosaurs became extinct about 65 million years ago, whereas the first human remains are only a few million years old (a gap of over 60 million years). Moreover, the track beds in Glen Rose are now assigned by mainstream geologists to the lower part of the Cretaceous period, at or near the Aptian/Albian boundary, dated at about 113 million years (Young, 1974; Bergan and Pittman, 1990).
 
HISTORY 3
In the 1930's at least one Glen Rose resident, Jim Ryals, began chiseling out dinosaur tracks from the riverbed, and selling them to tourists and passersby (Bird, 1954). Ryals also reportedly cut out some "human" prints, but evidently no one took photographs of them, and their present locations are unknown.
 
HISTORY 4
Around the same time another local resident, George Adams (Ernest Adams’ brother), is known to have carved and sold at least several "giant man tracks" and dinosaur tracks on loose slabs of rock. George's nephew Wayland once even related his uncle's carving technique to a group of creationist researchers, noting that his uncle would start with a suitable sized block already containing a depression, and then carve in human features at his leisure under the shade of a tree (Morris, 1980, p. 110-126). Evidently this technique involved less chance of breakage than chiseling and transporting real tracks from the riverbed, and allowed one to readily add print details that were typically indistinct or lacking on real prints. On the other hand, Adams was evidently handicapped by his limited carving skill; of the several loose "man tracks" which still exist and are generally attributed to him, all show serious anatomic errors, including misplaced ball and arch, and excessively long, misshapen toes.
 
HISTORY 5
In 1938 with help from locals, paleontologist Roland T. Bird, located a number of three-toed dinosaur tracks in the Paluxy riverbed. Although Bird never reported any real human tracks in the Paluxy Riverbed, his writings would inadvertently lead to the spread of the "man track" claims. In one of his articles Bird mentioned the carved "man tracks" that led him to Glen Rose, as well as rumors from locals that "giant man tracks" could be found in the Paluxy riverbed itself. Bird related that when he asked Jim Ryals to show him such tracks in the riverbed, Ryals could only show him a single specimen, which Bird referred to as a "mystery track." Bird described this as, "something about 15 inches long, with a curious elongated heel." Noting that the print was too indistinct to diagnose precisely, Bird suggested that it was made by some "hitherto unknown dinosaur or reptile"
 
HISTORY 6
Among the first creationist advocates of the "man track" claims was Clifford Burdick, who helped found the Deluge Society, one of the first creationist groups in America. After a brief visit to the Paluxy, Burdick published an article in the Seventh Day Adventist magazine, Signs of the Times, proclaiming that the Paluxy contained clear human and dinosaur footprints, and that this dramatically refuted evolution while supporting the belief in a recent Creation and the formation of the fossil record during Noah’s Flood. By interweaving Bird's comments about carved tracks with those referring to dinosaur tracks in the riverbed, Burdick implied that Bird himself had reported and excavated genuine human tracks from the Paluxy.
 
HISTORY 7
In the early 1960's the Paluxy "man tracks" became more widely known when photographs of the same loose carvings were featured in the landmark creationist book The Genesis Flood by John Whitcomb and Henry M. Morris (1961, p. 173-175). Like Burdick, Whitcomb and Morris suggested that these slabs were genuine "giant" human footprints known to have been excavated from the Paluxy riverbed--relying heavily on out-of-context statements by Roland Bird. A few years later, another creationist, A. E. Wilder-Smith, briefly visited the Paluxy at Burdick's invitation. In his subsequent 1965 book Mans Origin, Man's Destiny, Wilder-Smith followed the example of previous creationist authors in making strong "man track" claims based largely on inaccurate representations of Roland Bird’s work and writings.
 
HISTORY 8
Footprints in Stone (Taylor, 1972) was a film by Stanley Taylor, a Baptist minister who owned a small apologetics film company called Films for Christ. In the film, Taylor strongly encouraged the human track interpretations, even suggesting that several prints showed human-like toes. Some of the supposed "man tracks" occurred on a rock ledge in what is now Dinosaur Valley State park. However, the film focused most heavily on an area now known as the "Taylor Site," containing a deep dinosaur trail and several reputedly human trails, some of which Taylor's team reportedly excavated from under previously undisturbed rock strata. For many years the film was shown to schools, churches, and creationist groups throughout America, helping to widely spread the Paluxy "man track" claims.
 
CON 9
In October of 1985 Glen J. Kuban invited John Morris of ICR and Paul Taylor (now running the film company founded by his deceased father, Stan), to revisited the Alfred West site and Taylor Site,  When Kuban pointed out to them the various metatarsal dinosaur tracks at the Alfred West site, and their similar but largely infilled counterparts at the Taylor Site, Morris and Taylor expressed concern that they had made serious errors in the past.  Taylor stated that he would stop circulating  Footprints in Stone, and Morris indicated that he would probably stop selling his book.
 
CON 10
Claims of human tracks occurring alongside dinosaur tracks in Texas have not stood up to close scientific scrutiny, and in recent years have been largely abandoned even by most creationists. Although genuine dinosaur tracks are abundant in Texas, the alleged Paluxy "man tracks" involve a variety of misidentified phenomena. The most celebrated "man tracks" on the Taylor Site are forms of "metatarsal" dinosaur tracks--made by dinosaurs which, at least at times, made elongate prints by impressing their metatarsi (soles and heels) as they walked, rather than walking on their toes only. When the digit marks on such elongate/metatarsal tracks are subdued by sediment infilling, mud- collapse, erosion, or a combination of factors, the metatarsal segment at the rear often presents an oblong shape that roughly resembles a large human footprint. Other alleged "man tracks" include erosional features and indistinct markings of uncertain origin, some of which were enhanced with water or oil at times to appear more human, or even physically altered in some cases. A smaller number of "man tracks" are outright carvings (mostly on loose blocks of rock).
 
PRO 11
In the December 1988 issue of ICR's Acts and Facts, John Morris explained that he had returned to the Paluxy this past September to investigate "new evidence" gathered by Carl Baugh and Don Patton. Although Baugh and Patton acknowledge that the Taylor Trail is dinosaurian, they now are proposing that a human being followed the same trail, leaving a human print inside each dinosaur track.
 
CON 11.1
Morris' article is an unfortunate sign for young earth creationism. It indicates an unwillingness to fully abandon past claims (no matter how well-refuted), and a return to the same kind of faulty research, deficient documentation, and inaccurate reporting that fostered the Paluxy mess in the first place. Instead of helping to set the record straight on the Paluxy issue, Morris' article undoubtedly will contribute to the spread of new misinformation among creationists and the public at large. Already some creationists are calling for the film Footprints in Stone  to be reinstated. Evidently little if anything was learned from past mistakes.
 
CON 12
Those "footprints" in the Paluxy river bed are NOT human. A simple observation of the tracks reveal that while an arch is present forward of the heel, there are only three toes. If a track is observed which is uneroded, webbing is visible between the toes. A special on NOVA allowed these tracks to be visible to millions.
 
Question 13
I wonder.  Is it assumed that a man tracking a dino would be barefoot?  What would the footprint of a man wearing leather 'moccasins' look like?  Might they appear to be web-footed?  Perhaps there might be a toe or two sublimated by the moccasin skin.  I wonder.  Is the issue as settled as many would have us believe?  After all, if it is so conclusively not man-prints, what creature did make the prints?  I don't think any one really knows for sure.

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« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2009, 11:23:21 PM »

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SEEKER55
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« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2009, 12:00:11 AM »

Am I the only one who'd like a little more bibliography on some of those claims?


Prof. Ze'ev Herzog
Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Studies
Tel Aviv University
P.O.B. 39040, Ramat Aviv, 69978 Tel Aviv, ISRAEL
Tel: (Office) 972-3-6409578
Fax: (Office) 972-3-6407237
E-mail: herzog@post.tau.ac.il

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog is associate professor in the Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Cultures at Tel Aviv University.
He took part in the excavations of Hazor and Megiddo with Yigael Yadin and dug at Tel Arad and Tel Beer Sheba with Yohanan Aharoni. He has directed the excavations at Tel Michal and Tel Gerisa and has recently begun a new exploration project at Tel Yafo (ancient Jaffa).
Prof. Herzog serves as archaeological advisor to the Israel Nature and National Parks Protection Authority in the preservation and development of National Parks at Arad and Beer Sheba. His fields of interest are: Social Archaeology, Ancient Architecture, Field Archaeology and Public Archaeology.

Prof. Herzog is the author of the following books:

- Beer-sheba II: The Early Iron Age Settlements. (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 7) Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University and Ramot Publishing Co. Tel Aviv 1984.

- Das Stadttor in Israel und in den Nachbarländern. Verlag Philipp von Zabern. Mainz 1986.

- Excavations at Tel Michal, Israel. With G. Rapp, O. Negbi (eds). (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 8) University of Minnesota Press and Tel Aviv University, Institute of Archaeology. Minneapolis 1989.

- Archaeology of the City: Urban Planning in Ancient Israel and its Social Implications. (Monograph Series of the Sonia and Marco Nadler Institute of Arahaeology No. 13) Emery and Claire Yass Archaeology Press, Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University. Tel Aviv 1997.

- Ancient Arad- An Early Bronze Age Community on the Desert Fringe (with Arad: R. Amiran, O. Ilan, and M. Sebbane) Z. Herzog: The Arad Fortresses.Tel Aviv 1997. [in Hebrew].
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« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2009, 12:02:55 AM »

Did you remove some of your posts?

Anyhow...the majority of the inconsistencies you list have to do with the fact that the "traditional" histories associated with the Bible have the places and geography wrong.

Early in the history of the Christian era, it became lucrative to create holy sites that people would travel to on pilgramages.  The short version is that the tourism industry of the ancient world determined where many of the "historical" places were.

The real Mt Sinai, for instance, isn't even in the Sinai peninsula.  Haran is not located in Aramea/Assyria, it's waaaaay farther south near the present Dead Sea.  The captivity probably wasn't in the Nile region, and the exodus wandering years assuredly did not occur in the Sinai peninsula.

But that doesn't mean that there was no historic Hebrews.  Far from it.

Also, the dating of the Philistines at 1200 BC has to do with the speculative identification of the group with the "Sea Peoples" that tried to invade Egypt.  But that forgets that the Mediterranean civilization of the Minoans was scattered some 300 years earlier, and the Philistines very well may be those immigrants, rather than the Sea Peoples.

Jarrod
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« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2009, 12:15:10 AM »

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog
Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Studies
Tel Aviv University
P.O.B. 39040, Ramat Aviv, 69978 Tel Aviv, ISRAEL
Tel: (Office) 972-3-6409578
Fax: (Office) 972-3-6407237
E-mail: herzog@post.tau.ac.il

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog is associate professor in the Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Cultures at Tel Aviv University.
He took part in the excavations of Hazor and Megiddo with Yigael Yadin and dug at Tel Arad and Tel Beer Sheba with Yohanan Aharoni. He has directed the excavations at Tel Michal and Tel Gerisa and has recently begun a new exploration project at Tel Yafo (ancient Jaffa).
Prof. Herzog serves as archaeological advisor to the Israel Nature and National Parks Protection Authority in the preservation and development of National Parks at Arad and Beer Sheba. His fields of interest are: Social Archaeology, Ancient Architecture, Field Archaeology and Public Archaeology.

Prof. Herzog is the author of the following books:

- Beer-sheba II: The Early Iron Age Settlements. (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 7) Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University and Ramot Publishing Co. Tel Aviv 1984.

- Das Stadttor in Israel und in den Nachbarländern. Verlag Philipp von Zabern. Mainz 1986.

- Excavations at Tel Michal, Israel. With G. Rapp, O. Negbi (eds). (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 8) University of Minnesota Press and Tel Aviv University, Institute of Archaeology. Minneapolis 1989.

- Archaeology of the City: Urban Planning in Ancient Israel and its Social Implications. (Monograph Series of the Sonia and Marco Nadler Institute of Arahaeology No. 13) Emery and Claire Yass Archaeology Press, Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University. Tel Aviv 1997.

- Ancient Arad- An Early Bronze Age Community on the Desert Fringe (with Arad: R. Amiran, O. Ilan, and M. Sebbane) Z. Herzog: The Arad Fortresses.Tel Aviv 1997. [in Hebrew].
Thank you Seeker.  May I ask, are you Prof Herzog?  Or one of his students?
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SEEKER55
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« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2009, 12:26:21 AM »

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog
Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Studies
Tel Aviv University
P.O.B. 39040, Ramat Aviv, 69978 Tel Aviv, ISRAEL
Tel: (Office) 972-3-6409578
Fax: (Office) 972-3-6407237
E-mail: herzog@post.tau.ac.il

Prof. Ze'ev Herzog is associate professor in the Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Cultures at Tel Aviv University.
He took part in the excavations of Hazor and Megiddo with Yigael Yadin and dug at Tel Arad and Tel Beer Sheba with Yohanan Aharoni. He has directed the excavations at Tel Michal and Tel Gerisa and has recently begun a new exploration project at Tel Yafo (ancient Jaffa).
Prof. Herzog serves as archaeological advisor to the Israel Nature and National Parks Protection Authority in the preservation and development of National Parks at Arad and Beer Sheba. His fields of interest are: Social Archaeology, Ancient Architecture, Field Archaeology and Public Archaeology.

Prof. Herzog is the author of the following books:

- Beer-sheba II: The Early Iron Age Settlements. (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 7) Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University and Ramot Publishing Co. Tel Aviv 1984.

- Das Stadttor in Israel und in den Nachbarländern. Verlag Philipp von Zabern. Mainz 1986.

- Excavations at Tel Michal, Israel. With G. Rapp, O. Negbi (eds). (Publication of the Institute of Archaeology No. 8) University of Minnesota Press and Tel Aviv University, Institute of Archaeology. Minneapolis 1989.

- Archaeology of the City: Urban Planning in Ancient Israel and its Social Implications. (Monograph Series of the Sonia and Marco Nadler Institute of Arahaeology No. 13) Emery and Claire Yass Archaeology Press, Institute of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University. Tel Aviv 1997.

- Ancient Arad- An Early Bronze Age Community on the Desert Fringe (with Arad: R. Amiran, O. Ilan, and M. Sebbane) Z. Herzog: The Arad Fortresses.Tel Aviv 1997. [in Hebrew].
Thank you Seeker.  May I ask, are you Prof Herzog?  Or one of his students?


Nope,  just an impartial observer, seeking the truth.
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« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2009, 12:56:38 AM »

I appreciate your screen-name.  As you seek, it may help to have good questions.  May I suggest some?

I suggest that you consider the destruction of the Minoan civilization by the supervolcano Thera (ie Santorini). 
Particularly, what would the meteorological effects of such an eruption be on the area between Euphrates and Jordan?  how long would they last?  What were the activities of the inhabitants of that area during that time period?  How did they survive and what sort of governmental structure did they have?

I would also suggest that you consider an alternate geography to the standard.

Of Haran, is there any place other than the theorized location that could be considered to be Haran?  What does the word Haran mean?  Are there any other locations listed in the Biblical accounts with the same name (or a different version of the name)?  What would the natural path of travel from Ur to Hebron have been?  Is there a location on that route that could be called "Haran?"

Of Egypt, is there any other territory which could be considered to be "Mizraim" other than what we think of as Egypt?  What were the borders of Egypt during this time frame?  Why does the story of Abimelech and Sarah duplicate the story of Pharoah and Sarah?  Where did this happen?

How long did the Israelites really stay in "Egypt?"  Is there any record in Egyptian antiquity of the Egyptians "driving out" a group of peoples with the characteristics of the Israelites?  When did such an event occur?

Where is Mt Sinai located?  What does "Sinai" mean, and what does that tell us about the location of the mountain?

Moses took the entire exodus group to see his father-in-law Jethro.  What do we know about Jethro?  Where did Jethro live, what was his job, and why would that be important?  Is the location of Mt Sinai on a logical path between their original position and Jethro?
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