Catholic Church does away with second commandment....see for yourself!!

[desertknight]

Your picture that you want to display has to have an http://www. address I think, otherwise it will not display it.

[wayne]

yes desert, its just giving honor. and, i dont know the adress of my pictures. let me try again....[img][my  pictures

[desertknight]

If it's from your pictures stored in your computer wayne, I don't think it will allow you to post it.  I think they do not allow it in order to protect content.  Only pictures that have an http: address that you find on-line can be displayed.  I gotta go for now. Peace brother.

[wayne]

[wayne]

i kinda feel bad posting this pic with the help of desertknight. my feelings for desert shouldnt get in the way of presenting what i believe to be the truth. what are these people doing?

[wayne]

this is another p[icture of people not praying to statues. only this guy is the head man

[wayne]

we are not bowing to this statue, we slipped and fell

[desertknight]

You shouldn't feel bad wayne.  I want you to post what you believe as long as your honest about it.

...No, they are not bowing to a statue.  That statue, like any statue, is mere marble or plaster...nothing more.  The flag of the United States is mere cloth, thread and dye...nothing more, but I do not let one pass me without reverently saluting or placing my hand over my heart and coming to attention.  Why?  Is it the cloth and dye that earns my devotion?  No!  It is what it represents.  I will again state, that when you keep a picture of your wife and children with you in your wallet, and if you have ever taken it out and kissed it, you have done exactly what Catholics do when they pray in front of a statue of a saint or use stained glass art or icons to enrich the worship and understanding of the faith.  They are not required of any Catholic, but are there as a sacramental focus and as a beautiful part of our Christian history and tradition.   The Commandments of Exodus were there for the explicit prohibition of worshiping as the pagans did.  Worshiping actual objects or other false gods.  Catholics as a dogmatic absolute of our faith, solely and only worship the one, true and living God, who is Father ,Son, and Holy Spirit!  I just have one question.  Why, if the Catholic Church was wrong on this, do we have numerous examples of icons and paintings and statues, from the very first generations of Christians?  You said you have been to the Vatican.  Did you not wonder why in the Catacombs there is religious artwork everywhere?   I posted a picture of the earliest known Christian icon ever recorded in the Catacomb of Priscilla from the very first generations of Christians and it is of the Madonna and Christ child.  You will find such depictions in every Catholic church today as well as many others.  

Now you can either believe that I am lying, you can accept that I am telling you what is easy to find Catholic orthodoxy on the matter, and BTW, Eastern Orthodox, Lutherans, Anglicans, and many other Christians believe as we do, or you can be dishonest and accept that what I have told you about Catholic orthodoxy but continue to post in the future as if you were never informed of your error.

If we got it wrong, we got it wrong from the very begining...

[wayne]

desert, heresies crept in from the first day of christianity. yep allegence to the flag is allegence to the flag. its the symbol of a country. i see what you are getting at and you and i agree about thingsrepresenting other things. but do the children realize this? how long were you in italy? does every catholic know the statue is and abstract of the saint? can little children even spell abstract?  i take it your not just a man in the pews. and thanks for helping me with the pics. its hard for me though to find the pics on internet cause it was a yr ago when i found a bunch of real good statue pics and now i dont know where they are. but i have them in my pictures. so its not me youre convincing. how about the catholic children. my girlfriend was raised catholic and went 1 thru 12 in catholic school. this was in new jersey where they had the home grown old school italien catholics and the real deal churches. school nuns got mad at her if she questioned statue worship during catholic studies. her mother had to come down once and tell some nun where to go if she mistreated her little girl again. statues galor in churches over there. some street festival in new your where they have a mary statue on a platform that they bear on their shoulders and people toss money and flowers up on it. she told me all this. super duper pagan. she never went to catholic church again after hi school. her kids, who are now 21 and 23 have never been in a catholic church. she dowsnt even like talking abut it.

[desertknight]

If heresies crept into the Church from the earliest times then Holy Scripture would be lying to us for Christ promised us that the "gates of Hell would never prevail against it."  He promised us that the Holy Spirit would reside within it, "until the end of time."  He told us that the Church was His Body!  People within the Church can be corrupt, but the Church and her mission cannot.  I was partly drawn to Catholicism because I can read the texts of Bishops and believers from Clement or Ignatius to Ratzinger and the beliefs are still the same.  From the centrality of the Word and Holy Eucharist, to the episcopal structure and our obedience to Christ's authority through His ministers to the nature of Grace and Salvation;  in 2,000 years it has remained the same.  The promises of Christ have been true.  Now does every Catholic know what is correct doctrine of the Church?  Well, no, no more than every Protestant does theirs.  I listen to a radio program of Calvinist Protestant theologians from time to time called "The White Horse Inn".  It's very good.  They have done radio interviews on basic theology at Evangelical and other Protestant conventions and been stunned at the number of people who don't even know the basics, but as to your specific question, yes, if any Catholic is active in the Church they would have a hard time not knowing what the Church believes and teaches.  All Catholic children are required to attend CCC if they are going to be active in the Church and they receive, all over the world, a sound basic education in Christian beliefs.  If you went into any Catholic church, anywhere in the world, and asked any frequent parishioner if, "they pray to statues", they would likely giggle and ask what religion you must be as the question would seem funny to them.  Of course they don't!  I have no idea what nun you could be referring to, but any nun that would allow any Catholic to falsely hold the idea that idolatry was OK, or that we pray to marble or plaster, would quickly be in serious trouble with her Mother Superior.  It just isn't the case.  I would not go on the basis of the example you sited.  I cannot imagine for the life of me any nun behaving as you have said.  We are not talking about some obscure theology here.  This is Catholic 101 stuff.  Any school age Catholic kid should know it.  As for me, you are wrong.  I am just a typical Catholic man in the pew.  Faithful, but no saint, that's for sure.  I am active with my parish and am as typical as can be except for the fact that I am a convert to Catholicism from a religiously indifferent Protestant family.  I was drawn to the Church from reading the New Testament over and over and reading about the basic beliefs and history of Christianity from it's roots.   As I posted on another thread, I was left with the paradox that a famous English writer was...

"Catholicism is not an opinion to which one subscribes, but a reality to which one submits."  J.R.R. Tolkien

Peace.

[wayne]

my friend desert, i dont believe you are of the pews. the man in the pews has no idea what the man behind the curtian s doing. another thing that is difficult to believe is that u went from protestant to cathoilic. i was raised protestant. but i went to mass every christmas eve with my neighbors because i though it was more than what my family was doing. i thought it was more holy than doing nothing. but being saved, the holy ghost tells you what is gods and what is the devils.

[desertknight]

Well, I am wayne.  Just a simple lay Catholic, former career military, full time fisherman and goof-off now.  There is no "man behind the curtain" and there are plenty of Catholic converts like me.  I post here and on the board, "Defenders of the Catholic Faith Forum", where I'm known as "Desertfalcon".  You can see that I am the same person there as I am here.  That board was started by Protestant converts to Catholicism and has plenty of members who are way smarter than I am on this stuff.  I was just lucky that as a young man I asked the right questions and got the right answers and found Christ and have been Catholic ever since, although not always doing what I should have been to please God.   I have nothing against Protestants, I just think they are missing the fact that the Church that Christ began, that He anointed His Apostles to run, that they passed that authority on to, is alive in well in every Catholic parish.  It only has to be understood that every Christian member of it is a sinner, from Popes to parishioners and that it will never be perfect until the last days, but it has always been faithful to His Word.

http://forums.catholic-convert.com/index.php  

[wayne]

hey desert, i used to go to catholic church christmas eve with my friends from across the street. i thought it was good thing at the time. i was young. the rest of my family was in front of TV. to me, catholic was just another religion, but i thought it was more in line with god because of all the trappings. the methodist church my ma and grandma drug me to was sterile and boring.even after  was saved i didnt think anything about catholic church. i was hanging out with new crowd. i went to a saved gathering. some beat up place near LAX. once your born again u gather with others of the same mind. i was saved by accident, as far as i knew. its no accident. i asked him to come into me and show himself. it was at a love in , i thought. the poster said free food free music free love, so i went. 1970 it was.the change came on the bus ride home. all of a sudden everything look different.stores, billboards, ads, it all looked like useless human vanity. im tellin you. he reaches inside you and gives you a new spirit. there are 2 kinds of people. saved and unsaved.when the unsaved read the bible, it passes rite thru.  blinders are on the unsaved. its impossible for them to understand the things of the spirit. they can regurgitate the words and philosophize, like teachers of religion at colleges and things. these are generally unsaved people, theologans. ive never told anyone this, but when i got home, i ran upstairs to tell my parents about god. then i started rambling off all this stuff from out the bible and i had never cracked open one befor. but later on in life i started hearing things about catholic and other religions. that satan actally uses these groups to decieve people. dont think that i have some big beef with catholic church. i have beef with all the religions. why dont you find a quiet time and ask jesus to show himself to you. to make you over again. born again he says that in no wise will he cast you out

[papist1]

the catholic church has taken out the second commanment that says we shall not make graven images or bow down to them. i have a link here to the official vatican site for the catechism, which is what the young are taught from. scroll down to where it says  ten commandments.   http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM          why would they take that out? isnt it obvious? the master of the catholic church does not want to see you be saved. he wants you on your knees in front of statues. this keeps you from asking jesus for salvation. we got some devout catholics in here defending their faith. their faith changed the commandments. this shows who is in control of that satanic religion. well, those defenders got some defending to do     

LOL, this is rediculous.

Maybe if the writer here were to actually read the catechism, he might see that this is the farthest thing from the truth.

boy, what a doozy this was.

peace, papist

[Mikey]

STUPID is as STUPID does!!!

Unreal...