LINK:Question: "What does the Bible say about Purgatory?"
Answer:According to the Catholic Encyclopedia, Purgatory is “a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God's grace, are not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.” To summarize, in Catholic theology Purgatory is a place that a Christian’s soul goes to after death to be cleansed of the sins that had not been fully satisfied during life. Is this doctrine of Purgatory in agreement with the Bible? Absolutely not!
Winsome has shown that it is. This article does not show that it is not.
Jesus died to pay the penalty for all of our sins (Romans 5:8).
Romans 5:8 But God proves his love for us in that while we were still sinners Christ died for us.
If the author wants to show that Jesus died to pay the penalty for all of our sins, Romans 5:8 is not helping him. Jesus died to pay the eternal penalty. We are called in the gospels to "repent and do works worthy of repentance". We still suffer temporally as consequence for our sins, and we do so for good reason.
Isaiah 53:5 declares, “But He was pierced for our transgressions, He was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon Him, and by His wounds we are healed.” Jesus suffered for our sins so that we could be delivered from suffering. To say that we must also suffer for our sins is to say that Jesus’ suffering was insufficient.
Paul says that he "makes up for what is lacking in the sufferings of Christ". (Col. 1:24) Paul sees that something is "lacking in the sufferings of Christ". Why can't the author? He is not here to answer. Maybe you can answer?
"By his wounds we are healed" is absolutely true, but it doesn't say exactly how that manifests in reality. Even accepting Christ's suffering for our sins we see that there is still something very wrong with our soul, that we are still inclined to sin. From the beginning it was not so.
The way we are "healed" is through partaking in the sufferings of Christ. It is through that union of our suffering with Christ's suffering that we are healed.
To say that we must atone for our sins by cleansing in Purgatory is to deny the sufficiency of the atoning sacrifice of Jesus (1 John 2:2). The idea that we have to suffer for our sins after death is contrary to everything the Bible says about salvation.
The author needs to make up his mind. Does he believe that we suffer for our sins before
death? Why do we suffer for our sins, if Jesus' atoning sacrifice took away all suffering for our sins? Rather, Jesus' atoning sacrifice took away the eternal punishment
for our sins. In that act he made atonement. Anyone who is in purgatory is in Christ Jesus and so is in an imperfect state of being "at one". Their will is being molded to be truly at one with God's will. We cannot be at one with God wholly, until our will is at one with God. Otherwise it is only a real-but-imperfect reconciliation.
The primary Scriptural passage Catholics point to for evidence of Purgatory is 1 Corinthians 3:15, which says, “If it is burned up, he will suffer loss; he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.” The passage (1 Corinthians 3:12-15) is using an illustration of things going through fire as a description of believers’ works being judged. If our works are of good quality “gold, sliver, costly stones,” they will pass through the fire unharmed, and we will be rewarded for them. If our works are of poor quality “wood, hay, and straw,” they will be consumed by the fire, and there will be no reward. The passage does not say that believers pass through the fire, but rather that a believer’s works pass through the fire. 1 Corinthians 3:15 refers to the believer “escaping through the flames,” not “being cleansed by the flames.”
As winsome has shown, and this article fails to acknowledge, that there is wide evidence for purgatory both in scripture and even belief that precedes Jesus and still exists in some parts of Judaism today that involves praying for the dead.
This passage from this article seems to deny that sin actually puts a stain on our soul. Winsome has posted at least one scripture that shows that we are to "cleanse ourselves". That means 1) we need cleansing and 2) we need to take part in the process ourselves, that Jesus doesn't do it all for us. The above verse isn't the only passage that shows the necessity of purgatory; it is one among many which this article doesn't respond to. Taken as a whole one can easily see how purgatory fits into the whole of scripture and is very scriptural. His interpretation of 1 Cor. 3:15, put quite simply, is wrong; it's false.
This part I've edited to deal with his scriptural arguments apart from his "poisoning the well" so that we can see more clarity without his opinion involved.
...Jesus’ once-for-all sacrifice was absolutely and perfectly sufficient (Hebrews 7:27)....
27 Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.
This doesn't say what the author says it did. This is simply stating that the OT sacrifices are now put away because the sacrifice of Jesus replaces them. It doesn't say what exactly the sacrifice was sufficient for. The author implies his own opinion (something that he hasn't proved) is the answer, but doesn't support it.
Jesus' sacrifice was sufficient to redeem us but it is clear from scripture and experience that we still suffer consequence for sins that is the Father chastising us. If we are perfect, then why would the Father chastise? Is this punishment without purpose? Is that what Christians are supposed to believe?
Catholics view meritorious works as contributing to salvation due to a failure to recognize that Jesus’ sacrificial payment has no need of additional “contribution” (Ephesians 2:8-9).
His sizing up of Catholic theology is lacking because he doesn't take into account that his definition of grace is not only different from ours, but also not reconcilable with the Bible. Grace is not Unmerited Favor
Similarly, Purgatory is understood by Catholics as a place of cleansing in preparation for heaven because they do not recognize that because of Jesus’ sacrifice, we are already cleansed, declared righteous, forgiven, redeemed, reconciled, and sanctified.
No scriptural support given, but plenty to the contrary provided by winsome.
For believers, after death is to be "away from the body and at home with the Lord" (2 Corinthians 5:6-8; Philippians 1:23). Notice that this does not say "away from the body, in Purgatory with the cleansing fire." No, because of the perfection, completion, and sufficiency of Jesus' sacrifice, we are immediately in the Lord's presence after death, fully cleansed, free from sin, glorified, perfected, and ultimately sanctified.
2 Corinthians 5
6 Therefore we are always confident and know that as long as we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord. 7 For we live by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord.
I would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. And I would also prefer to be away from work and at home with my family. Soon I will be away from work, but the long drive exists between me and my family. The statement in 2 Corinthians 6:8 doesn't demonstrate that when we are away from the body, the only other place to be is at home with the Lord.
23 I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far;
Likewise I desire to depart from work and be with my family. In the same way, Paul's statement doesn't show that there isn't a step between. The author wants it to be that way, but the verse doesn't show it. You can't use a premise to demonstrate a conclusion.
The rest of his statement is an an unsupported statement.
There, now maybe you can try something similar with winsome's posts. Let's hear it.