Biblical marriage

[janine]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--][!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]A wife must not separate from her husband. 11But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.[/quote][/quote]
Is that "separate" the same word as being loosed or untied or unbound - is it "divorced"?

[memmy]

Well Grace, If you did not share this with us then how can we know how to pray for you?

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to pray for you! :pray:

Memmy :)

[janine]

Gracie- no one is saying "don't get emotional here"!

It's just that all we're good for is to let off stream with, and to love you.  Counseling you need to get from someone with skin on.  

God bless you, sugar.

[charlie]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--][!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--][!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]A wife must not separate from her husband. 11But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.[/quote][/quote]
Is that "separate" the same word as being loosed or untied or unbound - is it "divorced"?[/quote]
Today, we would call it 'divorce' simply because it results in someone being 'unmarried.' Back then, though, a man could go up to his wife after she burned his toast and say, "I divorce you, get out," and out she went. Without his support, but without the freedom to remarry, she basically had one option for income at that point. That is why Moses' mentioning of writs of divorce had progressed to a command to give a writ of divorce. Divorce papers were originally meant to be a method whereby a divorced woman could prove that her former husband had no claim on her and could thus remarry. They were originally a GOOD thing!

[grace42day]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]Gracie- no one is saying "don't get emotional here"![/quote]
Thanks.  I know that.  Y'all have never made me feel otherwise.  I came to that conclusion myself.  I mean, I made that decision after considering the affect my exposure may have on others.  If it's obvious I'm have serious enough problems that someone would recommend I get counseling, then I've exposed more than I intended.  
While somewhat embarrassing, I've survived much worse, so I'll live through this too, I suppose!   :)
I hope I didn't make anyone too uncomfortable with my rantings, ramblings and what nots!  Thanks for your patience, compassion and kind remarks!   :hug:
Most of all, thanks for your prayers!

[janine]

:inlove:  :inlove:  :inlove:

You're welcome.

:inlove:  :inlove:  :inlove:

[Richard]

Gracie,
The only thing that has made me uncomfortable is my own inability to reach out and help you.
I'm like that...I'm a fixer.  I don't like situations I can't fix.

That's why I spend so much of my time frustrated. :bangingheadagainstwall:  :bangingheadagainstwall:

If blowing off steam here helps you...I say blow away!

Peace,

Richard

[grace42day]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]...uncomfortable is my own inability to reach out and help you.[/quote]
:hug:  :givingkiss:  
I appreciate the thought and intent...
And I pray a special portion of His grace on you because you feel so deeply the pain of others.  I hope you give as much attention to getting your cup refilled...   thank you for your tender heart and sweet spirit!

[Richard]

Thanks Grace.
I find that the less attention I pay to my cup, the more it overflows.  God's Grace is abundant.

Peace,

Richard

[Lee Freeman]

In the Middle Ages in Europe a marriage was considered valid if it had been consummated; on a couple's wedding night, it was customary for friends to stand outside the door, listening for sounds of the couple coming together, in case the marriage's consummation was ever called into question. This happened when Henry VIII married his deceased brother Arthur's wife, Catharine of Aragon; Henry claimed the marriage had never been consummated, which left Henry free to take Catherine to wife.

I'm a veritable fountain of totally useless knowledge.

Pax.

[Jones518]

I encourage you to take a look at this if you haven't already.  Give it a read and see what you think about it.

Jonesy

[grace42day]

I think that it is long - but well worth the read.  

His arguments are both convincing and liberating.  It saddens me that reconciliation is completely out of the question.  I think I've known that for a long time, probably from the beginning of the end.  I just didn't want to admit it.  
But his comments here regarding what the scriptures really do say and the forthright explanation of what that means in application shouts to me to let him go and that I can move on and to stop waiting for him to come and tell me that it was all a mistake.

This aspect of my life has been on hold for so long... wondering what I should do.  Wondering what God expects of me.  Weighing what the elders of one congregation had to say versus what the elders of another advised me.  None convinced me of my role in my own future.  I feel this article spells it out accurately and, while it still hurts, I know that letting go is His Will.  I am convinced of that now.  I haven't been convinced until now.  ouch... it's almost like going to a funeral after all these years.

And it's not just the letting go that I get out of this article.  It's the release from the bonds placed on me to remain single.  Now... I don't have to be afraid of remarriage - should that blessing be in His Will for me again.  It feels as though my sentence has been lifted.  So it is a bitter-sweet feeling that this article generates for me.  To let go when I didn't want the divorce in the first place and to be freed from the sentence that forbid me to remarry since my husband divorced me instead of me using my "free pass" to a scriptural divorce.  

Well, I've learned a lot about God, about grace, about myself and about love during these years of uncertainty.  You know what?  I'm gonna be okay.  More than okay.  I can freely partake in His blessings guilt free.

Thanks.  Thanks for pulling this old article back up.  I've printed it out to read again and look up the scriptures and really let it soak deep into my heart, my mind and my spirit.  Thank you.

[St. Rubicon]

John 4

18Jesus said to her, "You are right when you say you have no husband. The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true."

If Jesus means by "having" a man that they have a sexual relationship, then he doesn't buy the "intercourse = marriage" point of view.  Any thoughts?

[standnawe]

Just my 2 cents , if it helps a little, then good.

In the bible there is fornication , and I believe that is sex outside marriage, sex with a married person would be adultry.

Fornication does not make a marriage,its rather the vow that does , and the actual act seals it. If fornication could make a marriage , then rape would be a  marriage, and thats just not Gods way of bringing two together , Im sure.

There has to be the vow and sexual act together to complete the union.. So I see it this way.(The will to committ to each other as husband and wife.) We are not animals!

So if betrothed ones have sex before the cerimony, I think they are married in Gods eyes. The cerimony would make them married in mans eyes.

[ConnieLard]

Being new to the board, I am just now scrolling through this particular thread.  I deliberately put it off a few days after joining because I didn't want to read a lot of "stuff" you usually hear from CoC types about marriage and divorce!  I also went through a divorce about 10 years ago and it was, of course, the most devastating experience of my life. I can really relate to Grace and what she has been going through.  Just when you think you've dealt with it all, something else comes along to grab you; often, that "something" is from someone in the church.  Anyway, I was fortunate enough to get involved with a Divorce Recovery group at a Baptist Church across the street from where I regularly worshipped.  I found comfort and hope, as well as assistance in looking at what scripture has to say re: this.  If you haven't experienced divorce, the best thing you can do for someone who is dealing with it is to listen to them, pray for them, and connect them up with another Christian who has also experienced divorce and dealt with it successfully.  DO NOT give advice, because you really don't know what you're talking about - no matter how many verses from the Bible you can quote about marriage and divorce!
Thanks for letting me get this off my chest! :)