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Offline s1n4m1n

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Wife won't clean house
« on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 12:02:50 »
I'm disgusted with my wife in that she is the full time "homemaker" and yet doesn't fulfil her role. On a scale of 1 to 10 I'd put it at a 2. It seems like she has very little concern for how we live (we have 3 children), other than "prettifying" or 3 year old daughter when we go out in public.

This has been a continual problem in our marriage (married 13 years). Examples of the types of problems:

1) I would repeatedly tell her to make sure that diapers were properly thrown away - I come home from work, diapers or pull-ups laying on the floor (thankfully this has stopped since our children were potty trained)

2) I come home for lunch from work almost everyday - who fixes lunch for the children during this period, I do, many times the wife doesn't even know what food in the house to prepare

3) Doesn't prepare dinner - wife said she couldn't cook because the stove we had was too old, I bought a $700 stove exactly what she wanted and she still doesn't prepare dinner. Either I do the cooking or we eat out. I don't mind cooking so this isn't that much of a problem, except I end up coming home from work, cooking dinner, setting the table, and wait on everyone hand and foot during the meal

4) House cleaning is virtually nonexistant - if I don't do it it doesn't get done with the exception of clothes washing and dish washing. Literally food and mess laying on the floor for weeks, if I don't clean it up.

This has been the essential dispute between my wife and I our entire marriage, I consider it to be slothfulness and a sin. I would understand if she worked full-time or even part-time but this is her only job.

I'll ask her what she did for the day and she'll reply "I don't have to tell you", stuff like that.

I've tried for years and years and I'm at the end of my rope. Finally, I've told her that if she doesn't change I will divorce her. I'm tired of the yelling and fights that we have (in front of the children too) about the same issue over and over. It's like she doesn't care.

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Wife won't clean house
« on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 12:02:50 »

Offline walker starr

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #1 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 13:46:08 »



   I know my answer may displease every one or almost everyone on this forum.
    My first wife was a great deal like that.  I don't mean she didn't help housekeep but
she constantly was quarrelsome.  I stuck it out for 17 years.  But enough is enough.
    It is not good it is harmful for children to hear their parents constantly yelling at each
    other.  I know that my children(grown now) were harmed psychologically.  They
    have been much better off if I hadn't waited 17 years  and taken them with me.
    GOD bless.

  Ps I was too young to know any better at the time.

Offline Silvia

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #2 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 13:56:50 »
Do you find things to compliment her about? That she has the 3 year old fixed up nicely, etc. Do you speak kindly about the things that she *does* do?

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #2 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 13:56:50 »

Offline chosenone

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #3 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 14:46:19 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce. Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #3 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 14:46:19 »

Offline phoebe

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #4 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 17:30:52 »
I've been reading your posts on GCM for a long time and have always respected you.  Am wondering why you waited so long, until you are in a crisis moment, to seek help, when you've obviously been needing it for years?

Get help.  Insist on a counselor with the understanding that if she doesn't go, separation for your mental health and the physical and emotional health of your children will be the next step.  She needs motivation to which she can respond.  Ask Doc Roberson for direction.


In the meantime, my suggestions:

1)  Stop doing her work.

2)  Invite someone over.  Explain to them in advance your dilemma so they won't be shocked at what they will see.  Don't be surprised if she bolts and leaves you holding the bag.

3)  www.FlyLady.com  For her, not you.  Trust me.  If one is overwhelmed by the tasks at hand, this is the place to go.

4)  Be compassionate.  It is sometimes the result of a form of depression and/or extremely low self-esteem (why she needs counseling).


It seems she has closed her spirit-door to you.  There is a reason(s) for it that may or may not have anything to do with you.  Whatever it is, you need to find out why, and then work at re-opening that door, if, indeed, it ever was open to you.




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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #4 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 17:30:52 »



Offline BobsRib

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #5 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 21:26:02 »
Threatening to leave will really help(sarcasm) ::frown:: Her problem is probably due to depression. Stay at home Mom's rarely get much praise. It is a job that is often called a "thankless" job. People that don't live it day in and day out can't see it. Do you have any idea how many women get jobs outside the home because they can't hack it??? Of course I don't mean all working Mom fit into this category. but many do.

What can you do? Help her with the housework without acting all "holier than thou". It just make it worse if you help and act mad. You might as well not do it.


Show that you value HER not just what she is supposed to do for you and your children.

She "pretties" up your daughter.... maybe because she doesn't feel like a person on her own.... just through someone else.... like her daughter.

Asking her "what have you been doing all day?". to her, is an accusation, not true interest in HER.

Asking someone over for dinner might just help. Give her notice. Volunteer to cook outside. This will give a chance to clean up the house and not worry about dinner.

Make sure you let her know the dinner guest are for a fun evening for BOTH of you. Hire a babysitter to feed the kids (in another room) and put them to bed.

God commands you to love and UNDERSTAND your wife. Poor housekeeping skills are NOT an excuse to put her down and threaten to leave her.  If there is arguing and fighting over this... it is your fault. Sorry walker You are way off base. I guess if the Hubby doesn't mow the yard often enough or take out the trash or service the cars on time, then wives should take to the streets and hire lawyers.

This is a tough time in marriage. Job demands, kid demands, financial demands, couple are tired and stressed. It is not the time to turn on each other.  Live with you wife in understanding. and pray.

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #5 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 21:26:02 »

Offline BobsRib

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #6 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 22:01:04 »
I would like to add one more thought.

If your wife had posted about how her husband was griping constantly about how bad she was keeping the house and not cooking, I would remind her about her duty to God to be the wife her husband needs. I would tell her to read the book A Woman After God's Own Heart for ideas about how to show her love to her husband by keeping his home a sanctuary he can't wait to come home to.  It is not a one sided deal. But since I can't tell your wife what she needs to do to improve the marriage .... I can only tell the husband how he can and should work on the marriage.

Prayer is part of spiritual warfare!!

Offline phoebe

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #7 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 23:23:17 »
BobsRib - I agree with much of what you have said, esp. the biblical part about the husband being called to "understand" his wife.  Your comments have brought to my mind the following questions:

• Where is the wife's "sanctuary"?
• What haven does the husband provide for his wife?
• Where can she go for a few moments of respite and guilt-free peace, with no one disturbing her few moments of refueling solace?
• Does a husband ever think of his wife's needs in this way, or is this need reserved only for husbands, and to be provided by his wife? 

When the place of solace is the source of the stress, there can never be any solace, no sanctuary. 








Offline lightshineon

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #8 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 23:34:25 »
 Truth- She needs to do much better
 
 Truth- no reason for divorce

 Truth- she is doing something else, facebook, drugs, My Space, TV, whatever not cleaning house.

 Truth- Prayer changes things, love her where she is right now, things can change by God's hands, use the love Ch 1 thirteen, to motivate you.

 Truth- You could marry and OCD, humming bird like me, that never sits still, and nothing is ever clean enough.

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #8 on: Thu Jun 10, 2010 - 23:34:25 »

Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #9 on: Fri Jun 11, 2010 - 09:54:30 »
Do you find things to compliment her about? That she has the 3 year old fixed up nicely, etc. Do you speak kindly about the things that she *does* do?

Yes I do. Though I admit I'm not lavish in my praise. Sometimes I'm not sure to praise or not, for example when she washes the boys clothes (I normally do it) but then leaves them in the basket in the hall for 5 days and I end up putting everything up even though I've asked her everyday to put it up.

Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #10 on: Fri Jun 11, 2010 - 10:16:31 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce.

Its the continuing unresolved conflict that is tearing at our marriage. Frankly I don't have much respect for her anymore, I'm not asking for anything special, just to do what she said she wanted to do before we were married. She said she wanted to be a homemaker which was apparently a lie as she never really put any effort into it.

Quote
Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?

I'm up for counselling, I've told her to find one (so I don't get of accused of picking someone on my side) and we'll go, so far she hasn't even looked. Our conversations on this have run the gamut from calm reasoned discussions to yell-fests. She knows my position on what I think she needs to do. Her position is that I'm to love her unconditionally therefore I have no right to complain.

Yes, she has always been messy and not a cook. It was my fault for not seeing these problems before we were married. Her parents weren't going to say anything, my parents live out of town and didn't know her well enough and the church we were members of knew the problems she had but decided to keep quiet about it.

[/quote]

Yes,

Offline chosenone

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #11 on: Fri Jun 11, 2010 - 10:59:44 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce.

Its the continuing unresolved conflict that is tearing at our marriage. Frankly I don't have much respect for her anymore, I'm not asking for anything special, just to do what she said she wanted to do before we were married. She said she wanted to be a homemaker which was apparently a lie as she never really put any effort into it.

Quote
Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?

I'm up for counselling, I've told her to find one (so I don't get of accused of picking someone on my side) and we'll go, so far she hasn't even looked. Our conversations on this have run the gamut from calm reasoned discussions to yell-fests. She knows my position on what I think she needs to do. Her position is that I'm to love her unconditionally therefore I have no right to complain.

Yes, she has always been messy and not a cook. It was my fault for not seeing these problems before we were married. Her parents weren't going to say anything, my parents live out of town and didn't know her well enough and the church we were members of knew the problems she had but decided to keep quiet about it.


Yes,
[/quote]n 

 Well I never cooked till I married at 19, but I soon learnt or we would have starved lol.
 I really think that you need to maybe write her a letter, telling her all of this and how seriously this is affecting you and the marriage, so much so that you are considering a separation. That may just give her a bit of a shock and get her to fond a counsellor and/or start to pull her weight.  Really it isn't that hard to cook and keep a  house in reasonably good condition and wash the clothes.I know that looking after three kids is hard work but you say she has always been like this so it cant be that. If it is just laziness then she can do something about it.
What would happen if you didn't go home lunchtime? Would the kids starve?
 Maybe you could also decide between you  which jobs you will do from now on and which she will do, and do them and nothing else. Don't do her jobs. It isn't fair that you work and do most of the house work as well.

The only other alternative is for her to work full time and get a cleaner and child minder/nanny for the kids. Maybe give her that option?Telling you that you must put up with it whatever isn't right.


Offline vonny

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #12 on: Fri Jun 11, 2010 - 11:26:49 »
I feel for you, and am not sure what to say...

However, my take on this, that I'm getting from your post, is that you are, rightly, very frustrated and hurt,and don't really want it to come to separation? I think you really need her to pay attention to what you are telling her and for her to show some love. Her comment that you 'should love her unconditionally' goes both ways, in that she ought to also love you, and love is shown by how we treat one another.

MY second thought is the same as someone else has said; she may well have 'cabin fever', a sense of depression and boredom being at home for a long time. Believe me, it can get you down if you don't get out enough, if you're short on sleep or if there are other extenuating circumstances. Only you will know whether there may be any factors that could be leading to depression in her. Depression doesn't have to be a totally obvious thing, it can be a low grade, subtle apathy about life, a loss of being bothered about things, a loss of perspective. Sometimes we need to get a fresh perspective, get out more, spend time with our spouse alone, and talk.

The only one who may be able to answer whether depression is involved is your wife, and she does need to counsel with someone, and you. Honestly, I feel for you, and know you want to be a good husband, but you are not wrong for feeling so frustrated.

I will mention your situation in prayer, and ask God to be near you and undertake for you right now. ::groupprayer::

Offline JohnDB

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #13 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 06:17:31 »
Truth- She needs to do much better
 
  Truth- she is doing something else, facebook, drugs, My Space, TV, whatever not cleaning house.

 Truth- Prayer changes things, love her where she is right now, things can change by God's hands, use the love Ch 1 thirteen, to motivate you.

 Truth- You could marry and OCD, humming bird like me, that never sits still, and nothing is ever clean enough.

Ummmm  Rhonda...you are already happily married to your husband. God only made one of ya.  rofl

(the world couldn't take any more)
 rofl


and as far as the OP is concerned...try this:  ::destroyingcomputer::

considering your financial situation she needs to help...and sitting on the computer ain't gonna help at all. She is showing a complete lack of respect for you or for herself.

Offline Eagle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #14 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 14:03:14 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce. Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?


Chosen this is only sorta on topic....

If the husband was not working/will not work/had not worked for 13 years just sat around making a mess   would you say
Quote
..... but cant see that it is a cause for divorce....


You liked her enough to make 3 kids she must do something right.    I could not live in the mess i would leave and take my kids.  Hoping to wake her up.


I agree Light

Offline chosenone

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #15 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 14:57:35 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce. Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?


Chosen this is only sorta on topic....

If the husband was not working/will not work/had not worked for 13 years just sat around making a mess   would you say
Quote
..... but cant see that it is a cause for divorce....


You liked her enough to make 3 kids she must do something right.    I could not live in the mess i would leave and take my kids.  Hoping to wake her up.


I agree Light


 I would say the same. Its not right or loving to act this way (as I have already said), and seems very irresponsible, but since when has being messy been grounds for divorce?

Offline Eagle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #16 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 16:16:31 »
Bibicaly never but i have seen some messes that are over the top.  Kids living in a home make a mess and they should be allowed to live funnly.  Thinking filithy in this case.


Offline lightshineon

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #17 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 17:45:12 »
Truth- She needs to do much better
 
  Truth- she is doing something else, facebook, drugs, My Space, TV, whatever not cleaning house.

 Truth- Prayer changes things, love her where she is right now, things can change by God's hands, use the love Ch 1 thirteen, to motivate you.

 Truth- You could marry and OCD, humming bird like me, that never sits still, and nothing is ever clean enough.

Ummmm  Rhonda...you are already happily married to your husband. God only made one of ya.  rofl

(the world couldn't take any more)
 rofl


and as far as the OP is concerned...try this:  ::destroyingcomputer::

considering your financial situation she needs to help...and sitting on the computer ain't gonna help at all. She is showing a complete lack of respect for you or for herself.


 LOL John, true God broke the mold, be that good or bad. ::giggle::

Offline ela

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #18 on: Sat Jun 12, 2010 - 23:51:43 »
I know of someone very close to me who for years had a very difficult time keeping up...and to her husbands shagrin. He got to the point of being very disrespectful and emotionally hurtful altho not in public as he didn't want anyone to think that he had anything wrong with him.

She was finally diagnosed with a mental illness and was given med's that totally changed things on her part...altho by that time the damage was done.

People's behaviors do not normally happen out of a void...there are reasons. The root cause is what to aim at, not the behaviors. This person I speak of...the having children and the added household responsibilities triggered her mental illness to come to the surface...or to be evident.

Do some research....note her specific behaviors...find out...approach her in a "I want to help" attitude instead of a "I think you are a sloth" attitude. I encourage you to put your foot down gently...especially after you have gained some specific knowledge that would truly help. She does need intervention....she doesn't need more hurt or being looked down on.

  Good resource--  < http://www.nami.org/ >

Also, United Way has lots of resources as well -- Call 211

Offline Kindle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #19 on: Sun Jun 13, 2010 - 07:40:09 »
I just joined recently, so do not know you personally yet. But I can understand your frustration. Marriage is a partnership. If it seems one partner simply doesn't care, where do you go?
There are some excellent thoughts already posted. I trust you will seek God's wisdom in discerning which best apply to your situation.
Here are my thoughts. Please accept that they are well intended.
Relationships are often just hard for guys to talk about, but I sensed an approach to your original post that makes me feel like you just may be working too hard to "manage" both your wife and the situation. Maybe it is simply how you have come to cope with it over time...but you seem (to my ears) to be emotionally distanced from her. 
I don't mean to be judgemental. I'm just trying to pull from my own experience to give you something that might be of help.  A husband can love a wife dearly, and be beating his brains against the wall trying to do the right thing. But all a wife can see is that her husband looks angry...
Some small suggestions:  ::smile:: Again, you must discern if any even apply. These are directly from my own history.

Be wary of micro-managing. It steals the identity of others.
Ask what you can do to help in a manner that excludes any judgement. There might  still be a backlash..but a kind word does turneth away wrath! (mostly)
Make little inroads into finding out more about who your wife is as a person.  You both need and deserve that.
Try to express to her your own joy in your three children. Be "in tune" with her when she does the same.
Basically, help her to feel more like a true partner and less like a burden...if that seems to fit. True enough, being an at home mom and knowing your husband is out there working himself to the bone can make you feel that way.
If you can find it in yourself to do so, maybe even make that appointment with a counselor yourself. Hopefully she will understand what it meant for you to go that distance.
Also, for you... please be kind to yourself as well.  I don't know you yet, but you do seem to care deeply about your marriage. Go with that, and may you be Blessed with a happy resolution.

Offline Eagle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #20 on: Sun Jun 13, 2010 - 08:03:37 »
Nice post Kindle and welcome to the forum.

Offline Kindle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #21 on: Sun Jun 13, 2010 - 15:28:39 »
Thank you very much for the welcome, Eagle.
S1n4m1n, this thread struck a chord for me; a bit close to home.  It's much easier for me to respond with possibilities from what might be your wife's perspective here. (In my case it was indeed depression, and as Ela and others stated; it's much better to check out that possibility foremost.  The right med can really help if that is the issue. The things I listed are concepts my husband mainly utilized to help get us back on track...)   

Offline Tandemlady

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #22 on: Sun Jun 13, 2010 - 20:14:30 »
I'm disgusted with my wife in that she is the full time "homemaker" and yet doesn't fulfil her role. On a scale of 1 to 10 I'd put it at a 2. It seems like she has very little concern for how we live (we have 3 children), other than "prettifying" or 3 year old daughter when we go out in public.

This has been a continual problem in our marriage (married 13 years). Examples of the types of problems:

1) I would repeatedly tell her to make sure that diapers were properly thrown away - I come home from work, diapers or pull-ups laying on the floor (thankfully this has stopped since our children were potty trained)

2) I come home for lunch from work almost everyday - who fixes lunch for the children during this period, I do, many times the wife doesn't even know what food in the house to prepare

3) Doesn't prepare dinner - wife said she couldn't cook because the stove we had was too old, I bought a $700 stove exactly what she wanted and she still doesn't prepare dinner. Either I do the cooking or we eat out. I don't mind cooking so this isn't that much of a problem, except I end up coming home from work, cooking dinner, setting the table, and wait on everyone hand and foot during the meal

4) House cleaning is virtually nonexistant - if I don't do it it doesn't get done with the exception of clothes washing and dish washing. Literally food and mess laying on the floor for weeks, if I don't clean it up.

This has been the essential dispute between my wife and I our entire marriage, I consider it to be slothfulness and a sin. I would understand if she worked full-time or even part-time but this is her only job.

I'll ask her what she did for the day and she'll reply "I don't have to tell you", stuff like that.

I've tried for years and years and I'm at the end of my rope. Finally, I've told her that if she doesn't change I will divorce her. I'm tired of the yelling and fights that we have (in front of the children too) about the same issue over and over. It's like she doesn't care.

 
Your post could have been written by my husband until about 2 years ago (well..."parts" of it, anyway).

I agree with BobsRib that you need to live with your wife with understanding and compassion....you can catch a lot more flies with honey than you can with vinegar.   

I also agree with another poster who says that it sounds as if your wife is severely depressed.....a depression that is an unending cycle....she wants to clean house and please you....but nothing she does is "good enough"  (even doing laundry and dishes well gets little or no recognition or appreciation from you).  I used to ask my husband "Why is it you 'see'  what I haven't done but seem to never 'see' what I have done?" 

Once I started on antidepressant medication and counseling, I started pointing out to my husband when I would dust or mop the kitchen floor (he would NOT notice at all if I I didn't tell him what I had done).  I remember one time I told him what I had done and he said, "Well, you are SUPPOSED to do that...that's part of your 'job' as a wife!"  (Needless to say, that went over like a "lead balloon"). ::frown::  I promptly responded "...and so is kissing me....what if I didn't give you any 'credit' for being kind and romantic....just because it's 'your job' as a husband?"

You say you have 3 children....you only mention the 3-year old...how old are the others?  Are they old enough to "help" mommy by making sure their belongings are where they are supposed to be?

I KNOW how difficult it is to keep the house "picked up" with children (regardless of their ages) in the home. 

When our children were growing up, my husband pretty much worked 12 hours a day/7 days a week....and I worked 40 hours a week.  At one point, we did hire someone to come in once every two weeks to mop, vaccuum, dust, and clean the bathrooms but it got where she wasn't doing a good job.

I retired in 2003 but our daughter was still in school and I was still unable to "keep up" with the housekeeping.  (I AM an excellent cook and clothes launderer).

My husband retired in 2008 and our daughter graduated from college a few months ago.....and our house is "lived in"---(not "perfect") but a lot better organized and "picked up" and "cleaner" than ever before.   My husband is also an excellent cook, so now we enjoy cooking together.

My husband is a bit OCD and I have a bit of a "hoarder" in me!  (One thing I'm going to ask God when I get to heaven is "why do opposites attract???" ???  ::giggle::

What I'm trying to say is that with love, patience, and understanding...and TIME....it can and undoubtedly WILL get better. 

Again, FIND things for which to compliment your wife.....show and TELL her that you appreciate her for being a good mother, for being a good clothes launderer, for washing the dishes promptly and not letting them "stack up" in the sink.  And for taking care of herself for YOU and your children. LIFT her spirits any way you can.

Ohhh, by the way, taking care of a 3 year old all day ( let alone, the other two children).....IS a FULL-TIME job....

Regarding the cooking of meals....get a slow cooker...put the meat/vegies in it before you go to work....and presto!  dinner when you get home.

Take your lunch to work....STOP going home at lunch and she will stop depending on you to see to the kiddo's lunches.....who knows?  She may feel like you think she is so inept that she has just "given up"...and lets YOU do it "YOUR" way.  (Which again COMPOUNDS her depression).

Get (and most importantly READ) the book "The Power of a Praying Husband" by Stormie Omartian.

Blessings!

Tandemlady


 

« Last Edit: Sun Jun 13, 2010 - 20:23:00 by Tandemlady »

Offline kensington

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #23 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 05:55:11 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce. Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?


Chosen this is only sorta on topic....

If the husband was not working/will not work/had not worked for 13 years just sat around making a mess   would you say
Quote
..... but cant see that it is a cause for divorce....


You liked her enough to make 3 kids she must do something right.    I could not live in the mess i would leave and take my kids.  Hoping to wake her up.


I agree Light


 I would say the same. Its not right or loving to act this way (as I have already said), and seems very irresponsible, but since when has being messy been grounds for divorce?


It it grounds for a separation, and a refusal to reconcile until long term changes are made.  I have been married 24 years, and we agreed I would be a stay at home wife and mother.  If I did not live up to that, my husband could certainly leave me and keep a home of his own. 

There is no excuse for a wife not cooking her husband a meal or EVER doing any house work or laundry if she does not work a full time job outside of the home.  I personally, would leave.  Maybe as a believer you cannot divorce, but you can leave.  You can have a home or apt that is decent for you and your kids to enjoy.  Titus 2 says for the older women to be teachers of the young women that they should be chaste keepers at home. Biting at someone who is working and meeting the financial obligations of his family and who just wants a halfway decent home and a cooked meal once in a while to me is moot. Because it's a command of God that his wife is SUPPOSED to be doing those things.

It's her reasonable service unto the LORD.  If she is not a Christian, then... so be it.  She is not tied to this word, but if she is, then she is.  And He has every right to leave and get a place of his own until she wakes up and becomes what she is called to be by God.  It's my guess, that she doesn't do anything, because in her mind, he won't leave, he is bound because he is a Christian.  But, leaving doesn't mean divorce and I personally would leave.  And I'd sell that stove to pay for it.

Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #24 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 12:08:12 »
I am sure it is frustrating, but cant see that it is a cause for divorce. Have you tried counselling to help sort this out? Has she always been so messy and unable to want to cook?


Chosen this is only sorta on topic....

If the husband was not working/will not work/had not worked for 13 years just sat around making a mess   would you say
Quote
..... but cant see that it is a cause for divorce....


You liked her enough to make 3 kids she must do something right.    I could not live in the mess i would leave and take my kids.  Hoping to wake her up.


I agree Light


 I would say the same. Its not right or loving to act this way (as I have already said), and seems very irresponsible, but since when has being messy been grounds for divorce?


Being messy is not, essentially, the problem. The problem is not fulfilling one's duties. I'm not asking for perfection, I'm asking for a good faith effort. I fulfill my duties by providing for my family the necessities of life: food, clothing, shelter and beyond. I also try to be loving and kind, though I admit I'm not perfect.

This problem isn't a one time deal, but has been festering for 13 years. I've asked for ladies at church to help teach her to be a homemaker. I've asked my wife to find a marriage counselor (I don't want to be accused of picking someone that will take my side). I've provided for every tool she said she needed. I personally do 95% of the house cleaning. I've told my wife that if she didn't want to clean she can get a job and we'll pay for a house cleaner. I've made schedules (which amounted to cleaning one room a day). I've shown her the flylady website.

What I face is a stubborn, obstinate refusal to contribute to the well being of the household. The only method I know of that will communicate the gravity of the situation is tell her I intend to divorce. If she decides she doesn't want to change, then there is nothing further I can do to help her. The only thing I can do is remove myself, and my children, from a destructive situation.

Ken

Offline kensington

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #25 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 12:37:54 »
I would not live in filth for anyone.  God doesn't call us to that.  When Hosea's wife went back out to her filth in her life, God didn't command Hosea to go with her. 

Call her out of it, and if she doesn't change, leave.  NOTE: I did not say divorce.  I said refuse to live that way... and take the kids with you.  Leave until she shows a noticeable pattern of change.  You can eat sandwiches, but you cannot live healthy in filth.

Offline OldDad

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #26 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 12:49:37 »
Taking care of a three year old is NOT a fulltime job.

Offline Eagle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #27 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 13:00:01 »
Old Dad you and i agree  LOOK OUT

Now days the kids run the farm so daily life gets screwy. 

Nap time for the kids was  MY time (1-2 hours) and they went to bed about dark  so WE had some time. 

Young parents make things so hard on them selfs these days. 

I can't believe what i see in children in the church setting.  Walking around being disruptive Guess folks dont know some of the OTHER uses for the rest room! 

ok ok this is not a thread about kids..

Offline kensington

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #28 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 13:11:08 »
Taking care of a three year old is NOT a fulltime job.

Did I miss something?  You know me, I probably did.

Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #29 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 15:33:20 »
I would not live in filth for anyone.  God doesn't call us to that.  When Hosea's wife went back out to her filth in her life, God didn't command Hosea to go with her.  

Call her out of it, and if she doesn't change, leave.  NOTE: I did not say divorce.  I said refuse to live that way... and take the kids with you.  Leave until she shows a noticeable pattern of change.  You can eat sandwiches, but you cannot live healthy in filth.

Yes, I've thought about seperation instead of divorce. However, I think she would justify it in her head that "he'll have to come home sooner or later".

My wife is a "faithful" member of the Church of Christ (goes to church 3 times a week) with the typical understanding of marriage and divorce. Marriage is permanent and divorce is only permitted in cases of adultery. It seems to me that all she cares about is being married with no care for any of the attached responsibilities (except for sexual faithfulness, that would mean I could rightly get a divorce).

« Last Edit: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 15:44:50 by s1n4m1n »

Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #30 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 16:07:11 »
Taking care of a three year old is NOT a fulltime job.

Did I miss something?  You know me, I probably did.

He's responding to Tandemlady's post above:

Quote
Ohhh, by the way, taking care of a 3 year old all day ( let alone, the other two children).....IS a FULL-TIME job....

Except for the fact this past school year my 3 year old (we have 3, 6 and 10 year olds) was in preK-3 all morning. This was because of my wife's specific complain that she was too busy watching the daughter.

Before that you don't want to know the number of times I came home for lunch to children wearing diapers or pull-ups filled with urine and/or feces, only to hear the inevitable "I just changed her". Or come home from work with a DVD playing the title screen in the living room with the wife somewhere else in the house oblivious to the fact the DVD movie ended 30 minutes ago.



Offline vonny

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #31 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 16:13:18 »
Quote
Before that you don't want to know the number of times I came home for lunch to children wearing diapers or pull-ups filled with urine and/or feces, only to hear the inevitable "I just changed her"

This isn't to retract anything I wrote earlier, because I believe things are bad.

Being a mum of  six, one still in nappies, I can say that it is possible for a nappy to get pretty yucky very quickly,even full of wee wee very quick, lol. I've been surprised many times how yucky they can get right after changing, and I would hope no one would judge me on that without knowing for sure. Does the little one get sore with being left in the nappy?


Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #32 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 16:26:04 »
I know of someone very close to me who for years had a very difficult time keeping up...and to her husbands shagrin. He got to the point of being very disrespectful and emotionally hurtful altho not in public as he didn't want anyone to think that he had anything wrong with him.

She was finally diagnosed with a mental illness and was given med's that totally changed things on her part...altho by that time the damage was done.

People's behaviors do not normally happen out of a void...there are reasons. The root cause is what to aim at, not the behaviors. This person I speak of...the having children and the added household responsibilities triggered her mental illness to come to the surface...or to be evident.

Do some research....note her specific behaviors...find out...approach her in a "I want to help" attitude instead of a "I think you are a sloth" attitude. I encourage you to put your foot down gently...especially after you have gained some specific knowledge that would truly help. She does need intervention....she doesn't need more hurt or being looked down on.

  Good resource--  < http://www.nami.org/ >

Also, United Way has lots of resources as well -- Call 211


Apparently, based on discussions with my wife, her "root cause" is the fact that when she was growing up her mother never gave her any responsibility. Based on comments from her sisters my wife's concept of responsibility is not having to do something if you don't want to.

I think my wife's main problem is the fear of failure. Like I've said before, I've asked her to see a psychiatrist but she doesn't want to.


Offline s1n4m1n

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #33 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 16:35:26 »
Quote
Before that you don't want to know the number of times I came home for lunch to children wearing diapers or pull-ups filled with urine and/or feces, only to hear the inevitable "I just changed her"

This isn't to retract anything I wrote earlier, because I believe things are bad.

Being a mum of  six, one still in nappies, I can say that it is possible for a nappy to get pretty yucky very quickly,even full of wee wee very quick, lol. I've been surprised many times how yucky they can get right after changing, and I would hope no one would judge me on that without knowing for sure. Does the little one get sore with being left in the nappy?



I know for a fact they weren't changed because I looked to see if there were any disposed of. Also, sorry to be graphic, feces dried on the bottom is a good indication of how long diapers are on. This was a regularly occuring problem.

I'm not some idiot father who never changed the children's diapers. Let's get that out of the way. I have changed thousands of diapers. I know as much as anyone about the topic. The likelihood this type of thing (completely filled diapers hanging down) happening for many, many, many days just a few minutes before I get home is extremely remote.

Thankfully, that time is over as all my children are potty trained.

Offline Kindle

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Re: Wife won't clean house
« Reply #34 on: Tue Jun 15, 2010 - 17:31:47 »
Well, you would know her mental and emotional state better than anyone.  I always worry. MY family seems particularily challenged with those issues.  How are you yourself doing?  I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you or your perceptions.  But men, it seems, are less likely to seek assistance in sorting out the serious issues. Please allow yourself whatever help you feel you need. Professionals are paid to be objective. It's really easy for the rest of us, me certainly included, to be otherwise.