A Cry For Help

[NewCreature]

I'm posting this here because I have nowhere else to go (that I can think of). I've exhausted all my known options, from my large social group (which includes multiple pastors), to the various churches in the area, even to organizations like Teen Challenge. So, my attention turned online. I googled "Christian mens forum", and this one popped up.

Honestly, part of the reason I'm posting this is simply cuz I hurt so much, that I need to get this off my chest. I also hope that Jesus does something with this post ... but I'm not really expecting it. Everywhere I've gone (and I've gone a lot of places), I've hit a wall. So I hardly expect this to be any different. I really, really, really hope that I'm wrong, though, and that something DOES come of this ...

Anyway.

As the title says, this is a cry for help.

THE PAST
In January of 2012 my life was so miserable that I finally surrendered to Jesus. That was the year I turned 21. A lot has changed, since then. I changed. And, according to those who know me best, I changed a lot, and fast.

A few years in, I told my mom that her love had kept me from killing myself, growing up. I told her that I knew how much she loved me, and so I knew how much my death would devastate her. And the thought of devastating her ...? It devastated me to such a point that I couldn't even give suicide enough thought.

In response to me telling her this, she told me the following story ...

I was in 5th grade. I was sitting with her on the front steps of the school I went to at the time, and somehow the topic of suicide came up. She said, "You know that would devastate me, right?" At which point I burst into tears and said, "That's the only reason I can't do it."

That was 5th grade. I was 11 years old, and already I had suffered so much that I longed to die.

But Jesus saved my life. He knew what would stop me: the pain of imagining my mom devastated (as well as the fear of hell). In this way, he stripped from me the freedom to kill myself.

But he didn't heal me. I was still in excruciating emotional pain, and so I found ways to cope with the pain. For one, I suppressed it as much as I could, lying to myself until I'd convinced myself that I was ok. And for two, I self-medicated with pleasures such as porn, sex, games, stories, and food. But that coping couldn't last. Eventually, the pain caught up with me, and I knew I'd eventually snap. So I gave up fighting Jesus, and surrendered to him.

The porn and sex ended right then. Stopped cold turkey (THAT was a hell all it's own). Over the following 4 years, the games, stories, and food have slowly been taken from me as well. Now, finally, in the past 2 years, Jesus has taken away my last coping mechanism: the lying. He's told me to face the pain. To feel it. And to just ... cry. To grieve.

THE PRESENT
Right now, nothing keeps the pain away except for Jesus himself, the power of his Spirit within me, and that indescribable peace that waxes and wanes in strength. Some days, the peace is so powerful that I feel better and more joyful than I ever have in my entire life.

But on other days ...? Days like today ...?

I've never understood why people cut themselves. But now, to some extent, I do: it's a cry for help. Alongside of suicide and other reckless, dangerous behaviors, it seems to be the only thing that will explain to people HOW much pain I'm really in.

But people don't get it. They see me functioning, because I have that undescribable peace of God ... and because my masks are still second-nature to me. Masks I still can't wholly drop, cuz the people around me can't handle seeing me. They're too immature. They'd be hurt, or freak out and call the cops, not understanding how horribly safe I am.

"Horribly" safe, because just like with suicide, God has stripped from me the ability to gravely wound myself — and I will sooner suffer and die than hurt anyone else. And so I have nothing, nothing I can do. And the pain is all the worse, when you can do nothing.

I'm crying almost every day: the loud, messy crying that causes my whole body to clench and leaves me feeling drained, oftentimes with an ache in my chest (because of how much I've used my diaphragm and lungs). And even though I refuse to do it, the idea of cutting myself still comes to mind. That, and other stupid, reckless stunts.

Like getting into a fight with a cop.

Why? Cuz it'd be a "letting go", and a way of begging Jesus to save me. A way of saying "LOOK AT ME!!! PLEASE!! DO SOMETHING!!" Like the teen who goes out and does all sorts of nonsense, just to try and get his father to pay attention to him. That's me. You can tell me "Jesus loves you" and "Jesus is with you" till you're blue in the face, and I'll still feel alone, abandoned, crying because I deserve to be abandoned, because so much of this torment is all my fault, because I refused to submit, and I'm so sorry, sorry, sorry, and I just want my Dad to come back home, to hold me, to comfort me, to discipline me — SOMETHING!! — just please don't leave me. Please, don't leave me ...

The truth is that Jesus is here, watching over me, protecting me. Much like my mom's love, his love is why I'm safe, unable to wound myself or do other stupid stunts like getting into a fight with a cop. His love is why I can wait, even in the midst of this hell. His love is why I can fathom that maybe, juuust maybe, this post might matter. Because he's saved me before, using online posts. He's already healed me so much.

... but I'm not done. I'm still wounded. I'm still the traumatized, abused little kid, abandoned by his dad, who chose to hold onto his hate, his spite, planting a root of bitterness so deep, and now who suffers every day because of the tree that grew.

Only, now I'm trapped in a 27 year old body.

Why do we only think of minors as "orphans"? Why is it that, suddenly, an orphan stops being an orphan when they turn 18, or 21, or 40, or 67 ...?

I'm still an orphan.

And it crushes me every day.

THE FUTURE
I long for a male authority figure, for a man I can submit to — a man I can serve. I want that second chance. I want to be comforted, held. I want the roughhousing, even the discipline. It's why I want to get into a fight with a cop. I want to drop all the masks, to let go and stop suppressing everything, to fight! ... and to lose, to be pinned, held down. Even prison has an appeal. I want the freedom that comes with total humility, with no control, when everything is taken from you: my possessions, my dignity. And I could just let loose, in there, because I know that if I ever fight, I'm the only one who will be hurt. I'll always lose. And that gives me the freedom to lash out. Furthermore, I'd be pursued, not allowed to leave, as if they wanted me ... but none of this would be in love. And so, I expect it'd be a bad idea.

I'm kinda messed up, aren't I? Heh. That's putting it lightly ...

But do you see the constant theme?

Letting go ... not hiding ... expressing everything ... submitting ... being held down ... being hit ... being held ... losing everything ... it can all be summed up in three words.

Freedom in humility.

That's what I long for. And it's not something I can take for myself. The dead cannot bring themselves to life. Children cannot give birth to themselves. And we cannot take away our own control. We have to be brought to life, birthed anew, and have our control (our pride) stripped away. Only Jesus can do that, and he's doing it to me — which, I suppose, is why I'm still stuck in this wilderness.

He's not letting me out in my timing.

But he has promised to let me out.

And so, my questions to y'all are these:

Is there anyone who can give me that place to submit, to obey ...?

Is there a man somewhere who will give me a second chance ...?

Are there any brothers in Christ who actually want to help me heal ...?

Is there anyone who can live out the gospel of Jesus Christ, pursuing me like a lost sheep, and thereby give meaning to the words that I've spoken and heard spoken a thousand times ...?

The truth is that I'm forgiven. And I've focused on this truth for so many years, reading scripture, telling myself this truth over and over and over again so as to get through the hard times ... and all the while, I was lying to myself without realizing it, thinking that focusing on and speaking the words was all it took to believe it.

((To make it explicitly clear: The lie was that I thought I believed the truth, when I don't.))

Yes, the truth is that Jesus has forgiven me. He loves me unconditionally. He pursued me like a lost sheep, tackled me to the ground, broke my legs, and carried me home. And I've put my faith and hope in this truth. And I've tasted little tidbits of it. I've seen it in my mom.

But because I've never experienced this from a man, I don't believe it. Or, rather, I don't know (ginosko) it. I don't know that I'm forgiven. Heck, I don't even know that God has seen my sins, and therefore am constantly fighting the fear of "if he sees my sin, he'll destroy and abandon me".

So, again I ask: is there a male authority figure somewhere who can SHOW me the truth? Who can convince me that he sees my sins, considers them disgusting, and will do what it takes to cleanse/forgive me ...?

Chase me down and break my legs, if you have to. Seriously. God knows a spanking, a beating, whatever, is nothing comparative to the hell I've faced. If anything, it'll just help me let go and submit.

I know this becuase I've been pinned, before, by a friend who taught jui-jutsu. When this happened, I had to fight to keep from crying, to keep the mask in place.

I even slap myself in the face, at times, or hit my arms, or punch hard things, all because the pain speaks of a hint of that submission, that loss of control, that freedom that I long for, and that hint brings the slightest taste of comfort.

Anyway, I'll stop here. Not much more to say.

I hope y'all understand, at least, if nothing more.

And if you've read this far ... well ... thanks. If nothing else, perhaps you can say a prayer for me.

Supposedly prayers are powerful. That's another thing I struggle to believe.

[Dave_UK]

Am greatly surprised that no others  on this forum (far better suited than I) have given some answer to your desperate cry for help!

Having read your post carefully, I was struck of the pre-ponderance of the pronouns "I" and "me"  (apart from mentioning your mum and absent dad) - and this seems, I reckon to be the nub of the problem.  We are not meant to live for ourselves - perhaps you might know that we are urged to love our "neighbours" as we love ourselves (not hurting ourselves in any way, but taking care to live healthily) etc,.  Everyone has problems of some sort, lets endeavour to help one another!  Would that I might be able to live out the words of that hymn "Brother let me be your servant, let me be as Christ to you". We cannot possibly please the Lord by ignoring Him, whenever we choose. All of life is a struggle - and for sure, what The Holy Spirit would like you to do - may not coincide with your intents - we call this the battle between the "flesh and the Spirit"!

You have cried out to Jesus, and I know He has heard your cry - He hears all our desperate cries! (There have been so many who have witnessed that in their desperate crises when calling out, as for instance "Lord - if you really exist - help me!" - have found genuine help, in some form or way!)  If you truly seek Him you will find His care ("For those who would come to God must believe that He exists, and is a rewarder of those who seek His face").  I didn't want to really start throwing Scripture verses around - but some are too important to miss! What you need to realize is that you are no longer  "just yourself".  When you asked Jesus to be Lord of your life - He came (in part) to dwell within you - the question is "What have you done with Him?"  - have you got Him closeted hidden away somewhere inside you?  Do you "hear" the voice of His spirit, warning you not to do things that will grieve Him?  If you don't "hear" Him (a quiet inner voice, sometimes just words that seem to pop up in the mind) - if there is nothing but silence, it is a sure sign that something is radically wrong in ones's life that offends the Lord and needs to be put right!  If you read the Gospels - follow up the "trail" (you may need a good concordance for this) from where in John's gospel, Jesus says "I in you and you in Me" (e.g. in the epistle to the Romans and Corinthians etc - regarding the indwelling spirit - you will come across some deeply thought provoking statements along the way) .  You need to communicate with Him, presenting yourself to Him, asking Him to show you the way to go (He is in fact "The Way") One of my favourite books refers to our indwelling spirit of Jesus by the title of "Resident Boss" - and that's the way it should be, we often need to be "pointed in the right direction"! Just remember, He knows best in all circumstances. When you pray - just remember too that because He knows best - the answer may not be to your liking - yet as He is the very best, the finest - we need to submit to His rule in our lives!

Set aside time, preferably on a daily basis, to spend maybe 1/2 hour or more, reading from the Gospels - and memorize what hits you as important! You will also benefit by reading some of the Psalms, Proverbs and Epistles  - then when you are distraught, the Lord will remind you of what you have memorized and bring you solace!

There is much more that one might say - but lets leave it at that for now!

[Dave_UK]

I'm posting this here because I have nowhere else to go (that I can think of). I've exhausted all my known options, from my large social group (which includes multiple pastors), to the various churches in the area, even to organizations like Teen Challenge. So, my attention turned online. I googled "Christian mens forum", and this one popped up.

Honestly, part of the reason I'm posting this is simply cuz I hurt so much, that I need to get this off my chest. I also hope that Jesus does something with this post ... but I'm not really expecting it. Everywhere I've gone (and I've gone a lot of places), I've hit a wall. So I hardly expect this to be any different. I really, really, really hope that I'm wrong, though, and that something DOES come of this ...

Anyway.

As the title says, this is a cry for help.

THE PAST
In January of 2012 my life was so miserable that I finally surrendered to Jesus. That was the year I turned 21. A lot has changed, since then. I changed. And, according to those who know me best, I changed a lot, and fast.

A few years in, I told my mom that her love had kept me from killing myself, growing up. I told her that I knew how much she loved me, and so I knew how much my death would devastate her. And the thought of devastating her ...? It devastated me to such a point that I couldn't even give suicide enough thought.

In response to me telling her this, she told me the following story ...

I was in 5th grade. I was sitting with her on the front steps of the school I went to at the time, and somehow the topic of suicide came up. She said, "You know that would devastate me, right?" At which point I burst into tears and said, "That's the only reason I can't do it."

That was 5th grade. I was 11 years old, and already I had suffered so much that I longed to die.

But Jesus saved my life. He knew what would stop me: the pain of imagining my mom devastated (as well as the fear of hell). In this way, he stripped from me the freedom to kill myself.

But he didn't heal me. I was still in excruciating emotional pain, and so I found ways to cope with the pain. For one, I suppressed it as much as I could, lying to myself until I'd convinced myself that I was ok. And for two, I self-medicated with pleasures such as porn, sex, games, stories, and food. But that coping couldn't last. Eventually, the pain caught up with me, and I knew I'd eventually snap. So I gave up fighting Jesus, and surrendered to him.

The porn and sex ended right then. Stopped cold turkey (THAT was a hell all it's own). Over the following 4 years, the games, stories, and food have slowly been taken from me as well. Now, finally, in the past 2 years, Jesus has taken away my last coping mechanism: the lying. He's told me to face the pain. To feel it. And to just ... cry. To grieve.

THE PRESENT
Right now, nothing keeps the pain away except for Jesus himself, the power of his Spirit within me, and that indescribable peace that waxes and wanes in strength. Some days, the peace is so powerful that I feel better and more joyful than I ever have in my entire life.

But on other days ...? Days like today ...?

I've never understood why people cut themselves. But now, to some extent, I do: it's a cry for help. Alongside of suicide and other reckless, dangerous behaviors, it seems to be the only thing that will explain to people HOW much pain I'm really in.

But people don't get it. They see me functioning, because I have that undescribable peace of God ... and because my masks are still second-nature to me. Masks I still can't wholly drop, cuz the people around me can't handle seeing me. They're too immature. They'd be hurt, or freak out and call the cops, not understanding how horribly safe I am.

"Horribly" safe, because just like with suicide, God has stripped from me the ability to gravely wound myself — and I will sooner suffer and die than hurt anyone else. And so I have nothing, nothing I can do. And the pain is all the worse, when you can do nothing.

I'm crying almost every day: the loud, messy crying that causes my whole body to clench and leaves me feeling drained, oftentimes with an ache in my chest (because of how much I've used my diaphragm and lungs). And even though I refuse to do it, the idea of cutting myself still comes to mind. That, and other stupid, reckless stunts.

Like getting into a fight with a cop.

Why? Cuz it'd be a "letting go", and a way of begging Jesus to save me. A way of saying "LOOK AT ME!!! PLEASE!! DO SOMETHING!!" Like the teen who goes out and does all sorts of nonsense, just to try and get his father to pay attention to him. That's me. You can tell me "Jesus loves you" and "Jesus is with you" till you're blue in the face, and I'll still feel alone, abandoned, crying because I deserve to be abandoned, because so much of this torment is all my fault, because I refused to submit, and I'm so sorry, sorry, sorry, and I just want my Dad to come back home, to hold me, to comfort me, to discipline me — SOMETHING!! — just please don't leave me. Please, don't leave me ...

The truth is that Jesus is here, watching over me, protecting me. Much like my mom's love, his love is why I'm safe, unable to wound myself or do other stupid stunts like getting into a fight with a cop. His love is why I can wait, even in the midst of this hell. His love is why I can fathom that maybe, juuust maybe, this post might matter. Because he's saved me before, using online posts. He's already healed me so much.

... but I'm not done. I'm still wounded. I'm still the traumatized, abused little kid, abandoned by his dad, who chose to hold onto his hate, his spite, planting a root of bitterness so deep, and now who suffers every day because of the tree that grew.

Only, now I'm trapped in a 27 year old body.

Why do we only think of minors as "orphans"? Why is it that, suddenly, an orphan stops being an orphan when they turn 18, or 21, or 40, or 67 ...?

I'm still an orphan.

And it crushes me every day.

THE FUTURE
I long for a male authority figure, for a man I can submit to — a man I can serve. I want that second chance. I want to be comforted, held. I want the roughhousing, even the discipline. It's why I want to get into a fight with a cop. I want to drop all the masks, to let go and stop suppressing everything, to fight! ... and to lose, to be pinned, held down. Even prison has an appeal. I want the freedom that comes with total humility, with no control, when everything is taken from you: my possessions, my dignity. And I could just let loose, in there, because I know that if I ever fight, I'm the only one who will be hurt. I'll always lose. And that gives me the freedom to lash out. Furthermore, I'd be pursued, not allowed to leave, as if they wanted me ... but none of this would be in love. And so, I expect it'd be a bad idea.

I'm kinda messed up, aren't I? Heh. That's putting it lightly ...

But do you see the constant theme?

Letting go ... not hiding ... expressing everything ... submitting ... being held down ... being hit ... being held ... losing everything ... it can all be summed up in three words.

Freedom in humility.

That's what I long for. And it's not something I can take for myself. The dead cannot bring themselves to life. Children cannot give birth to themselves. And we cannot take away our own control. We have to be brought to life, birthed anew, and have our control (our pride) stripped away. Only Jesus can do that, and he's doing it to me — which, I suppose, is why I'm still stuck in this wilderness.

He's not letting me out in my timing.

But he has promised to let me out.

And so, my questions to y'all are these:

Is there anyone who can give me that place to submit, to obey ...?

Is there a man somewhere who will give me a second chance ...?

Are there any brothers in Christ who actually want to help me heal ...?

Is there anyone who can live out the gospel of Jesus Christ, pursuing me like a lost sheep, and thereby give meaning to the words that I've spoken and heard spoken a thousand times ...?

The truth is that I'm forgiven. And I've focused on this truth for so many years, reading scripture, telling myself this truth over and over and over again so as to get through the hard times ... and all the while, I was lying to myself without realizing it, thinking that focusing on and speaking the words was all it took to believe it.

((To make it explicitly clear: The lie was that I thought I believed the truth, when I don't.))

Yes, the truth is that Jesus has forgiven me. He loves me unconditionally. He pursued me like a lost sheep, tackled me to the ground, broke my legs, and carried me home. And I've put my faith and hope in this truth. And I've tasted little tidbits of it. I've seen it in my mom.

But because I've never experienced this from a man, I don't believe it. Or, rather, I don't know (ginosko) it. I don't know that I'm forgiven. Heck, I don't even know that God has seen my sins, and therefore am constantly fighting the fear of "if he sees my sin, he'll destroy and abandon me".

So, again I ask: is there a male authority figure somewhere who can SHOW me the truth? Who can convince me that he sees my sins, considers them disgusting, and will do what it takes to cleanse/forgive me ...?

Chase me down and break my legs, if you have to. Seriously. God knows a spanking, a beating, whatever, is nothing comparative to the hell I've faced. If anything, it'll just help me let go and submit.

I know this becuase I've been pinned, before, by a friend who taught jui-jutsu. When this happened, I had to fight to keep from crying, to keep the mask in place.

I even slap myself in the face, at times, or hit my arms, or punch hard things, all because the pain speaks of a hint of that submission, that loss of control, that freedom that I long for, and that hint brings the slightest taste of comfort.

Anyway, I'll stop here. Not much more to say.

I hope y'all understand, at least, if nothing more.

And if you've read this far ... well ... thanks. If nothing else, perhaps you can say a prayer for me.

Supposedly prayers are powerful. That's another thing I struggle to believe.

Think I've read your post 3 times now - please excuse my high-lighting in blue and bolding - that's to remind me of the bits that particularly need attention.


I read a book once that contained a section on the "orphan" spirit  within some of us.  I didn't have a happy relationship with my own dad - he had a wickedly violent temper - but sometimes he behaved in  a sensible "just" way

(Like the time in my early teens when I went on a long cycle trip without warning my parents - saw what I had been "itching" to go around - Winchester cathedral, but got a puncture on the way home - no repair kit with me - no money to get a train back nearer home - no cell phone in those days - and to add to my woes, the rain "bucketted down". When I eventually got home late, weary and wet - my dad took off his army belt, exposed my bare rump and gave me my "just" punishment - something I never forgot!  You can read about - not withholding "just" punishment - in Proverbs!)

There were continual matrimonial brutal rows at home.  My dad was on 2 foreign tours of duty - (site foreman for the building of the Naval hospital at Kowloon - for which Earl Mountbatten presented him with an MBE) - and got involved with other women during that stay in the Orient - during most of my teen years - being absent at one critical time when trying to decide what career to take up after schooling finished. On one occasion, I was ejected from home for taking my mum's side in the conflicts  - until the final split came and my dad left home to "shack up" with another woman.  That was a relief for my mum, younger sister, and myself.  (There is in fact a lot more to this story, but have just mentioned a few points!) So I have some empathy with those suffering from "an orphan spirit" In fact, when I finally became a Christian and the Lord "touched" my life (circa 40! - BTW am now 82!) I wrote in my Bible (given to me by my wife to celebrate that fact) "I have a Father who loves me!"

I would like to deal with the last, red high-lighted, part of your post first!  There is one Scripture passage that is imprinted on my mind regarding this - "If we ask for anything according to His will, He hears us, and if He hears us, we know that we have the petitions that we ask." (this does work! Subject to the Lord's omniscient knowledge of what is good for us - in other words, it may not tally with what we hope for!!!

Think this is necessarily going to be a long post and I want to say something about what the Lord is likely to communicate to us - in a nutshell it will be pithy and meet our immediate concerns - so if the still small voice "says" "I have heard you!", then rejoice - for whatever the outcome of the problem, it is in His capable hands - and all we have to do is trust Him!!!

In my limited experience, the Lord's "words" to me are usually few in number - like "Do not go there!", "You do not need that!" etc,. I doubt very much that if you were to ask about some mystery of His cosmos - that you, as a puzzled non astro-physicist, would get a relevant "reply" - rather, I would expect the Lord to point you to the verses at the end of the book of Job! "  ...But I have spoken of great things which I have not understood, things too wonderful for me to know...". 
Sometimes I think the Lord will graciously show us some picture instead of a few words - e.g. in response to a cry for help in finding some necessary item that has got mislaid (these "senior moments" plague a lot of us)! Do not go "all religious" and ask the Lord about trivial things of obvious little consequence to your day.  e.g. Don't ask Him what colour socks you should wear!!!


Think you need to be very careful if the decision you wish to make depends on what you think you"hear" from the HS - do not be over-hasty in action if the decision is obviously life-changing (e.g. new job, moving, getting married etc,) - check it out!  I don't think (from experience! ) that you can rely 100% on Godly advice from others, because only the Lord knows the full details about a situation.  I have made a note in my Bible of advice from pastor Charles Stanley, about finding God's will for a situation that is of great import.  His advice seems wise, if rather long in its  time for application!  I quote it here for your possible benefit  : -

(1) Is the decision I am about to make consistent with the Word of God?

(2) Is this a WISE decision - think of the consequences - does the HS give a witness in your heart?

(3) Can I honestly ask God to enable me to do this?

(4) Do I have GENUINE peace about this?

(5) Does this 'fit in' with who I am 'in Christ'? (I.e. In accordance with Christ's discipline of cleanliness of thought, and right behaviour)

(6) Does this 'fit in' with God's overall plan for my life?

(7) If I make this decision - will it honour God?

  If the result is still positive after several passes of this filtering process, over a reasonable period of time - - then there is a final question : -

    Now that I know His will - Am I willing to do it???"

The length of time in doing the above filtering process does cause me some concern - for there is a Scripture verse that says "Obedience delayed is a kin to disobedience." (I can think of 2 such examples in the OT (1) Saul's disobedience (see book of Samuel) to fully obey the Lord's instruction (2) The rebellion" of the Israelites in their response to the 12 spies sent out to scout the Promised Land ahead - 2 spies giving a good report and the others a bad one - and then when rebuked, disastrously tried to be obedient - but too late - the "die had been cast"!)

Having mentioned the OT - perhaps I need to "nail my colours to the mast" so that you know where I "stand".  For me, the Lord's declaration of His nature to Moses in Exodus "A god compassionate and gracious - long-suffering and ever constant" stands for all time - even though Jesus has put an end to the requirements of the Jewish Law by initiating the new covenant.  Hence anywhere in the Bible where the Lord indicates His displeasure at something  that despoils His handiwork - then we need to take those concerns "on board".  I for one, certainly want to please Him, and not grieve Him in any way!

There is another important point that needs to be said.  Do not keep on "badgering" the Lord if you don't like His response to your request! Especially - do not try to "bribe" Him to change His mind, by offering additionally to do something which you would in fact find difficult or unpleasant! (Just submit, because He knows best!)



Now back to the start of your post and my blue high-lighting of items that worry me : -

I am rather perturbed that after seeking help from so many different Christian sources- no one seems to have been able to help you - and you are still hoping for an "answer".  Given your contacts with such sources, it seems most arrogant and presumptuous of me, to even suppose that I might be able to help!
 


(will resume later - and in a separate fresh post - this one is getting too long to "handle"!)

[Dave_UK]

Honestly, part of the reason I'm posting this is simply cuz I hurt so much, that I need to get this off my chest. I also hope that Jesus does something with this post ... but I'm not really expecting it. Everywhere I've gone (and I've gone a lot of places), I've hit a wall. So I hardly expect this to be any different. I really, really, really hope that I'm wrong, though, and that something DOES come of this ...

I can almost feel your hurt! Every day - every little chance occurrence - the Lord can use it in some way to your benefit (to "grow" your character), if you will only have the right "heart attitude" to whatever "circumstances" serves up to you! Do not expect anything joyful to occur if you go through life with a "downbeat" attitude.  That's like someone who walks along staring at the ground just a yard or two in front of them - oblivious to what's going on around them!  OK so sometimes we do get hurt, upset, and put down by others - but you need to give the "wrong stuff" to the Lord, to deal with, while you heave a great sigh of relief at having passed it on - to the One who knows all, and is in charge of all.   Think there is a saying "Keep close to the Shepherd" - DO THAT!  I think you will find some help from re-visiting some memorized passages from the Psalms  - which also "cry out" to the Lord (who has broad strong shoulders for all our heavy loads), when in some situations - if feeling lost, abandoned, or maybe filled with shame at having "messed up" yet again.  Find the passages that "speak" to you personally - and use them in your prayers!!! 

 On a personal note, I find it helpful to use short passages from the Psalms, like : -


...I will seek your face O Lord, do not hide it from me
Nor in the anger, turn away thy servant whose help Thou hast been.
Do not cast me off or forsake me, O God my saviour...

...To thee O Lord I call.  Oh my Rock, be not deaf to my cry;
lest if Thou answer me with silence, I become like those who go down to the Abyss.
Hear my cry for mercy when I call to Thee for help...

etc,.  Or when I "mess up" badly, I use parts of David's penitential psalm 51 : -

...Turn away Thy face from my sins and blot out all my guilt.
Create in me a pure heart, O God,
and give me a new and steadfast spirit;
do not drive me from Thy Presence
or take Thy Holy Spirit from me;
revive in me the joy of Thy deliverance
and grant me a willing spirit to uphold me....
...
Open my lips, O Lord,
that my mouth may proclaim Thy praise.
Thou hast no delight in sacrifice;
if I brought Thee an offering, Thou wouldst not accept it.
My sacrifice, O God, is a broken spirit;
a wounded heart, O God, Thou wilt not despise.


Always try to "approach" the Lord with a thankful heart (no matter what the burdens of the day have been)!  It is said that God inhabits the praises of His people - so remember that!  "I will enter His gates with thanksgiving in my heart.  I will enter His courts with praise!"

[Dave_UK]

That was 5th grade. I was 11 years old, and already I had suffered so much that I longed to die.

It seems to me that the "forces of darkness" wait until we have grown a bit - before attacking us. Around the age of puberty the onslaught seems to start.  From what you say, I am unable to get the "picture" (abuse?, loneliness?, a sense of abandonment by your dad?, or whatever!?) - but it was all in the past - water under the bridge.  As your "username" shows you have declared yourself a NEW CREATION by inviting Jesus into your life - you have a fresh start "in Him" and "He in you, by His Holy Spirit".  Do not entertain thoughts of your "victimhood" - thinking "poor me" will get you nowhere. Many of us can look back with sorrow at the turmoil of our early years (unless raised in a "normal" family - and just what is "normal" these days!?).  I think Proverbs 4:20-27 contains excellent advice : -

“My son, attend to my speech; pay heed to my words; do not let them slip out of your mind; keep them close in your heart; for they are life to him who finds them; and health to his whole body. Guard your heart more than any treasure, for it is the source of all life. Keep your mouth from crooked speech and your lips from deceitful talk. Let your eyes look straight before you, fix your gaze upon what lies ahead. Look out for the path that your feet must take and your ways will be secure. Swerve neither to right nor left, and keep clear of every evil thing.”

Like many others, I do not have very happy memories of the past - so in a sense we are "walking wounded" and it is difficult to shake off the past.  But one thing worries me about your above statement and some of the others - it is this unnatural "death-wish" which is in direct conflict with most peoples instinct for self-preservation. It may be a different matter for those near the end of their lives, incapacitated and having a poor "quality of life" (at 97 almost blind, stone-deaf, and having lost her mobility - my mum confided that she wished to die!).  They say that "Life is what you make it" and I think the Bhuddists have a saying "All that we are is the result of what we have thought, it is based and founded upon our thoughts!" and this seems fairly obvious - but the "answer" is to have right thoughts.  Do not allow wrong thoughts to dwell and "grow" in your mind, they will "fester" and lead you into sin - and "sensuality" is particularly "dangerous" in that context!  As Christians, we need to take un-Christlike thoughts captive for Him.  Now that requires discipline - I repeat below a small portion from one of my other posts, dealing with such discipline : -

"...Am not sure who said it, but this struck me as helpful at the time (just remember it works either way, according to your choice of thought - upwards  or downwards  ) : "Sow a thought - reap a deed - sow a deed - reap a habit - sow a habit - reap a life!"  Great things can result from small beginnings  there is a Bible verse that says "Do not despise the day of small beginnings!" So we can all make a fresh start on the right road!..."

Think there is an Oriental saying "Even just by drips, a water pot gets filled!".  So if we keep on making the right, apparently minor, decisions, and refuse to "accept"  or dwell on wrong thoughts - we will become, little-by-little, an "imitation of Christ", and we know that He is the very best!

(having come this far - am beginning to think my posts are much like the responses "Agony Aunts" give to their readers in some papers - but I sincerely hope that you will find my "burblings" helpful, even if only in small measure! )

[Dave_UK]

From here on, I'll comment with red highlighting on bits of of your post, as they occur, that "hit" me!

...The porn and sex ended right then. Stopped cold turkey (THAT was a hell all it's own [BRAVO!!!]). Over the following 4 years, the games, stories, and food [My wife has what seems to be an never ending battle with this - it originates back to parental neglect when she was very young (she was fostered from the age of 12), not knowing when the next meal might come.  Despite much prayer and ministry - there seems to be no relief from her greed/secret eating at times (she fights against the inevitable consequences by a strict, really self-punishing exercise regime, to keep her weight just below 8 stone - visiting 2 gyms a day, every day of the week (Oh the membership costs ) and energetic swimming for over an hour at a time. I think I know why the Lord does not free her from this "affliction" - she ignores the Lord's messages of correction, because she is frightened of "ballooning" out in size, and keeps to the only "solution" she knows will work. It's all about lack of trust in Him!  At 75, small build, 5ft high, she is probably the fittest gal in town, putting those much younger to shame!)] have slowly been taken from me as well. Now, finally, in the past 2 years, Jesus has taken away my last coping mechanism: the lying. He's told me to face the pain. To feel it. And to just ... cry. To grieve.

THE PRESENT
Right now, nothing keeps the pain away except for Jesus himself, the power of his Spirit within me, and that indescribable peace that waxes and wanes in strength. Some days, the peace is so powerful that I feel better and more joyful than I ever have in my entire life.

But on other days ...? Days like today ...?

I've never understood why people cut themselves. But now, to some extent, I do: it's a cry for help. Alongside of suicide and other reckless, dangerous behaviors, it seems to be the only thing that will explain to people HOW much pain I'm really in.

But people don't get it. They see me functioning, because I have that undescribable peace of God ... and because my masks are still second-nature to me. Masks I still can't wholly drop, cuz the people around me can't handle seeing me. They're too immature. They'd be hurt, or freak out and call the cops, not understanding how horribly safe I am.

"Horribly" safe, because just like with suicide, God has stripped from me the ability to gravely wound myself — and I will sooner suffer and die than hurt anyone else. And so I have nothing, nothing I can do. And the pain is all the worse, when you can do nothing.

I'm crying almost every day: the loud, messy crying that causes my whole body to clench and leaves me feeling drained, oftentimes with an ache in my chest (because of how much I've used my diaphragm and lungs). And even though I refuse to do it, the idea of cutting myself still comes to mind. That, and other stupid, reckless stunts.

Like getting into a fight with a cop.

Why? Cuz it'd be a "letting go", and a way of begging Jesus to save me. A way of saying "LOOK AT ME!!! PLEASE!! DO SOMETHING!!" [We readers of your agonized cries are looking!] Like the teen who goes out and does all sorts of nonsense, just to try and get his father to pay attention to him. That's me. You can tell me "Jesus loves you" and "Jesus is with you" till you're blue in the face, and I'll still feel alone, abandoned, crying because I deserve to be abandoned, because so much of this torment is all my fault, because I refused to submit, and I'm so sorry, sorry, sorry, and I just want my Dad to come back home, to hold me, to comfort me, to discipline me — SOMETHING!! — just please don't leave me. Please, don't leave me ...[You are never alone if you have given your life to Christ - He is always with you - but does he rule in your life, or do you mostly, please yourself?!]

The truth is that Jesus is here, watching over me, protecting me. Much like my mom's love, his love is why I'm safe, unable to wound myself or do other stupid stunts like getting into a fight with a cop. His love is why I can wait, even in the midst of this hell. His love is why I can fathom that maybe, juuust maybe, this post might matter. Because he's saved me before, using online posts. He's already healed me so much.

... but I'm not done. I'm still wounded. I'm still the traumatized, abused little kid, abandoned by his dad, who chose to hold onto his hate, his spite, planting a root of bitterness so deep, and now who suffers every day because of the tree that grew.

Only, now I'm trapped in a 27 year old body.

Why do we only think of minors as "orphans"? Why is it that, suddenly, an orphan stops being an orphan when they turn 18, or 21, or 40, or 67 ...?

I'm still an orphan.

And it crushes me every day. [Dwelling on the past gets us nowhere (except in determination not to repeat past mistakes) - we musn't "luxuriate" in any perceived "victimhood" - the open road of life lies before us!  In John's Gospel, after His Last Supper Discourse - Jesus says "Up, let us go forward!" - bravely going on, knowing full well what He would endure for us.  Where is your bravery, in forgetting what is past and looking to what may lie ahead?[/b]

THE FUTURE
I long for a male authority figure, for a man I can submit to — a man I can serve. I want that second chance. , even theI want to be comforted, held. I want the roughhousing, even the discipline. [This cry sounds to me as if you need to be part of team contact sport, something like "Five-a-side Soccer" league contests. I would advise "team" sport, then the contact doesn't become "too personal" (i.e. just you and a mate) as in Judo etc - or you might come adrift on that "wanting contact" business - I'll say no more on that issue!  The idea of team sport may not interest you - but you need IMO to take up some Godly activity that is of absorbing interest to you and in which you can study/strive to do well.  Competitive swimming wouldn't be the answer in your case 'cos it is a solo activity, except for the competitive element.] It's why I want to get into a fight with a cop. I want to drop all the masks [It's a sad business to go though life wearing a mask - let it go!], to let go and stop suppressing everything, to fight! ... and to lose, to be pinned, held down. Even prison has an appeal. I want the freedom that comes with total humility, with no control, when everything is taken from you: my possessions, my dignity. And I could just let loose, in there, because I know that if I ever fight, I'm the only one who will be hurt. I'll always lose. And that gives me the freedom to lash out. Furthermore, I'd be pursued, not allowed to leave, as if they wanted me ... but none of this would be in love. And so, I expect it'd be a bad idea.

I'm kinda messed up, aren't I? Heh. That's putting it lightly ...[Yus! A very bad case - but there's always hope in Jesus!]

But do you see the constant theme?

Letting go ... not hiding ... expressing everything ... submitting ... being held down ... being hit ... being held ... losing everything ... it can all be summed up in three words.

Freedom in humility.

That's what I long for. And it's not something I can take for myself. The dead cannot bring themselves to life. Children cannot give birth to themselves. And we cannot take away our own control. We have to be brought to life, birthed anew, and have our control (our pride) stripped away. Only Jesus can do that, and he's doing it to me — which, I suppose, is why I'm still stuck in this wilderness.

He's not letting me out in my timing.

But he has promised to let me out.

And so, my questions to y'all are these:

Is there anyone who can give me that place to submit, to obey ...?

Is there a man somewhere who will give me a second chance ...?

Are there any brothers in Christ who actually want to help me heal ...?

Is there anyone who can live out the gospel of Jesus Christ, pursuing me like a lost sheep, and thereby give meaning to the words that I've spoken and heard spoken a thousand times ...?

The truth is that I'm forgiven. And I've focused on this truth for so many years, reading scripture, telling myself this truth over and over and over again so as to get through the hard times ... and all the while, I was lying to myself without realizing it, thinking that focusing on and speaking the words was all it took to believe it.

((To make it explicitly clear: The lie was that I thought I believed the truth, when I don't.))

Yes, the truth is that Jesus has forgiven me. He loves me unconditionally. He pursued me like a lost sheep, tackled me to the ground, broke my legs, and carried me home. And I've put my faith and hope in this truth. And I've tasted little tidbits of it. I've seen it in my mom.

But because I've never experienced this from a man, I don't believe it. Or, rather, I don't know (ginosko) it. I don't know that I'm forgiven. Heck, I don't even know that God has seen my sins, and therefore am constantly fighting the fear of "if he sees my sin, he'll destroy and abandon me". [Doesn't the HS, after you have confessed your most recent failings - re-assure you of His forgiveness and care for you? If not, you need to "have it out" with the Lord - to find out why He isn't correcting/noticeably guiding you! Are you in communication with Him? - If not, there has to be something in your life that offends Him, and He is "waiting on you" to find out what that is! Seems to me the best thing you can do, is to regularly spend say 5 or 10 mins a day, "just waiting on Him" in silence, some might sneer and say that would be time wasted, but do you think/analyse too much - for a change, as in that little song "Be still and know that I am God"  - I know that is reminiscent of the line often attached to pictures of Rodin's sculpture "The Penseur"  - "Sometimes I sits and thinks - but, sometimes I just sits!"]. It is possible to spend too much time in self analysis - sometimes it may be necessary to "just be" in stillness!

So, again I ask: is there a male authority figure somewhere who can SHOW me the truth? Who can convince me that he sees my sins, considers them disgusting, and will do what it takes to cleanse/forgive me ...? [They call us Christians "saints" because we aim/try to follow the Way - but there is still the statement "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.".  The "bar" is set too high for us to high-jump over - unaided! So I reckon you are putting too much expectant hope in your fellow man!]
Chase me down and break my legs, if you have to. Seriously. God knows a spanking, a beating, whatever, is nothing comparative to the hell I've faced. If anything, it'll just help me let go and submit.

I know this becuase I've been pinned, before, by a friend who taught jui-jutsu [That reminds me of a brief phase in my late teens when I joined a Judo club - bad mistake!  Am extremely short-sighted, and (so I was told not aggressive enough - just defensive!) I wore wire frame specs to keep them over my ears when flung around the mat - well that was the plan, but in being flung around by a green belt (a matelot - who they said often went looking for trouble to try out his skills)  my specs flew off - so I later tried without them. No sooner did I get back on my feet, then my opponent managed to throw me yet again, and again.... - it got a bit monotonous for me, and the bods watching. At least my much more skilled opponent complimented me on my good break-falls - what else could I do!?  .  After several sessions I was so badly bruised that walking was difficult - so end of that little experiment!]. When this happened, I had to fight to keep from crying, to keep the mask in place.

I even slap myself in the face, at times, or hit my arms, or punch hard things, all because the pain speaks of a hint of that submission, that loss of control, that freedom that I long for, and that hint brings the slightest taste of comfort. [How about learning to box and joining a boxing club?  That might let off some "aggressive steam"]

Anyway, I'll stop here. Not much more to say.

I hope y'all understand, at least, if nothing more.

And if you've read this far ... well ... thanks. If nothing else, perhaps you can say a prayer for me. [I have indeed, and  it maybe that the Lord has put some thought about your situation into my mind 2 days ago - I will add an account of that below this red-highlight "hacked" quote of your original post!!! ]

Supposedly prayers are powerful. That's another thing I struggle to believe.[I tackled this point - when I wrote that I would deal with this matter first before other matters!  There was one notable time in my life when pleas to the Lord failed - our almost 13 year old, very much loved Cairn Terrier had a stroke a few hours after a happy long walk (drooling, and eyes flicking to/fro, not sure where he was) - the bleeding into his brain got worse quickly - so when he tried to stand and just toppled over, it was undeniably the end for him, despite all our deep urgent prayers.  We could only conclude that the Lord knew what was best!  Two years later and we still have his ashes in a box, as are those of our first Cairn Terrier (who also went to 13 but was ill with liver problems) - we miss them both badly!]

I have copied the following post of mine from the "General Discussion" sub-forum - it describes an unusual experience I had which may be relevant to you! : -


A very strange business!
« on: Yesterday at 04:22:48 »
ReplyQuoteModify
...and a bit puzzling too!

Last night, I was wondering what to put in a post  to someone weighed down with problems [you!!!].  I thought about the bravery that Jesus showed, knowing full well what would shortly face Him.  In John's Gospel, in his account of The Last Supper, Jesus says "Up, let us go forward!" - a clarion call to us all, in meeting with bravery, all that "Life" throws at us - and it's not over till our last gasp!  My mind went to the Maori war dance "Haka" ritual - thinking of it as a challenge to "Life"- "I will not be bowed-down under circumstances, because I have a Father who loves me!". Wanting to know more about that, I looked at the YouTube "Top 5 Haka Performances" video clip - then as they were shouting and posturing - suddenly the "indwelling spirit" burst out from within me, with strange utterances - unlike what the NZ chaps were shouting!  Now what puzzles me, is why this should have happened when I was not praying as I do "with and sometimes without" understanding. We know that the traditional Maori "Haka" ritual is not Christian, but it reminded me of the OT references to the Israelites raising the "battle shout" when confronted by their adversaries.

  Am reminded also of the start of Psalm 33 "Shout for joy before the Lord, you who are righteous" - when was the last time we did that in a church service - what a miserable lot some of us are!?  And what about that last part of that verse, referring to "you who are righteous"!? Yeah I know - Paul tells us, and rightly so, that all our righteousness is as filthy rags - and we understand that Jesus, as our Great High Priest, represents all humanity before the Father - He alone is our righteousness, that we can never achieve, and He is our "all in all"!

Mention of "bravery" raises another issue - that of it's reverse, "cowardice" - what does the Lord think of that - is there any place in "The Kingdom" for cowards?  I think the answer is NO! Despite the Lord's mercy and compassion, Rev 21:8 has a list topped by cowards!
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I need to explain that it is a relatively rare occurrence for the in-dwelling spirit within me, to burst out (glossalalia!?) unexpectedly - it usually implies the Lord's deep concern/interest in a matter.  In the past it has been initiated by me hearing on the TV a report of some great human tragedy or crisis - or after an acquaintance has spoken of their chronic affliction which medicos have been unable to alleviate etc,.  It has always occurred privately - when alone, or exceptionally, in my wife's presence when praying for her afflictions.

In the YouTube "Haka" clips - I was unmoved by the "confrontational" rugby style "Haka"s - but the spirit burst out from me when it was the case of a much respected retiring school teacher at a NZ boys school. I would surmise that He had spent many years helping to instil a manly/courageous/brave spirit into his students.  Is that the message for you I wonder???

Fare-well, God-Be-With-You!

[NewCreature]

!!UPDATE!!
As the Spirit of Jesus says, "Those who wait on YHWH will renew their strength" (Is. 40:31) and "Those who endure to the end will be saved" (Matt. 24:13)

Sometime in late-August, I was introduced to a guy. It wasn't what I wanted. But God did something, and to this day, I'm still not sure what. It had to do with two things, at least:

1. The man was the most intense, serious man I've ever met. Like a drill sergeant, but without the screaming. He was terrifying to the wounded side of me; and merely by interacting with him, I got to practice letting go of my crippling fear of man (and to an intensity I hadn't been able to do before). To this end, I was even able to "push back" at some of the things he said. Not everything he said was true. He still thinks he disagrees with me on some things. And when this happened and I realized that I was still okay, I laughed; and there was a bit of freedom/refreshment in those moments.

2. At some point, on my own, I just got up and sang and danced for Jesus. That's the day I look back on as a turning point. (I've heard that worship, especially this kind of worship, is spiritual warfare.)

Then, around the end of September, I began experiencing the freedom I still feel today. The torment seems to have just "up and walked away", to use a friend's words.

It's not like I'm 100% healed, though; I'm still in need of further emotional healing/cleansing. But I'm not in pain like I used to be. And my mind~!!! My mind is always clear. I'm always at peace, no matter how physically or mentally or emotionally exhausted I am.

So praise Jesus for that!!

Seriously.

[NewCreature]

By the way, Dave: A reason why no one else had responded was because the thread hadn't been approved until a day or so before you replied. I had checked on the thread one day, and it hadn't yet been approved; and so I came back a day or two later to see if I could delete the thread, and not only had it been approved, but you had replied. So I left it as it was.

Further Thoughts: Dave
...apart from that, I wanted to respond to you, Dave: no offense; what you wrote was a bit overwhelming for me. I still read it, but it wasn't anything new. And it didn't help. In fact, I was kinda frustrated. It reminds me of all that men today seem capable of: speech without action, and prayer. Not that these are worthless. There is great value in the prayers, exhortations, examples from your own life, and the words of truth. There is a time and a place and a people who need to hear that. Keep it up!!

... but for people like me, and where we're at ... that's not what we need.

We need to be shown that we're wanted. That's been a large part of God's healing journey for me: giving me guys who (in various healthy ways) have been able to show me that I'm wanted. But the journey isn't complete yet. It's just easier for me to wait now.

Further Thoughts: All
On that note, it's no wonder to me that sexual immorality is flourishing. There are so many guys longing to know that they're wanted by a woman, or a man; and when men in the Church have a tame (or nonexistent) delight for those outside their biological family (or even their own biological kids), then our male leaders tell us, "Be warmed and filled!", and fail to give what is needed for the nourishment of our souls. It's worthless. In fact, it's worse than worthless: because it leaves people starved, but thinking that they should be okay. And when so many men are starved for affection, silently screaming to know that they're wanted and desired, it only makes sense that they fall into temptation. Sex is a very easy way to feel wanted. And when we're so starved, the demons of sexual immorality (adultery, homosexuality, etc.) have a very easy time digging into our wounds like maggots.

But if us men in the church had a Godly delight in our brothers, our kids (a delight which we unashamedly expressed) and we treated one another like the actual family we are in Christ rather than mere friends (and sometime we don't even treat our biological family like family), then we would all better know just how much God delights in us; and we wouldn't be so starved; and thus it'd be soooo much easier to resist the devil, because we wouldn't even have this all-consuming desire to be ... well ... desired. Why? Because we'd be satisfied.

But no. Apart from 1 man, the best I've found in the Church is joyful acceptance. Which is nice. But it's very obvious that most have no delight in me (or a desire to pursue me). If I seek, I'll find acceptance — and some enjoy my presence. But if I pursue further ... or if I leave ... all I get are walls and silence. Apart from 1, no man has sought for me. No man loves me enough to be willing to go that deep.

Now, some might think, "You're making male affection into an idol." But no, I used to be tempted to make male affection into an idol. But instead I clung to the Lord. And he showed me that I wasn't normal, by which I mean: I wasn't healthy. I was starved. My own godly desire lured and enticed me (James 1:14) because it was unnatural strong, exacerbated by malnourishment. And it was God himself who led me into receiving healthy, god-given male affection (slowly, over 3+ years; you don't give a feast to a starving man; he wouldn't be able to handle it). And that's healed me to the point that I'm not even tempted anymore. And where I am still tempted, it's such a weak temptation that there is no laborious effort to overcome. It's not hard; it's an easy burden and light yoke (Matt. 11:28-30).

So, all of this that I'm talking about ...? It's not theoretical. It's what happened with me.

Praise be to God that he heals; that he has provided bits and pieces of healing here and there as I needed it; and that he loves us more than we're comfortable with and transforms his children to be just like himself.

For yes, love is more than mere emotion; but it is inextricable from emotion: and delight is love. And the love of many has grown cold. What we need is for men in the Church to seek God all the more, to become like Christ, to stop thinking of "family" as merely biological, and to delight themselves in strangers with a depth of love they tend to have only for their wives (non-sexually).

...of course, our men are like this because they too are starving, and yet have no idea. Work, wives, sports ... fun and the busy-ness of life is enough of a cologne that they can't smell the rot festering in their wounds ... that is, until they're old, and the weakness of age takes away their filters and makes them unable to handle the stress of grandchildren, and the blister finally pops and all that pus comes oozing out.

On his deathbed, my "good, Christian" grandfather verbally tore into my grandmother in a death-addled haze, when his body and mind and will-power were finally all but gone. I know why. He was still so wounded, having never been healed himself. He had never known what it meant to be truly desired.

The body (and the world) suffers for our mens' lack of a deep, emotional relationship with God. For it's only in the depth of God that we will begin to love.

But this post isn't so much a call for men to "do better"; because we CAN'T. We can only be healed. But once we're healed, we're changed; we aren't so tempted anymore; we're stronger; we ARE MORE LIKE JESUS and can handle being crucified and even grieve for our crucifiers for not knowing what they do (for by then we realize that people don't sin because they see, but because they're blind) ... and we can give to others what was given to us; we can raise people from the dead; we can HEAL one another. As Jesus said, "Truly, Truly, whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I am going to the Father." (John 14:12)

So what is this post? It's a call for men to realize that they're wounded, and to cry out to God for healing, and to seek this his kingdom and his righteousness as #1 priority (Matt. 6:33), and to stop settling for less than perfection but instead to press on to make it their own (Phil. 3:12-17). It won't happen immediately. It'll only happen in God's timing. But it'll happen.

...that is, if we don't give up.

And for those who aren't so wounded and are just being idle, it's a call to adopt adults into your family, to pursue a deeper relationship with God so that your delight in HIS children grows all the more. And I don't mean "legal adoption". I mean love one another as family, not merely friends.

And who knows ... maybe there's someone else on here who already understands.

And who knows what this post will really do.

[Dave_UK]

... Further Thoughts: Dave
...apart from that, I wanted to respond to you, Dave: no offense; what you wrote was a bit overwhelming for me [I "do go on a bit" don't I!  ] I still read it, but it wasn't anything new. And it didn't help. In fact, I was kinda frustrated. It reminds me of all that men today seem capable of: speech without action, and prayer. Not that these are worthless. There is great value in the prayers, exhortations, examples from your own life, and the words of truth. There is a time and a place and a people who need to hear that. Keep it up!!

... but for people like me, and where we're at ... that's not what we need.

We need to be shown that we're wanted. That's been a large part of God's healing journey for me: giving me guys who (in various healthy ways) have been able to show me that I'm wanted. But the journey isn't complete yet. It's just easier for me to wait now.

Hi brother!  I am very sorry I was unable to provide any real help (I am tardy in replying 'cos I've been on a "fast" from posting on the forum).  However, you might find it interesting to read the blue-highlighted portion of my reply #2 on the thread "Attacked by a spirit of pornography" (although the topic is not relevant to you).  It is an extract from a book formed from the collected talks of Watchman Nee - talking about "Walking in the Spirit" as part of the normal Christian life - it is, or should be, an intrinsic part of our lives.

On the business of "We need to be shown that we're wanted" - how true that is!  Am finding it difficult, with my advancing years (83 at the next "mile-stone") to get over "old-age blues" and managing with the limitations that age often brings.  It is not easy to avoid feelings of being of little value to others, and worries about how my wife and daughter will cope with clearing out the accumulation of "stuff" (mainly books!), and making sure that there is adequate financial (etc,) provision for my 7 years younger wife  - when the inevitable demise occurs.

[Dave_UK]

Hi again "NewCreature"!

I re-read your post, yet again this morn - thinking back (not sure if the "Resident Boss" was responsible or not) to some of the complex issues in my own early life, which had some similarity to your own earlier feelings, and possibly the source of some of my "unholy thoughts" ever since! If not the source, then getting back closer to the root of things!

Some of the following may shock or even disgust you - but please don't "destroy me" with your condemnation - bear with me!  There are those who may have had a "normal" upbringing and this "stuff" is quite alien to them.  I saw a video recently of two bear cubs having a "play-wrestle", and that just reminded me of an early lack in my own life (was an only child for the first 12 years of my life - then had a baby sister to help nurture - she sadly died just a few months ago).

Can remember being invited, at about age 9 probably - maybe it was a Christmas morn - into my parents bed when it was daylight.  Remember my disgust at seeing all the matty "fur" on my dads chest! (As a result of post heart op meds since 2010, I only have hair on my head now - apart from a balding patch atop the thinning "thatch" - all the other "secondary" hair has virtually gone now.)

Another formative experience I now recall, is that of seeing Cornel Wilde as Robin Hood in the 1946 film "The Bandit of Sherwood Forest".  Thereafter, for a while, I "idolized" him, imagining wrestling with him, in chest to chest friendly striving.   Think this was probably the start of my "wicked imaginings" that have, from time to time, plagued me ever since.  I never had a happy relationship with my dad, and he was absent during the war years and on 2 tours of duty in Hong Kong during most of my teen-age years.

Then of course came puberty and the awakening realization of what ones "kit" could do! Lets gloss over that part!!!

As very much an "introvert" in character - making friends has never been an easy matter for me - and as a result of an unhappy "teenage intimate explorative experiment" with a like-minded "friend" - I made the self-proclamation "I am unworthy to have a friend - I cannot be trusted!" - which (Oh!, the hidden power of words!!!) has dogged the rest of my adult life.

However the deeply buried desire(?) for intimate (skin-to-skin, hugging one another) contact with one of my own kind has never gone away.  Being "touched" by the Lord when I was 40 - the new birth, meant a fresh start in life for me and a walk with The Indwelling Spirit - but oh! how the "flesh" raises it's head, again and again!

In a "normal" relationship between a married couple , maybe the "wicked imaginings" might not have arisen so much.  However, as I have indicated in my posts on the men's sexual matters sub-forum - that is not practical for my wife and self - both of us having physical problems.  Sometimes the "wicked imaginings" concern normal relationship between a man and his wife - but at other times they verge on "G-0-Y" style relationships! My only Hope is in Christ!!!

So what has this post achieved? Can it be a "dropping of a mask"?  Few of us are as good as we would like to be!!! I suppose one can reach a state of resigned acceptance of one's own nature - only the Lord and His leading/correcting via the Indwelling Spirit can change us - I cannot Lord, please change me to become as You!

[Ohan]

Just wondering ~ if you have a job ~ if you'r taking a class at collage now and then ~ even Guitar or dancing ~ is there a basket ball or baseball team you've joined ~ do you go to church ~ there are groups you could join ~ you could start a group that helps out older people ~ you know fixing their fence or ~ well ~ just wondering what you do with your time ```

By the way ~ have you ever gotten in touch with your dad ~ told him you really love him and miss him ~ could you give him a hand ~ working on his car with him would be fun ~ anything cause you miss him ~ he means so much to you ~ well, gota go ~ I'll go check the date of you opening post ```

The very best to you ~ your mom and dad as well ```


Ohan