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Offline percoid

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What does it take to get to heaven
« on: August 05, 2010, 06:09:33 PM »
I will teel you as I have been trained according to the bible. First we must repent and accept Jesus for what He did for us. Then we must want God more then anything or anyone to get His Spirit into our heart because it is the only way that God will be first in your life. Then we must overcome sin and go throught the fire to become what God wants. Then when our life is over we can stand before God and hear Him say Enter My Rest. There are many scriptures that support what I teach like the second works of grace is found in the gospel of John 1:12 where it say (But as many as recieved Him ( who? Jesus) to them gave He power To Become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name.) God trained me not some school that has been taken over by God's enemies.

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What does it take to get to heaven
« on: August 05, 2010, 06:09:33 PM »

Offline kindlyangel

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2010, 11:19:59 PM »
Thank you for that post. It bolsters me.

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2010, 11:19:59 PM »

Offline Seriousseeker

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2010, 08:27:06 PM »
I will teel you as I have been trained according to the bible. First we must repent and accept Jesus for what He did for us. Then we must want God more then anything or anyone to get His Spirit into our heart because it is the only way that God will be first in your life. Then we must overcome sin and go throught the fire to become what God wants. Then when our life is over we can stand before God and hear Him say Enter My Rest. There are many scriptures that support what I teach like the second works of grace is found in the gospel of John 1:12 where it say (But as many as recieved Him ( who? Jesus) to them gave He power To Become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name.) God trained me not some school that has been taken over by God's enemies.

What you say is essentially true for salvation, but part of it is only true to obey and honor God.  I don't want to be critical here, but some Christians believe we must do a lot of good works to win heaven, and that is not the real gospel message.  Faith alone in Christ is salvation.

It is certainly true that one must receive the Lord Jesus into their heart by faith to be saved for heaven, but most of the rest you mention has to do with honoring God and pleasing Him for our rewards and commendations when we get to heaven.  I just think we need to make that distinction here.  Look up always!

-Seriousseeker

I believe a faithful "child of God" should trust our Savior --the Lord Jesus (which pleases the Father), worship Him and make Him our best Friend;  value "unity of the faith", be non-sectarian and hold fully to Scripture ---declaring "all the counsel of God" and be "rightly dividing the Word of Truth" as the Apostle Paul counseled the saints.  Let us look up always (note John 14).

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2010, 08:27:06 PM »

Offline Teresa

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2012, 04:14:19 AM »
What you say is essentially true for salvation, but part of it is only true to obey and honor God.  I don't want to be critical here, but some Christians believe we must do a lot of good works to win heaven, and that is not the real gospel message.  Faith alone in Christ is salvation.  
That is not correct and that is not Biblical.

The Bible says we are saved by grace.

If we say that we are saved by faith, then we must ask where did this faith come from? Did you come to faith by yourself? If so then that means you are basically saying that you salvation depended on you which is what you are deriding on one who claims he is saved by works.

The important thing to remember is that we are saved by grace, that salvation is a gift.

The man who says he is saved by faith and the man who says he is saved by works both say the same thing so long as they think their faith and their work came from them.

A man who say he is saved by works but recognizes that his ability to do good works is given by God is more correct than the man who claims to be saved by faith but thinks this faith is due wholly to his own conjuring.

Quote
It is certainly true that one must receive the Lord Jesus into their heart by faith to be saved for heaven,  
No that is not Biblical.  I don't think you will find that in the Bible at all. Jesus said that those who do the will of the Father will be the ones who will go to heaven. The will of the Father is that we believe in the Son. And belief in the Son means that we do all He commanded and believe everything He said. Part of what He said is feed the hungry, clothe the naked, etc.

Quote
but most of the rest you mention has to do with honoring God and pleasing Him for our rewards and commendations when we get to heaven.  I just think we need to make that distinction here.  Look up always!

-Seriousseeker
Then that is nothing more than indirect egotism. You are praising God for what He will do for your when you get to heaven. That is nothing more than self-centredness and that wil not get you to heaven.

Peace and All Good.

Teresa
« Last Edit: February 03, 2012, 06:39:35 PM by Teresa »
By His Wounds, we are healed.

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2012, 04:14:19 AM »

Online DaveW

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2012, 04:55:04 AM »
One thing glaringly missing from this discussion: Covenant.  Not mentioned once by anyone.

At its base, salvation is by covenant. We marry the Lord.

From God's persective, it is HIS Grace that is extended to us to enter that covenant, and from our perspective it is by faith that we access that grace.

Do works have a place? Yes. Both God's works (the death and resurrection of Messiah) and our own. (repentance, obedience) But it is not the works that are salvic, the covenant is.

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2012, 04:55:04 AM »



Offline Teresa

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2012, 05:16:00 AM »
One thing glaringly missing from this discussion: Covenant.  Not mentioned once by anyone.

At its base, salvation is by covenant. We marry the Lord.

From God's persective, it is HIS Grace that is extended to us to enter that covenant, and from our perspective it is by faith that we access that grace.

Do works have a place? Yes. Both God's works (the death and resurrection of Messiah) and our own. (repentance, obedience) But it is not the works that are salvic, the covenant is.
Depends on how you understand salvation.

Salvation is not a mere getting to heaven.  I like how the Francis Beckwith put it: Salvation is getting heaven into you.  In short, salvation is about becoming holy - becoming transformed into the image of Christ.

So yes, works is salvific because works is transformative.  That is why Christ said that those who fed the hugry, clothe the naked, gave drink to the thirsty will enter the kingdom of heaven.  Christ did not give any caveats when He said that.  As a matter of fact, He was adamant that it is not those who call Him Lord, Lord who will enter the Kingdom of Heaven but those who do the will of His Father. The will of His Father is expressed in the 10 Commandments. In short, it is obedience that tells us whether we are following the Will of the Father or not. Obedience implies work.

According to Saint Paul of Faith, Hope and Love the greatest is Love.  Love IS Work. 

Peace and All Good.

Teresa.



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Offline pointmade

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2012, 01:28:13 PM »
Teresa :If we say that we are saved by faith, then we must ask where did this faith come from? Did you come to faith by yourself? If so then that means you are basically saying that you salvation depended on you which is what you are deriding on one who claims he is saved by works."

There you go with Augustine's Irrestible Grace."
If we do not come to faith by ourselves by "hearing, and hearing by the word of God" ( Romans 10:17 ),
then belief, faith, confession, repentance must be infused grace.

This is Augustine's theory that man is so depraved that he cannot understand the Gospel and must be
revealed to him through the Church.

The Bible speaks clearly of God's universal desire to be gracious to all human beings.
( John 3:16; 1 Tim. 2:4; 2 Peter 3:9; 1 John 2:2 ).
Is grace conditional? or must grace be infused by Holy Spirit regeneration?
If so, than grace is unconditional, and applied only to those of the "Elect."
All sinners need not apply!
What is your assurance? A shot of faith taken through the eucharist.

 


Offline Teresa

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2012, 06:07:56 PM »
Teresa :If we say that we are saved by faith, then we must ask where did this faith come from? Did you come to faith by yourself? If so then that means you are basically saying that you salvation depended on you which is what you are deriding on one who claims he is saved by works."

There you go with Augustine's Irrestible Grace."  
There you go with misunderstanding what I said.  This is a bad habit pointmade so please try to erradicate it.
Quote
If we do not come to faith by ourselves by "hearing, and hearing by the word of God" ( Romans 10:17 ), then belief, faith, confession, repentance must be infused grace.
Faith is both a grace and a response.

As you yourself said, the initiative is first by hearing it.  The fact that you are able to hear at all, the fact that it gets to you at all is grace. Just think, some people hear and don't believe and then one day, voila they just do.

Faith is a grace and if you say otherwise then you are saying you save yourself.

But once this grace is given, then a response is asked of us. All of us are given enough grace to respond with a yes. Even those who responds with a no are given the same grace.  And this is where free will comes in. When we respond to that grace, this changes us and our faith grows.

But the initial action is always God's not man's.  To say otherwise is to hold to the heretical belief of pellagianism.

Quote
This is Augustine's theory that man is so depraved that he cannot understand the Gospel and must be revealed to him through the Church.
Total depravity is Calvin's who happens to be a protestant - just like you.
Quote
The Bible speaks clearly of God's universal desire to be gracious to all human beings.
( John 3:16; 1 Tim. 2:4; 2 Peter 3:9; 1 John 2:2 ).
Exactly! And that is what I have been saying all along but because you have this blinkered view and do not pay attention to the post you are respondig to, you have completely missed that.

You have this terrible habit of ascribing to others what they have not said at all. If you will only drop your preconcieved notions about the point that one makes, then you will realize that you do not have any issue against my post at all.
Quote
Is grace conditional? or must grace be infused by Holy Spirit regeneration?
Grace is not conditional. Grace is given to all but but we need to respond to this grace.
Ang yes, grace is infused. What this means is that grace has the capacity to change us, that it goes into the depths of our being.  If you extend your reading of the Bible beyond the common proof texts, you will realize this too.

Quote
If so, than grace is unconditional, and applied only to those of the "Elect."
All sinners need not apply!
Infused grace does not mean that they are only applied to the elect.  You do not understand what infused grace means. I suggest that before you attack this concept you read up on it. At the moment you are attacking a strawman.
Quote
What is your assurance? A shot of faith taken through the eucharist.
My hope is faith taken through the Eucharist who IS Jesus.

Peace and All Good.
Teresa
« Last Edit: February 03, 2012, 06:35:56 PM by Teresa »
By His Wounds, we are healed.

Offline pointmade

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2012, 06:58:43 AM »
Teresa: "Grace is not conditional. Grace is given to all but but we need to respond to this grace.
And yes, grace is infused. What this means is that grace has the capacity to change us, that it goes into the depths of our being.  If you extend your reading of the Bible beyond the common proof texts, you will realize this too."

Well, I finally pulled the term "infused" out of you dear Teresa....
This is exactly Augustine's doctrine of irresistible grace.
True, it is Calvinism...as related in his "Institutes of the Christian Religion.

But, old Johnny Calvin got his religion from the Catholic Church where he had been a Catholic priest.
Calvinism is not a theological system invented by Calvin, but most of his componets can be found
in Augustine ( d. A.D. 430 )

As you know as a "scholar" that most of Calvin's system was already being taught by earlier reformers,
especially Luther and Zwingli.

You write: "But once this grace is given, then a response is asked of us. All of us are given enough grace to respond with a yes. Even those who responds with a no are given the same grace.  And this is where free will comes in. When we respond to that grace, this changes us and our faith grows."

I see...and how does an infant respond with a "yes"?
You and I both know that the RCC baptizes an infant to transform the little tyke from the unsaved to the saved
by an unconditional, unilateral, irresistible act of the Holy Spirit.

Were you Teresa, as a babe, able to respond to the gospel in FAITH?
Please do not say "yes," I am giving you the benefit of doubt as a intellect here.
Note that you have already written:....
"Faith is both a grace and a response."

So, you can see why your words confuse me when you say:
"My hope is faith taken through the Eucharist who IS Jesus."

Do you not find that transubstantiation is a theory?
I ask this, because it was not until 831 that at pronouncement of the Mass, the bread is changed into
the historical body of Christ; it became that and nothing else.

History reveals that an abbot of a monastery in France, Paschasius Radbertus, wrote a book "on the Body
and Blood of Christ," which, he dedicated to Emperor Charles the Bald as a Christmas gift (844).
Maurus Rabanus, archbishop of Mainz, Germany also a leading a theologian, opposed it as "a novelty"
and appealed to Augustine who had made a distinction between the historical and the Eucharistic body of Christ.

The view of Maurus Rabanus: Christ has three bodies:
The historical body, born of the Virgin Mary.
The Eucharistic body, created in the Mass.
The spiritual body, the Church. ( Also called the mystical body .)

Now, Teresa, the theory becomes interesting among the Catholic "brethren.
Radbetus was opposed to Ratramus' theory.
He argued that the Eucharist was the body of Christ "in mystery, not in verity."
( This was essentially a symbolic view. )

In the year 1049, a theologian named Berengar of Tours attacked the doctrine of transubstantiation.
He was opposed by the Archbishop of Canterbury, Lanfrance and condemned by a Roman synod which
met in 1050, and by later councils. Berengar was forced to sign a recantation.

So, Teresa, your "faith is in the hope of the Eucharist," which In the 9th century the theory of transubstantiation
in the Catholic Church is marked as a "novelty," and 200 years later a man is marked as a heretic if he
opposed it. Yet, in 1215, the Fourth Lateran council declared transubstantiation to be a dogma of the pope.

I wouldn't let my imagination run away with me on the theory of transubstantiation that was kicked around
by men of the same cloth who never really came to an agreement.
I guess we could agree that the early Catholics ( before Augustine  ), never really received the "infusion" of grace?




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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2012, 06:58:43 AM »

Offline Teresa

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2012, 05:18:47 AM »
Teresa: "Grace is not conditional. Grace is given to all but but we need to respond to this grace.
And yes, grace is infused. What this means is that grace has the capacity to change us, that it goes into the depths of our being.  If you extend your reading of the Bible beyond the common proof texts, you will realize this too."

Well, I finally pulled the term "infused" out of you dear Teresa....

So what? Do you even know what infused grace means? You think you have a "gotcha" but you don't because you don't even understand what it means.

Pointmade, before you reply, read up on what it means and how infused grace relates to salvation.

Quote
This is exactly Augustine's doctrine of irresistible grace.
True, it is Calvinism...as related in his "Institutes of the Christian Religion. 

Well no. Infused grace does not mean irresistable grace. The only term that means irresistable is efficacious. You are getting your terms completely confused. Please read on this understand it before you reply again.

Quote
You write: "But once this grace is given, then a response is asked of us. All of us are given enough grace to respond with a yes. Even those who responds with a no are given the same grace.  And this is where free will comes in. When we respond to that grace, this changes us and our faith grows."

I see...and how does an infant respond with a "yes"? 

Where did I say that an infant responds with a yes.

Pointmade, before you respond read up first, at the very least a summary of what Predestination means, what grace means, what infused grace means and read up on how all this relate to baptism and salvation in general.

Quote
You and I both know that the RCC baptizes an infant to transform the little tyke from the unsaved to the saved
by an unconditional, unilateral, irresistible act of the Holy Spirit.

Not just children. Baptism washes all sins away and confers sanctifying grace that was lost by our first parents.

Now, maybe you can explain to me what is wrong that?
Quote
Were you Teresa, as a babe, able to respond to the gospel in FAITH? 

Who said that at baptism you need to be able to respond with a yes?

Are you saying that a severely mentally impaired person who is unable to give an assent should not be baptised? Strange kind of Christianity you preach.

Quote
Please do not say "yes," I am giving you the benefit of doubt as a intellect here.
Note that you have already written:....
"Faith is both a grace and a response."

Yes, faith. But not sanctifying grace. Sanctifying Grace is not faith.  Please learn to read better as this is getting very, very tiresome.

Quote
So, you can see why your words confuse me when you say:
"My hope is faith taken through the Eucharist who IS Jesus."

Do you not find that transubstantiation is a theory?

You really ought to broaden your reading if you are going to question dogma's. If you are going to attack something it is good to be knowledgeable about that something.

Transubstantiation is an explanation of what happens at the Eucharist. It is an explanation of how come, this bread is no longer bread but as Christ said, it His Body and Blood.

Before you reply, read up on it.

Quote
I ask this, because it was not until 831 that at pronouncement of the Mass, the bread is changed into
the historical body of Christ; it became that and nothing else.

Wrong. The Church has always believed that it is the Body and Blood of CHrist just as He said it is.  That is why Eastern Churches believe the same.  AS a matter of fact, the first challenge to this doctrine was from Berengarius of Tours in the 1100's. His teaching was regarded as heresy.
Quote
History reveals that an abbot of a monastery in France, Paschasius Radbertus, wrote a book "on the Body
and Blood of Christ," which, he dedicated to Emperor Charles the Bald as a Christmas gift (844).
Maurus Rabanus, archbishop of Mainz, Germany also a leading a theologian, opposed it as "a novelty"
and appealed to Augustine who had made a distinction between the historical and the Eucharistic body of Christ.

The view of Maurus Rabanus: Christ has three bodies:
The historical body, born of the Virgin Mary.
The Eucharistic body, created in the Mass.
The spiritual body, the Church. ( Also called the mystical body .)

Now, Teresa, the theory becomes interesting among the Catholic "brethren.
Radbetus was opposed to Ratramus' theory.
He argued that the Eucharist was the body of Christ "in mystery, not in verity."
( This was essentially a symbolic view. )

In the year 1049, a theologian named Berengar of Tours attacked the doctrine of transubstantiation.

The Radbertus and Ratramnus is irrelevant. As I said before sift through the data before you start posting otherwise you end up with this kind of response.

There was no doctrine of transubstantiation until St Thomas named it as such.

Before St Thomas there was only the belief that the Eucharist is indeed the Body and Blood of Christ but there was no explanation. Transubstantiation is how St Thomas explained this mystery to be.  It still remains a mystery but this shows a bit more clarity as to why it is so.

As a matter of fact, even Luther believed in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist although he did not believe in transubstantiation. Rather he believed that Christ is in, with and under the bread.

Quote
So, Teresa, your "faith is in the hope of the Eucharist," which In the 9th century the theory of transubstantiation
in the Catholic Church is marked as a "novelty," and 200 years later a man is marked as a heretic if he
opposed it. Yet, in 1215, the Fourth Lateran council declared transubstantiation to be a dogma of the pope.

You and a lot of protestants fall into this grave error of thinking that name preceeds reality. Just because something was named later does not mean that it did not exist until it was named. Otherwise, you were not a being until your parents named you.

Transubstantiation was always a reality that the Church that Christ established have always believed. It was only in the 12th century that they gave a name to it and an explanation of why.
Quote
I wouldn't let my imagination run away with me on the theory of transubstantiation that was kicked around
by men of the same cloth who never really came to an agreement.
I guess we could agree that the early Catholics ( before Augustine  ), never really received the "infusion" of grace?

But your imagination has in fact galloped at a speed that has left sense miles behind.

The Catholic Church ( which happens to be the Church that Christ established ) has always believed in the infusion of grace. You really have got no clue as to what you are talking about. You don't even know what infused grace is and why we say grace is infused.

Based on your responses, I believe you are deriving your information from usual anti-Catholic literature. Upgrade your reading. Study Catholic books and find out from us exactly what we believe.

Study pointmade. Study. Then you will know what is true.

Here are two links two Catholic sites that will explain to you what we believe and why we believe it.  And you will find that all Catholic beliefs are Biblical. It cannot be otherwise because we gave the world the Bible.

http://www.catholic.com/

http://www.davidmacd.com/catholic/index2.htm


Peace and All Good

Teresa




[/quote]
By His Wounds, we are healed.

Offline pointmade

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2012, 10:17:49 AM »
Teresa: "Study pointmade. Study. Then you will know what is true."

Why would I need to study? Since you believe grace is "infused" ( to the "elect" of course ).
Seems all I need to do is to hook up with Catholicism. Become schooled by some priest who is straight
and has had hands laid on him by a bishop who hopefully is straight and I will get a true "read out"
on Catholic doctrine that has had more changes to it than a baby with diarrhea.

I can recall the day's when eating meat on Friday was a shot into Purgatory.
My family never did get old uncle Raymond out of the holding pen....
Forget if we ran out of money, or prayers....lol....

Getting a fusion of grace everytime one kneels before a RC priest who recites some hookahs-pookahs
over the host, then sticks it in ones mouth, and "bingo" your "fused" up for another week of grace is not biblical.

Oh, I know, the Eucharist becomes the "flesh of Christ" lol--lol...Sure, and the Big Mack you eat at McDonald's
become two all meat patties, with pickle, lettuce, tomato, onion on a sesame bun when served by Ronald McDonald.


Offline Teresa

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2012, 07:48:16 PM »
Teresa: "Study pointmade. Study. Then you will know what is true."

Why would I need to study? Since you believe grace is "infused" ( to the "elect" of course ).
Why do you need to study?  Just for starters because of this one line.

You have no idea what infused grace means and nowhere did I say that grace is infused "only" to the elect.

You do not need only to study. You need to learn to read posts better.

Peace and All Good

Teresa
By His Wounds, we are healed.

Offline JohnDB70X7

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2012, 06:18:51 PM »
I will teel you as I have been trained according to the bible. First we must repent and accept Jesus for what He did for us. Then we must want God more then anything or anyone to get His Spirit into our heart because it is the only way that God will be first in your life. Then we must overcome sin and go throught the fire to become what God wants. Then when our life is over we can stand before God and hear Him say Enter My Rest. There are many scriptures that support what I teach like the second works of grace is found in the gospel of John 1:12 where it say (But as many as recieved Him ( who? Jesus) to them gave He power To Become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name.) God trained me not some school that has been taken over by God's enemies.

Notice what I have highlighted in your own statement.

John 3:16-18 (NIV)
16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.

It's about believing in Jesus... the genuine Jesus and not some counterfeit invention of the devil or man.

2 Corinthians 11:3-4 (NIV)
3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent’s cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.
4 For if someone comes to you and preaches a Jesus other than the Jesus we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it easily enough.

In other words don't tolerate false Christs...

Matthew 24:24 (NIV)
24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible.

Belief in a false Christ is as damning as not believing in Jesus at all.

Matthew 7:21-23 (NIV)
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’
23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

It's really that simple.
Give to those who hold to untruth
Questions they cannot answer and
Answers they cannot question

Offline heir

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2012, 05:19:50 AM »
I will teel you as I have been trained according to the bible. First we must repent and accept Jesus for what He did for us. Then we must want God more then anything or anyone to get His Spirit into our heart because it is the only way that God will be first in your life. Then we must overcome sin and go throught the fire to become what God wants. Then when our life is over we can stand before God and hear Him say Enter My Rest. There are many scriptures that support what I teach like the second works of grace is found in the gospel of John 1:12 where it say (But as many as recieved Him ( who? Jesus) to them gave He power To Become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name.) God trained me not some school that has been taken over by God's enemies.
In answer to the title of this thread, "What does it take to get to heaven?" The asnwer is the righteousness of God.

How are you stacking up? I know, I know. There is none righteous, no not one. For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God.  The good news is, the righteousness of God is unto all and upon all them that believe by the faith OF Jesus Christ!

Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

And where is the righteousness of God revealed? It is revealed in the gospel of Christ, the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth (and at the time Paul wrote Romans it was to the Jew first and also to the Greek)

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

the gospel of Christ declared:

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

You shouldn't say that one has to DO something to be saved. When you do you are preaching an "other gospel" than that which Paul preached.

Galatians 1:8-9 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Salvation is by grace through faith.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Titus 3:4-7 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

GaryMac

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Re: What does it take to get to heaven
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2012, 02:42:28 AM »
I will teel you as I have been trained according to the bible. First we must repent and accept Jesus for what He did for us. Then we must want God more then anything or anyone to get His Spirit into our heart because it is the only way that God will be first in your life. Then we must overcome sin and go throught the fire to become what God wants. Then when our life is over we can stand before God and hear Him say Enter My Rest. There are many scriptures that support what I teach like the second works of grace is found in the gospel of John 1:12 where it say (But as many as recieved Him ( who? Jesus) to them gave He power To Become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name.) God trained me not some school that has been taken over by God's enemies.


I agree with most of what you say in repentance but I think repentance is from ourselves, our way, and adopting Gods way for us which is Jesus Christ. 

To me Jesus was sent by God to teach and give to me the same thing Jesus had and that is Gods Spirit working in my being. God came to Jesus in Matt 3:16 and opened all of heaven to Jesus and Jesus became a different person from that point on.  The same happened in Paul on the road to Damascus and 120 in an upper room, and Moses, and all who receive from God His Spirit who is Christ in you, anointed of God. And the same happened in me.

 To follow Gods way is to have in you that what Jesus had in him, it is Gods way for us. He is the way we are supposed to be, one with God, same Spirit, same mind. Christ in you, anointed of God. Anything less is our own way.

Gary