The Mark of the Beast His Name and the Number of His Name

[W E Tubbs]

            
          THE MARK OF THE BEAST
                           HIS NAME      
     AND THE NUMBER OF HIS NAME
                                                Walter E. Tubbs


 In all probability countless people in the world are familiar with the mark and name of the United Nations a beast first seen in heaven by God’s foreknowledge seen as a great red dragon having seven heads and ten horns with seven crowns upon his heads. Revelation 12:3
This beast the United Nations seen in A.D. 96 as a beast yet to come Revelation 17:10 came in 1945 long after the passing of the last remnant of the Roman Empire in A.D.464 The United Nations is now seen as seven kings Revelation 17:10 the seventh world order but facing death with restoration Revelation 13:3 and is made commander-in-chief of the restored United Nations and in effect become the eighth. Revelation 17:11
THE FLAG OF THE UNITED NATIONS TO BE SET UP IN ISRAEL
And he will lift up an Ensign to the nations from far Isaiah 5:26 The United Nations headquartered in the United States helped assemble the outcasts of Israel and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth Isaiah 11:12 Let all the nations be gathered together and let the people be assembled. Who among you can declare this and show us former things? Let them hear and say it is the truth Isaiah 43:9
The United Nation coming centuries after passing of the Roman Empire the sixth world order is now the seventh to become an eighth. Revelation 17:10,11 seen first as a beast out of the sea Revelation 13:1,2 representative of  peoples nations tribes and tongues Revelation 17:15 the present phase of these United Nations after being wounded to death will be given a new image by governmental order Revelation 13:14 like unto a Leopard even he a commander-in-chief is the eighth and is of the seven
And the ten horns out of this kingdom the European Union are ten kings that shall arise and another different [the United States] a little horn shall rise higher after them and he will be diverse [different] from the first [ten] and shall subdue three horns [leaders] of Europe who finally agree with seven other members to give control of the International Organization to him the United States. Daniel 7:8- 20,24  
For God hath put in their hearts the ten horns to fulfill his will and to agree to give their kingdom to the beast Revelation 17:16,17 out of the earth Revelation 13:11,12 the United States a little horn supporting him for office of Supreme commander of the United Nations.
THE UNITED NATIONS IN YWO PHASES
The dragon Revelation 13:2 i.e. the United Nations in existence since 1945 is seen as being the first [phase] of this beast Revelation 13:12 before him a leader in the United States seen as the beast out of the earth. Revelation 13:11 Who after the death as it were of the Dragon, the United Nation, following a devastating world war in the Middle East resulting in death as it were that is total collapse of the first phase of the United Nations but did live. Revelation 13:3-12 in turn giving total authority to the United States Revelation 13:11,12 the Power most instrumental in restoring the United Nations. Revelation 17:10,11      
This new leader with authority over all nations request Representatives in the General Assembly to make an image Revelation 13:14 not of but to the beast. And the dragon the United Nations was given an image like unto a Leopard. Revelation 13:2
The new image of the United Nations [phase 2] show that man of sin II Thessalonians 2:3 the United States putting together the most powerful International government in 3 1/2 years and zealously controlling the world for another 3 1/2 years but like Alexander who died with none to help him will also meet the same fate. Daniel 11:45
ANOTHER VIEW OF THE BEAST OUT OF THE EARTH
I beheld another [a different] beast coming up out of ‘the earth Revelation 13:11 not the European Union but the United States. He had two horns like a lamb a Christian objective and spoke like a Dragon, a super power allied with the European Union.
And to ‘him’ a star a famous person “fallen from heaven” unto the earth once a spiritual character now fallen from grace, an apostate:  “that man of sin” II Thessalonians 2:1,4 given key control of the bottomless pit  Revelation 9:1 - 17:8 involve all humanity on earth. Daniel 8:23,27
Notice the star’s fall is from heaven to earth undoubtedly describing a man reminiscent of Christ in a mission like Christ’s second coming is to be creating his kingdom on earth.  
They had a king over them which is the angel the leader of the bottomless pit  the United Nations whose name in the Hebrew is Abaddon destroyer but in the Greek tongue A-pollyon destroyer Revelation 9:11 The new leader in the United States. Daniel 8:24,27
And the ‘shape’ Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe the headquarter of the locusts armies were like unto horses prepared unto battle and on their heads were crowns like gold and their faces were as the faces of men and hair as women both gender are in this army. And the sound of their wings airplanes was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle. Revelation 9:7,11
THE UNITED NATIONS IS GIVEN A NEW IMAGE
And he exercises all the power of the first beast before him and cause the earth and them that dwell therein to excessively support the second phase of  the first beast the United Nations whose deadly wound was healed Revelation 13:12 Revelation 13:2-14
Here is wisdom let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast that is the voting number it is six hundred threescore and six. Understanding where and how this number is applied will help understand who this beast represent. Revelation 13:18
The Prophet Isaiah predicted this Ensign in 760 B.C. And he [the United Nations] will lift up an Ensign to the nations coming from far the United States and God will hiss unto them ‘the Jews’ from the end of the earth and behold they shall come swiftly in globe-master aircraft shouting Isaiah’s prophecy “they shall mount up with wings of Eagles”. Isaiah 5:26  40:31
And it shall come to pass in that day that the Lord shall recover the remnant of his people ‘the second time’ And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, the flag of the United Nations and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth. Isaiah 11:11,12  
All ye inhabitants of the world, and dwellers on the earth, see ye, when he the United Nations lifts up an Ensign, a flag of the United Nations on the mountains in Israel. Isaiah 18:1,3
                  ISREAL TO BE BORN IN A DAY                
                 Who has heard such a thing or who has seen such a thing. Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day shall a nation be born at once? For as soon as Zion prevailed she brought forth her children. Isaiah 66:8
           After world war 1 the League of nations approved the British Mandate of Palestine with intention to create a national home for Jewish people. In 1947 the United Nations approved the partition of the Mandate of Palestine into two states one Jewish nation and one Arab nation. The Arab League rejected the plan and on March 14, 1948 Israel declared independence. A nation is born in a day. Isaiah 66:8
The new country’s victory in the subsequent three Arab-Israel wars expanded the borders of the Jewish State beyond those in the UN Partition Plan. Peace between Arab and Jew has not yet been established.
On October 29,1956, Israeli armed forces crossed the Egyptian border on the Sinai Peninsula bringing full-scale war. The U.N. ordered a cease-fire, and on November 4, the General Assembly asked the Secretary General to create a United Nations police force to supervise a halt in hostilities. When U.N.E.F. emergency troops arrived they lifted up an Ensign the flag of the United Nations and placed it on the border of Israel and Egypt November 12, 1956  
THE NUMBER OF THE BEAST
it is the number of a living thing it is humanity’s number not the number of a certain man KJV as most expositors have determined. Revelation 13:18                                                                      This number has do with buying and selling by nations and evidently determined by votes assigned each Representative. This number is not observable to the public but acknowledged through the International community.

Let him that hath wisdom count the number of the beast Revelation 13:18 this warning is given to God’s people so they can unmistakably identify the beast.
There are three references in the Bible involving this number six hundred three score and six I kings 10:14,20  II Chronicles 9:13,19 and Revelation 13:18 where something supervised by government is counted.
Whenever a subject matter is given three times, it is most important that we take heed it could contain answer to the mystery of the beast, his mark, name, and the number of his name.
THE NUNBER IS SIX HUNDRED THREESCORE AND SIX
Now the weight of gold that came to Solomon in one year was six hundred three score and six. And King Solomon made two hundred targets of beaten gold: Six hundred shekels of beaten gold went to one target and three hundred shields made he of beaten gold, three hundred shekels of gold went to one shield. Moreover the king made a great throne of ivory i.e. both small and great Revelation 13:18 and overlaid it with the best gold. I Kings 10:14,21 II Chronicles 9:13,19
In these two books of the Old Testament there is evidence that [gold] one substance in different amounts was divided and put in diverse places and counted with the wisdom of Solomon II Chronicles 9:22,23 Wisdom is also necessary COUNTING the number of the beast. Revelation 13:18.
At the present time one vote is given each Representative in the United Nations that total 192 is not now satisfactory.  In the near future undoubtedly different number of votes will be assigned each Representative.
Nations in the United Nations Organization especially the West are anxiously aware that voting now in effect is inequitable and must be changed.
UNITED NATIONS SANCTION AGAINST IRAN
The result of two months of tough negotiations and resolutions in the United Nations in effect ordering all countries to stop supplying Iran with materials and technology that could contribute to its nuclear and missile programs and cause freeze up of Iranians assets of 10 key companies. The U.N. vote was used after talks with North Korea already under similar but tougher U.N sanction.
UNITED NATIONS   The U.N. Security Council voted unanimously Saturday December 23, 2006 imposed sanctions on those nations refusing to suspend uranium enrichment, and increase international pressure on governments supplying such material.

Article 18 of the United Nations charter now states each member of the General Assembly shall have one vote. Decisions in the General Assembly on important questions shall be made by a two-thirds majority of the members present and voting.

VOTING IS NOT SATISFACTORY IN THE UNITED NATIONS
Majority voting in the International Institution is not a genuine democratic procedure so long as the rule of one state one vote persists given the same voting power of States such as India or China with over a billion inhabitants and Iceland with less than a million having the same influence.
Theoretically a collection of small states representing a very minor fraction of the population could exercise negative or even positive effect over the decision process of the Assembly. The era of Western dominance of the Assembly’s process seems to have come to an end.
Voting privilege should be proportioned to real power and influence in the world defined by some formula that would give weight but not exclusive weight to the population factor. Majority decisions in the equalitarian General Assembly are likely to be undemocratic in that they do not represent a majority of the world’s population.
The outcome of this struggle is not easy to predict. No one should be surprised that there has been political dissatisfaction with this arrangement at the United Nations.
When the United Nations was first founded October 24, 1945 with 51 nations there was little need for concern. The West commanded the majority votes in the organization. When most of the freed colonized countries became member nations of the United Nations they were given equal voting privileges with as much leverage as the larger states regardless of their size or importance.
A proposal has been made that voting privilege in the General Assembly should be adjusted to a nation’s size and support given the Organization with of course limitation. Voting proposal for the United Nations suggests  Nation’s having the largest population and other beneficial contributing factors would each have 30 Representatives nations with lesser population and giving significant less benefit to the Organization would have voting status accordingly 12-8-4-3 and smaller nations those with one million or under would be given one vote most likely a similar plan like this will be adopted in the United Nations.
With 192 member states now in session in the year 2009 and the new Asian and African States in the majority there poses serious problems for the great Powers. A bloc of these smaller states voting on an issue can determine in whose favor for or against the outcome will be. This indeed is why the United States does not trust, and continues to be reluctant to bring vital issues to the United Nations and what is definitely a recognized weakness in the World Organization by all major nations.
Here is room for discernment, a call for wisdom of interpretation. Let anyone who has penetration and insight enough count the number of the beast. Revelation 13:18
Votes understandably must frequently be counted. No nation will be able to buy or sell without approval consequently their citizens suffer for they too will be unable to buy or sell if nothing is distributed to those countries. Revelation 13:18.
And he shall cause all small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark not a number in their right hand or in their foreheads. Revelation 13:16
If any man worship [respect] Revelation 14:9 or assist the beast with unbounded admiration or become a participant in this World Order and its Image receive it's mark in his forehead or in his hand notice: this is not a number, the same shall drink of the wrath of God which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation. he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presenceof the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment shall ascend up forever and forever and they have no rest day nor night who worship [engage in service for the beast] and whosoever receives the mark of his [it’s] name. Revelation 14:9,11
If any man worship [pay extraordinary respect] to the beast and his Image, and receive his mark in his forehead or in his hand not a number the same shall drink of the wrath of God. Revelation 14:9,11
The first angel went and poured out his bowl on the land, and ugly and painful sores broke out on the people who had the mark of the beast and worshipped his image. Revelation 16:10
Warning: do not become engaged with this blasphemous beast or assist it in any manner regardless of consequence. To fight will be stupid: the sword must kill him that kills with the sword. Here is the patience of the saints. Revelation 13:10
And I saw thrones and they that sat upon them and judgment was given unto them and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God and which had not worshipped the beast neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. Revelation 20:4
And out of his mouth goes a sharp sword that with it he should smite the nations and he shall rule them with a rod of iron. Revelation 19:15 Amazing as it may sound when Christ returns to take over the kingdoms of this world not all people will welcome him.
NOT EVERYBODY WILL BE SATISFIED WITH THE REIGN OF CHRIST
People engaged in positions not required to take the mark of the beast who enter the Millennium will most likely object to the high moral standards set up by Christ in his kingdom. But his citizens hated him and sent a message after him saying we will not have this man to reign over us. Luke 19:4
And it shall come to pass, in the last days that the mountain [kingdom] of the Lord’s house shall be established in the top of the mountains and shall be exalted above the hills. And all nations shall flow into it. And many people not everyone shall say come ye and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord to the house of the God of Jacob for out of Zion shall go forth the Law and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem. And He shall sit in judgment among the nations and shall rebuke many people Isaiah 2:2-4 The Lord shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion and rule thou in the midst of thy enemies. Psalms 110:2
And he that overcomes and continue my works unto the end to him will I give power over the nations. And he shall rule them with a rod of iron as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers even as I received of my Father. Revelation 2:26,27
And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the king the Lord of hosts. And it shall be that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them, shall be no rain and there shall be the plague wherewith the Lord shall smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. Zechariah 14:18
SUMMARY
If all people are compelled by the beast system to take the mark, name, or the number of its name 666 in order to buy or sell necessary things to sustain life Revelation 14:9,10 or be killed. Who are these unrestrained people from all nations in millennium needed to be ruled with a rod of iron and brought to the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ?

                     ---------------------------------------------------------

[Britt333]

http://www.gracecentered.com/christian_forums/general-discussion/rfid-and-verichip/new/?topicseen#new
another topic on the mark of the beast
hope it helps 
 
God Bless

[Eccl12:13]

ISREAL TO BE BORN IN A DAY    
            
Who has heard such a thing or who has seen such a thing. Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day shall a nation be born at once? For as soon as Zion prevailed she brought forth her children. Isaiah 66:8

After world war 1 the League of nations approved the British Mandate of Palestine with intention to create a national home for Jewish people. In 1947 the United Nations approved the partition of the Mandate of Palestine into two states one Jewish nation and one Arab nation. The Arab League rejected the plan and on March 14, 1948 Israel declared independence. A nation is born in a day. Isaiah 66:8

Now let's read the REST of what will happen on the day the REAL Israel will be gathered and born;

Isa.66
[12] For thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees.
[13] As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.

Has peace been extended to Jerusalem today?

Are the people of Jerusalem comforted today?

[14] And when ye see this, your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall flourish like an herb: and the hand of the LORD shall be known toward his servants, and his indignation toward his enemies.

When we see the above, then we will know who the servants of the Lord are AND His enemies.

[15] For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.
[16] For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.

So did ALL of this happen in 1948?  If not, then the nation Israel HAS NOT been born in a day, not yet anyway!




.

[Bigdog]

 Not to confuse things anymore but I have a little info I found on the Christian Answer. Net
 As someone Else has said: In Ezra 2: 1 Now these are the people of the province who came back from the captivity, who had been held captive in Babylon... Now if we go to( Verse 13) you will find the name of Adonikam whose people numbered six hundred sixty six. I found that interesting because his name was under the subject of the Antichrist, but I'm not suggesting anything.
The meaning of his name is: Whom the Lord sets up: He came with Zerubbabel the meaning of his name: The seed of Babylon, He is also known by the Persian name Sheshbazzar ( Ezra 1:8) there he is the prince of Judah.
Now in ( Ezra 1:11) some more interesting info on him is; All the articles of gold and silver were five thousand four hundred, he brought from Babylon to Jerusalem.
Prince defines an ambiguous position of authority, which is specified in Ezra 5:14 as Governor He is mentioned 4 times in Ezra but no where else in the OT.
Upon his return after 70 years of captivity in Babylon, he erected an altar and laid the foundation of the temple on the ruins of that which had been destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar (3:8-13; ch. 4-6) All through the work he occupied a prominent place, as he was a descendant of the royal line of David.
I find that all very interesting but you can't draw any conclusions from that,I just thought I would share it.

[Northboy]

Huh.

I take from the Book of Revelations to mean something completely different.

To me, after study of Jewish wisdom writings and commentaries I see the Mark of Beast as being "speculation" in this generation.

Head - Heart - Hand

Ideas of the mind should be discerned through the heart before we act.

Speculation in ideas, not properly discerned, but acted upon.

Spiritual speculation ( witchcraft, Kabballah)
Religious speculation (too many examples to count)

without discernment lead to rash actions ( Head - Hand, no Heart) A method of decision making without reference to God.


The heart is where the spirit of God resides.

Rash actions are like a grenade going off, everybody gets a little bit.

We'll see who's right won't we?

[han55]

does the christians would take the mark of the beast?

[Bigdog]

does the christians would take the mark of the beast?

Most Christians should be Gone in the rapture by then, but anyone who becomes a Christian during the time if the great tribulation would be told to take the mark of the beast if they want to live, if they refuse they would not be able to go to heaven: Revelation:14: 11; If you read in Daniel 3:1-28 it is sort of the same as what happened to Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego, it is great reading.

[BondServant]

There will be no Christians on earth after the rapture.  Once Jesus comes for His bride, it is too late (Matt 25).

In Christ,
KP

[Eccl12:13]

There will be no Christians on earth after the rapture.  Once Jesus comes for His bride, it is too late (Matt 25).

In Christ,
KP

First, can you please provide just ONE scripture that says the Lord will return BEFORE the tribulation period?

Next, this is the fate of all those Christians that do not make it to God's place of safety, which is right here on this earth;

Rev.12
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Dan.7
[21] I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

Those "saints" that do not make it to God's secret place, will have to go against the man of sin.  And the bible says he wins!

.

[BondServant]

First, can you please provide just ONE scripture that says the Lord will return BEFORE the tribulation period?

I have never made this claim...if you read my posts, you will see I do not believe that.  Please do not put words in my mouth.

Thank you!

In Christ,
KP

[Eccl12:13]

First, can you please provide just ONE scripture that says the Lord will return BEFORE the tribulation period?

I have never made this claim...if you read my posts, you will see I do not believe that.  Please do not put words in my mouth.

Thank you!

In Christ,
KP

I never said you did.  I'm just asking for a scripture that says Jesus returns before the tribulation period.  Do you know of one?

.

[larry2]

I'm just asking for a scripture that says Jesus returns before the tribulation period.  Do you know of one?

The following is the manner of how the Lord will receive us into heaven unless you have some other way you know of. There is also an order of the resurrection.

1 Thessalonians 4:16  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1 Thessalonians 4:17  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

If those in Christ can trust Him to receive them as 1 Thessalonians 4:16 describes, and in Revelation 3:10 He promises some that patiently keep His word to be kept from the temptation to come upon all the world, it appears to me that Jesus must receive those to Himself in the clouds prior to the tribulation.

[Eccl12:13]

I'm just asking for a scripture that says Jesus returns before the tribulation period.  Do you know of one?

1 Thessalonians 4:16  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

But will the Lord return with the sounding of just ANY trump?  Let's read at what trump the Lord returns and the dead that rise with Him;

Rev.8
[2] And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.

So we know the number of the trumpets that will be blown; (7).  Now let's find at which trump the Lord returns;

1 Corth.15
[52] In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

So Jesus cannot return until the sounding of the LAST trump, the 7th trumpet, meaning (6) MUST sound before He returns.  Now let's see what other events takes place at the sounding of the Last trump;


- the dead in Christ shall rise first. 1 Thes.4:16
- we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds. 1 Thes.4:17
- SIx trumpets will have already sounded. Rev.8:2,6
- Great voices in heaven announce that the kingdoms of this earth are now Jesus. Rev.8:15
- The nations are mad. Rev.8:18
- Jesus give His reward to the saints. Rev.8:18
- Jesus destroys those that destroys the earth. Rev.8:18

Now ALL of these events happen at the sounding of the LAST trumpet, the 7th Trump.  Let's look at something here;

The alive and the dead are caught up to be with the Lord at the sounding of the 7th trump and they will be with the Lord FOREVER!

The kingdoms of this earth are given to Christ at the sounding of the 7th trump, and He rules those kingdoms FOREVER!

Now at what point does the Lord GO BACK TO HEAVEN?  Looks like He is here to stay.....FOREVER!!!!

Let's search more. Let's now read in Rev.19;

Rev.19
[11] And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

So we see Jesus JUDGING AND MAKING war at this time also. Well that is the SAME THING He did at the sounding of the 7th TRUMP in Rev.11:18. Let's read it here again;

Rev.11
18]And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

"That they should be JUDGED", "And should destroy them which destroy the eaarth"

Just how many times will Jesus come back to Judge and make war? Let's continue;

[13] And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

His clothes were dripping in blood because He was at war. And who came with Him? Those same saints that were caught up in the air to meet Him;

[14] And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

And NO! The heaven they came from was NOT the habitation of God. It was simply the heaven of the clouds (The 2nd, of the 3 heavens mentioned in the bible.) The same clouds the saints are gathered to to meet Jesus.

[15] And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Now let's look at one more place where this event is described;

Dan.7
[12] As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

Again we see nations and their power being taken away. Let's read who took their power away;

[13] I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.

So the Son of Man came to the earth from the clouds!

[14] And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

And the Son of man was given a kingdom which shall never pass away!

[18] But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

And the saints He brought with Him will rule FOREVER!

[22] Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

WAIT ONE SECOND! So the saints that came with the Lord STAYED! They DID NOT GO BACK TO HEAVEN? Well let's read what happens next;

[26] But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

Now one more verse.  Let's look to see who else the Lord punishes when He returns;

2 Thes.2
[8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Again, the Lord is going to render judgement at the sounding of the 7th trump, even to the Wicket one.  Now who is the "Wicked" one?  Let's read;

[3] Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
[4] Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

That "Wicket" one is none other that the Abomination of Desolation.

Now if Jesus returns at the 7th trump, renders judgement, rewards the saints, takes over and rule the earth AND destroys the AOD, that ENDS the great tribulation period.

Again....ALL of these events take place at the sounding of the LAST trumpet.  The 7th trumpet.


.

[larry2]

Eccl 12:13 - I'm just asking for a scripture that says Jesus returns before the tribulation period.  Do you know of one?

larry2 - The following is the manner of how the Lord will receive us into heaven unless you have some other way you know of. There is also an order of the resurrection.

larry2 - 1 Thessalonians 4:16  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

larry2 - 1 Thessalonians 4:17  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

larry2 - If those in Christ can trust Him to receive them as 1 Thessalonians 4:16 describes, and in Revelation 3:10 He promises some that patiently keep His word to be kept from the temptation to come upon all the world, it appears to me that Jesus must receive those to Himself in the clouds prior to the tribulation.

Eccl 12:13 - Will the Lord return with the sounding of just ANY trump?
 
Eccl 12:13 - Again....ALL of these events take place at the sounding of the LAST trumpet. The 7th trumpet.

larry2 - It appears you have all the answer you want. Why ask since you believe the Lord is limited to trumps of judgment, or to even one appearing? Apparently you do not see a difference in the different appearing of saints in heaven at separate times after Revelation 4:1 when John is caught up into the open door in heaven to see things that will be hereafter.

Sorry I misinterpreted your intent in asking.  If you're locked into A-Mill, I have no need to attempt to convince you of other possibilities. 

[Stucky]

    I hope you all don't mind if I add something to this discussion.  I believe what is stated here but understand that others may not.  This is quoted from a Bible study lesson written by Jack Kelly of www.gracethrufaith.com.  He sets the time with the first two paragraphs.


 
A Bible Study by Jack Kelley

The Great Tribulation is about to begin on Earth. The Temple will soon be made desolate. When that happens, the Jewish remnant will heed the Lord’s call from Matt. 24:16 and flee to a place of supernatural protection as we saw in Rev. 12. When they do, the target of opportunity will become the so-called Tribulation Saints, those who’ve come to faith in the Lord after the Rapture. The anti-Christ’s first order of business after proclaiming himself to be God and setting up his counterfeit religion will be to shut down this new movement of God’s. Since they’re scattered all over the place the best way to do that is to freeze them out of the economy, making it impossible for them to earn wages or buy life’s essentials.

While discussing Job, Satan had chided God, “He only worships you because you bless him and protect him. Take it all away and he’ll curse you.”(Job 1:9-11) Now he has his man, the anti-Christ, go after the Tribulation Saints the same way. Deprive them of enough and these new converts will either turn or die. Either way, he’ll soon be rid of them, or so he thinks.

Revelation 13
And the dragon stood on the shore of the sea. (Rev 13:1) Having been cast out of Heaven, Satan stands by the sea, a euphemism for the gentile nations (Daniel 7:2) ready to do his worst on Planet Earth.

The Beast out of the Sea

And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. He had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on his horns, and on each head a blasphemous name. The beast I saw resembled a leopard, but had feet like those of a bear and a mouth like that of a lion. The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was astonished and followed the beast. Men worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, “Who is like the beast? Who can make war against him?”(Rev. 13:2-4) As the same beasts in Daniel 7 represented Babylon (lion) Persia (Bear) and Greece (leopard) it makes sense to see them that way here. The order is reversed because Daniel was looking forward in time while John was looking back. When Daniel saw Rome, he couldn’t compare it to any animal he’d seen, so he called it a large and terrifying beast. John shows it to be a monster with multiple heads and horns.

But the personal pronouns indicate a king more than a kingdom. That means that the speed of Alexander (the leopard), the strength of Cyrus (the bear), and the boastful roar of Nebuchadnezzar (the lion) are all present in this king. And what’s more, he wields all the power and authority of Satan, even seating himself on Satan’s throne. This monster in the guise of a man is the anti-Christ, finally revealing his true nature. Having complete power (10 horns) supernatural wisdom (7 heads) and officially recognized authority over all (10 crowns) he’s set to make the world over in his own image, and those whose hearts are focused on the things of Earth are loving it. He’s apparently come to power through a botched assassination attempt that’s left his right eye blinded and his right arm withered (Zech. 11:17) The world thought he had died, but here he is alive. Rumors of his resurrection add to his aura and are encouraged.

The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise his authority for forty-two months. He opened his mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world. (Rev. 13:5-8) Having consolidated his power over Earth, and endearing himself to the Jews by helping them build a Temple, he now marches into the Holy City to stand in the Temple and declare that he’s God in the flesh, slandering His Name, making His House desolate, and mounting a full sale attack on remaining believers. We saw the Heavenly reaction to this declaration. It got him kicked out for good and signaled the beginning of the Great Tribulation. But on Earth it’s different. Every one whose name isn’t written in the Lamb’s Book of Life will worship him.

A more literal translation of verse 8 reads, ” and all who dwell on earth will worship it (the beast), everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slain.” It’s the version used by the New American Standard and the English Standard, two of the most literal translations of the Greek. It speaks clearly to the validity of the doctrine of Eternal Security.

If you’re saved, God knew about it before He created the Earth. Prior to giving Adam his first breath He looked down over the vast span of time and saw the moment when you would make your independent decision to serve Him. (He foreknew.) And that’s when He made a reservation for you in His Kingdom, swearing never to blot your name out of the book. (He predestined.) When the time was right he spoke to your heart, knowing you’d respond. (He called.) And when you did He cleansed you from all of your sins, regarding you from that time forward as if you’ve never sinned at all. (He justified.) And one day soon He will give you a new eternal body and a place near Him in His Kingdom. (He glorified.) (Romans 8: 29-30)

In the context of time you made your own free choice to accept the pardon that Jesus purchased for you. But having seen the end from the beginning, He has always known that you would. All your life He’s watched over you, preparing you for your day of decision. And ever since then He’s protected you, for He promised He would never lose any of those He’s been given. (John 6:39-40) He knows that it’s the shepherd’s job to keep the sheep. And He’s the Good Shepherd.

He who has an ear, let him hear. If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity he will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword he will be killed. This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of the saints. (Rev. 13:9–10) Again we’re told that the Great Tribulation will not be cut short, but will run the full 3 1/2 years ordained for it from ancient times. Nor will anyone from this point on be miraculously preserved. The judgments will come and will run their course.
“Be faithful unto death,” He told the Church at Smyrna, “And I will give you the crown of life.” (Rev. 2:10) Like it was at the beginning of Christianity, so it will be at the end. The penalty for loving Jesus is death. Let me hasten to remind you that the Christian Era doesn’t end with the Church. There will be Christians on Earth long after the Church is gone.

The Beast out of the Earth

Then I saw another beast, coming out of the earth. He had two horns like a lamb, but he spoke like a dragon. He exercised all the authority of the first beast on his behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed. And he performed great and miraculous signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to earth in full view of men.

Because of the signs he was given power to do on behalf of the first beast, he deceived the inhabitants of the earth. He ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. He was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that it could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed. He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. (Rev. 13:11-17) We call this second beast the False Prophet. The fact that he comes out of the Earth means that he’s an ordinary man. His two horns mean that he has the authority of a witness, testifying to the power of his senior partner, just as John the Baptist testified about Jesus. He sounds a lot like the Gentle Jesus of liberal denominations, and performs miracles like Elijah’s, but his words originated in Satan’s heart.

He heads up the one world religion, and makes certain that it’s united in its worship of the anti-Christ. Building a great image of him, he uses supernatural power from the devil to give it a semblance of life and makes everyone worship it on pain of death. Because no one can tell if another person is really worshiping or just going through the motions, he devises a test. If you’re loyal to the anti-Christ and truly worship him, you must agree to take a mark to prove it. It will not only demonstrate your sincerity, but allow you to participate fully in mainstream life without fear. Refusing it means you’re one of those who has given your heart to Jesus. If you’re caught, the penalty for that is death. And even if you’re not, you’ll face a nearly impossible challenge in just staying alive.

This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man’s number. His number is 666. (Rev. 13:18) This verse has been subject to much speculation and incorrect interpretation because it tells us so little. It says only that the anti-Christ’s number is the number of a man, and that his number is literally 600 and 60 and 6, which may be different from 666. We don’t know.

What we do know is that both Biblical languages (Hebrew and Greek) gave numerical values to the letters of their alphabets to compensate for their lack of a direct numbering system. The Romans used Roman Numerals, assigning numerical values to a few letters, and today much of the world uses Hindu-Arabic Numerals, value specific symbols originally developed in the 2nd century BC but not widely used until several hundred years later.
If (and it’s a big if) the numbers six hundred, sixty, and six, are supposed to signify a name, then the numerical value of the anti-Christ’s name would probably have to equal that amount in its Greek form, Greek being the language of the Revelation.

I don’t think it makes sense to devise a numerical equivalent for the letters of the English alphabet to figure this out because, outside of certain pagan religious practices, there’s no accepted valuing system for doing so. We’ve always used Arabic numerals and so haven’t assigned numerical equivalents to the letters in our alphabet like the Hebrews, Greeks and Romans did.

Some think that the number might apply to something other than his name, his birthday for instance, or a title of some sort. It could also be a registration number, like the American Social Security number, or any one of the other numbers by which we’re known in various aspects of our lives.

The big qualifier for the verse is the phrase “let him who has understanding.” To me that disqualifies most of us from even guessing. It seems that a person would have to have an understanding of the practice of gematria, the calculation of the numerical equivalence of letters, words, or phrases in Biblical Greek to come up with the answer.

Daniel 12:4 tells us that in the latter days knowledge will increase. That means that pretty soon someone will crack this code. Personally, I think it’s unlikely that this will happen before the church disappears.