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Online RB

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #35 on: Sun Jun 02, 2019 - 07:10:02 »
You're simply incorrect.
You saying that proves not one thing without scriptures supporting what you are saying, and you have none BTW.
Quote from:  robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
Scripture says the false prophet, the antichrist's sidekick,
You are so wrong~the false prophet and the antichrist (spirit of) are one and the same!
Quote from: The apostle John
1st John 2;18,19~"Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."
The false prophets and antichrists are ONE and the SAME. The prophecy of Daniel 7-12; Christ from  Matthew 24, Mark 13; and Luke 21; of Paul 2nd Thess 2; all speak of the false prophets/antichrists/fasle professors that shall come in GREAT MUlTITUDES in the little season of Revelation 20 just before the Lord's coming.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
will issue the mark of the beast
A person is BORN WITH this mark, again, it is called human depravity! Sinners have its on their foreheads~their minds are in FULL agreement with Satan and serving sin..... and on thier right hand ~they are in perfect fellowship with the world AGAISNT God and the saints, with whom they shall make war against. Your dotrine tells me which side you are on at the moment.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
You're making the mistake of "symbolizing" too much Scripture.
I did not write the scriptures, God did. Soterion wisely said:
Quote from: soterion on: Yesterday at 09:57:33
And others literalize too much to the extent that scripture becomes impossible to make any sense of, and they do this to fit their own agendas and inventions.

The plainer and more literal sections of scripture should interpret those that are less plain and those that are written in poetic or apocalyptic style. If the literalizing of a passage results in a contradiction with another passage, or if it results in an impossibility, then that literalizing should be abandoned in favor of a more figurative view.
You would show wisdom by heeding his godly advice.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
God's word consists of ABSOLUTES.  However, it doesn't work that way. All of God's word is absolutely true, & what symbolism there is always represents a LITERAL person, thing, or event.
To understand those absolutes, we MUST compare scriptures with scriptures and let the word of God yield to us it OWN interpretation and that's the way to come to the true knowledge of the truth. You would be wise to do the same.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
]Men reduce "inconvenient" Scriptures to "symbolic/figurative" status so it'll fit their own agendas and inventions.
Again no man wrote Revelation using highly symbolical language~ the scriptures came to us by the Spirit giving them John~ and we take the word of God overall to interpret those highly symbolical words. Your problem is that you do not like what you are hearing from men who let the SCRIPTURES yield to us the true intent of those words given to John. Zechariah 13:7-10 is a perfect example of what we are saying, scriptures that you made no comment on, and acted as though we never gave it to you and others for your consideration of the meaning of 666. So, WHO is being dishonest? Look in the mirror and you will see the man, you just might know him.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
And the antichrist will be one man, as Daniel mentions, Paul mentions, and Revelation mentions.
You are living under the strong delusion of 2nd Thessalonians 2:11! You cannot take Daniel, and Christ's words, not Paul's and prove what you are saying~if you think you can, then do it.
Quote from: Paul
2nd Thessalonians 2:3-12~"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.  And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
You will find no support from Paul here in these scriptures.

Who is the man of sin? Is he a single person as you vainly teach? No, he is not. Man of sin is very easy to see and understand. MAN of sin...man OF SIN...is the man who is living under the power of SIN.....the man of sin as spoken by Paul is a collective pronoun including ALL who are serving sin and not following the word of God, but their own man-made doctrines, etc. Man of war is not a single person but all who engage in war.  Man of God is NOT limited to ONE man but all who are servants of God, etc.
Quote from: robycop3 Reply #33 on: Yesterday at 09:07:11
Try BELIEVING the Scriptures you read, and studying some history.
Well, prove to me that do believe the scriptures, which so far you have prove not one truth in this thread. As far as history, I get most of mine from the word of God. I read history, but I NEVER use extra-biblical information to teach BIBLICAL TRUTH. You would be wise to do the same.
« Last Edit: Sun Jun 02, 2019 - 07:13:49 by RB »

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #35 on: Sun Jun 02, 2019 - 07:10:02 »

Offline robycop3

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #36 on: Sun Jun 02, 2019 - 09:42:23 »
   More pret garbage.
   Some of it isn't worthy of a reply, but I'll answer some of the rest, for the benefit of other readers.
  First, again, Scripture is MOSTLY-LITERAL. Where it says "fire & brimstone", it means "fire & brimstone", burning sulphur. Where ti says "our Lord jesus Christ", it means just THAT. And Paul wrote "THAT MAN of sin, not "those MEN of sin". He wrote that HE, not 'they", will exalt HIMSELF, not "themselves", above everything/everyone who's been worshipped as God. So, according to Scripture, there will be ONE particular "man of sin". He's called the antichrist, "that Wicked", son of perdition, etc. as well.  Yes, John wrote there were many antichrists in his day, & he went on to define an antichrist as anyone who denied the Father and the Son, or who was opposed to Jesus.And yes, that was true then, & is true now. But THE penultimate AC hasn't yet come. (Satan is the ULTIMATE AC.) This man will be a world dictator, as shown in Rev. 17.
   And Rev. 20:10 mentions THE false prophet being cast into the lake of fire, called "THE beast from the earth" in Rev. 13. He shall be the antichrist's sidekick.
  I highly recommend you discard all the trash of Alcazar, Gentry, Preston, etc. which you may have, as you're obviously badly misled by that pret hooey. Try reading the Bible with BELIEF, as written, insteada what someone else SAYS certain Scriptures mean.

Offline 3 Resurrections

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #37 on: Sun Jun 02, 2019 - 18:13:44 »
Hi robycop3,

RB doesn’t claim to follow Preterism at all, but I do, although I’m not any kind of Preterist you may have encountered before.  (For example, I hold to a literal 1,000-year PAST millennium from 967BC-AD33, and no less than THREE PHYSICAL resurrection events, including a past, literal, physical rapture of all the dead saints up to AD70 when Christ physically returned to the Mount of Olives.  Likewise a future, final end to fallen man’s history in AD 3033, but NOT an end to the planet or the universe.  The Satanic realm was destroyed in AD70, and we are currently in the NHNE, awaiting Christ’s final return when He will purge this planet of the presence of any human evil forever.)

Like you, I believe scripture teaches about a SINGLE “Man of Lawlessness”.  He arose from among the MANY antichrists present back in John’s days, and died in the Temple in the fall of AD 66 after a brief, meteoric rise to power which was snuffed out by one of his fellow Zealot rivals.  His name was Menahem; a son or grandson of the Zealot rebel who perished, Judas the Galilean in Acts 5:37, giving Menahem the title of “the son of destruction”.

All that aside, as far as the original theme of this post, there seems to be much confusion manifested above about the “mark” of the Beast.  The basic fact is that the “mark” of the Beast is not the same thing as either the NUMBER 666 or the NAME of the Beast, because Rev. 13:17 lists all three as separate and distinct from each other. 

The number 666 is NOT the “mark”.  The calculated number with the actual, full numerical value of six-hundred-sixty-six (not 66 percent, as proposed) is the AGE IN YEARS of the Sea Beast’s existence as of John’s writing Revelation in AD 59-60.  The 666 years started in 607 BC with Nebuchadnezzar’s (the head of the “lion” kingdom) first deportation of the Jews from Jerusalem, which began their 70-year exile period.

Furthermore, there is one salient point in the context of Rev. 13 that each of the views expressed above has not mentioned.  That point is one single identifying feature that shows us precisely who this Sea Beast creature is.  We are told in Rev. 13:2 that the Dragon (which is Satan) gives his own power AND HIS SEAT to the Sea Beast, along with great authority.  Scripture itself tells us exactly what that “SEAT” or “THRONE” of Satan is.  In Rev. 2:13, it’s found in THE CITY OF PERGAMOS where Satan was said to dwell. 

That means any identity we assign to the Sea Beast MUST include the fact that Satan gave his own SEAT or THRONE in the city of PERGAMOS to that Sea Beast.  In addition, this also shows us that Satan Himself CANNOT BE THE BEAST (as RB has proposed) because that would mean Satan gave his own seat in Pergamos to himself, and not to another.  This isn’t even a possibility. 

The idolatrous city of Pergamos (along with Satan’s seat), as well as the entire Pergamum kingdom in Asia was given to the ROMAN REPUBLIC by King Attalus III in 133 BC, as a dying bequest in his written will, presented and recorded in the Roman Senate.  As the last king of the Attalid dynasty, Attalus III had no heir to inherit the Pergamum kingdom, so he handed it over to his ally, the Roman Republic, before he died.  This means the Sea Beast is unmistakably connected with Ancient Rome - not a time in our future. 

There are a couple more texts proving that Satan cannot possibly be one of the Beasts.  That is because Satan was later thrown into the Lake of Fire where the Beast and the False Prophet already were(Rev. 20:10).  Each of these is distinct from each other. 

Also, Rev. 16:13 lists Satan as separate from the Beast and the False Prophet, because “unclean spirits like frogs came out of the mouth of the Dragon, and out of the mouth of the Beast, and out of the mouth of the False Prophet.”  Three separate entities, distinct from each other.

RB’s proposal insists that the mark of the Sea Beast imposed by the Land Beast is HUMAN DEPRAVITY from birth, and that 2/3 of mankind will have this mark, with only God’s 1/3 elect portion who does not have this mark of human depravity, according to the symbolism he is extracting from Zech. 13:8.  This CONFLICTS with his own theology saying that we are ALL born with human depravity from birth (which I happen to agree with).

Apparently, RB’s proposal is that 1/3 of humanity is not born with human depravity, or at least no longer has it (after salvation).  This would mean that he assigns a total number of only a 1/3 remnant of humankind that will ever be saved.  There is a problem with using a 1/3 fraction to quantify how many will be eternally saved; we are told in Rev. 7:9 that the “great multitude” found in heaven are an amount of people “that NO MAN CAN NUMBER”.  To assign a fixed number of 1/3 of mankind who will be saved is to ignore the Rev. 7:9 text about the “great multitude” that no one is supposed to be able to number. 

Besides, doesn’t it sound odd that the “elect angels” have a 2/3 number who didn’t fall into rebellion (Rev. 12:4) compared to mankind’s  proposed 1/3 ?  Why would the angels have a better percentage of righteousness than elect humankind?   

I think it’s a mistake to apply the Zech. 13:8 numbers of 1/3 and 2/3 to the SALVATION STATUS of ALL mankind.  When Zech. 13:8 says that 2/3 will be “cut off and DIE”, it only means that the 2/3 lost their PHYSICAL LIVES in that LOCAL JUDGMENT on the land of Israel and Jerusalem in particular, which are the very locations being spoken of in that Zech. 13:8 context.  Bad eisegesis all around on that one point.

As for the “mark” of the Beast that is imposed by the Land Beast on behalf of the Sea Beast, along with the restriction of not being able to buy and sell, there is a picture of this “mark” of the Sea Beast at the
following link:   

http://www.begedivri.com/shekel/

It’s a coin. You can actually purchase one online for about 700-800 bucks, if you are so inclined.  A very particular silver coin called the “Tyrian shekel” which the Jewish priesthood REQUIRED all in Israel to use for paying their annual Temple Tax and for buying and selling any sacrificial animals in the Temple. 

This coin, prized for the purity of its high silver content of 94-95%, was minted in the city of Tyre from 127 BC until 19 BC.  That year, Rome closed the mint at Tyre, and started importing degraded 80% silver coins from the East instead.  It was then that the Jews asked Rome for permission to start minting a purer silver coin themselves, for ceremonial use in the Temple. 

Since only an independent nation had the privilege of minting its own currency, Rome agreed to let the Jews do this, as long as they continued to keep the same Tyrian shekel images on their coins of the demi-god Hercules and the Roman eagle with the inscription “Tyre the holy and city of refuge”.  They also had the initials “KP” stamped on them, standing for “kraitos Romaion”, which meant “power of the Romans” - a sign that the Jews were only issuing their coins under subjection to Rome’s authorization.  These forbidden, pagan images and profane inscription were an abominable affront to God’s laws about this, given to Israel by Moses back in Deuteronomy 7:25-26.  However, the Jewish priesthood ignored this point of the law and agreed to keep using the same pagan images on the new coins that Rome allowed them to produce after 19 BC.

All those in Israel who did not cooperate with the Jewish leadership’s insistence on using this coin for religious transactions would have been regarded as a rebel - similar to the Zealots who opposed anything that recognized Roman oversight of their nation.  Any rebellious ones disturbing the pro-Roman status quo - like the Zealots - were put under a ban by being cast out of the synagogue.  This was a punishment on a par with a death sentence, because such individuals were to be shunned by the entire community, and forbidden any personal sympathy or business support of the person’s livelihood.  Such ostracism could literally kill, and kept the people in petrified fear of the Sanhedrin’s power.

We have ample scripture examples proving the widespread extent of this “fear of the Jews” concerning the threat of excommunication from the synagogue by the religious leaders of Israel.

John 19:38 - Joseph of Arimathea’s fear of the Jews
John 9:22 - the parents of the blind man fearing expulsion from the synagogue
John 12:42 - any converted religious leaders were afraid to confess their faith, lest the Pharisees kick them out of the synagogue
John 16:2 - Jesus gave His disciples a warning that they would be put out of the synagogue, and even killed for confessing their faith in Christ

These examples show us that the Land Beast of Rev. 13, (the 2-horned Pharisee and Sadducee leadership of Israel that spoke lies, just like the Dragon/Satan did) could actually cause those not giving homage to the image of the Beast to be killed. 

Revelation 13:12 and 14 tells us that the Land Beast “exercises all the power of the first Beast BEFORE IT”.  This was done by the delegated powers that the Roman authority allowed the Sanhedrin of Israel to exercise over its own people. 

The priesthood were responsible for the “fire from heaven” on the Temple’s altar, which was done by the Land Beast “IN THE SIGHT OF THE SEA BEAST”.  That is, in its very presence. The Greek word “ENOPION” in Rev 13:13 and 14 means “before the face of”, or visually in front of it.  This was absolutely true in first-century Jerusalem, because the Temple was positioned across from the Roman Antonia fortress and its barracks for
the soldiers which was situated on what we mistakenly call the “Temple Mount” today. 

This Antonia fortress was directly in view of the true location of Jerusalem’s Temple sitting across from it on Mount Zion, with the waters of the Gihon Spring channeled through it.  So the Land Beast of Israel’s leadership was actually operating from the Temple in the very sight of the Roman Sea Beast who was present at the Antonia fortress.

Rev. 13:16 goes on to indicate that the “mark” imposed on those in Israel by the Land Beast in behalf of the Roman Sea Beast was received in their right HAND or in their FOREHEADS.  In spite of a certain symbolism expressed by this (as RB has noted), for the Tyrian shekel, this was literally true.  For a fee, the Temple money-changers handed over the required, priesthood-approved Tyrian shekel or half shekel in exchange for any foreign currency brought to the Temple by the worshippers.  Or, as scripture calls this coin, the “didrachma”, or the “drachma”. 

This “drachma” coin also showed up in the headdress of married women of the time.  A row of ten drachma coins was fastened in the FOREHEAD portion of the headdress as a sign of a woman’s married status, serving the same purpose as a wedding ring.  This is why the woman who lost one of her 10 drachma coins in Luke 15:8-10 was so perturbed by the loss, just as a married woman today would be upset at losing her wedding ring somewhere in the house.

So, to condense these comments into simple terms of definition:

Sea Beast of Rev. 13:1 -  a conglomerate biographical history of Daniel’s world empires ever since Nebuchadnezzar’s “lion” kingdom, ending finally with the Roman empire’s presence in John’s days, sitting on Rome’s 7 hills, with a specified number of 10 horns as crowned emperors.  This Sea Beast had been given the seat of Satan in Pergamos in 133 BC.

Land Beast of Rev. 13:11 -  the 2-horned Pharisee and Sadducee leadership structure in Israel with a reputation for deceit and speaking lies like Satan, the Dragon.  (As Christ described them in John 8:44 and 55, “Ye are of your father the devil...he is a liar, and the father of it....if I should say I know Him not, I should be a liar like unto you...”). It exercised the power delegated to it by the Roman Sea Beast over those in the land of Istael on the behalf of, and in support of the last Roman phase of the Sea Beast.

The “mark” of the Beast -  the Tyrian shekel and half-shekel coin (the didrachma and drachma) required by the priesthood Land Beast for use in any buying and selling of sacrificial offerings in the Temple, and for payment of the annual Temple Tax.  The Tyrian shekel “mark” was placed in the hands of those exchanging their foreign currency by the money-changers in the Temple, and was also featured as the coins in the forehead of a married woman’s headdress covering.

The 666 number of the Sea Beast -  the actual calculation of the number of years the combined world empires of Daniel’s vision had held sway, from 607 BC when Nebuchadnezzar deported Daniel and the first group of Jews from Jerusalem (at the start of the 70-year exile) until the time when John was writing Revelation in AD 59-60; just prior to the AD 60 Laodicean earthquake ( predicted soon to happen in Rev. 3:14-16).

Lots to digest, I know...sorry about that robycop3...and I’m pretty sure you will not agree with any of this Preterist-flavored material, but that’s okay...I won’t be offended.  Just hope you realize that not all Preterists “spiritualize” away everything.  These were literal, historical, physical events of the first-century times that all line up with fulfilling the WRITTEN prophecies of Revelation, down to the letter in many, many cases.  That leaves the UNWRITTEN prophecies of Rev. 10:4 to be fulfilled AFTER AD 70.
 




Online RB

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #38 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 05:29:51 »
RB doesn’t claim to follow Preterism at all, but I do, although I’m not any kind of Preterist you may have encountered before.  (For example, I hold to a literal 1,000-year PAST millennium from 967BC-AD33, and no less than THREE PHYSICAL resurrection events, including a past, literal, physical rapture of all the dead saints up to AD70 when Christ physically returned to the Mount of Olives.  Likewise a future, final end to fallen man’s history in AD 3033, but NOT an end to the planet or the universe.  The Satanic realm was destroyed in AD70, and we are currently in the NHNE, awaiting Christ’s final return when He will purge this planet of the presence of any human evil forever.)
3 Resurrections what are you going to do if we are here in 2034 and nothing has changed as you predicted they will? Also you did not present my understanding correct here:
Quote
RB’s proposal insists that the mark of the Sea Beast imposed by the Land Beast is HUMAN DEPRAVITY from birth, and that 2/3 of mankind will have this mark, with only God’s 1/3 elect portion who does not have this mark of human depravity, according to the symbolism he is extracting from Zech. 13:8.  This CONFLICTS with his own theology saying that we are ALL born with human depravity from birth (which I happen to agree with).

Apparently, RB’s proposal is that 1/3 of humanity is not born with human depravity, or at least no longer has it (after salvation).  This would mean that he assigns a total number of only a 1/3 remnant of humankind that will ever be saved.  There is a problem with using a 1/3 fraction to quantify how many will be eternally saved; we are told in Rev. 7:9 that the “great multitude” found in heaven are an amount of people “that NO MAN CAN NUMBER”.  To assign a fixed number of 1/3 of mankind who will be saved is to ignore the Rev. 7:9 text about the “great multitude” that no one is supposed to be able to number. 

Besides, doesn’t it sound odd that the “elect angels” have a 2/3 number who didn’t fall into rebellion (Rev. 12:4) compared to mankind’s  proposed 1/3 ?  Why would the angels have a better percentage of righteousness than elect humankind?   
ALL are born with this mark, read my post again and even after regeneration we still live in this body of sin and death. Only that a small remnant is sealed so that the beast cannot deceive them.

I will say more to you after I could back over your post again.

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #38 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 05:29:51 »
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Online RB

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #39 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 05:51:45 »
More pret garbage.
You do not even understand the three main schools of thoughts if you believe that I follow Preterism. Not even close. I'm a Amill idealist if you understand what that entails~which I'm convinced you do not.
Quote from: robucop3 Reply #36 on: Yesterday at 09:42:23
Some of it isn't worthy of a reply,
That's a copout...robycop3.
Quote from: robucop3 Reply #36 on: Yesterday at 09:42:23
but I'll answer some of the rest, for the benefit of other readers.
Reading your post you sure did not benefit them very much, if any. No wonder the knowledge of the average churchgoer is pitiful if they have men like you in the pulpit.
Quote
First, again, Scripture is MOSTLY-LITERAL. Where it says "fire & brimstone", it means "fire & brimstone", burning sulphur. Where ti says "our Lord jesus Christ", it means just THAT.
Oh, that's deep teaching! I know that we read the scriptures at FACE VALUE, but try that with Revelation and see where you get with that! Okay Mr. Literaist help me out with these scriptures:
Quote from: JESUS CHRIST
John 6:53-57~"Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him. As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me."
Your deep teaching has you in a world of trouble even in such scriptures as these. I could heap hundreds more, but they would serve no purpose to men like you.
Quote from: robucop3 Reply #36 on: Yesterday at 09:42:23
I highly recommend you discard all the trash of Alcazar, Gentry, Preston, etc. which you may have, as you're obviously badly misled by that pret hooey.
See, you cannot even figure out what school of eschatology I belong to. You need to do your homework before you try to correct one who has been at this for almost fifty years. You are out of your league little boy.
Quote
Try reading the Bible with BELIEF, as written, insteada what someone else SAYS certain Scriptures mean.
Just as I said to you...you are out of your league little boy. You are barking up the wrong tree because a LION is there waiting for you that that lion can eat you for lunch. You better move on to the next tree were kittens play.

This is NOT my manner of dealing with posters, but I believe you deserve it, to get you off of your high horse where you do not belong.
« Last Edit: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 05:55:00 by RB »

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #39 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 05:51:45 »



Offline 3 Resurrections

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #40 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 07:34:05 »
Hi RB,

The dated year I gave was not “2033”  for the Lord’s final return, but 3033.  Might be just a typo when you asked what I would do if we are still here in 2034.  The year 2033 is the switching point to the final thousand years of the total 7,000 years for all of fallen man’s history on this planet, based on the pivotal date of Christ’s AD 33 crucifixion and the “First Resurrection” at the end of the 4th millennium of human history.  You and I have discussed this chronology of world history before, and neither of us is changing.  You can continue to follow Tony Warren’s proposed chronology, of course, but I don’t believe in basing scripture’s chronology on one single verse about a mistaken insertion of Cainan into the genealogical line of the patriarchs.  Warren’s entire theory is founded on building inflated patriarchal ages on that one individual who never existed.  But that’s definitely off topic here.

As for the 666 number, what you are doing with your 1/3 and 2/3 comparison in Zech. 13:8 is a classic case of conflating two passages of scripture, hoping to concoct a connection between the two.  I might as well say that King Solomon was the Beast of Rev. 13 because he had 666 talents of gold brought to him in one year, which point I have heard suggested before from I Kings 10:14.

Those 2/3 in Zech 13:8 who are “cut off and die”  is not an indication that they are necessarily unregenerate, anymore than the Messiah being “cut off out of the land of the living” means that Christ was unrighteous because He physically died by His life being cut off by crucifixion. 

All that passage in Zech. 13:8 tells us is that physical death would fall on 2/3 of the people in all the land of Israel - not the entire globe.  Remember, that verse is only part of Zechariah chapter 12-14’s prophecy described as “The burden of the word of the Lord FOR *ISRAEL*” which described the AD 70 “siege against Judah and Jerusalem” (Zech. 12:2).   

There are multiple items in this intact Zech . 12-14 prophecy predicted to happen “IN THAT DAY” of Jerusalem and Israel’s experience, which includes the Zech 13:8 verse you are kidnapping to prove only a 1/3 salvation limit for all mankind.  I would think God has better stats than that, especially since we consider that the number of infants miscarried and aborted throughout history very likely amount to a third of all conceived human life anyway, without even considering those of us who made it to adulthood.

The 666 calculated number (not 66 %, which is a different number entirely), was called “the number of A MAN”.  Anyone reading John’s writing in the first century  with even a basic knowledge of Daniel’s prophetic writings knew that the “lion kingdom”, (representing King Nebuchadnezzar), was “made to stand upon the feet AS A MAN, and A MAN’S HEART was given to it.” (Dan. 7:4).  Definitely a connection to the “number of A MAN” in Rev. 13.

Daniel’s statue of different metals in Dan. 2, (from the golden head of Nebuchadnezzar’s kingdom down to the 10 toes of the Roman iron kingdom blended with the clay of the nation of Israel), was that of A MAN, representing all the world empires up to the time John was writing Revelation in AD 59-60 (666 years after Nebuchadnezzar’s 607 BC deportation of Daniel).  That is why John’s vision in Rev. 13 saw a Sea Beast (which had the 666 number of a man) that had ALL the features combined in it from the lion, leopard, and bear kingdoms all subsumed into one.  The Sea Beast of Rev. 13 represented the complete biographical history of 666 YEARS of world-empire rule up to the time John was writing, starting with King Nebuchadnezzar’s first deportation of Daniel and the Jews from Jerusalem in 607 BC. 

You may not agree with anything written above, but at the very least, there are absolutely no self-contradictions in this  paradigm as presented. 

Offline soterion

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #41 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 07:41:13 »
A person is BORN WITH this mark, again, it is called human depravity! Sinners have its on their foreheads~their minds are in FULL agreement with Satan and serving sin..... and on thier right hand ~they are in perfect fellowship with the world AGAISNT God and the saints, with whom they shall make war against.

For at least two reasons I can't buy into that view, the one that says the mark of the beast is the depravity that all are born with.

The first reason should come as no surprise, so I will not spend any significant amount of time on it: We are not born depraved.

The second reason has to do with what I see as a distinction being made between those who receive the mark and worship the beast, and those who do not. Not everybody is given this mark. In Revelation 13, it is those who worship the image of the beast that are given the mark so as to buy and sell. In Revelation 14:1-12, a distinction is made between those who worship the beast and are given the mark and those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus, who have the name of His Father written on their foreheads.

I should add here that this mark is given by the beast. People are not born with it. It is given to those who decided to give-in to the beast. The beast is not causing all mankind to be born depraved. This event is contemporary to the time and people of which are being written, it is not speaking of all mankind for all time.

Online RB

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #42 on: Mon Jun 03, 2019 - 09:29:04 »
Hi RB,

The dated year I gave was not “2033”  for the Lord’s final return, but 3033.  Might be just a typo when you asked what I would do if we are still here in 2034. 
Sorry, my bad.

Offline robycop3

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Re: WHAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS AND THE MEANING OF 666
« Reply #43 on: Tue Jul 16, 2019 - 01:49:14 »
I have written a bible study on what is the "mark of the beast", why it is evil, how it is nearly impossible to buy or sell without it, what the "right hand" and "forehead" symbolize, and what 666 means.

Check out the study here http://www.wisdomofgod.us/2019/01/07/what-the-mark-of-the-beast-is-and-the-meaning-of-666/ .

Also available in Spanish here http://www.sabiduriadedios.com/2019/01/07/lo-que-es-la-marca-de-la-bestia-y-el-significado-de-666/ .


  The mark of the beast will be an implantable microchip. The tech already exists. The right hand & forehead don't "symbolize" anything but body parts. The mark will be literal, & will replace cash, , MAC cards, etc. Christians will have to depend upon a "black market" as they otherwise won't be able to buy, sell, or even earn wages.

  But it won't happen til the "beast" is in power, & the "rapture" has occurred.

 

     
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