Author Topic: discernment and church leadership  (Read 4690 times)

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Offline churchplanter

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discernment and church leadership
« on: Sun Dec 19, 2010 - 22:04:52 »
Over the past week a situation has come to light in the church where I am attending and wanted to get the views of others.

 Several months ago our church was brought some equipment that the church desperately needed and the pastor was told "you can use these until the church can afford to financially purchase their own."  Fast forward until this past Tuesday.  an individual has chosen to leave the church and let the pastor know that he needed the equipment back that was on loan.  It was brought to the pastors attention that this equipment was taken from an employer without there permission. The individual that took the equipment wanted to return it to the employer but the pastor and elders did not agree with how this was to take place. The pastor wanted the individual to return the equipment and confess to the employer that he had taken it without permission.  The individual knew that he was wrong and knew that he could be fired if he spoke up so he refused and said that it would be simply returned no questions asked. On Friday the pastor and leadership met with the employer returned the equipment and the employee was terminated.

This puts me in a tough situation on one hand the pastor is my mentor as I am in training to plant a church out of my current church but on the other hand I fundamentally disagree with the pastor and his stance and leadership on the issue especially since he informed the church this morning of the situation in the service with friends and family of this individual present.

I am seeking guidance on this issue as I believe that as clergy it is our position to forgive, and urge people to make the right decision, not to make the decision for them and inform the church of the situation.  I believe it is not our position to play God but that people do need to be held accountable for their actions.

Scripture tell us the following

"If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private ; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.   16  "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.   17  "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church ; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

What do you think?

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discernment and church leadership
« on: Sun Dec 19, 2010 - 22:04:52 »

HRoberson

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Re: discernment and church leadership
« Reply #1 on: Mon Dec 20, 2010 - 19:26:28 »
Over the past week a situation has come to light in the church where I am attending and wanted to get the views of others.

 Several months ago our church was brought some equipment that the church desperately needed and the pastor was told "you can use these until the church can afford to financially purchase their own."  Fast forward until this past Tuesday.  an individual has chosen to leave the church and let the pastor know that he needed the equipment back that was on loan.  It was brought to the pastors attention that this equipment was taken from an employer without there permission. The individual that took the equipment wanted to return it to the employer but the pastor and elders did not agree with how this was to take place. The pastor wanted the individual to return the equipment and confess to the employer that he had taken it without permission.  The individual knew that he was wrong and knew that he could be fired if he spoke up so he refused and said that it would be simply returned no questions asked. On Friday the pastor and leadership met with the employer returned the equipment and the employee was terminated.

This puts me in a tough situation on one hand the pastor is my mentor as I am in training to plant a church out of my current church but on the other hand I fundamentally disagree with the pastor and his stance and leadership on the issue especially since he informed the church this morning of the situation in the service with friends and family of this individual present.

I am seeking guidance on this issue as I believe that as clergy it is our position to forgive, and urge people to make the right decision, not to make the decision for them and inform the church of the situation.  I believe it is not our position to play God but that people do need to be held accountable for their actions.

Scripture tell us the following

"If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private ; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.   16  "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.   17  "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church ; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

What do you think?
Your pastor and elders were out of line. It isn't their job to confess someone else's sins. They should simply have returned the equipment and let it go at that. Very simple, actually.

Offline ucbc777

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Re: discernment and church leadership
« Reply #2 on: Mon Jan 31, 2011 - 21:24:31 »
I gasped when I read this post! Everyone here is right...out of line.  Now the pastor sinned.  Here is a simple way to figure out an answer to a problem like this. Do you think Jesus would have done something like this? My heart tells me no. If the pastor could not forgive and move on, then our Lord will not forgive and move on right? Sometimes people do not use common sense and faith is full of common sense. What is so difficult to understand about loving your neighbor these days? Life would be so simple if we truly lived by God's law! Here you have a corrupt preacher leading a congregation. Something wrong with this picture! There is a sermon on my churches website about corrupt preachers and giving Christianity a bad name...that comes to mind right now. There is also one about helping others, loving others and being a good neighbor... I wish all preachers taught like my pastor does. Link deleted per rule 3.1
« Last Edit: Mon Feb 07, 2011 - 02:00:19 by larry2 »

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Re: discernment and church leadership
« Reply #2 on: Mon Jan 31, 2011 - 21:24:31 »

Offline Apothecary 4 Christ

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Re: discernment and church leadership
« Reply #3 on: Wed Feb 02, 2011 - 08:32:08 »
churchplanter,

I've been through a variety of church conflicts in my life, both as a church leader, and as "the guy in the pew."

I've learned that there is often more to a story than is fully disclosed, and this is often wise.

But even if this is the whole story, just remember that Pastors and elders make mistakes.  They/we are sinners too.  Often these mistakes are made with good intentions and we are wise to try and put the "best" construction on their actions if we can.

Don't let this 1 incident discourage you from learning from this pastor.  Learn from this.  One day it will be your turn to make the mistake.  Deal with them in the way you would want to be dealt with at that time.

Blessings,
Jason

 

     
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