Author Topic: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?  (Read 34585 times)

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Offline janine

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #70 on: Sat Sep 12, 2009 - 17:08:40 »
Mandelee,

I appreciate that thought.  Divorce may be a symptom of a bigger problem.  Could it be the problem of disobedience?  Or what I believe, that many don't know that Jesus considers remarriage after a divorce adultery.

Only if there was no adultery or sexual immorality in the first marriage. if there was, then the innocent party is allowed to divorce and remarry.

So you're saying that the person who cheated stays married but the innocent party is single after the divorce?

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #70 on: Sat Sep 12, 2009 - 17:08:40 »

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #71 on: Sun Sep 27, 2009 - 20:22:08 »
pastors are trained a specific way for a vocation.  They do not meet the requirements of leadership.  (Or very, very few actually do.)  They read up on something and then preach on it as if they not only know about it, but are experts on it.

Even the secular world doesn't accept this in most situtations.  Yet we who are wise them them that we are wise and we do that which is against common sense, and against the scriptures.  Every person bears fruit of the state of their soul.  A Jekyl and Hyde?  Then he is evil, according to Christ, and all that he does is works of wickedness, again as expressly stated by Christ.  Yet we don't believe that.  Why not?  Well, we don't believe much of the rest of the Word, for look what we allow in leadership, and remarriage, etc..  The blind heart will indeed twist the Word, and reason away whatever it wants, for "every man does what is right in his own eyes", even when it conflicts with direct statements in God's Word.  Hence, female leaders, gay churches, remarriage, etc..  But they are enlightened, and we are bigoted and blind and arrogant hypocrites.  Novel concept, that.  Anyhow, I don't see any way to open eyes that are intent on remaining blind, for "how great is that darkness".  But then again, that will be quoted against those who hold to the obvious Word, and speak against the sinful "Christian".  There's nothing that we can do about it, for if they reviled Him, surely they will revile those who are sent by Him.  Thus the injunction to leave them to their sin, making a distinction among the people, for by their fruits you will know them, and judge every man according to his deeds.

After the first and second admonishment, have nothing to do with such, the Word says.  That applies to this forum, also.  Thus, there are those who will not respond at all to a number of people, for they insist on saying "so. You can belive what you want, and I'll belive what I want -- there are many interpretations."  Even though there is only one in God's eyes.

"A word to the wise is sufficient"

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #72 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 03:23:28 »
pastors are trained a specific way for a vocation.  They do not meet the requirements of leadership.  (Or very, very few actually do.)  They read up on something and then preach on it as if they not only know about it, but are experts on it.

Even the secular world doesn't accept this in most situtations.  Yet we who are wise them them that we are wise and we do that which is against common sense, and against the scriptures.  Every person bears fruit of the state of their soul.  A Jekyl and Hyde?  Then he is evil, according to Christ, and all that he does is works of wickedness, again as expressly stated by Christ.  Yet we don't believe that.  Why not?  Well, we don't believe much of the rest of the Word, for look what we allow in leadership, and remarriage, etc..  The blind heart will indeed twist the Word, and reason away whatever it wants, for "every man does what is right in his own eyes", even when it conflicts with direct statements in God's Word.  Hence, female leaders, gay churches, remarriage, etc..  But they are enlightened, and we are bigoted and blind and arrogant hypocrites.  Novel concept, that.  Anyhow, I don't see any way to open eyes that are intent on remaining blind, for "how great is that darkness".  But then again, that will be quoted against those who hold to the obvious Word, and speak against the sinful "Christian".  There's nothing that we can do about it, for if they reviled Him, surely they will revile those who are sent by Him.  Thus the injunction to leave them to their sin, making a distinction among the people, for by their fruits you will know them, and judge every man according to his deeds.

After the first and second admonishment, have nothing to do with such, the Word says.  That applies to this forum, also.  Thus, there are those who will not respond at all to a number of people, for they insist on saying "so. You can belive what you want, and I'll belive what I want -- there are many interpretations."  Even though there is only one in God's eyes.

"A word to the wise is sufficient"



 ON the subject of divorce and remarriage, there are as many interpretations as to what the Bible say as there are people who say them. I have heard many teachings on this subject and also those who have studied it for many many years looking into the original greek and hebrew and even who speak greek and hebrew . Along with this I have also studied the Bible and prayed about it and that is how I have come to the conclusions that I have. if people have come to different conlcusion then that isnt my responsibility. The only responsibility I have is to do what God is leading me to do and believe what He has led me to believe.If others believe differentl;y that is between them and God.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #72 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 03:23:28 »

Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #73 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 07:54:11 »
Actually I don't believe that the Bible is obscure on the subject.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #74 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 07:57:41 »
Actually I don't believe that the Bible is obscure on the subject.


No nor me.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #74 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 07:57:41 »



Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #75 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 07:59:25 »
Ms ch:

So I'll be happy to quote the verses again, then...

(But I thought you just said: "...ON the subject of divorce and remarriage, there are as many interpretations as to what the Bible say as there are people who say them....")

Actually I don't believe that the Bible is obscure on the subject.


No nor me.

Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #76 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 08:04:43 »
Luke 16.18: "Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery."

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #77 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 08:31:46 »
I don't either when you understand the culture Jesus and the Apostles were speaking to... its clear as day.

But when you take the 21st english spin on things it's totally opposite of what Jesus was taking.. (which is what I chalk up to willful ignorance and the doings of a homosexual king).

People like Farouk are exactly like the Rabbi's that Jesus was discrediting when he walked the earth.  They had lost the spirit and culture of the Law and built a Law unto themselves.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #78 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 11:06:30 »
Ms ch:

So I'll be happy to quote the verses again, then...

(But I thought you just said: "...ON the subject of divorce and remarriage, there are as many interpretations as to what the Bible say as there are people who say them....")

Actually I don't believe that the Bible is obscure on the subject.


No nor me.
 

Yes there are many different interpretations but I know what I believe and never doubt it. i cant help what others think.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #78 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 11:06:30 »

Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #79 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 11:55:52 »
T:

Oh, so what else does Luke 16.18 mean, then?

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #80 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 12:20:22 »
matthew 5 v 32
"I tell you whoever dissmisses and repudiates and divorces his wife, EXCEPT on the grounds of unfaithfullness (sexual immorality)causes her to committ adultery."
The trouble is that you take only one meaning of the word 'pornea' and not many meanings as it has, (such as adultery, fornication, incest, homosexual relationships etc etc).I take the full meaning of that word. THAT is the reason why we will never agree as you cant accept the full meaning as being more that sex before marriage. Maybe you have been taught that, I dont know.
however I know that divorce is allowed for sexual immorality, whether it be adultery. gay sex, incest, or any other type of sexual immorality. Therefore we will never agree.  ::smile::

« Last Edit: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 12:26:22 by chosenone »

Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #81 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 14:18:01 »
Ms ch:

Actually it's not a joke.

It's significant that Luke 16.18 contains no reference to fornication. Why?

.... ::smile::



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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #82 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 16:15:00 »
Who said it was a joke?.(its only a smile) Matthew includes the allowance to divorce for 'pornea' and that is good enough for me. There is a reason why that part about 'pornea' is included, even if you dont like it. Its is there in black and white for all to see.
We will never agree so dont waste your time. You concentrate on your walk with God and I will continue to walk the way that God is leading me.
« Last Edit: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 16:34:50 by chosenone »

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #83 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 21:44:41 »
Ms ch:

It seems to hinge on the meaning, in context, of PORNEIA, in Matt. 5 and Matt. 19.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #84 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 22:05:18 »
There are many interpretations on virtually every topic in the scriptures.  However, there is only one correct one in God's eyes, or there are conflicting truths.  So to dole out the statement about many interpretations, so each to their own, is merely humanism applied the Christianity.  And I think that many see it to be rampant.  Perhaps they are correct.  Maybe not.  In either event, there can only be one truth on a topic.  The whole of the Word is to be interpreted by the whole of the Word.  It is not culturally interpreted, else the Word of God changes with culture.  That's sheer foollishness, for God is a fluzy who changes by the habits of mankind.  "I am God, and I change not".  The spiritual truths of the Word are totally above all cultures, and are not to be understood or defined by them, or they are not of God, but are of culture.  Anyone can study this at university, for the world understands it.  Do we?  I hope so, but sometimes I can't help but doubt.  May we grow together in the Word.  And the word alone.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #85 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 22:14:27 »
I agree.

There are many interpretations on virtually every topic in the scriptures.  However, there is only one correct one in God's eyes, or there are conflicting truths.  So to dole out the statement about many interpretations, so each to their own, is merely humanism applied the Christianity.  And I think that many see it to be rampant.  Perhaps they are correct.  Maybe not.  In either event, there can only be one truth on a topic.  The whole of the Word is to be interpreted by the whole of the Word.  It is not culturally interpreted, else the Word of God changes with culture.  That's sheer foollishness, for God is a fluzy who changes by the habits of mankind.  "I am God, and I change not".  The spiritual truths of the Word are totally above all cultures, and are not to be understood or defined by them, or they are not of God, but are of culture.  Anyone can study this at university, for the world understands it.  Do we?  I hope so, but sometimes I can't help but doubt.  May we grow together in the Word.  And the word alone.

Offline chosenone

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #86 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 22:26:24 »
Ms ch:

It seems to hinge on the meaning, in context, of PORNEIA, in Matt. 5 and Matt. 19.
 

yes and the reaon Jesus used that word is because sexual immorality is more than just adultery. If a man abuses children or sexually abuses a women that is sexual immorality. If a husband or wife engages in some sort of sexual relationship with another of their own sex, that is sexual immorality. if a person engages in sex with an animal, while not strictly adultery in one sense, that is 'pornea' as well. If he had merely used the word for adultery it would have been far too restricting. Pornea includes many different types of sexual immorality.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #87 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 22:29:45 »
There are many interpretations on virtually every topic in the scriptures.  However, there is only one correct one in God's eyes, or there are conflicting truths.  So to dole out the statement about many interpretations, so each to their own, is merely humanism applied the Christianity.  And I think that many see it to be rampant.  Perhaps they are correct.  Maybe not.  In either event, there can only be one truth on a topic.  The whole of the Word is to be interpreted by the whole of the Word.  It is not culturally interpreted, else the Word of God changes with culture.  That's sheer foollishness, for God is a fluzy who changes by the habits of mankind.  "I am God, and I change not".  The spiritual truths of the Word are totally above all cultures, and are not to be understood or defined by them, or they are not of God, but are of culture.  Anyone can study this at university, for the world understands it.  Do we?  I hope so, but sometimes I can't help but doubt.  May we grow together in the Word.  And the word alone.
 

I agree.WE do need to look at the whole of the Bible when deciding matters such as divorce and remarriage. We also need to be 100% at peace about what we believe after we have done this.I am 100% at peace so I will walk with God the way he has led me, and I am sure that others will do the same.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #88 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 22:43:21 »
Ms ch:

Why then is the Lord silent in Luke 16.18, if PORNEIA really does refer to adultery as well as fornication in the Matt. passages? As Luke 16.18 reads, it reads as if there is no exception as a general rule. It seems to me that if PORNEIA really did refer primarily to adultery in Matt. 5 & 19, one would expect to see an excpetion clause repeated in Luke 16.

Ms ch:

It seems to hinge on the meaning, in context, of PORNEIA, in Matt. 5 and Matt. 19.
 

yes and the reaon Jesus used that word is because sexual immorality is more than just adultery. If a man abuses children or sexually abuses a women that is sexual immorality. If a husband or wife engages in some sort of sexual relationship with another of their own sex, that is sexual immorality. if a person engages in sex with an animal, while not strictly adultery in one sense, that is 'pornea' as well. If he had merely used the word for adultery it would have been far too restricting. Pornea includes many different types of sexual immorality.


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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #89 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 23:23:02 »
Ms ch:

Why then is the Lord silent in Luke 16.18, if PORNEIA really does refer to adultery as well as fornication in the Matt. passages? As Luke 16.18 reads, it reads as if there is no exception as a general rule. It seems to me that if PORNEIA really did refer primarily to adultery in Matt. 5 & 19, one would expect to see an excpetion clause repeated in Luke 16.

Ms ch:

It seems to hinge on the meaning, in context, of PORNEIA, in Matt. 5 and Matt. 19.
 

yes and the reaon Jesus used that word is because sexual immorality is more than just adultery. If a man abuses children or sexually abuses a women that is sexual immorality. If a husband or wife engages in some sort of sexual relationship with another of their own sex, that is sexual immorality. if a person engages in sex with an animal, while not strictly adultery in one sense, that is 'pornea' as well. If he had merely used the word for adultery it would have been far too restricting. Pornea includes many different types of sexual immorality.



 For whatever reason Luke didnt include it, but Matthew did and God clearly wanted it to be in the Bible so we cannot ignore it. It is clear as day in Matthew, so Jesus said it and what Jesus says is good enough for me.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #90 on: Mon Sep 28, 2009 - 23:30:36 »
Ms ch:

'clear as day' and 'good enough for me' are not the same for everyone.

It's a question of understanding the whole balance of the Lord Jesus' teaching in context, including in the light of the reference to Joseph wanting to put Mary away before they came together: the apparent context of the PORNEIA references in Matt 5 and 19.

Ms ch:

Why then is the Lord silent in Luke 16.18, if PORNEIA really does refer to adultery as well as fornication in the Matt. passages? As Luke 16.18 reads, it reads as if there is no exception as a general rule. It seems to me that if PORNEIA really did refer primarily to adultery in Matt. 5 & 19, one would expect to see an excpetion clause repeated in Luke 16.

Ms ch:

It seems to hinge on the meaning, in context, of PORNEIA, in Matt. 5 and Matt. 19.
 

yes and the reaon Jesus used that word is because sexual immorality is more than just adultery. If a man abuses children or sexually abuses a women that is sexual immorality. If a husband or wife engages in some sort of sexual relationship with another of their own sex, that is sexual immorality. if a person engages in sex with an animal, while not strictly adultery in one sense, that is 'pornea' as well. If he had merely used the word for adultery it would have been far too restricting. Pornea includes many different types of sexual immorality.



 For whatever reason Luke didnt include it, but Matthew did and God clearly wanted it to be in the Bible so we cannot ignore it. It is clear as day in Matthew, so Jesus said it and what Jesus says is good enough for me.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #91 on: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 04:05:24 »
You are free to come to your conclusions that no one is allowed to divorce even for serious abuse or sexual immorality, and I have come to mine based on the whole of scripture (which actually states that a couple cannot come together again if one had married (had sex with) another as that person is then defiled). I know that Jesus says that we can divorce and remarry for certain reasons, you dont.
 
Why dont you study the teachings of David Instone Brewer, who has looked into this in depth for many years.he has looked in depth into the original greek and hebrew meanings, what was happening at the time and what those listening would have already known. As well as being a committed christian he is a Bible historian.

 I have never actually met ANYONE except for 2 or 3 on this forum, who believes that you cannot divorce even for sexual immorality, so for you to assume that you are right when hundreds of learned Christian teachers say the same as me,is somewhat arrogant , but that does happen here sadly.

each to their own. For a reason that I dont know about, you have decided that you must tell those who are remarried that they are in sin, instead of doing what God wants and that is building them up and praying for them. You are treading on thin ice with God and sometimes he allows thing to happen in our lives to put us right on something so be very careful, .but you cant even see it sadly.
I am signing off, this is pointless. God Bless

Offline farouk

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #92 on: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 04:08:36 »
Ms ch:

Part of the context of the Lord Jesus' exception clause was the 'hardness of heart' for the sake of which He said Moses allowed it.

Under grace, this does not fit: as if one's heart were hard enough under grace to qualify for a divorce.

You are free to come to your conclusions that no one is allowed to divorce even for serious abuse or sexual immorality, and I have come to mine based on the whole of scripture (which actually states that a couple cannot come together again if one had married (had sex with) another as that person is then defiled). I know that Jesus says that we can divorce and remarry for certain reasons, you dont.
 
Why dont you study the teachings of David Instone Brewer, who has looked into this in depth for many years.he has looked in depth into the original greek and hebrew meanings, what was happening at the time and what those listening would have already known. As well as being a committed christian he is a Bible historian.

 I have never actually met ANYONE except for 2 or 3 on this forum, who believes that you cannot divorce even for sexual immorality, so for you to assume that you are right when hundreds of learned Christian teachers say the same as me,is somewhat arrogant , but that does happen here sadly.

each to their own. For a reason that I dont know about, you have decided that you must tell those who are remarried that they are in sin, instead of doing what God wants and that is building them up and praying for them. You are treading on thin ice with God and sometimes he allows thing to happen in our lives to put us right on something so be very careful, .but you cant even see it sadly.
I am signing off, this is pointless. God Bless

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #93 on: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 06:58:53 »
Ms ch:

Part of the context of the Lord Jesus' exception clause was the 'hardness of heart' for the sake of which He said Moses allowed it.

Under grace, this does not fit: as if one's heart were hard enough under grace to qualify for a divorce.

You are free to come to your conclusions that no one is allowed to divorce even for serious abuse or sexual immorality, and I have come to mine based on the whole of scripture (which actually states that a couple cannot come together again if one had married (had sex with) another as that person is then defiled). I know that Jesus says that we can divorce and remarry for certain reasons, you dont.
 
Why dont you study the teachings of David Instone Brewer, who has looked into this in depth for many years.he has looked in depth into the original greek and hebrew meanings, what was happening at the time and what those listening would have already known. As well as being a committed christian he is a Bible historian.

 I have never actually met ANYONE except for 2 or 3 on this forum, who believes that you cannot divorce even for sexual immorality, so for you to assume that you are right when hundreds of learned Christian teachers say the same as me,is somewhat arrogant , but that does happen here sadly.

each to their own. For a reason that I dont know about, you have decided that you must tell those who are remarried that they are in sin, instead of doing what God wants and that is building them up and praying for them. You are treading on thin ice with God and sometimes he allows thing to happen in our lives to put us right on something so be very careful, .but you cant even see it sadly.
I am signing off, this is pointless. God Bless

It's God who extends his grace to us.. in quantities that he sees fit as he regenerates us and lives in us.  Unfortunately, your doctrine excludes Gods time table for individuals and you are demanding obedience that may not be in the plans he has for someone.  This is very much an Old Covenant mentality.. and we know how that failed.

Why do you act like you are smarter then the Holy Spirit?

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #94 on: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 08:04:24 »
'clear as day' and 'good enough for me' are not the same for everyone.

It's a question of understanding the whole balance of the Lord Jesus' teaching in context, including in the light of the reference to Joseph wanting to put Mary away before they came together: the apparent context of the PORNEIA references in Matt 5

Understanding the whole balance of God's teaching should prove to everyone there is only ONE way...Jesus.  

It would be easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle then for anyone on God's green earth to enter the Kingdom of heaven following the law.  Or figuring out what PORNEIA means, or what law saves...or that divorce/re-marraige condemns...or whatever else we can judge another on.  

Put your trust in Jesus...accept His Spirit; and enjoy the freedom we have through the fruits of the Spirit...against such things there is NO law...
« Last Edit: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 08:32:46 by Thankfulldad »

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #95 on: Tue Sep 29, 2009 - 19:18:52 »
I think that one of the problems of many is that they micro manage the Word.  What do I mean by that?  Here's a little example:

(Mat 19:8)  He said to them, Because of your hard-heartedness Moses allowed you to put away your wives; but from the beginning it was not so.

(Mat 19:9)  And I say to you, Whoever shall put away his wife, except for fornication, and shall marry another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is put away commits adultery.


And everybody stops right there.  Not good.  Not good.  Keep reading:

(Mat 19:10)  His disciples said to Him, If this is the case of the man with his wife, it is not good to marry.

(Mat 19:11)  But He said to them, Not all receive this word, except those to whom it is given.


So to whom is this teaching of Christ given?  The divorced?  Everyone?  Divorced because the spouse was adulterous while married?  Look at Christ's answer:

(Mat 19:12)  For there are some eunuchs who were born so from their mother's womb; and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men; and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of Heaven's sake. He who is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Only eunuchs can't receive this teaching: it is for all others.  And there's only one reason why it doesn't apply to eunuchs, isnt' there?!!!  They can't get it up!  There is no union!   ::doh::

It is for all others.  Period.

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #96 on: Sat Jan 30, 2010 - 23:10:44 »
I got to this topic waaaaaaaaaaaay late; nonetheless, I would like to weigh in:

In the few pages I read, I didn't see anyone mentioning the passage
in Matthew 19:6, where Jesus commanded that what God has joined together, man must not put asunder.  But later in the Bible, God (as is His way) again leaves recourse for those who have been yoked to someone who chooses to disobey Him.

 I Corinthians 7: 15 "But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart.  A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases:  but God hath called us to peace."

See that the bondage was released there?  There is grace that covers, grace that breaks, grace that satisfies debt, etc. 

The word translated "depart" there wasn't just  translated as physically leaving, but rather:   "to separate, divide, part, put asunder, to separate one's self from, to depart".  It's the same word that was used in Matthew 19:6.  The "departing"  that God talked about isn't just done physically.

Moreover, Matthew 18:17 says that if after personal private appeal, appeal with two or three witnesses, appeal through the church, a professing believer will not repent, he/she is to be unto us as a heathen and a  publican(unbeliever).  If that heathen/publican still WILL not repent, will not turn, digs in the heels--he/she is described from the Bible as having departed.

Offline RedemptionAddict

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #97 on: Sun Feb 28, 2010 - 22:19:01 »
Sorry just joined the discussion . . . But did we get a conclusion on remarriage being okay?

Offline Saralee

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #98 on: Wed Mar 03, 2010 - 14:47:19 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him. 
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already. 
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone. 
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?

Offline rrawd

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #99 on: Wed Mar 03, 2010 - 17:48:12 »
These scriptures are the words of Jesus himself.  Today, those who call themselves born again Christians have divorce rates equal too or greater than the non-believers.  Pastors have one of the highest divorce rates of all professions.   ???

Pastors seem to be able to speak boldly against same sex marriage, yet there is a strange silence on marriage/divorce/remarriage for diciples of Christ.  Why the silence Shepards?  The sheep need the truth of what the Lord Jesus is saying.  Where is your voice crying in the wilderness?    ::shrug::

Thank you for doin the research for me. You are right there should be more teachings about the subject.

HRoberson

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #100 on: Wed Mar 03, 2010 - 18:34:35 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him. 
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already. 
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone. 
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?

Marriage is a life-long commitment to someone else, despite their failings. I would also observe that you don't know if he likes you, loves you, or wants to be married to you. The best you can do is take his word for it.

Apparently he does know that what he has done is wrong because he's living with his mother.

If he will go to counseling - to someone who won't beat either of you up - then I would recommend you give it a shot. Life change though, won't happen over night, so don't expect a 180 degree turn around over night.

I would also observe that a good counselor isn't going to treat your husband based on your story. It is simply true that there are two sides to every story, but we often don't hear the second version.

Marriage is not punishment. A poor marriage may be a consequence of poor choosing, or it may be the result of of a continuing emotional, mental, or sin problem.

You have to decide when you have had enough to not follow through with your commitment. Nobody here can do that for you.

Offline Saralee

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #101 on: Wed Mar 03, 2010 - 22:31:26 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him. 
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already. 
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone. 
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?

Marriage is a life-long commitment to someone else, despite their failings. I would also observe that you don't know if he likes you, loves you, or wants to be married to you. The best you can do is take his word for it.

Apparently he does know that what he has done is wrong because he's living with his mother.

If he will go to counseling - to someone who won't beat either of you up - then I would recommend you give it a shot. Life change though, won't happen over night, so don't expect a 180 degree turn around over night.

I would also observe that a good counselor isn't going to treat your husband based on your story. It is simply true that there are two sides to every story, but we often don't hear the second version.

Marriage is not punishment. A poor marriage may be a consequence of poor choosing, or it may be the result of of a continuing emotional, mental, or sin problem.

You have to decide when you have had enough to not follow through with your commitment. Nobody here can do that for you.


thank you for taking the time to type to me..

I know that God is the only one who can lead me through this..
I was just having a desperation attack!!!

nothing in me wants to do this any more,

that is just the honest ugly truth...

but I am open to God regardless of how I feel,
 ::pickinguprock::


once again
thanks!
God Bless You!


Offline RedemptionAddict

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #102 on: Thu Mar 04, 2010 - 22:44:08 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him. 
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already. 
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone. 
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?


Sounds like a bad situation. I think divorce is a terrible thing but Jesus said that adultery gives you grounds for divorce. And if your husband as been looking at porn, then he has already committed adultery in his heart (Matt 5:28, Matt 5:32)

Does anyone object? As far as I know what Jesus said on this subject was pretty clear

HRoberson

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #103 on: Thu Mar 04, 2010 - 23:38:55 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him.  
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already.  
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone.  
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?


Sounds like a bad situation. I think divorce is a terrible thing but Jesus said that adultery gives you grounds for divorce. And if your husband as been looking at porn, then he has already committed adultery in his heart (Matt 5:28, Matt 5:32)

Does anyone object? As far as I know what Jesus said on this subject was pretty clear
I would object on a number of grounds.
-- Looking at porn is not the same as adultery, despite what the Matthew passages seem to indicate.
-- Even if it is, the exception was not provided as the preferred choice - it was allowed because of hardness of our hearts.
-- The preferred choice is always to keep our commitments rather than look for reasons not to.

It's a heart thing, not a law thing. Why do we keep forgetting that?

HRoberson

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Re: Marriage/Divorce/Remarriage: Why Are God's Anointed Silent?
« Reply #104 on: Thu Mar 04, 2010 - 23:43:35 »
I need some Godly counsel, Please help me!!

   Last month I had to call the police on my husband because he hit one of my pets, cat, braking his front leg, just because he is always so mad, the police arrested him.  
We both are suppose to be christian. But I can see that my husband commitment to God was not strong at all.  He feels as thought because he got married he got in debt.  We have only been married for 8 months. In those 8 months, because he became bitter and sorry that he married me. He was very harsh with me, critical and punished me for his misfortune. I have endured a lot of ugly things.  I was in love with him when I married him.  Needless to say that because of his treatment, I am very hurt.  He swears he loves me and wants to work things out with me, but at the moment he is staying by his mothers' house because he said we fight too much.

I don't believe in divorce, but my first 8 months have been hell already.  
I do believe that with God everything is possible, but I also, if my husband is not seeking God, what am I suppose to do? I don't think he loves me.

I did wrong from the start by marrying him without seeking the Lord enough for His direction, and now I am in torment.  Last week I checked his cell phone records and found out he is downloading soft porn or porn pictures into his cell phone.  
When I met him in church, he was christian. He has a 2 year college diploma from  Bible College.  But that has not stopped him from doing all this.

Is my punishment to stay with him because I did wrong?

Marriage is a life-long commitment to someone else, despite their failings. I would also observe that you don't know if he likes you, loves you, or wants to be married to you. The best you can do is take his word for it.

Apparently he does know that what he has done is wrong because he's living with his mother.

If he will go to counseling - to someone who won't beat either of you up - then I would recommend you give it a shot. Life change though, won't happen over night, so don't expect a 180 degree turn around over night.

I would also observe that a good counselor isn't going to treat your husband based on your story. It is simply true that there are two sides to every story, but we often don't hear the second version.

Marriage is not punishment. A poor marriage may be a consequence of poor choosing, or it may be the result of of a continuing emotional, mental, or sin problem.

You have to decide when you have had enough to not follow through with your commitment. Nobody here can do that for you.


thank you for taking the time to type to me..

I know that God is the only one who can lead me through this..
I was just having a desperation attack!!!

nothing in me wants to do this any more,

that is just the honest ugly truth...

but I am open to God regardless of how I feel,
 ::pickinguprock::


once again
thanks!
God Bless You!
You're welcome. While we may not feel like being who we are called to be, we need to remember that Jesus didn't "feel" like remaining true either. Good luck, and God bless.