Bothersome question

[mitchell]

Christianna:"Does anyone else here find it ironic that some of the same ones on this thread who say we should not send money to help the poor in other countries because it can lead to laziness and/or corruption THERE, are the same who have criticized us "greedy Republicans" ...Maybe Mitchell and Booty have converted to  "compassionate conservatism"?  "

Sorry, but I didn't weigh in on the issue of sending money to missions. If I develop an opinion I'd be glad to share it. I'll keep my political view on the politics page.

[Booty]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote (christianne @ Jan. 21 2004,11:01)[/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]Does anyone else here find it ironic that some of the same ones on this thread who say we should not send money to help the poor in other countries because it can lead to laziness and/or corruption THERE, are the same who have criticized us "greedy Republicans" on the politics thread because we said that we should help people HERE on a personal level instead of raising our taxes to do it, because we have no control of how our tax money is spent?  Maybe these people will now understand OUR position.   :thinking:

Check out the "how do you see the poor...a question for the republican leaning" in the politics section.  

I (and many others there) tried to make the point that we should give willingly from our hearts on a personal level, not only because it benefits the recipient but also the one who is giving.  We said that relying on tax dollars for social programs is not preferable, because the money can and is spent on things that have nothing to do with helping the truly needy, and often the money is wasted on bureaucracy and pork, or to provide for those who are able but unwilling to work. When we tried to say that, we were criticized for being un-Christian and greedy.

Maybe Mitchell and Booty have converted to  "compassionate conservatism"?  (I know, Booty, you're not a "yank", but humor me here, will ya? :) )



PS:  Kinda sad, though, that some will trust the government with spending "donors" money more than they will trust fellow Christians - I'm not saying one should have more trust than the other, I'm just making an observation here.[/quote]
No I will not Humour you Christianne and I think we have had just about enough of partisan USA politics here at Grace Centered to last us a lifetime!

I do not care if you are a Republican Christianne, I truly do not. Nor do I care if you are a Green, a Socialist or an Aardvark!

Perhaps you might want to take your partisanship to the Politics Forum and leave it there!

[christianne]

Gee, I thought we actually had something to agree about here.

I truly felt that there was a connection here regarding giving or providing for the less fortunate.

All I was trying to say is that you advise people not to send money to help those in other countries because it tends to corrupt and doesn't go where it was intended.  I didn't accuse you of being "un-Christian" or anything because of that.  I just tried to point out that when others here have said basically the same thing in relation to tax monies going for the same type of things you were talking about, we were called un-Christ-like and accused of being greedy.  I thought maybe pointing out the similarities of our opinions would help you understand that, but I guess not.  My intent was not to upset you.  But sometimes I think there are some who are looking for something to argue about with no intention of seeing the similarities of views.
 
Sorry you two took it wrong.

[Booty]

Christianne, you know what the objection is and why. Leave your politics in the politics section.

[christianne]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]Christianne, you know what the objection is and why. Leave your politics in the politics section.[/quote]

No, I don't, but I guess I must have pushed your buttons there or you wouldn't be so angry.

[Booty]

Christianne,

We just finished a very traumatic experience at Grace Centered thanks to political partisanship. The Politics thread has remained and a predominant reason to retain it was that the political vitriol might be contained there and not spill out to the rest of the board.

There is no call for mention of political groupings in this discussion and it would be greatly appreciated by myself if you would keep same on the Politics Forum.

Now I believe we have sidetracked the thread sufficiently with this and should return to the subject.

[WileyClarkson]

:alert:  :alert:


This discussion is bordering on being lmoved to the politics area if it continues to include references to "political parties" or their "political positions" or "derogatory nicknames"? assigned to parties (or anyone for that matter) regarding their political position or supposed level of wealth, etc.  I really don't care what party anyone belongs to or has a preference for or a bias against.  

This area is for general discussion of personal views and communications without political affiliations and it appears that has momentarily been forgotten in the discussion.  I personally have a very broad definition of what can be discussed, but politics in any form is not included.  

Remember, there are no political party affiliations in Christ.  

:alert: :alert:

Thank you in advance for your cooperation in regards to this request.

[Bon Voyage]

Unbelievable.

Would some of this take place in a face to face discussion?

I am tired of the partisanship.

From the Republicans and Democrats.

[Nelta]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote (PreachersWife @ Jan. 17 2004,1:55)[/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]I haven't been around much at all due to personal reasons. Something came up in more then one congregation lately and I am troubled. Different men have led prayers or stated in discussions that God has blessed the US more then any other nation. They have offered thanks for this. Back in my own country we offered thanks to God for blessings but never I have heard it declared He preferred us to them.  So here I am a non american christian sitting with american christians and being told that God prefers US christians over other christians.  I am dumbfounded. I never even thought of God recognizing political boundaries. It  sounds so Old Testament.  Nation over nation. My understanding is that there is ONE kingdom God recognizes now and that is the one of believers. That the believers collectively comprise a nation. Not political borders. To say that God blesses the US (there for US christians) more then others means he elevates US christians over Canadian Christians, Indian (the country) Christians, european christians etc. Somehow they are less blessed. Are we really still in OT times where we place political nations against political nations?

PW[/quote]
Hi,

God recognizes no special nation today as He did the nation of Israel.  Now He has family in every nation. Those who think God blesses America might want to consider how evil America has become.  We are far from blessed as a nation.  Sin has crept even in to God's family in our country.  Materialism is rampant among "Christians" today.  

Nelta

[memmy]

Sin is everywhere Nelta.

God still does bless us everyday that we have a roof over our heads, food and clothing to protect us from the elements and good health for alot of us.

I call them blessings and they do come from God.

All of us on this board have to be blessed somewhat or they wouldn't have the access to a computer. This was the last splurge that I invested in. The electricity to plug it into, etc. is also a blessing.

That is what I am referring to as in God is blessing us.

And to be more clear, God is not only blessing us as His children here, He is blessing all of His, everywhere!

Memmy :D

[PreachersWife]

WOW.. all I can say is WOW!

I apologize to the mods if this got out of hand. I think my initial premise got lost somewhere. Thank you for the comments.

It's not "blessing America" that was my concern. It was offering a prayer on my behalf (since it was public) that the US was the MOST blessed. Perception is everything sometimes. Being Canadian I felt that we were being placed lower on God's totem pole so to speak.

I still question if God recognizes the same political boundaries we do as far as "nations" go.

I also see things through the eyes of the "non".  My parents came to visit me here in the US. I stayed home from the bible classes cause some of the older gentlemen love to catholic bash.  My parents are leary of my "new relegion" at the best of times, so I can imagine the confusion had they heard that prayer to top things off.

My husband just laughs at me. He gives my hand an extra squeeze when the song leader says "let's stand up and sing this one" and it's "America the Beautiful" or "God Bless America".. but we sit to sing "Our God is an Awesome God". It's all perspective.

I love my town here in the US.  Once you settle into a life the people are the same everywhere. I don't think I have ever "bashed" the US in anyway. Somedays I just see things from an outsider's perspective I guess..

thanks for letting me get that "itch" off my chest the other day.

PW

[Booty]

You sing America the Beautiful in services?

[PreachersWife]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote [/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]You sing America the Beautiful in services?[/quote]
Not Sunday or Wednesday. The Friday night singings and such it has happened a time or two. It's actually in some hymnals. Right now I am looking at "songs of Faith and praise" and it's number 1007.

PW

[memmy]

PW,

I want to make sure that you know that I understand your position, even though I am from here.

It wasn't you I was referring to as "bashing" the US. Our own citizens do that quite well, and that is mostly who I was referring to when I have mentioned that word.

You will find very pious people everywhere and I am sorry for the feeling you got from one of "us". I just hope and trust that you don't feel this way from all people here.

I am sorry that this whole thread got so defensive in nature. It is just that I am one who would rather show thanks for what we all have, in any country, than to "bash" what God has blessed us all with, that's all. I consider it to be a blessing where I am, it doesn't mean if I was somewhere else I wouldn't feel it wasn't a blessing to be there also.
  
Hugs to you and by the way, welcome to this country! The place where I pray that all will be welcome forever!

Blessings, :)
Memmy

[marc]

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote (WileyClarkson @ Jan. 21 2004,09:20)[/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]:alert:  :alert:


This discussion is bordering on being lmoved to the politics area if it continues to include references to "political parties" or their "political positions" or "derogatory nicknames"? assigned to parties (or anyone for that matter) regarding their political position or supposed level of wealth, etc.  I really don't care what party anyone belongs to or has a preference for or a bias against.  

This area is for general discussion of personal views and communications without political affiliations and it appears that has momentarily been forgotten in the discussion.  I personally have a very broad definition of what can be discussed, but politics in any form is not included.  

Remember, there are no political party affiliations in Christ.  

:alert: :alert:

Thank you in advance for your cooperation in regards to this request.[/quote]
. . . . not that "derogatory nicknames" are actually appreciated on the politics board. . . .  ;)