Author Topic: Creation scientists  (Read 35599 times)

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Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1330 on: Sun Oct 02, 2022 - 12:49:03 »
I am a creationist; I just don't agree with you. But, I think I get it now.  Science is true if it agrees with you; science is false if it doesn't agree with you.  OK, I understand. I can get a little biased at times too. 

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1331 on: Tue Oct 04, 2022 - 21:09:49 »
I am a creationist; I just don't agree with you. But, I think I get it now.  Science is true if it agrees with you; science is false if it doesn't agree with you.  OK, I understand. I can get a little biased at times too.

Yes, the world is filled with non-biblical creationists such as yourself. That is, those who cannot point to holy scripture which supports their versions of creation. Their faith lies elsewhere. My faith is based upon what the scriptures simply and repetitively state. I believe science which submits to the authority and truth of holy scripture. Go ahead, ask me to show you from scripture why I believe this or that about our origins, and I will. I have asked you to do the same many times over, without ever a response. Of course, the reason you do not is obvious enough. What you believe is not found anywhere in scripture at all. Please do take this opportunity to express and or explain otherwise. Thank you.

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1332 on: Tue Oct 04, 2022 - 23:48:29 »
My faith is based upon what the scriptures simply and repetitively state. I believe science which submits to the authority and truth of holy scripture.
Pheh.  This thread stands as an enormous monument to you looking everywhere EXCEPT at the Scriptures.

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1333 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 07:28:47 »
Pheh.  This thread stands as an enormous monument to you looking everywhere EXCEPT at the Scriptures.

A valid point. Concerning whom though? Please do point out where I have done so, and I will clarify my position as relating directly to the scriptures. I certainly do not want to give the impression that I am looking elsewhere for a final word concerning truth.

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1333 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 07:28:47 »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1334 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 07:35:55 »
I believe science which submits to the authority and truth of holy scripture.
Amo, you obviously wouldn't know, let alone believe, science if it jumped up and bit you in your backside, whether or not it submits to the authority and truth of holy Scripture.

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1335 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 08:45:01 »
Amo, you obviously wouldn't know, let alone believe, science if it jumped up and bit you in your backside, whether or not it submits to the authority and truth of holy Scripture.

I understand your need to revert to personal insult, and or attack. Nevertheless, all such is just 4WD said so nonsense. People not agreeing with you, does not equate to people intellectually inferior to you, but perhaps in your own mind. Much that is "science so called" is purely vain imagination. You yourself are a supposed climate change denier, are you not? Correct me if I am wrong. Which means many out their consider that you do not follow the science, as they so often like to claim considering those who do not accept their supposed "science so called". Are you not doing the same to me right now, just like the lefties do? Those who have faith in their theories , think such of you. And you think such of me, because my faith in God's word directs me toward different theories of our origins, than your faith in evolution direct you. I call your faith vain imaginings, along the same lines. We are all somewhat guilty parties to this. There is no meat in these claims though, they are not science or anything to do with it, but just defenses of our own faiths.

So, setting such things aside, please do offer up some meat or proof of what you are claiming. Then we can discuss or debate real issues, instead of faith based accusations. Here we are.
« Last Edit: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 08:47:15 by Amo »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1336 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 10:28:25 »
I understand your need to revert to personal insult, and or attack.
There are few here that revert to personal insult and attack more than you, Amo. Your attacks on Catholics is brutal as are your attacks on science and any scientists that might disagree with you. So it would be best if you just climbed down off of that high horse you think you are riding. My attacks on you are almost always a like response to your attack on your accusation of my lack of faith.
« Last Edit: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 10:46:20 by 4WD »

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1337 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 11:59:45 »
There are few here that revert to personal insult and attack more than you, Amo. Your attacks on Catholics is brutal as are your attacks on science and any scientists that might disagree with you. So it would be best if you just climbed down off of that high horse you think you are riding. My attacks on you are almost always a like response to your attack on your accusation of my lack of faith.

Same crap, no meat, just 4WD says so. What high horse, I just included myself among those who share their opinions of others, which has nothing to do with addressing the actual facts of the matter.

What brutal attacks upon Catholics are you referring to. Do you consider factual accounts of events and beliefs to be brutal attacks? Give an example of such brutal attacks, and I will point out your error, and the many others who also see these very things for what they are. From whom I get more than just a little of the information I share. Bring some meat, not just 4WD says so accusations.

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1338 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 17:50:00 »
Page upon page of posts against Catholics, the Catholic Church and its leadership; your insistence of interpreting Babylon of Revelation as being the Catholic Church; eleven pages of your diatribe in the topic "Roman Politics". So far as I know, no one here attacks the SDA and what you believe with all the viciousness and malignancy that you attack the Catholic Church or anyone who does not agree with your interpretation of Scripture. 
« Last Edit: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 17:53:34 by 4WD »

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1339 on: Thu Oct 06, 2022 - 22:10:21 »
Please do point out where I have done so, and I will clarify my position as relating directly to the scriptures. I certainly do not want to give the impression that I am looking elsewhere for a final word concerning truth.
Well, we're up to page 39.  I reckon most of the pages in this thread contain a lengthy quotation from at least one redoubtable "scientific" source.

Why do you need scientists to affirm Scripture?  It does not belong in the province of science.  It is literature.

Jarrod

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1340 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 07:24:57 »
Well, we're up to page 39.  I reckon most of the pages in this thread contain a lengthy quotation from at least one redoubtable "scientific" source.

Why do you need scientists to affirm Scripture?  It does not belong in the province of science.  It is literature.

Jarrod

Why do you need science at all?  What is the purpose of your interest an anything science that ranges from medical, to geological to a myriad of others

Are you simply curious about how and why things work so you are able to discount some things within the literature that is the focus of many of these threads? Like... you can't quite figure out how God parted the waters while they were crossing?

Are you a scientist? or a Physicist?

How can you follow "the science" ... any of it... when after some discovery at some point in the future someone else will come along to dispess or at least dampen the first discovery?

" I reckon most of the pages in this thread contain a lengthy quotation from at least one redoubtable "scientific" source."
That in and of itself should cause you to question yourself as to why your interest.

I looked up one ( only) definition of creation scientist...it states

A creation scientist is a scientist who has received a PhD or master’s degree from an accredited university, believes that God created the earth in six 24-hour days, believes the earth is 6,000 years old, believes Noah’s Flood was global, and interprets research starting with the understanding that God’s Word is true.

What is it about the tie in of science and creation that you doubt?

I, BTW, agree with this definition "EXCEPT" I do not believe that God created the earth in six 24-hour days.

Can I prove this? NO. But it is an ongoing quest of mine for my personal Genesis beliefs.... And there does seem to be a growing consensus I am on to something.

But why does it bother you?

God is the master scientist above all.  Never forget that

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1341 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 10:06:14 »
Why do you need science at all?  What is the purpose of your interest an anything science that ranges from medical, to geological to a myriad of others

Are you simply curious about how and why things work so you are able to discount some things within the literature that is the focus of many of these threads? Like... you can't quite figure out how God parted the waters while they were crossing?

Are you a scientist? or a Physicist?

How can you follow "the science" ... any of it... when after some discovery at some point in the future someone else will come along to dispess or at least dampen the first discovery?

" I reckon most of the pages in this thread contain a lengthy quotation from at least one redoubtable "scientific" source."
That in and of itself should cause you to question yourself as to why your interest.

I looked up one ( only) definition of creation scientist...it states

A creation scientist is a scientist who has received a PhD or master’s degree from an accredited university, believes that God created the earth in six 24-hour days, believes the earth is 6,000 years old, believes Noah’s Flood was global, and interprets research starting with the understanding that God’s Word is true.

What is it about the tie in of science and creation that you doubt?

I, BTW, agree with this definition "EXCEPT" I do not believe that God created the earth in six 24-hour days.

Can I prove this? NO. But it is an ongoing quest of mine for my personal Genesis beliefs.... And there does seem to be a growing consensus I am on to something.

But why does it bother you?

God is the master scientist above all.  Never forget that
I'm short on time, but let me put it this way...

Always use the right tool for the job.  You don't use a hammer to drive screws, or a rip saw to cut aluminum.

Using science to try to understand the Bible is like using a chainsaw to dig post-holes.

Jarrod

Offline Alan

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1342 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 11:01:23 »

I looked up one ( only) definition of creation scientist...it states

A creation scientist is a scientist who has received a PhD or master’s degree from an accredited university, believes that God created the earth in six 24-hour days, believes the earth is 6,000 years old, believes Noah’s Flood was global, and interprets research starting with the understanding that God’s Word is true.



There are other definitions if you venture past the confines of creationist sites.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/creationism


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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1343 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 11:13:31 »
I'm short on time, but let me put it this way...

Always use the right tool for the job.  You don't use a hammer to drive screws, or a rip saw to cut aluminum.

Using science to try to understand the Bible is like using a chainsaw to dig post-holes.

Jarrod

Why,

Can science not be used to prove that things like the global flood did happen, or even that the creation days were not literal 24 hour days? or that proper marching around a wall will knock it down... as in Jericho?

If you dont want to use science to prove what can be proved then you are left with your own logic to what we have been told.

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1344 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 13:30:51 »
Why,

Can science not be used to prove that things like the global flood did happen, or even that the creation days were not literal 24 hour days? or that proper marching around a wall will knock it down... as in Jericho?
When you do that, you have already assumed the conclusion. You take your own preconception of what Scripture says, and look somewhere unrelated for evidence that you are right.  Of course you can find evidence of ANYTHING if you Google long enough!

This is not examining Scripture and honestly trying to figure out what is being said.  This is just looking for confirmation bias.

OR...

Perhaps it's putting the Bible to the test, because you put more stock in science than Scripture.

Neither seems good.

Jarrod

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1345 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 13:34:20 »

There are other definitions if you venture past the confines of creationist sites.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/creationism
tracking down the origins of Tower of Bable or Hoe the waters parted
Dear Alan,

If you are looking for those who wish to prove accuracy of the dates, sites, and stories within the four corners of the bible you need a creation scientist because it is extremely difficult to even interest an agnostic or an atheist in tracking down the origins of Tower of Babel or How the waters parted when they crossed, or the age of the flood or where the flood really was or was creation something other then 24 hour days....

The Holy bible does not support evolution. It does support Giants.

The Holy bible does not support man before Adam.... I do.

I could go on and on but your link is interesting and informative but not for bible specific study

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1346 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 15:24:11 »
When you do that, you have already assumed the conclusion. You take your own preconception of what Scripture says, and look somewhere unrelated for evidence that you are right.  Of course you can find evidence of ANYTHING if you Google long enough!

This is not examining Scripture and honestly trying to figure out what is being said.  This is just looking for confirmation bias.

OR...

Perhaps it's putting the Bible to the test, because you put more stock in science than Scripture.

Neither seems good.

Jarrod

No it doesn't.

I know what the bible tells us. Can I prove that everything in it is accurate or perhaps was embellished by others.... NO

And neither can you because if we dont have references with opinions we will end up with unprovable conjectures.

Face it... no matter what one reads and studies in the bible and forms their own opinions... others here will knock their ideas
because no two people think alike.

You say

"This is not examining Scripture and honestly trying to figure out what is being said. "

Look how well that has served you.

You, 4WD, RB, TC, and even AMO have no consensus based on your own studies . And toss me into the mix and we make a fine tossed salad and that is all.

Look at the differences ya'll come up with .

You say

"When you do that, you have already assumed the conclusion. You take your own preconception of what Scripture says

And I say it is because of my studies I do assume a conclusion. And then I look to see if I need to change my conclusion.

I was raised that the Holy Bible was the inerrant word of God. And then I found assorted translations. So?????

But there is nothing wrong with seeing who says what out there. I gravitate to the thologians I know or who have heard of... things like the Westminster Confession... even the Catholic Catechism.... and then when you, RB, TC, Amo ( who is flawlwaa in what he posts about Frankie... and others n I check you out. So I am wrong???  ::shrug::

Offline Alan

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1347 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 19:48:23 »

I could go on and on but your link is interesting and informative but not for bible specific study


That is why I will often say that it's important to seek sources outside of religious sites if you are attempting to verify historical, or scientific events to coincide with scripture. That said, looking for data to prove the Red Sea was parted (ex) is an effort in futility, and the only information you'll likely find is bias research. Many other things in the Bible do line up with historical records, even according to secular historians.

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1348 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 23:11:17 »
Page upon page of posts against Catholics, the Catholic Church and its leadership; your insistence of interpreting Babylon of Revelation as being the Catholic Church; eleven pages of your diatribe in the topic "Roman Politics". So far as I know, no one here attacks the SDA and what you believe with all the viciousness and malignancy that you attack the Catholic Church or anyone who does not agree with your interpretation of Scripture.

And still just more of the same crap. Are you going to address any of the posts themselves and prove them wrong or inaccurate? Apparently not. Are they the truth? Does that matter to you? The vast majority of the material presented on those pages, are articles and or quotes from other sources, including many Catholic ones, with my two cents thrown in. Most often reflecting the fact that all such have, do, and will continue to prove the very points you are complaining about above. Do you care about that? Apparently not.

You are right that no one has been attacking SDA's or my positions on those boards for quite some time now. They used to routinely. Nor did I cry and or wine about it, but rather entered into debate with them, to prove my points from scripture, or history, or the weaknesses of their arguments. As I would now as well, for any interested in proving their perceived faults with historical SDA doctrine. They simply are no longer doing so. Millions in the past, and millions still today, believed and believe that the RC is Babylon The Great. Why should those who believe such be silent while Babylon is busy hopping in bed with the politicians, rich, and powerful of this world unto the globalist authoritarian one world government and economy she preaches and teaches should subjugate all others? Why will so many deny these very words and admonitions in writing from herself, as no sign that that is exactly what she intends? Then finally, why would any bible believer deny that this is exactly what scripture predicts will happen before Christ's return, under the intoxicating influence of Babylon herself? Is it not because in the end they have more in common with her and her aims and goals, than those of the holy scriptures? Is this not the exact condition of humanity which scripture points out nearing the end?

I don't want to divert the topic of this thread. But if you want to discuss or debate such, you obviously know where you can do so. I'm not telling anyone on these boards not to do so. Is someone else? The articles shared on the thread you referenced are real articles, by real people, about real events in history, or real events taking place right now, concerning the Roman Catholic church and its involvement with almost everything which effects almost all of our daily lives. Do you not think such things are very important concerning an institution with such an abusive history and very apparent leanings towards authoritarian, communistic, and or socialistic governments in exact opposition to the founding principles of this nation which you live in? There is nothing I can do about such indifferentism or apathy, but continue to inform them and everyone else of just exactly what is going on with this most dangerous liberty destroying institution. And so I do, as long as I still have the freedom to do so.

No doubt the present trends of censorship recommended and supported by this very institution as well, will end these freedoms soon enough. Then you won't have to worry about hearing such troublesome and bothersome reports anymore. You can be free of the Protesters, and be at peace with the silence of Babylon's enemies as it were. You know, those pesky Bible believing fundamentalists, which the Pope has declared violent terrorists. Until then -

Rev 14:6  And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, 7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters. 8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication. 9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. 13  And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

The world is rapidly approaching the time, when there will be no in between. Only two sides, two crops to be harvested. This is the Lord's doing, as He intends to reap those harvests as soon as they are ripe.

Rev 14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. 15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. 16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. 17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. 18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. 19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. 20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

« Last Edit: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 23:19:48 by Amo »

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1349 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 23:28:04 »
Well, we're up to page 39.  I reckon most of the pages in this thread contain a lengthy quotation from at least one redoubtable "scientific" source.

Why do you need scientists to affirm Scripture?  It does not belong in the province of science.  It is literature.

Jarrod

Why do you need scientists to affirm the vain imaginings and rantings of Charles Darwin? He just wrote fairy tales. Two can play that game. The answer to your questions and mine is simple. We both rightly want science to affirm that which we have placed our faith within. At least you are honest about what you really think of scripture. Denying the validity of the following verses contained within it, apparently.

2Ti 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. 14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1350 on: Fri Oct 07, 2022 - 23:33:48 »

There are other definitions if you venture past the confines of creationist sites.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/creationism

Yes. We wouldn't want Creationists defining for themsleves what they think they are doing. That should of course be left up to others who know better than they do, what they are trying to do. Just like all the rest of us always want someone else explaining what we say and or mean for us. Right? 

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1351 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 04:47:11 »
The Holy bible does not support evolution.
The Bible doesn't support the heliocentric theory of our solar system either, but we know that it is the correct theory.

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1352 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 04:53:58 »
The vast majority of the material presented on those pages, are articles and or quotes from other sources, including many Catholic ones, with my two cents thrown in.
And your purpose in presenting that material is to demonstrate your love for those who adhere to the Catholic doctrines and to show them the more correct way.  NOT!

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1353 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 08:45:03 »

That is why I will often say that it's important to seek sources outside of religious sites if you are attempting to verify historical, or scientific events to coincide with scripture. That said, looking for data to prove the Red Sea was parted (ex) is an effort in futility, and the only information you'll likely find is bias research. Many other things in the Bible do line up with historical records, even according to secular historians.



Perhaps: We do know that in  Exodus 14:23-28 we are told  Pharaoh’s chariots pursued the Israelites through the path God created in the Red Sea only to be destroyed when God caused the waters to collapse upon them.

That is biblical.

I do not call this a futile effort to try and prove it happened .

We all have heard of the alleged discovery by Wyatt of "chariot wheels" at the bottom of the red sea.

Of course it was debunked by that outstandingly  trustworthy source SNOPES.

And certain other claiming it to be false..

But was it? False that is.

CHARIOT WHEELS DISCOVERED IN THE RED SEA!

Four, six and eight-spoked wheels were found in the Red Sea. These wheels were typical of the wheels used in the 18th Dynasty at the time of Moses and the Red Sea Exodus were the claim.

From the link below... Mr. Wyatt commented that the bottom of the Red Sea was littered like a junk yard.

 Confirmation of Wyatt's discoveries was made by Dr. Lennart Moller who has all of the credentials to verify the discoveries.
  An excellent book and DVD are available detailing recent scientific research that has verified Mr. Wyatt’s discoveries. “The Exodus Case” is available at Amazon.  The DVD “The Exodus Revealed” is also available at Amazon.
(Amazon link to all three editions... including the extended third one. https://www.amazon.com/s?k=The+Exodus+Case&crid=38NHAB0Q9SHT5&sprefix=the+exodus+case%2Caps%2C65&ref=nb_sb_noss_1)

 Internationally known research scientist Dr. Lennart Möller investigates the archaeological and historical evidence for the Exodus of the Bible.

https://www.discovery.global/chariot-wheels-discovered-in-the-red-sea

The interesting thing within this link says

GOD PROVIDED AN UNDERWATER BRIDGE!

     Wyatt also discovered that there was an under-water causeway or land bridge stretching from the shores of Neweiba Beach, across the deep waters.  This remarkable escape route provided by God is nearly 200 yards wide!

      The land bridge provided by the Lord for His people, slopes gently down to almost 900 feet below the water before going back up to the other side!  Imagine walls of water 900 feet high . . . little wonder that Pharaoh’s army was totally destroyed!  That remarkable underwater land bridge is still there!

So can it be proved that God provided a way for their escape. Naysayers will maintain NO... but then there pops up newer info

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1354 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 09:36:40 »
The Bible doesn't support the heliocentric theory of our solar system either, but we know that it is the correct theory.

The Bible does not address the specifics of how our solar system operates, but it very definitely and specifically addresses how this world was created, and how long this took. Even emphatically stating such in the central commandment of God's Ten Commandments, spoken to humanity with His own mouth, and written for humanity with His own finger in tables of stone twice. Commandments which the scriptures teach all of humanity to keep from one end of scripture to the other. It is not simply about what the Bible does not address, but far more importantly, what it does specifically address, which is denied and or ignored by the vast majority of humanity including "Christians". And why do most professed Christians deny or ignore it, because Babylon The Great claimed the authority to change it, and transfer its significance to another day. While forcing its observance upon all at the same time, and condemning those who would still keep God's commandment as He instructs us. Your theory of evolution which denies the testimony and therefore authority and truthfulness of this commandment as well, is also accepted and preached by Babylon The Great. It is one of the many abominations of this earth within her golden cup, which all of God's faithful have been called out of to separate from before the Lord returns unto judgment. It is a tie that binds all evolutionists to sympathies with her, which must be severed by the faithful. Therefore do I argue against it, as I do against all of her abominations unto damnation. It is nothing more than an intellectual idol made and fashioned by humanity in defiance of God's word.

Hab 2:18 What profiteth the graven image that the maker thereof hath graven it; the molten image, and a teacher of lies, that the maker of his work trusteth therein, to make dumb idols? 19 Woe unto him that saith to the wood, Awake; to the dumb stone, Arise, it shall teach! Behold, it is laid over with gold and silver, and there is no breath at all in the midst of it. 20 But the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the earth keep silence before him.

Psa 115:1 Not unto us, O LORD, not unto us, but unto thy name give glory, for thy mercy, and for thy truth's sake. 2 Wherefore should the heathen say, Where is now their God? 3 But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased. 4 Their idols are silver and gold, the work of men's hands. 5 They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not: 6 They have ears, but they hear not: noses have they, but they smell not: 7 They have hands, but they handle not: feet have they, but they walk not: neither speak they through their throat. 8 They that make them are like unto them; so is every one that trusteth in them. 9 O Israel, trust thou in the LORD: he is their help and their shield. 10 O house of Aaron, trust in the LORD: he is their help and their shield. 11 Ye that fear the LORD, trust in the LORD: he is their help and their shield. 12 The LORD hath been mindful of us: he will bless us; he will bless the house of Israel; he will bless the house of Aaron. 13 He will bless them that fear the LORD, both small and great. 14 The LORD shall increase you more and more, you and your children. 15 Ye are blessed of the LORD which made heaven and earth. 16 The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men. 17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence. 18 But we will bless the LORD from this time forth and for evermore. Praise the LORD.

Isa 2:8 Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made: 9 And the mean man boweth down, and the great man humbleth himself: therefore forgive them not. 10 Enter into the rock, and hide thee in the dust, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty. 11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day. 12 For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low: 13 And upon all the cedars of Lebanon, that are high and lifted up, and upon all the oaks of Bashan, 14 And upon all the high mountains, and upon all the hills that are lifted up, 15 And upon every high tower, and upon every fenced wall, 16 And upon all the ships of Tarshish, and upon all pleasant pictures. 17 And the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be made low: and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day. 18 And the idols he shall utterly abolish. 19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth. 20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats; 21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth. 22 Cease ye from man, whose breath is in his nostrils: for wherein is he to be accounted of?

Jer 50:1 The word that the LORD spake against Babylon and against the land of the Chaldeans by Jeremiah the prophet. 2 Declare ye among the nations, and publish, and set up a standard; publish, and conceal not: say, Babylon is taken, Bel is confounded, Merodach is broken in pieces; her idols are confounded, her images are broken in pieces. 3 For out of the north there cometh up a nation against her, which shall make her land desolate, and none shall dwell therein: they shall remove, they shall depart, both man and beast........................ .........
31 Behold, I am against thee, O thou most proud, saith the Lord GOD of hosts: for thy day is come, the time that I will visit thee. 32 And the most proud shall stumble and fall, and none shall raise him up: and I will kindle a fire in his cities, and it shall devour all round about him. 33 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; The children of Israel and the children of Judah were oppressed together: and all that took them captives held them fast; they refused to let them go. 34 Their Redeemer is strong; the LORD of hosts is his name: he shall throughly plead their cause, that he may give rest to the land, and disquiet the inhabitants of Babylon. 35 A sword is upon the Chaldeans, saith the LORD, and upon the inhabitants of Babylon, and upon her princes, and upon her wise men. 36 A sword is upon the liars; and they shall dote: a sword is upon her mighty men; and they shall be dismayed. 37 A sword is upon their horses, and upon their chariots, and upon all the mingled people that are in the midst of her; and they shall become as women: a sword is upon her treasures; and they shall be robbed. 38 A drought is upon her waters; and they shall be dried up: for it is the land of graven images, and they are mad upon their idols. 39 Therefore the wild beasts of the desert with the wild beasts of the islands shall dwell there, and the owls shall dwell therein: and it shall be no more inhabited for ever; neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation. 40 As God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah and the neighbour cities thereof, saith the LORD; so shall no man abide there, neither shall any son of man dwell therein.


What are all the warnings against idols in the scriptures, but warnings against placing faith in these powerless creations of fallen humanity in defiance of their God. All of which deny Him as their Creator, Sustainer, and
Redeemer. What is the theory of evolution, but an intellectual idol and creation of fallen humanity in defiance of God's testimony and commandments. Which many an atheist today proclaim as their faith regarding our origins. Which Babylon the Great also acknowledges and accepts as part of her endeavors toward the unification of all humanity under her leadership in rebellion against the law and testimony of God. In her rejection of the fourth commandment of God in favor of her own created day of worship and rest as well.

Isa 8:20  To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. 5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.


Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1355 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 10:23:38 »
And your purpose in presenting that material is to demonstrate your love for those who adhere to the Catholic doctrines and to show them the more correct way.  NOT!

Yes, it is. In calling them out of Babylon, whose teachings and golden cup filled with the abominations of this earth lead to damnation. Therefore do I so very often quote the following scriptures along with my posts.

Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. 5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. 6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double. 7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow. 8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her. 9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning, 10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come. 11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more: 12 The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble, 13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men. 14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all. 15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing, 16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls! 17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off, 18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city! 19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate. 20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her. 21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all. 22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee; 23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived. 24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

With whom did our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ do battle when He came to us for our salvation? Was it not those who claimed to be His chosen, the leaders of the church as it were, the priests and those who claimed to teach the truth? Yes it was. And who had our Lord falsely accused and crucified? Was it not these same professed religious leaders of the day? Yes it was. And what did our Savior say would happen to us if we followed Him, and by whose hands? Was it not that we would be persecuted, and by the hands of those who would think they were doing God's will? Yes it was. And who has persecuted and killed more professed Christians in the name of God throughout history, than Babylon The Great, the Roman Catholic Church? And what church today is more involved in the politics of this world as they slide into authoritarian form with countless anti Christian supporters and sentiment? Yes, that is right, Roman Catholicism, Babylon The Great.

Joh 15:18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. 19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. 20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.

Joh 16:1 These things have I spoken unto you, that ye should not be offended. 2 They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service. 3 And these things will they do unto you, because they have not known the Father, nor me.


Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. 33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free? 34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. 35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever. 36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed. 37 I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you. 38 I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father. 39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. 40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. 41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. 42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. 43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. 44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. 45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. 46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? 47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God. 48 Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil? 49 Jesus answered, I have not a devil; but I honour my Father, and ye do dishonour me. 50 And I seek not mine own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth. 51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. 52 Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. 53 Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself? 54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God: 55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Again, who were Jesus' worst enemies who sought to kill Him, and eventually succeeded, but the professed religious leaders and expositors of truth in His day. So it has continued throughout history, with professed believers themselves very often persecuting and killing other believers who would not bow to their usurped, false, abusive, and self appointed leadership. The Roman Catholic Church itself professing to be Christian while doing these very things, as the mother of professed "Christian institutions" who have followed her example. All of which have united with the state to effect such abusive authority and persecution. Today though she seeks the unification of all religions and governments under her guidance unto the same effect. Just as the holy scriptures predict. So be it, as God's word has determined.

 
« Last Edit: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 10:27:36 by Amo »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1356 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 11:22:26 »
The Bible does not address the specifics of how our solar system operates...
Yes, it does; again and again. Here are just a few verses describing the geocentricity of the solar system.  There are a bunch more.

Jos 10:13  And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies. Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day.

1Sa 2:8  He raises up the poor from the dust; he lifts the needy from the ash heap to make them sit with princes and inherit a seat of honor. For the pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and on them he has set the world.

1Ch 16:30  tremble before him, all the earth; yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Psa 93:1  The LORD reigns; he is robed in majesty; the LORD is robed; he has put on strength as his belt. Yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Psa 96:10  Say among the nations, "The LORD reigns! Yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved; he will judge the peoples with equity."

Psa 104:5  He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be moved.

Ecc 1:5  The sun rises, and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.


Such descriptions do not bother me.  I know what is intended.  But nevertheless, the literal interpretation from these and many other verses must be that the sun revolves around the stationary earth, i.e., a geocentric model of the solar system.  It is no less literal than the description of the time duration in all the mentions of creation.

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1357 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 12:39:58 »
Why do you need scientists to affirm the vain imaginings and rantings of Charles Darwin? He just wrote fairy tales. Two can play that game. The answer to your questions and mine is simple. We both rightly want science to affirm that which we have placed our faith within. At least you are honest about what you really think of scripture. Denying the validity of the following verses contained within it, apparently.
What makes you think I care about Darwin? 

Looking at science to understand the Bible is a fallacy.  That applies whether the science is pro-Bible or anti-Bible.  So throw out Darwin with the rest of the lot.

I think you're just stuck making the same arguments over and over, without actually reading or understanding what anybody else has written.  This has nothing to do with what I said.

Jarrod

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1358 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 12:52:25 »
Such descriptions do not bother me.  I know what is intended.  But nevertheless, the literal interpretation from these and many other verses must be that the sun revolves around the stationary earth, i.e., a geocentric model of the solar system.  It is no less literal than the description of the time duration in all the mentions of creation.
Geocentricity is a mathematically valid model of the universe.

The idea of relativity is that (within Newtonian physics) everything is measured relative to some fixed point of reference which is assumed to be at rest.  Using the earth as that point of reference is allowable, and in many cases it is preferable.  For instance, the speedometer in your car measures the speed of your car relative to the earth, assuming that the earth is a fixed point of reference.  Geocentricity!

Now, if you are looking at a system of planets and a star, it isn't a very convenient model.  It makes the math really ugly.  A heliocentric model is much more convenient and simplifies things greatly. 

But I am rarely looking at such things.  Most of my concerns are down here on the surface of planet earth, and it is much more useful to me to know that my car is going 40 mph relative to the fixed position of the earth, than it is to know that my car is hurdling through space at 67,000 mph, relative to the sun.

Jarrod

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1359 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 16:05:44 »
Geocentricity is a mathematically valid model of the universe.
I think you need to dig a little deeper into the physics of geocentricity.  It is not a mathematically valid model of the solar system. The distinction between the geocentric and heliocentric description of the solar system is not simply a difference in point of reference. It is a difference in the actual motion taking place.  The point of reference is immaterial.
Quote from: W_S
The idea of relativity is that (within Newtonian physics) everything is measured relative to some fixed point of reference which is assumed to be at rest. 
I think maybe you have stepped outside of your comfort zone.  There is no need that everything be measured relative to some fixed point of reference which is assumed to be at rest.
Quote from: W_S
Using the earth as that point of reference is allowable, and in many cases it is preferable. 
That is certainly true, but doing so would never produce the error of the sun revolving around the earth, i.e., the geocentric model. The velociity, momentum, and energy of an object is not changed simply by changing the point of reference.
Quote from: W_S
For instance, the speedometer in your car measures the speed of your car relative to the earth, assuming that the earth is a fixed point of reference.  Geocentricity!
Well yes the is the function of the speedometer, but that is not geocentricity.  That is simply the speed of the car relative to the earth which are both rotating about the sun at very nearly, though not exactly at the same velocity.
Quote from: W_S
Now, if you are looking at a system of planets and a star, it isn't a very convenient model.  It makes the math really ugly.  A heliocentric model is much more convenient and simplifies things greatly. 
Sorry, but you are really confused. 

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1360 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 17:08:29 »
Yes, it does; again and again. Here are just a few verses describing the geocentricity of the solar system.  There are a bunch more.

Jos 10:13  And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies. Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day.

1Sa 2:8  He raises up the poor from the dust; he lifts the needy from the ash heap to make them sit with princes and inherit a seat of honor. For the pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and on them he has set the world.

1Ch 16:30  tremble before him, all the earth; yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Psa 93:1  The LORD reigns; he is robed in majesty; the LORD is robed; he has put on strength as his belt. Yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Psa 96:10  Say among the nations, "The LORD reigns! Yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved; he will judge the peoples with equity."

Psa 104:5  He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be moved.

Ecc 1:5  The sun rises, and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.


Such descriptions do not bother me.  I know what is intended.  But nevertheless, the literal interpretation from these and many other verses must be that the sun revolves around the stationary earth, i.e., a geocentric model of the solar system.  It is no less literal than the description of the time duration in all the mentions of creation.

Again, apples and oranges. They shouldn't bother you, they are one sentence statements not intended to describe or explain creation and or how it works at all. Some true in and of themselves, others simply descriptions of that observed. None of them are in the context of explaining specific details of the creation of this world and or how it operates. Why would you even compare these to the first two entire chapters of scripture which are exactly addressing the creation of our world, the things in it, and our solar system and beyond?   

Jos 10:13  And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies. Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day.

The above is not a description of how the solar system works. It is an answer to a specific request to God which was -

Jos 10:12 Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon. 13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day. 14 And there was no day like that before it or after it, that the LORD hearkened unto the voice of a man: for the LORD fought for Israel.

Joshua didn't want the sun to go down, as we still refer to it today even though we understand that it doesn't really, till he routed his enemies. The Lord obliged. It wasn't a lesson or teaching regarding the operation of our solar system. Why would you even suggest anything of the sort.

1Sa 2:8  He raises up the poor from the dust; he lifts the needy from the ash heap to make them sit with princes and inherit a seat of honor. For the pillars of the earth are the LORD's, and on them he has set the world.

The above statement is correct, but certainly is not an explanation of exactly how God holds everything including this world in its place. Nor is the context of the rest of what is being said in the above sentence, even literal. Why would you take it and or promote it as such regarding the operation of our solar system?

1Ch 16:30  tremble before him, all the earth; yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Again, really, you think this statement is meant as an explanation of how our solar system or planet works and or operates? God Himself has stated that He most definitely will move and shake this entire world again.

Psa 93:1  The LORD reigns; he is robed in majesty; the LORD is robed; he has put on strength as his belt. Yes, the world is established; it shall never be moved.

Really, more of the same. The world shall not be moved, until God Himself determines it to be so. This statement has nothing at all to do with the rotation of this earth or not, or anything concerning the operation of our solar system. The rest accepting the following are along the same lines, and you know this.

Ecc 1:5  The sun rises, and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.

You mean as you and I and everyone to this day still speak of the sun rising and setting. Do we, do you intend to that such is a description of how the sun revolves around our world? We have been through and addressed that silly suggestion before.




 

« Last Edit: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 17:12:03 by Amo »

Offline Amo

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1361 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 17:26:55 »
What makes you think I care about Darwin? 

Looking at science to understand the Bible is a fallacy.  That applies whether the science is pro-Bible or anti-Bible.  So throw out Darwin with the rest of the lot.

I think you're just stuck making the same arguments over and over, without actually reading or understanding what anybody else has written.  This has nothing to do with what I said.

Jarrod

It seems you have things reversed in your mind. I am the one who admits that my views of science are based upon my faith and views though the lens of scripture, not the other way around. I never subject the word of God to our faulty observations and theories of science, but rather subject all the same to the higher authority of the testimony of scripture. "Christian evolutionists" are the ones who subject scripture to their views and or theories of science, which are found nowhere in scripture at all. It seems perhaps you are the one who is not reading or understanding what I am saying. As I have preached over and over, that science and all else is subject to the authority of scripture over an above it.

"Christian evolutionists" though, tell me the bible does not mean what it simply states, and try to align it with the theory of evolution which is not even hinted at, at all in scripture. You have things backwards in your mind brother.

It has everything to do with what you said, when you stated that the holy scriptures are just literature. Do you think the same of the volumes written explaining and or defending evolution? I certainly hope so. Considering that both scripture and the theory of evolution address and claim to be the authority concerning our origins.   

Offline 4WD

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1362 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 18:03:04 »
Again, apples and oranges.
It certainly wasn't apples and oranges to Galileo Galilei and Giordano Bruno, Giordano Bruno was burned at the stake and Galileo Galilei was sentenced to house arrest by people who were unknowledgeable about the reality of things, then as you are now, and who, again like you, insisted that their interpretation was the only one possible.
They shouldn't bother you
It doesn't really bother me, because I am well aware of the fact that it, like the Gensis account of creation, is more a colloquial description than a scientific description. And as such neither distract from the real intended message.
« Last Edit: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 18:07:08 by 4WD »

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1363 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 18:09:58 »
I think you need to dig a little deeper into the physics of geocentricity.
That sounds like a colossal waste of time.   rofl

I might be wrong.  I don't think so, but certainly this is not my area of expertise.

Offline Wycliffes_Shillelagh

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Re: Creation scientists
« Reply #1364 on: Sat Oct 08, 2022 - 18:16:29 »
"Christian evolutionists" though...
Found the strawman!  Again...

You're not talking to an evolutionist.  Why do you keep arguing against something that NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT?


 

     
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