Should Christians Own Guns?

[Charles Sloan]

I know this discussion will instantly turn to hunting, so to squelch that this is not a discussion about owning guns for hunting or just recreational shooting; but for self defense or home defense. This is a serious question, something I have mentioned in the past I don't know where to stand.

With that said, should Christians own guns?

[zoonance]

I suppose that a variety of views will emerge:

A) Having a gun pointed at a bad guy may be enough to stop a violent act.  (Actually putting bullets in the gun leaves one open to investigation, true.) So owning a gun, even for this purpose, would just be a fascimile of it's potential

B) Christians should not own anything for self or home defense (guns, knives, clubs, mace, guard dogs, hired police stationed out front, etc.) only prayer.  Direct or indirect use of these proves that our faith in God to protect us is not strong.  Even hiring a policeman or using a dog to protect and defend only shifts the responsibility to others - leaving our own concience intact.

C) Guns don't kill people, people do.  Even if it is the bad guy suffering the consequences of a violent attack - a form of self killing as if he/she pulled the trigger themselves. 

D) No.

E) Yes.

[Charles Sloan]

I lean toward B and E, I'm sure you could understand my problem..

[Imabear]

If I were a good Mennonite, my answer would be close to B. 
Their reasoning behind that decision is a little different though.

They believe the commands do not kill, love your enemies, blessed are the peacemakers... even applies in cases like this.
Not that you don't take any action. 
Basically, God is in control.  He will protect and provide.

[Bon Voyage]

God sent Smith and Wesson and Mr. Remington or Sir Banelli to protect my house.

[RAMS]

Categorically, absolutely.

I have had a weapon since I was 6 years old: shooting my new .22 single shot Stevens as a gift from my daddy. Always carried a weapon on the ranch growing up, for bears, cougars, etc. Always carried an 870 12 gauge sawed off shotgun and 30-30 lever action, both in scabbards on the saddle.

Still carry 2, 12 gauge 870 Remington Magnum shotguns in VEX when traveling south. One a sawed off 12 gauge with 8 shot magazine extension and 20" barrel,  and the other a long gun with full choked 28" barrel.

When  I cross into the southern reaches of Honduras, I always have the short shotgun on the dash holder for dealing with the Marxist banditos who wish to extract a 'toll' from me when I cross there, heading into western Nicaragua.  On several occaisions had I not had both with me, I would not be here.......

Robert

[avenger]

The better question would be.............Why shouldn't we? 

Avenger 

[Charles Sloan]

So for those who believe that Christians should own guns, would Christians be justified using a gun to protect themselves or their family under certain circumstances such as a robbery?

And would killing someone in extreme cases be justifiable?

[mikeyjc]

The closest I ever got to a real loaded gun was when I had a detective (retired now) of the Metropolitian Toronto Police over for lunch one day and he set his gun down on my dining room table for a few moments.  It kind of unnerved me a little.

But tasers...now that I would not mind having for self defense.  However, the last time I was accosted by thugs the Lord woke up a sister in Christ, told her to pray for me and I was delivered--no harm done to me, my wallet given back to me fully intact and I could feel the presence of the Lord encircling me as I walked away from them--no gun needed, no taser for that matter!

If guns were legal here in Canada would I buy one?  No...  The taser does intrigue me somewhat but I'd probably be better off not having one of those.  I can think of some people that I would like to zap with it! 

[sopranette]

So for those who believe that Christians should own guns, would Christians be justified using a gun to protect themselves or their family under certain circumstances such as a robbery?

And would killing someone in extreme cases be justifiable?

Better him than me.  And your intent is not to kill, but stop.  You would want a firearm with a sufficient amount of stopping power, aiming for center mass (chest).

love,

Sopranette

[mikeyjc]

Back in the fall the 1975 I was about to start some post secondary school education at a college in Toronto.  It was before I was saved and I had gone to a bar and had gotten pretty hammered that evening. I took the bus home and I walked into a house that looked identical to the one I was renting a room.  These two houses looked the same.   The front door had been unlocked and I stepped insided.  Then crouching at the top of the stairs was a man--the owner of the house.  Then his wife appeared beside him  I realized at that point, despite my alcohol fogged brain, that I had entered the wrong house.  I apologized and went next door to the house I should have gone to in the first place.  The next morning I saw the gentleman raking leaves and again I apologized for intruding into his home so late at night.

The thing is...I had made an honest mistake.  But had this happened in the US instead of Canada, do you think that I could have been shot and killed that night?  This is a serious question here.  Please give me your honest opinion.

[chosenone]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

[Flying To]

How ironic...the advertisement above!


I say God is your shield and if you need protection he can protect you.

Cast all fears to him and he can make you stronger.

[Bonnie]

I don't like guns and the intruder would probably wind up taking it from me and killing me with it.

Maybe I'll get a new BB.  Do they still make those things? 

[Bon Voyage]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

[sopranette]

The first inkling that a dictatorship is coming is the outlawing of guns.  Those who would give up their freedom for security deserve neither. (to paraphrase....I'm too tired to look for the exact quote).

love,

Sopranette

[Jimbob]

I don't like guns and the intruder would probably wind up taking it from me and killing me with it.

Maybe I'll get a new BB.  Do they still make those things? 

A paintball gun would work better than a BB gun.  At least then they'd know to look for the guy with the fluorescent pink and yellow splotches!

[mikeyjc]

I don't like guns and the intruder would probably wind up taking it from me and killing me with it.

Maybe I'll get a new BB.  Do they still make those things? 

A paintball gun would work better than a BB gun.  At least then they'd know to look for the guy with the fluorescent pink and yellow splotches!

One of the young men in the church I used to attend showed some of us his thigh after a prior evening of paintball.  He was bruised --huge and very dark.  I was shocked at the severity of that bruise.

[k-pappy]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

DUCK!

Kidding...facts have proven the exact opposite in Australia...after they banned guns and forced people to turn them in, violent crime increased, as did gun violence.  Why?  Lawful gun owners turned them in, criminals did not.

Back in the fall the 1975 I was about to start some post secondary school education at a college in Toronto.  It was before I was saved and I had gone to a bar and had gotten pretty hammered that evening. I took the bus home and I walked into a house that looked identical to the one I was renting a room.  These two houses looked the same.   The front door had been unlocked and I stepped insided.  Then crouching at the top of the stairs was a man--the owner of the house.  Then his wife appeared beside him  I realized at that point, despite my alcohol fogged brain, that I had entered the wrong house.  I apologized and went next door to the house I should have gone to in the first place.  The next morning I saw the gentleman raking leaves and again I apologized for intruding into his home so late at night.

The thing is...I had made an honest mistake.  But had this happened in the US instead of Canada, do you think that I could have been shot and killed that night?  This is a serious question here.  Please give me your honest opinion.

mickey, I do not think you would have been shot in that case...unless you drew a weapon on your neighbor...but since you lived right next door, he probably recognized you anyway.

This is a typical misnomer about gun ownership.  People think that when we own a gun for self defense, we automatically shoot anybody who enters our home.  Not so.  I would use it if an intruder was armed, without hesitation.  However, if some guy just walked in through the front door, I would merely ask him what he was doing in my house....if it was a drunk neighbor, I would probably laugh at him... 

In Christ,
KP

[RAMS]

So for those who believe that Christians should own guns, would Christians be justified using a gun to protect themselves or their family under certain circumstances such as a robbery?

And would killing someone in extreme cases be justifiable?

Categorically.  Count on it. Let God sort it out, thereafter.

Robert

[RAMS]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

Gary,

You talkin' my ex home, Montana?  Or New Mexico, the 5th largest state in the union?

I agree with you absolutely.

Robert

[Charles Sloan]

So for those who believe that Christians should own guns, would Christians be justified using a gun to protect themselves or their family under certain circumstances such as a robbery?

And would killing someone in extreme cases be justifiable?

Categorically.  Count on it. Let God sort it out, thereafter.

Robert

Can this be justified by Scripture, or is this just your personal beliefs apart from the Bible?

[Bon Voyage]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

Gary,

You talkin' my ex home, Montana?  Or New Mexico, the 5th largest state in the union?

I agree with you absolutely.

Robert

Montana.

[RAMS]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

Gary,

You talkin' my ex home, Montana?  Or New Mexico, the 5th largest state in the union?

I agree with you absolutely.

Robert

Montana.

I grew up and was raised in Whitefish, between Whitefish and Kalispell. 10 miles from each on Stillwater Dr, along the Stillwater River.  Winter ranged down near St. Ignatius. Summer ranged over on the Sweet Grass and Red Lodge as well as on the Blackfoot.

I forgot our discussion on this and why I had a sordid memory of the place. But the essence, I cannot deny it, remains within me, still. My adoption of New Mexico about 20 years for a U.S. origin haunt when I am back in country has had the same effect in attachment with no sordid memories.

Did you or do you hunt? 

If so did you go after Whitetail or Elk?

Folks haven't an idea about the American-Rocky Mountain west, understandably.

Robert

[RAMS]

Can this be justified by Scripture, or is this just your personal beliefs apart from the Bible?

Yes.

The underlying argument for gun control seems to be that the availability of guns causes crime. By extension, the availability of any weapon would have to be viewed as a cause of crime. What does the Bible say about such a view?

Perhaps we should start at the beginning, or at least very close to the beginning -- in Genesis 4. In this chapter we read about the first murder. Cain had offered an unacceptable sacrifice, and Cain was upset that God insisted that he do the right thing. In other words, Cain was peeved that he could not do his own thing.

Cain decided to kill his brother rather than get right with God. There were no guns available, although there may well have been a knife. Whether it was a knife or a rock, the Bible does not say. The point is, the evil in Cain's heart was the cause of the murder, not the availability of the murder weapon.

God's response was not to ban rocks or knives, or whatever, but to banish the murderer. Later (see Genesis 9:5-6) God instituted capital punishment, but said not a word about banning weapons.

Exodus 22:2-3 tells us "If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed. If the sun has risen on him, there shall be guilt for his bloodshed. He should make full restitution; if he has nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft."

Another question asked by Christians is "Doesn't having a gun imply a lack of trust that God will take care of us?"

Answer:  No That is why we have weapons and firearms in our possession.

Another: 

"What are you afriad of by owning a weapon?

Answer:  Nothing.

Just some facts, on subject.

Robert

[chosenone]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

Guns are very much part of your culture but does that mean that it is a good thing? Culture can change and very often should. surely.
We are always hearing about colleges and schools there where someone has murdered loads of kids and shot themselves. if they didnt have guns that wouldnt have happened . Shootings there are rife, and that is terrible and wrong. If there were no guns that wouldnt happen either. of course we have crime here but mainly with knives, While knives are terrible and often kill, guns are far more lethal becuase so many can be killed in one go wheras a knife cant. Also we all have to have knives for cooking etc so it would be impossible to ban them.

[RAMS]

Guns are very much part of your culture but does that mean that it is a good thing? Culture can change and very often should. surely.
We are always hearing about colleges and schools there where someone has murdered loads of kids and shot themselves. if they didnt have guns that wouldnt have happened . Shootings there are rife, and that is terrible and wrong. If there were no guns that wouldnt happen either. of course we have crime here but mainly with knives, While knives are terrible and often kill, guns are far more lethal becuase so many can be killed in one go wheras a knife cant. Also we all have to have knives for cooking etc so it would be impossible to ban them.

Utterly tragic, such liberalism.

Robert

[Bonnie]

So for those who believe that Christians should own guns, would Christians be justified using a gun to protect themselves or their family under certain circumstances such as a robbery?

And would killing someone in extreme cases be justifiable?

I had a Pastor one time who said he didn't believe God would put him in a situation like that.  Well, he is old and it hasn't happened.  Was it faith or just coincidence?  I never could decide.

[chosenone]

Guns are very much part of your culture but does that mean that it is a good thing? Culture can change and very often should. surely.
We are always hearing about colleges and schools there where someone has murdered loads of kids and shot themselves. if they didnt have guns that wouldnt have happened . Shootings there are rife, and that is terrible and wrong. If there were no guns that wouldnt happen either. of course we have crime here but mainly with knives, While knives are terrible and often kill, guns are far more lethal becuase so many can be killed in one go wheras a knife cant. Also we all have to have knives for cooking etc so it would be impossible to ban them.

Utterly tragic, such liberalism.

Robert

wow...the first time I have ever been accused of being liberal....is that good or bad I wonder?

[Jimbob]

of course we have crime here but mainly with knives, While knives are terrible and often kill, guns are far more lethal becuase so many can be killed in one go wheras a knife cant. Also we all have to have knives for cooking etc so it would be impossible to ban them.

Sure about that?


UK Guardian: Kitchen knife ban sought

Accident and emergency doctors today call for the banning of long, sharp kitchen knives, arguing they account for at least half of all stabbings.

They say such knives slice through clothing and penetrate vital organs.

"Many assaults are impulsive, often triggered by alcohol or misuse of other drugs, and the long, pointed kitchen knife is an easily accessible, potentially lethal weapon, particularly in the domestic setting," say the doctors from the West Middlesex university hospital, London, in the British Medical Journal.

----------

"UK government statistics show that 24% of all 16-year-old boys report carrying knives or other weapons, and 19% admitting attacking someone with the intent to cause harm.

"Although other weapons - such as baseball bats, screwdrivers and chains - are also carried, by far the most common weapons are knives."

[Imabear]

This reminds me of a time we had a trauma patient come into the ER. 
Her story was that she had accidentally stabbed herself with a long kitchen knife while doing the dishes.
The medics said their was blood all over the kitchen.  I didn't believe her story.

If they ban knives, what's next?  Baseball bats, shovels?  I'll have to think back on all the fatal traumas we had and try to remember the weapon involved.  The problem is the typical house is filled with things that can be used as weapons. 
Guns can be used at a greater distance and can be more deadly.

[Snargles]

Last week I got a call from the NRA. Before the Charlton Heston clone could start his spiel about the importance of gun ownership I told him, "The NRA doesn't want to be calling me." I told him if I had my way there would be no private ownership of hand guns. He asked what I would do if someone broke into my house and I told him I would call the police. "You mean if you had a gun you wouldn't use it to protect yourself?" he asked. I told him I might shoot the intruder in the kneecap but that if I shot and killed him I would be guilty of murder. "I have a son fighting in Iraq and I don't want to think he can't come home and protect himself" he went on. I don't see the connection and I told him I don't think Christians should serve in the military anyway.

The second amendment addresses the issue of state militias, not private ownership of guns. Militias were important to the people when the Constitution was written but law enforcement and the threat from foreign nations has changed in the last 200 years.

Christians get too attached to this life and some are willing to go against the word of God to preserve it. Paul said to die is gain. It is better to be killed and go heaven than to committ murder just so we can spend a few more years on this earth. Did Jesus pull out an Uzi when the soldiers came for him? Did he tell Peter "Cut a few more ears off so I get away?"

Should Christians own guns? If you are a hunter and eat what you kill or if you are a farmer and need a rifle to kill foxes getting into the chicken coop get a gun. If you are a private citizen and want a hand gun to protect yourself, get deadlocks for your doors, keep the number for the police station handy and live so that if today is your last day on earth you can meet your maker with a clean conscious. But don't buy a gun.

[jb728b]

Should Christians own guns?

Only if they want to.

Some have argued that prayer should be our shield and allow God to protect us, with this I agree but, How does God protect you.

Hypothetical:
How many of you would pray for God's protection and safety then deliberately step out into oncoming traffic, jump off a 10 story building or jump head first into a barrel of broken glass and expect God to protect and save you?

God's protection, although supernatural in origin, is not always supernatural in method.

Also this idea of letting others sin so I can be safe is garbage.  If it were a sin for a Christian to carry a gun it is a sin for EVERYONE and that includes police, military and whoever.

[Jimbob]

Interesting passage that may give insight...

"If the thief is caught while breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there will be no bloodguiltiness on his account."  Exodus 22:2

Nehemiah also called the people working on the wall to self-defense (Nehemiah 4)...

"15 When our enemies heard that it was known to us and that God had frustrated their plan, we all returned to the wall, each to his work. 16 From that day on, half of my servants worked on construction, and half held the spears, shields, bows, and coats of mail. And the leaders stood behind the whole house of Judah, 17 who were building on the wall. Those who carried burdens were loaded in such a way that each labored on the work with one hand and held his weapon with the other. 18 And each of the builders had his sword strapped at his side while he built. The man who sounded the trumpet was beside me. 19 And I said to the nobles and to the officials and to the rest of the people, “The work is great and widely spread, and we are separated on the wall, far from one another. 20 In the place where you hear the sound of the trumpet, rally to us there. Our God will fight for us.

[Bon Voyage]

I am very pleased that in the uk owning a gum is not allowed unless you have a special licence for maybe a farmer or whatever. The more guns that are around and available the more people get shot. Thankfully most police officers here still dont carry guns either except special forces who are called out if there is an incident involving a firearm, which is still rare.
Of course there are some illegal guns but the general population just dont have them or want them., and long may it stay this way.
I have never understood the American things for guns, why do you need or want them, they only result in more violence and more deaths and injuries? I also hate hunting so dont see the need for guns for this so called 'sport' either.
I will now duck before the flack comes my way !

Guns are intertwined with our very culture here.  They helped gain our independence, new territory, etc.  Guns are mentioned in the our Constitution.  In fact, the state I live in has a provision to secede from the United States if the second amendment was changed.  Perhaps, there is no way you could understand.  The state I live in is larger than the UK in area, with less than a million people.  Many parts of it are still very much wild.

Gary,

You talkin' my ex home, Montana?  Or New Mexico, the 5th largest state in the union?

I agree with you absolutely.

Robert

Montana.

I grew up and was raised in Whitefish, between Whitefish and Kalispell. 10 miles from each on Stillwater Dr, along the Stillwater River.  Winter ranged down near St. Ignatius. Summer ranged over on the Sweet Grass and Red Lodge as well as on the Blackfoot.

I forgot our discussion on this and why I had a sordid memory of the place. But the essence, I cannot deny it, remains within me, still. My adoption of New Mexico about 20 years for a U.S. origin haunt when I am back in country has had the same effect in attachment with no sordid memories.

Did you or do you hunt? 

If so did you go after Whitetail or Elk?

Folks haven't an idea about the American-Rocky Mountain west, understandably.

Robert

I have some property with some views of the Crazy Mt's, the Beartooths, and the Pryors.  I have only seen mule deer on my property.  Although I hear from time to time the elk are out my way,  as well as the mountain lion.  When I was younger, I spent time near Thompson Falls, and Drummond.