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Author Topic: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?  (Read 83988 times)

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Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1750 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:11:46 »
No it does not....
Are you suggesting that there is anything contained in God's word is not to be taken in a literal sense?

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1750 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:11:46 »

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1751 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:24:45 »
And you know that how?  A strict reading of God's word says that you are wrong.

No, a strict reading says that God's word is right. If in fact the sun and moon stood still in the sky, then God must have stopped their movement as well, since the earth, sun, and moon all move. Get your facts straight.

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1751 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:24:45 »

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1752 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:26:16 »
Are you suggesting that there is anything contained in God's word is not to be taken in a literal sense?

No.

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1753 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:34:51 »
No, a strict reading says that God's word is right. If in fact the sun and moon stood still in the sky, then God must have stopped their movement as well, since the earth, sun, and moon all move. Get your facts straight.
Facts?  What facts?

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1753 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:34:51 »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1754 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:35:57 »
No.
so who decides which is to be taken literally and which is to be taken figuratively?  You?

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1754 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 07:35:57 »



Offline Carey

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1755 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 09:22:16 »
Thank you, for further revealing your true disdain for God's word. Actually, the sun and the moon both move as well as this earth. Therefore, if in fact God did stop just this earth from moving, then it seems reasonable to assume the sun and moon would continue their movements. That is not what is recorded by those claiming to observe the same in scripture, who may or may not have understood that the earth revolves around the sun. In any case, it appeared to those observing, that the sun and moon stood still, which they would pretty much have to do, in order to look like they did even if this earth stood still. By the way, did you happen to observe the sunrise or sunset today?

https://www.universetoday.com/60174/does-the-sun-move/

Perhaps this question is relevant to the subject of this thread, how would creation have appeared to one observing, and what would be the result if those observations took place over six literal days.   ::headscratch::
Dr. Hugh Ross has a very interesting look at this.

A relevant question in discussing Genesis, is by what means was the information gathered by the author.  If it was dictated by God there is no reason that God could not have explained it clearly as mentioned by AVZ above, if however if the Genesis account was given by one that observed the events of creation... ::shrug::

From my perspective there are no winners or losers in this debate, both sides have brought up truly insightful points to support their positions. 





Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1756 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 11:37:46 »
so who decides which is to be taken literally and which is to be taken figuratively?  You?

The bible itself tells us many times when it is using symbols or allegories. Apart from such, or an extra ordinary compelling reason to do so, the is no reason to do so. Thinking God is not capable of creating the world in six days, or of explaining another way He did it, is not an extra ordinary compelling reason to make the creation and flood accounts such. Apart from this, when symbols or allegories are used in scripture, they should not contradict other plain testimony of scripture in relation to the same topic being addressed. If they do, they are not likely symbolic or allegorical in nature. To make them such makes God's word contradict itself. Though many are willing to do this to support what they have already chosen to believe, this is not rightly dividing the word of God, but rather simply using scripture for one's own ends.

The creation and flood accounts of the book of Genesis directly contradict the theoretical observations of fallen humanity in the theory of evolution. Do you really think that God couldn't do any better in an allegorical setting than the creation and flood account if in fact He really wanted us to understand the theory of evolution as established truth? This is again nothing short of bringing God down even below the level of fallen humanities abilities regarding the same. Still no doubt, you do not realize or consider how you cast down God before your supposed superior intellect, or exalt yourself above Him in these actions. You are not superior to God and or His chosen prophets of the past who delivered His testimony to us. You are among those prophesied in scripture as having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof. You deny God's greatest act of power in the creation in six literal days, through the self exalted and promoted theory of fallen humanities origins create and sustained by fallen humanity itself. God will destroy this tower of Babel built in defiance of God and his word as readily as He destroyed the first one by His personal appearance which will defy all the laws of nature and fallen humanities presumed superior intellect.

Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1757 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 12:22:41 »
Thinking God is not capable of creating the world in six days, or of explaining another way He did it, is not an extra ordinary compelling reason to make the creation and flood accounts such.
And there we have, once again, one of those straw-man arguments that really have nothing to do with anything.  The theory of the big bang has nothing whatsoever to do with thinking God is incapable of creating in six days.  But you will persist is such nonsense, building your entire argument around such straw-men.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1758 on: Fri Dec 29, 2017 - 12:56:31 »
And there we have, once again, one of those straw-man arguments that really have nothing to do with anything.  The theory of the big bang has nothing whatsoever to do with thinking God is incapable of creating in six days.  But you will persist is such nonsense, building your entire argument around such straw-men.

I was not addressing the big bang at all. I think you know that. All said was in reference to evolution not the big bang, though the article shared about the Pope did mention the big bang. Something like the big bang could have been part of the creative process, but we simply do not know. Nor of course do I subscribe to the time element of most big bangers. No pun intended.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1759 on: Sat Dec 30, 2017 - 08:21:17 »
https://creation.com/mutations-are-evolutions-end

Quote
Summary

Mutations are not uniquely biological events that provide an engine of natural variation for natural selection to work upon and produce all the variety of life. Mutation is the purely physical result of the all-pervading mechanical damage that accompanies all molecular machinery. As a consequence, all multicellular life on earth is undergoing inexorable genome decay because the deleterious mutation rates are so high, the effects of the individual mutations are so small, there are no compensatory beneficial mutations and natural selection is ineffective in removing the damage.

So much damage occurs that it is clearly evident within a single human lifetime. Our reproductive cells are not immune, as previously thought, but are just as prone to mechanical damage as our body cells. Somewhere between a few thousand and a few million mutations are enough to drive a human lineage to extinction, and this is likely to occur over a time scale of only tens to hundreds of thousands of years. This is far short of the supposed evolutionary time scales. Like rust eating away the steel in a bridge, mutations are eating away our genomes and there is nothing we can do to stop them.

Evolution’s engine, when properly understood, becomes evolution’s end.

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1760 on: Wed Jan 03, 2018 - 20:21:18 »
Quote
Barbarian said that "Science doesn't ever say that something is impossible." So, I predict that Barbarian would agree that something popping into existence in a space that does not exist is possible. The non-scientist Christian would. But, I doubt if he actually will. The overwhelming scientific evidence of a several billion year old universe compels and directs what he believes about that.   

I do believe that it crossed the mind of scientists that, there was in the beginning, something that exist from eternity from which all things came and started to be created from. For whatever theory they come up with always comes from an existing "something". They just don't want to deal with the matter as to where that "something" came from  or speak of an eternal "something". 

In fact, the Big Bang theory was initially assailed by atheists.   It was proposed by a Christian, it overturned the notion of an eternal universe, and it was consistent with Genesis.


Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1761 on: Wed Jan 03, 2018 - 20:28:12 »
Quote
Mutations are not uniquely biological events that provide an engine of natural variation for natural selection to work upon and produce all the variety of life.

That's what we see happening.   Over, and over again.   Most mutations don't do much.   A few are harmful.   A very few are useful.  Natural selection sorts it out.  So no one is surprised when a new, irreducibly complex enzyme system evolves in a culture of bacteria by mutation and natural selection, or when a population of lizards evolve a new digestive organ in response to a different environment.   That's how things work.

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Mutation is the purely physical result of the all-pervading mechanical damage that accompanies all molecular machinery. As a consequence, all multicellular life on earth is undergoing inexorable genome decay

Don't tell the lizards.  They've been happily digesting plant material,courtesy of their new spiral valve.   They'd be so let down, to learn that it was actually "decay."

Quote
because the deleterious mutation rates are so high, the effects of the individual mutations are so small, there are no compensatory beneficial mutations and natural selection is ineffective in removing the damage.

Don't tell the bacteria.   They not only evolved a new enzyme, they later evolved a new regulator, so that the enzyme is produced only in the presence of the food source.   

Quote
Our reproductive cells are not immune, as previously thought, but are just as prone to mechanical damage as our body cells.

You've been misled about that.   The only time mutations are passed on, is when they happen to reproductive cells.   

When direct observation contradicts one's beautiful hypothesis, the hypothesis loses.




 

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1762 on: Wed Jan 03, 2018 - 20:33:44 »
Quote
From my perspective there are no winners or losers in this debate, both sides have brought up truly insightful points to support their positions.

Not long ago, on a different board, a very confirmed YE creationist made a valiant attempt to bridge the gap.   He convinced me to give it a try.   After a lot of work, it fell apart.   The creationist outlook is so completely different than the scientific outlook, that there just isn't common ground for common descent.   The best we could do was look at common descent within "kinds", like cats or dogs, or ungulates.

We ended up disagreeing respectfully, and even had some kind words for each other.   And that was something everyone else found disconcerting.   

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1763 on: Wed Jan 03, 2018 - 20:39:28 »
4WD:
Quote
And you know that how?  A strict reading of God's word says that you are wrong.

Amo
Quote
No it does not,..

Psalm 104:5 Who hast founded the earth upon its own bases: it shall not be moved for ever and ever.

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1764 on: Wed Jan 03, 2018 - 21:08:18 »
You can observe evolution in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDaOgu2CQtI

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1765 on: Thu Jan 04, 2018 - 14:54:23 »
The sad thing is that there are some people who actually think that is about evolution.


Offline Open Heart

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1766 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 03:09:46 »
You can observe evolution in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDaOgu2CQtI
Fun video.  Of course it doesn't teach anything about evolution.  But then, no one wants to be serious all the time.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1767 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 17:54:33 »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSLfBo_TTU

One can observe that evolution is a lie after watching the above video. Or of course one can determine that all the photos, documentation, and eye witness accounts in the video are lies also. Depending upon which faith one chooses.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1768 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 18:11:47 »
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/08/170831134221.htm

Poor evolutionists have a tough time with difficult finds like the above. Not a problem for creationists though, do away with the silly time frame of evolution and there is no problem with this and other mysteries among evolutionists.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1769 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 18:16:28 »

Offline Alan

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1770 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 20:18:27 »
Fake, Fake, and FAKE!!  rofl

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1771 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 21:00:01 »
Fake, Fake, and FAKE!!  rofl

Of course it is, an evolutionist says so.

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1772 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 21:05:23 »
Quote
Poor evolutionists have a tough time with difficult finds like the above.

The find reinforces the other findings of transitional hominins in Africa.    If one of them had developed a human-like foot earlier than the Australopithecines who left their tracks at Laetoli, it's interesting, but not incompatible with the trend we see in human evolution at the time.

Quote
Not a problem for creationists though

As YE creationist Kurt Wise admits, these data are a huge problem for creationism, and what he calls strong evidence for evolution.

 

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1773 on: Fri Jan 05, 2018 - 21:28:37 »
The find reinforces the other findings of transitional hominins in Africa.    If one of them had developed a human-like foot earlier than the Australopithecines who left their tracks at Laetoli, it's interesting, but not incompatible with the trend we see in human evolution at the time.

As YE creationist Kurt Wise admits, these data are a huge problem for creationism, and what he calls strong evidence for evolution.

Nothing is a problem for evolution, since it constantly evolves whenever necessary due to exposed erroneous ideas. Perhaps these are problems for Kurt, I don't know. Fallen humanities speculations regarding the theories they have chosen to place their faith in, are just that, fallen humanities speculations. I pace little faith in such speculations which have been so very wrong so very many times. There is no finding human foot prints anywhere at the wrong time for creationists. This could only be a problem for evolutionists, if evolution didn't continually evolve so much itself. When they are wrong they forget, revise, move on, and claim their present "truth" as undeniable scientific fact. It works wonderfully in this fallen world, but it won't go over very well in the next world.

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1774 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 00:51:36 »
Australopithecines is a fake

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1775 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 05:21:47 »
The creation and flood accounts of the book of Genesis directly contradict the theoretical observations of fallen humanity in the theory of evolution.
No they do not.  But your interpretation of those accounts certainly is in conflict with the most reliable data available.
« Last Edit: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 05:23:59 by 4WD »

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1776 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 10:27:30 »
No they do not.  But your interpretation of those accounts certainly is in conflict with the most reliable data available.


Yes I know, believing what it actually says is a faulty interpretation while believing it means evolution which is so very contrary to what it actually says because human speculation concerning data applied to the faith of evolution demonstrates the same. By the way, I don't believe any "Christian" evolutionists on these boards has given their interpretation of these accounts for us, would you care to do so? Just how do they support your evolutionary faith? Surely if you know the accounts do not mean what they plainly say, then you do know what they really mean, don't you? Please do explain your interpretation to us.

Thank you for admitting above that you consider fallen humanities speculations concerning data, more reliable than the word of God. Of course you could always tell us your interpretation of the creation and flood accounts, and perhaps we would better understand your tendency to place so much trust in fallen humanities observations concerning "data".

http://www.icr.org/article/ten-misconceptions-about-geologic-column/

Quote
Ten Misconceptions about the Geologic Column

by Steven A. Austin, Ph.D.
Evidence for Creation › Evidence from Science › Evidence from the Earth Sciences › The Global Flood Is the Key to the Past › Geological Evidence Indicates Rapid Formation

The ten strata systems that geologists use (Cambrian, Ordovician, Silurian, Devonian, Carboniferous, Permian, Triassic, Jurassic, Cretaceous, and Tertiary) compose the "standard geologic column" and are claimed by many to contain the major proof of evolutionary theory. Several erroneous notions have been attached to the geologic column. The following are the ten most common misconceptions.

Misconception No. 1. The geologic column was constructed by geologists who, because of the weight of the evidence that they had found, were convinced of the truth of uniformitarian theory and organic evolution.

It may sound surprising, but the standard geologic column was devised before 1860 by catastrophists who were creationists.1 Adam Sedgewick, Roderick Murchison, William Coneybeare, and others affirmed that the earth was formed largely by catastrophic processes, and that the earth and life were created. These men stood for careful empirical science and were not compelled to believe evolutionary speculation or side with uniformitarian theory. Although most would be called "progressive creationists" in today's terminology, they would not be pleased to see all the evolutionary baggage that has been loaded onto their classification of strata.

Misconception No. 2. Geologists composed the geologic column by assembling the "periods" and "eras" which they had recognized.

The geologic column was not composed by assembling a chronology of "periods," "eras" or other supposed measures of time, but by superposition of objectively defined sequences of sedimentary strata called "systems." The "periods" and "eras" were later appended to the system nomenclature of the "geologic Column" transforming it into a "geologic time scale."


What makes the speculation of fallen humanity that the geological columns each represent vast periods of time, superior to the biblical account of the flood that would produce the same rapidly? Please explain also your interpretation of the biblical flood account which according to you is telling us of these vast time periods rather than the rapid formation of these columns one would expect if the account were to be taken for what it says at face value.
Thank you.
« Last Edit: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 12:14:29 by Amo »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1777 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 12:59:47 »
What makes the speculation of fallen humanity that the geological columns each represent vast periods of time, superior to the biblical account of the flood that would produce the same rapidly?
The flood would not, could not, produce the same rapidly.  It is only your "speculation of fallen humanity" that would even conjure up such a silly notion.  The geological history presented in the walls of the Grand Canyon gives alternating periods of time represented by differing rock layers; those layers consisting of periods of shallow sea beds and intervening desert conditions.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1778 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 16:39:29 »
The flood would not, could not, produce the same rapidly.  It is only your "speculation of fallen humanity" that would even conjure up such a silly notion.  The geological history presented in the walls of the Grand Canyon gives alternating periods of time represented by differing rock layers; those layers consisting of periods of shallow sea beds and intervening desert conditions.

So say you. What is the proof of this? Where are the signs of immense erosion in the layers that would be there if they took millions of years to form? How could they remain so evenly distributed over such vast areas as they are while natural erosion and no doubt many a natural disaster and or catastrophes would transpire during the million of years claimed to create them?

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1779 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 17:54:39 »
https://evolutionnews.org/2017/04/evolutions-influence-is-bad-news-for-your-health/

Quote
Evolution’s Influence Is Bad News for Your Health

Evolution’s dual myths of random causation and the king gene have not been good for biology, and they also have done damage elsewhere. In the area of human health, our cultural uptake of evolutionary ideas contributed to the dangerously flawed notion that health is a random affair. True, genetic mutations are capable of producing all kinds of diseases, but the vast majority of health issues stem from, or can be alleviated by, lifestyle and workplace decisions. In a great many cases, you are not what your genes say you are, but what you eat and how you live. Diet, stress, exercise, and exposure to toxins play an enormous role in determining your health history.

That shouldn’t be a surprise. But too often it is completely missed or underemphasized, and an unfortunate example of this flawed evolutionary influence is our health care system and health insurance.

Our skyrocketing costs could be reduced by half or even an order of magnitude with proper education and personal decisions. Instead, our health is too often viewed as essentially the luck of the draw. For instance, billionaire Mark Cuban recently expressed this sentiment in advocating for healthcare as a legal right:

I believe that, given we all face the exact same genetic and wrong place, wrong time risks, coverage of most chronic and life-threatening illnesses or injuries should be a right.
In other words, everyone faces about the same healthcare risks. Our health is a crapshoot.

This is an astonishing demonstration of scientific ignorance. There is no doubt Cuban is very good at making money. But he fails to grasp the most basic aspects of human health. He can hardly be blamed, however, given how dominant this evolutionary myth has become. Evolution’s influence is enormous, and that is bad news for more than just biology.

More problems caused by evolution than simply of faith it appears.

Offline Amo

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1780 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 18:24:01 »
Another video about evilution.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-14Nhj05L90


Offline Open Heart

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1781 on: Sat Jan 06, 2018 - 21:36:01 »
And who consulted on this video on evolution?  Legitimate scientists or religious creationists?  Not everything on the internet is true.  You have to consider the source.

Offline Alan

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1782 on: Sun Jan 07, 2018 - 02:08:39 »
And who consulted on this video on evolution?  Legitimate scientists or religious creationists?  Not everything on the internet is true.  You have to consider the source.


That's been my argument all along here, not a single credentialed scientist has made the claim that the earth is 6000 years old and that evolution is bunk. For every claim that evolution is wrong, there are a thousand corrections for their error.

Offline 4WD

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1783 on: Sun Jan 07, 2018 - 04:17:28 »
And who consulted on this video on evolution?  Legitimate scientists or religious creationists?  Not everything on the internet is true.  You have to consider the source.
That's been my argument all along here, not a single credentialed scientist has made the claim that the earth is 6000 years old and that evolution is bunk. For every claim that evolution is wrong, there are a thousand corrections for their error.
If you take away the faulty YEC translation/interpretation of the Hebrew word "yom" in the Genesis account of creation, there is absolutely no data whatsoever to suggest the universe is only 6000 years old.

And similarly, if you take away the faulty YEC translation/interpretation of the Hebrew word "ehrets" in the Genesis account of the flood of Noah there is no data to suggest a global flood.

Ginger Rella

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Re: Discussion Regarding Evolution, Fact or Fiction?
« Reply #1784 on: Sun Jan 07, 2018 - 09:04:00 »
That's been my argument all along here, not a single credentialed scientist has made the claim that the earth is 6000 years old and that evolution is bunk. For every claim that evolution is wrong, there are a thousand corrections for their error.
If you take away the faulty YEC translation/interpretation of the Hebrew word "yom" in the Genesis account of creation, there is absolutely no data whatsoever to suggest the universe is only 6000 years old.

And similarly, if you take away the faulty YEC translation/interpretation of the Hebrew word "ehrets" in the Genesis account of the flood of Noah there is no data to suggest a global flood.


faulty YEC translation/interpretation

Absolutely correct.

And if these areas have had a faulty translation/interpretation , what other areas of the Bible have?

The written word is only as good as the comprehension of those who read it.  Said understanding is surly debatable because NO two people read the same thing and understand the same way as others. That has certainly been demonstrated time and again right here on GC.

I have long maintained that the Holy Bible, while the inerrant word of God, is incomplete. Certain proofs of this are by the fact that the Roman Catholic Church has 7 more books in the New Testament and additional verses in a couple o f Old Testament books that the Protestants leave out

And the Greek Orthodox has 4 more beyond the Roman Catholic.

A comparason chart is here.    http://www.bible.ca/b-canon-orthodox-catholic-christian-bible-books.htm

Now, for those Protestant purists on here... and I am one of you.... there are reasons the Protestant bible is shorter. But, that is not the reason for this reply, and only as an example of why I feel the Holy Bible, in and of itself is incomplete.    Though not necessarily wrong at all.

I firmly believe that Genesis indicates that the earth likely is/can be far older then 6 or 7 thousand years.

As to the evolution of man from monkeys, NO. I would need to write a book to explain why that is surly unlikely based on the fact that first... there is not enough time in history past for the Darwinian ideas of evolution to have taken place, and second.. as we have commonly understood, save for a scant number of organisms, it takes a separate male and separate female to reproduce.  New and newer species would have died out before a mate-able couple  who have been produced, and if one was.... for every living thing in the bird, fish, and animal kingdom.... not enough time.

So... Billions of years is not long enough.... HOWEVER... I do  believe that God very well could have been up there with his heavenly erector set,
Linclon logs, and play dough creating whatever and whom ever he wished....  or maybe with His heavenly chemistry set started the big bang expansion of things and that well could have been a heck of a long time... perhaps billions... or even trillions of years ago. Though the bible tells us God spoke things into existence....

IDK, I was not there and do have only the bible for guidance on that.

As to modern man.... I see that as being within the past 6,000 or 7,000 years. Beginning with Adam. (Not at all a contradiction of my above statement.)

But what difference does it make if the Bible is incomplete, or tanslated/interpreted wrong????

We are mortal people with souls and are looking forward to an eternal home with Jesus.

The Holy Bible is a basic handbook of how we should live to achieve that....

There is nothing in the Bible that alters the way we are supposed to live and what we are supposed to do. ::tippinghat::






 

     
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