Hi..
I find giving to be great!
But tithing was an old covenant law,given under Moses.

Hebrews 7:5 And those descendants of Levi who receive the priestly office have a commandment in the law to take tithes from the people, that is, from their brothers,  though these also are descended from Abraham.

The problem I have today,is what should be giving,when and where God says,has become a 10% church tax.

In 2 Corinthians 8 and 9,they were gathering money,to help the poor saints in Jerusalem.

I think that there are a lot of hard working families,that are unduly burdened,supporting pastors,while the tithers work hard,and maybe don’t have enough money.

Beaten,stoned,shipwrecked Paul worked,why cant pastors work,not to burden the saints.Paul made that clear,he worked not be a burden in Corinthians,and in both Thessalonian letters.And in Acts 20,he stressed that his own hands,provided for him,and his fellow ministers.

I guess what I am saying is,though there are verses about living off the gospel,there is also a balance that needs to be attained.

Here we see,that one should give out of extra,not as a predominant law.

16Now concerning the collection for the saints: you should follow the directions I gave to the churches of Galatia. 2On the first day of every week, each of you is to put aside and save whatever extra you earn, so that collections need not be taken when I come.

Curious about  your thoughts.

My wife works for the church (AOG), so we don't have a choice but to give 10% of our joint income as a condition of employment.  However, we give quite a bit more than that, in fact, a lot more than that.  My wife works long hours and never charges for overtime pay, she also corrects class papers at home, prepares the sermon for the youth chapel, organizes the relief donations for disasters. I give a healthy tithe from my business income, and use my truck to haul donations to transfer and repack everything so that the boxes are squared off on pallets inside the container.  I also do street ministry on the streets of San Francisco for the Catholics and hospital chaplaincy at VA Hospital for the Protestants.  My wife also prepares the Sermon for the underground church in Saudi Arabia, and ships Bibles. My son plays the keyboard in a well known Christian light rock group.  His keyboard is in the $2,000 range, plus the assocated elecronics and speaker amount to a little more than that. My wife and I are both excommunicated from the Catholics, so they don't get a dime from us.  All and all, I would say that everything that we have belongs to the Lord, and we live on a small allowance. We consider ourselves doers of the word, and usually don't get so much as a thankyou from the Church.  We have been doers for so long that it's expected of us.

If ppl under the New Testament now want to give more than one tenth of their income as freewill offerings, then that's just fine. But as an obligation, it's an Old Testament thing; (where are the Levites to give the tithes to, today? see Malachi, etc.)

 8Will a man rob God? Yet you rob me. But you ask, 'How do we rob you?' In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse-the whole nation of you-because you are robbing me. 10 Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this," says the LORD Almighty, "and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that you will not have room enough for it." -- Malachi 3:8-11

When I was a kid, I used to get upset everytime someone preached about giving. That is awful selfish of them, I used to think to myself. I thought the preachers wanted us to give them the money or their church. It was not until I got older that I realized 1) when I give to church, I am in fact giving to God, and 2) there is more to giving than just money from my paycheck. Many people today think of tithing as optional, and many do not do it all all. I believe we should give to God, and in this study, I will go over why it is necessary and what it is exactly that God wants us to give.

Why We Should Give

The first thing we should look at is why. Why should we give anything to God? Well, the simplest answer is "Because God said so", but there is so much more to it that that. God does tell us to give, but not just "because He said so":

"Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." -- Luke 6:38

" 9 Honor the LORD with your wealth,
with the firstfruits of all your crops;
10 then your barns will be filled to overflowing,
and your vats will brim over with new wine."
-- Proverbs 3:9-10

"7Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. 8And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that in all things at all times, having all that you need, you will abound in every good work. 9As it is written:
   'He has scattered abroad his gifts to the poor;
       his righteousness endures forever.'
10Now he who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will also supply and increase your store of seed and will enlarge the harvest of your righteousness. 11You will be made rich in every way so that you can be generous on every occasion, and through us your generosity will result in thanksgiving to God." -- 2 Corinthians 9:7-11

As you can see, God commands us to give, but this is not just an empty command. God does not want us to be forced or coerced into giving, but rather wants us to give from the heart, out of love for Him and His people.

This command also comes with a promise. When we give to God, He blesses us. The more freely, and happily we give, the more we get blessed. This is a promise I can personally attest to. At the time of this writing, I had increased my tithe to support my church's missions program. Right after doing so, I got a promotion/raise at work, had an opportunity to work for paid overtime (being on salary, that is unusual), found a sizable check that I had though was lost in the U.S. postal system, and recieved a full refund check from the local college. If you give to God freely and with cheerfulness of heart, He will bless you. Does this mean we give just to recieve a blessing? No, there is more.

Another reason for giving is support of Christ's Church. Not just your local congregation, but the Church as a whole. Your tithes and offerings can be used to help support other congregations or missionaries. Paul collected offerings in Corinth and Galatia to help the Christians in Jerusalem, and He used the money recieved from asian chuches to support himself in Corinth so as not to be a burden to the Corinthians:

"1Now about the collection for God's people: Do what I told the Galatian churches to do. 2On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made. 3Then, when I arrive, I will give letters of introduction to the men you approve and send them with your gift to Jerusalem." -- 1 Corinthians 16:1-3

" 7Was it a sin for me to lower myself in order to elevate you by preaching the gospel of God to you free of charge? 8I robbed other churches by receiving support from them so as to serve you. 9And when I was with you and needed something, I was not a burden to anyone, for the brothers who came from Macedonia supplied what I needed. I have kept myself from being a burden to you in any way, and will continue to do so." -- 2 Corinthians 11:7-9

Did Paul literally steal money from the other churches? No, but those churches did support Paul in his ministry, and Paul did spread the Gospel all over the known world. When we give to God, we are helping spread His Word throughout the world by supporting His servants. Not only that, but giving itself can be a form of missions work:

"12This service that you perform is not only supplying the needs of God's people but is also overflowing in many expressions of thanks to God. 13Because of the service by which you have proved yourselves, men will praise God for the obedience that accompanies your confession of the gospel of Christ, and for your generosity in sharing with them and with everyone else." -- 2 Corinthians 9:12-13

"28 At the end of every three years, bring all the tithes of that year's produce and store it in your towns, 29 so that the Levites (who have no allotment or inheritance of their own) and the aliens, the fatherless and the widows who live in your towns may come and eat and be satisfied, and so that the LORD your God may bless you in all the work of your hands." -- Deuteronomy 14:28-29
When we give to the needy, to those who cannot provide for themselves, we are fulfilling Christ's command to help the poor and needy, but even more, it presents an opportunity to bring those people into our family. By showing love and care, and doing an example of what is right, we can show people the love of God first hand.

How Much do We Give?

Now that we know we need to give to God, and why, the next question is "How much?" How much does God require of us? The answer, of course, is in the Bible.

"Each of you must bring a gift in proportion to the way the LORD your God has blessed you." -- Deuteronomy 16:17

"29The disciples, each according to his ability, decided to provide help for the brothers living in Judea. 30This they did, sending their gift to the elders by Barnabas and Saul." -- Acts 11:29-30

The Bible says to give in proportion to the way God has blessed us, or in keeping with our income (1 Cor 16:2, above). We are to give according to our ability. But how much of a proportion? How much of our income? The Bible tells us that as well:

"30'A tithe of everything from the land, whether grain from the soil or fruit from the trees, belongs to the LORD ; it is holy to the LORD . 31 If a man redeems any of his tithe, he must add a fifth of the value to it. 32 The entire tithe of the herd and flock-every tenth animal that passes under the shepherd's rod-will be holy to the LORD.'" -- Leviticus 27:30-32

"Be sure to set aside a tenth of all that your fields produce each year." -- Deuteronomy 14:22

Hey wait a minute! You say? That's 'old law'! You say? Christ fulfilled the law, we are not held to it any more, you said so yourself! You say? You are absolutely correct. Under the law of Moses the Isrealites were required to give ten percent and the law was fulfilled by Christ. Tithing, however, is not just part of the law:

" 18 Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine. He was priest of God Most High, 19 and he blessed Abram, saying,
'Blessed be Abram by God Most High,
Creator of heaven and earth.
20 And blessed be God Most High,
who delivered your enemies into your hand.'
Then Abram gave him a tenth of everything." -- Genesis 14:18-20

"20 Then Jacob made a vow, saying, 'If God will be with me and will watch over me on this journey I am taking and will give me food to eat and clothes to wear 21 so that I return safely to my father's house, then the LORD will be my God 22 and this stone that I have set up as a pillar will be God's house, and of all that you give me I will give you a tenth.'" -- Genesis 28:20-22

Both Abraham and Jacob, gave God a tenth of what they had. This was long before Moses gave the law to the Isrealites. Abraham and Jacob both knew what was right, both did what was right. Giving ten percent was and is the right thing to do. But I can't afford to give ten percent! Doesn't God say, we should give according to what we have not what we don't have? (2 Cor 8:12). Sure, and God has given you all of your income, so one tenth of that should be doable.

But what if it really isn't? Than what? Well, I can honestly say, it is doable. [editor note:  this was "at that time" not the current situation] Right now (and my wife is going to kill me for saying this), we have more going out each month than we have coming in. I do our budget weekly and the bills alone take up the entire paycheck, let alone groceries, gas and tithes. I could very easily balance my budget by eliminating tithes. But I still tithe, and even though my budget should not work, it does. Somehow there is always money for bills, for food, for clothes, for gas. Even though we have more money going out each month than we have coming in, there always seems to be money for what we need. God takes care of my family and he will take care of you as well (check out my statement of faith from May of 2002).

Ok, so does this mean we should sit down with a calculator and our pay stub, calculating our income? Do we figures in tax, social security, 401(k)? Is it gross income? net income? Well, frankly, that is where you start turning it into law. Remember, God wants us to give freely and cheerfully. I would encourage you to pray about it. Ask God what He wants you to give each week or each month, and He will tell you. He will let you know what He wants you to give and then you can give that amount each week.


More Than Just Money

In the Old Testement, the Isrealites were told to tithe from their flocks and theri farms, in the New Testament, we are told to give monitarily. In both instances we are to give from our earnings, but is giving from our earnings really enough though? Is ten percent really enough? Is that all God wants, or as followers of Him, should we give more? I think we should follow the example of Jesus:

"5Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus:
    6Who, being in very nature God,
       did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,
    7but made himself nothing,
       taking the very nature of a servant,
       being made in human likeness.
    8And being found in appearance as a man,
       he humbled himself
       and became obedient to death--
          even death on a cross!"
             -- Philippians 2:5-8

Jesus Christ, gave his all, literally. He gave 100% of who He was, not 10% of what he earned, or what He had, but 100%.! He gave up the glory of Heaven to become a man, then he gave up his life as a man.....to death on a cross! We should follow his example, by giving ourselves 100% to God:

"17As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. 'Good teacher,' he asked, 'what must I do to inherit eternal life?'
18'Why do you call me good?' Jesus answered. 'No one is good--except God alone. 19You know the commandments: 'Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your father and mother.' '
20'Teacher,' he declared, 'all these I have kept since I was a boy.'
21Jesus looked at him and loved him. 'One thing you lack,' he said. 'Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.'
22At this the man's face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth." -- Mark 10:17-22

We should dedicate, not only all we have to the Lord, but all that we are. "He really doesn't NEED our money. He is omnipotent! What He WANTS is our heart, one that longs to serve and please and love":

"4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one. 5 Love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength." -- Deuteronomy 6:4-5

" 7Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not men, 8because you know that the Lord will reward everyone for whatever good he does, whether he is slave or free." -- Ephesians 6:6-7

"23Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men, 24since you know that you will receive an inheritance from the Lord as a reward. It is the Lord Christ you are serving." -- Colossians 3:23-24

The Lord wants us to give from ourselves and of ourselves. He wants us give everything we are, both in service and in love. But how do we do this, you ask? The Lord has given us each our own gifts:
"7But to each one of us grace has been given as Christ apportioned it. 8This is why it says:
   "When he ascended on high,
       he led captives in his train
       and gave gifts to men." 9(What does "he ascended" mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions? 10He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.) 11It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, 12to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ." -- Ephesians 4:7-13

God has given us all gifts to use, in service to Him. Each of us has different gifts, but each of us have our own. It may be that you are unsure as to what gifts the Lord has blessed with you, but He has blessed you with gifts. Still, how can you serve God if you do not even know what your gifts are yet? Well, how are you living?

" 1Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God--this is your spiritual act of worship. 2Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will." -- Romans 12:1-3

" 7In everything set them an example by doing what is good. In your teaching show integrity, seriousness 8and soundness of speech that cannot be condemned, so that those who oppose you may be ashamed because they have nothing bad to say about us." -- Titus 2:7-8

" 11Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in the world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul. 12Live such good lives among the pagans that, though they accuse you of doing wrong, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us." -- 1 Peter 2:11-12

Just by living right, you are serving God. How do you act in your workplace? What kind of life do you live outside of church? You should be a reflection of God, and can do this by living for Him. This goes back to following Christ's example. If we do our best to live like He does, then people will notice the difference. They will see the way you live, the way you are, and that gives you an opening. Nobody can possibly live a perfect life, but it is possible to "live such good lives among the pagans that...they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us." By making every effort to do, by setting your heart on living to glorify God, you are giving Him your all.


CONCLUSION:

Giving to God. It is more than just money. Yes, God does want us to tithe ten percent of our income, and He promises to bless us when we give to Him. There is more though. God wants 100%. He wants us to give Him our all. Everything we are. We should spend our lives, living to serve our Father. We should not only give God His ten percent from our paycheck, but our very lives should be a reflection of Him. We can serve God by showing the world we are "children of God without fault in a crooked and depraved generation, in which [we] shine like stars in the universe" (Philippians 2:15).

http://www.uebelecentral.com/giving.htm

In Christ,
KP

We must be careful not to confuse Israel with the church. Hermeneutically they are distinct.

Now, like I mentioned, if ppl want to give MORE than a tenth, more power to them. But strictly as an institutional, Levitical thing, it belongs to the Old Testament.

(Otherwise you get television evangelists behaving like patriarchs and politicians, etc.)

I dont see a mandatory 10% in new cov scripture,but if that is what people want to give,that is between them and the Lord,as I am sure you agree.

Paul did not want people who dont have,to give.

2 Cor 8:12
For if the willingness is there, the gift is acceptable according to what one has, not according to what he does not have.

Yes,those "faith people" on tv,use the "seeds' out of 2 cor 9,to manipulate people,promising great return,it they "sow" to them!

Do you think that before a local pastor,has income from others money,he should get a day job,if the church funds are burdening others?

Paul made tents.