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Bigdog
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« on: November 04, 2009, 01:59:51 PM »

 I believe most everybody has heard of The Lukewarm Church in Laodicea.

  I certainly believe that some Christians today could certainly fit right in.
 Let me give you some examples of what I mean.
 They remain all most emotionless.
 Someone could say " I got great news, my wife is going to have a baby, this is our first one."  The response "That's nice"
Someone could sadly say in tears. " My husband passed away last night."
 The response " That's to bad." no hug or any sign of symphony. It is like no one cares, now I'm talking about some of a so-called closest friends.
Here is some true examples that happened to me.  I'm a member of a Men's Ministry called "Dock Workers" which stands for "Disciples Of Christ Kingdom" now that sounds good. Well recently I've gone through many health issues and have missed allot of services. Only one man has wrote me some emails to find out how I was doing, no phone calls nothing, a few of the services I did get to he was the only one that said hello and shook my hand. Yesterday after I had some testing done I was told my Gull Bladder had to be removed. I called the Lady in charged of our the prayer team, I sent a message telling her of my situation and asked for prayer. Her reply that's too bad. I am I being over sensitive, or is this going on all over. The Bible Talks about in the last days this will be what happens. What does any one else think?
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« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2009, 02:21:17 PM »

I'm not sure the level of emotional response a person shows to the good/bad news shared with them by someone else is what the "lukewarm-ness" of Laodicea was about.

A lot of factors impact our response to someone's news - how long we've known them, how close the relationship, our own emotional state at the time, our personality type, etc. 

Of greater concern to me is a church that appears to not have adequate care and follow up of members who suddenly "disappear" and are absent for a while.  There should be some shepherding method in place to touch base and offer ministry and assistance to folks who are suddenly off the radar.  But again, I don't think it parallels the Laodicean problem.

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« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2009, 02:21:17 PM »

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Bigdog
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« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2009, 02:28:51 PM »

I'm not sure the level of emotional response a person shows to the good/bad news shared with them by someone else is what the "lukewarm-ness" of Laodicea was about.

A lot of factors impact our response to someone's news - how long we've known them, how close the relationship, our own emotional state at the time, our personality type, etc. 

Of greater concern to me is a church that appears to not have adequate care and follow up of members who suddenly "disappear" and are absent for a while.  There should be some shepherding method in place to touch base and offer ministry and assistance to folks who are suddenly off the radar.  But again, I don't think it parallels the Laodicean problem.


Well there is many other concerns to me, I'm more refering to those who sit in the pews motionless and a general felling I get every where I go,
even with non-christians.
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« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2009, 02:28:51 PM »

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« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2009, 03:07:10 PM »

I'm going to have to agree with OldDad on this one.

Laodocea was a community that was right next to some mineral hot springs that people bathed in for medicinal purposes and next to a river that was from some snow melting in the nearby mountains. The town's water supply was piped throughout the town and was lousy. It was lukewarm and full of minerals which made most people queasy when they drank too much of the city water. (the water pipes had to be replaced regularly from the mineral deposits) The river may have been in a deep ravine and difficult to haul water out of...but it's water was much much better.

That particular river watered many farms in the region providing lots of groceries for the area...

The Hot Mineral springs were heralded and known for their healing qualities.

The city water was also known for being the worst city water of anywhere in the roman empire.
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Bigdog
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« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2009, 04:33:34 PM »

 Well if your going to go in that direction perhaps you should read all of
 Revelation 3:14-20,
Especially the verse 16 what Jesus says he will do to that church.

 I was saying that I believe that this is the Church age were in right now, and to me there is a feeling like that in today's church's but I believe at least some of us can turn that around. If we have to.
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« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2009, 05:58:53 PM »

Bigdog, I'm sorry you have (or still are) gone through those things and it sucks when it seems that no one cares. I've experienced that myself and really felt like no one cared. We all need each other and none of us has to go through life alone.


I can see how you say that some christians could fit in with the lukewarm laodicean church. However, the lukewarmness Christ was referring to is in verse 17: these are people who say they are christian and are so convinced that because they are rich, they don't need anything. So because they feel they need nothing, their 'walk' with God is anything but righteous and they don't do what He tells them to do. They could care less about anything else and yet claim to be christians.

Please know that I love you, ok? Just because people don't empathize with you doesn't automatically mean they're lukewarm christians and it'd be best to not judge them, either. People have things going on in their lives too that you may not have any knowledge about. Whatever they are going through, it can play on their nerves and in their eyes, the last thing they want is someone coming to them with his/her problems. That may seem harsh, but that's the reality of the world we live in.

So the next time you need some support, just go get it from people you know WILL support and encourage you. Even if its just one person.  Smile
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« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2009, 05:58:53 PM »

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« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2009, 06:14:32 PM »

There is another term that is more appropriate for a good number of Christians. They are numb. Events within the family and general business have a tendency to make many just plain numb. Many are worn out by what goes on in life.

I have not posted on this forum for some time. I have a loved one who had a pacemaker installed recently. There are medications and further visits to doctors. This can get old. I am helping with putting medications into those little plastic boxes that organize medications. There are so many pills. There is blood work.

Within churches, you will find a few individuals who are not necessarily lukewarm, they are just worn out. They may have circumstances in the family that leave them feeling like they do not belong in worship and do not want to drag others down. This is life. "How are you?" they ask. "We are surviving." It would be a lie to say you are fine.


I'm not sure the level of emotional response a person shows to the good/bad news shared with them by someone else is what the "lukewarm-ness" of Laodicea was about.

A lot of factors impact our response to someone's news - how long we've known them, how close the relationship, our own emotional state at the time, our personality type, etc. 

Of greater concern to me is a church that appears to not have adequate care and follow up of members who suddenly "disappear" and are absent for a while.  There should be some shepherding method in place to touch base and offer ministry and assistance to folks who are suddenly off the radar.  But again, I don't think it parallels the Laodicean problem.


Well there is many other concerns to me, I'm more refering to those who sit in the pews motionless and a general felling I get every where I go,
even with non-christians.
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« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2009, 06:23:47 PM »

There is another term that is more appropriate for a good number of Christians. They are numb. Events within the family and general business have a tendency to make many just plain numb. Many are worn out by what goes on in life.

I have not posted on this forum for some time. I have a loved one who had a pacemaker installed recently. There are medications and further visits to doctors. This can get old. I am helping with putting medications into those little plastic boxes that organize medications. There are so many pills. There is blood work.

Within churches, you will find a few individuals who are not necessarily lukewarm, they are just worn out. They may have circumstances in the family that leave them feeling like they do not belong in worship and do not want to drag others down. This is life. "How are you?" they ask. "We are surviving." It would be a lie to say you are fine.

Very true. 

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Society sees christians going to church, singing songs and clapping our hands, doing religious stuff, having christian bumper stickers on our cars and christiany T-shirts. But do they see our love for people? Do they see love in action rather than in just our words?
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« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2009, 06:39:46 PM »

Thank you for your response. A manna for you.

There is another term that is more appropriate for a good number of Christians. They are numb. Events within the family and general business have a tendency to make many just plain numb. Many are worn out by what goes on in life.

I have not posted on this forum for some time. I have a loved one who had a pacemaker installed recently. There are medications and further visits to doctors. This can get old. I am helping with putting medications into those little plastic boxes that organize medications. There are so many pills. There is blood work.

Within churches, you will find a few individuals who are not necessarily lukewarm, they are just worn out. They may have circumstances in the family that leave them feeling like they do not belong in worship and do not want to drag others down. This is life. "How are you?" they ask. "We are surviving." It would be a lie to say you are fine.

Very true. 


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« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2009, 07:58:18 PM »

Bigdog,

I am saddened you are having to endure these trials.  So, not fun! 

There are so many possible factors  here, that it is hard to come to a conclusion.  The Lord does say...

1Jn 3:16  Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
1Jn 3:17  But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18  My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth

I have had the same thing happen to me.  I have also experienced leaving a church where I was very active and no one contacted me.  And it hurt greatly!  The Lord has a very strong admonition in Ezekiel against the pastors who do not go after sheep that wander away.  I have discovered many are gifted in teaching/preaching but I have not seen many pastors with a true shepherd's (pastor's) heart.

But that is the way it is and God is allowing this to happen to you for a reason.  Painful, yes, but God wants to turn it around and use it in your life so that you will be the one who cares...you will be the one who reaches out...you will be the one who the Lord loves the hurting through.

I'm going to find a devotional from "Streams in the Desert" that is precious to me and post it for you on my devotional thread.  Please do know that God will use every bit of your suffering for His glory and to bless His precious children, if you let Him...

Shalom
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« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2009, 07:58:18 PM »

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« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2009, 08:28:33 PM »

No matter what it is called, or what "lacking" is perceived on their part, it boils down to a heart state that BD is speaking of.  And that heart state has revealed itself to be a serious abrogation of the heart of God which they claim to be one with.

Sad stuff.  Prevelant stuff.
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« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2009, 10:43:13 PM »

I believe most everybody has heard of The Lukewarm Church in Laodicea.

  I certainly believe that some Christians today could certainly fit right in.
 Let me give you some examples of what I mean.
 They remain all most emotionless.
 Someone could say " I got great news, my wife is going to have a baby, this is our first one."  The response "That's nice"
Someone could sadly say in tears. " My husband passed away last night."
 The response " That's to bad." no hug or any sign of symphony. It is like no one cares, now I'm talking about some of a so-called closest friends.
Here is some true examples that happened to me.  I'm a member of a Men's Ministry called "Dock Workers" which stands for "Disciples Of Christ Kingdom" now that sounds good. Well recently I've gone through many health issues and have missed allot of services. Only one man has wrote me some emails to find out how I was doing, no phone calls nothing, a few of the services I did get to he was the only one that said hello and shook my hand. Yesterday after I had some testing done I was told my Gull Bladder had to be removed. I called the Lady in charged of our the prayer team, I sent a message telling her of my situation and asked for prayer. Her reply that's too bad. I am I being over sensitive, or is this going on all over. The Bible Talks about in the last days this will be what happens. What does any one else think?
The lukewarmness in Laodicea isn't about emotion in church or in conversations with you, nor is that what Scripture means when talking about the last days.
The question is whether they are committed to God, not whether they like you, or react the way you think they should.
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« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2009, 11:42:32 PM »

Personally I believe it has to do with not understanding how very important it is to be IN fellowship with others.  In the USA especially we are repeatedly told that Jesus is all we need and being independent is highly prized.

In reading thru the NT I am always struck with the idea that these guys are living in a way where you'd think they believe their lives were dependent on their brothers.
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« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2009, 11:42:32 PM »

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Bigdog
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« Reply #13 on: November 05, 2009, 08:37:57 AM »

Bigdog, I'm sorry you have (or still are) gone through those things and it sucks when it seems that no one cares. I've experienced that myself and really felt like no one cared. We all need each other and none of us has to go through life alone.


I can see how you say that some christians could fit in with the lukewarm laodicean church. However, the lukewarmness Christ was referring to is in verse 17: these are people who say they are christian and are so convinced that because they are rich, they don't need anything. So because they feel they need nothing, their 'walk' with God is anything but righteous and they don't do what He tells them to do. They could care less about anything else and yet claim to be christians.

Please know that I love you, ok? Just because people don't empathize with you doesn't automatically mean they're lukewarm christians and it'd be best to not judge them, either. People have things going on in their lives too that you may not have any knowledge about. Whatever they are going through, it can play on their nerves and in their eyes, the last thing they want is someone coming to them with his/her problems. That may seem harsh, but that's the reality of the world we live in.

So the next time you need some support, just go get it from people you know WILL support and encourage you. Even if its just one person.  Smile
Thank You so much for your reply, what hurts me is I've been told I have a caring heart and I've always pushed my problems aside for them and do what I can to support them, I cry with them I pray with them and always listen to them, well the Lord developed a caring heart in me, but this is just one of the problems of that type I'll put up with, but for the Lord I'll always go the extra mile. Well I really got off track with what I said.
Thank You Again,
Brother Robert
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Bigdog
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« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2009, 08:43:40 AM »

Bigdog,

I am saddened you are having to endure these trials.  So, not fun! 

There are so many possible factors  here, that it is hard to come to a conclusion.  The Lord does say...

1Jn 3:16  Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
1Jn 3:17  But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18  My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth

I have had the same thing happen to me.  I have also experienced leaving a church where I was very active and no one contacted me.  And it hurt greatly!  The Lord has a very strong admonition in Ezekiel against the pastors who do not go after sheep that wander away.  I have discovered many are gifted in teaching/preaching but I have not seen many pastors with a true shepherd's (pastor's) heart.

But that is the way it is and God is allowing this to happen to you for a reason.  Painful, yes, but God wants to turn it around and use it in your life so that you will be the one who cares...you will be the one who reaches out...you will be the one who the Lord loves the hurting through.

I'm going to find a devotional from "Streams in the Desert" that is precious to me and post it for you on my devotional thread.  Please do know that God will use every bit of your suffering for His glory and to bless His precious children, if you let Him...

Shalom
Thank you your saying exactly what I mean.
Brother Rob
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