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21
Theology Forum / Re: Food for Thought
« Last post by Vision on Today at 02:35:11 PM »
4 days had past before The Lord created the sun, moon and stars. Th first light determines the day and night also

Genesis 1:1,3,14-19 KJV
[1] In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. [3] And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. [14] And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: [15] And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. [16] And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. [17] And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, [18] And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good. [19] And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

Just something for you to consider. If you examine Gen verse 2:1 relating to everything being created and good it will tell you that the heaven and earth was completed and the  "hosts". Hosts usually relates to angelic beings like the cherubs and so forth being depicted in masculine form. However the English translation added the pronoun them at the end of the verse which kind of taken away the question if host is specifically relating to angels. Bear in mind that these beings were also creation of YHWH not of the dust but of the substance of YHWH in giving off fire emitting light and were beautiful. I say this to point out that the first light which is not the sun when examining the verse it would appear as if the verb to exist in the Hebrew word Yehi is saying let he exist as light. Usually, in relating to a thing the verb would have been in its feminine form as Haya. This would give the assumption that the light was possibly an angel giving off a very powerful bright light. However, a professor of mind in ancient language indicate that the masculine form of the verb is applied figuratively in a grammatical rule of when applied to an unidentified third person because English translators would not have expect that a being would literally exist as light thus the translation let there be light instead of let he be light. On the counter side if YHWH literally meant to create an angel giving off light the structure of the Hebrew sentence would not have been different except that there may have been a previous or subsequent sentence to indicate that angels or and angel was made at that point of the first light. That's a speculation though. Remember Cherubium were put in place to guard the garden.

One theory could be that first light on the first day was a beautiful angel/Cherub to serve man with light etc but by the time man was made that first light was no more hence the creation of the sun on the fourth day, then came the cunning cherub like feature with wings that YHWH removed because it deceived Eve.
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Theology Forum / Re: A study on the nature of eternal life
« Last post by SwordMaster on Today at 02:34:47 PM »
TS said...

Quote
when I give a verse SM I am not using it as a stand alone verse...  I do understand that principal.  I usually give a verse and am ready to give supporting verses to which there are many that support these verses.
 

Your track record demonstrates otherwise.

Quote
I will simplify the premise of study a bit.  I consider the writer, who he is speaking to, what happened previous to this event, the tenor of the people at the time, historically.  I like to find verses that may seem to contradict the verse and a few more things...
 

So...in other words, you do not take a whole and complete biblical hermeneutic...you wing it. That is what most people do, and that is why we have a great many false teachings running rampant through the church grounds. Most do not utilize a complete hermeneutic because if they did, they could no longer hold to their bias, because the complete hermeneutic demonstrates that bias to be a false one.

Quote
nothing wrong with your method, it can work...  the main thing is studying with an open mind with no agenda to blend with but as the Spirit of God leads...

Absolutely true...however, many that claim they study with an open mind check that attitude at the door when they open the Book to study. Their idea of an open mind is, "as long as it remains within my chosen bias, my mind is open."

That seems to be the great sadness demonstrated here...
23

Michael Boldea is the grandson of a rather famous prophet of God, Dimitri Dudeman,
who was given many visions and dreams about the end-times (which are now upon us).

From Michael ...
The Bible’s intent and desire is not to get you to know more about Jesus,
but it is to get you to know more about sin!


Yes, it is wise to have knowledge of the enemy to be able to fight him successfully.
Our enemies are Satan, his demons, and our sin nature.
All of these must be overcome ... then we can be called "overcomers".

P.S. I miss my brother Jaime!


That quote is completely untrue. The Law (part of the Word) makes us realize what sinners we are for the purpose of POINTING US TO CHRIST. "The Law is our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ".

The Bible does not have an "intent and desire"--but God does.

"And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy". (Revelation 19:10)

The intent and desire of God is to save us. Jesus left his throne in glory and came to earth not to condemn the world, but so that the world could be saved through Him (John 3:17).

We do not overcome by concentrating on the enemy, his demons and our sin nature.  We overcome by "looking away unto Jesus" and realizing and claiming who we really are in Christ.

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2 Timothy 1:11-14 (KJV)
11  Whereunto I am appointed a preacher, and an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.
12  For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.
13  Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
14  That good thing which was committed unto thee keep by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.

Was Paul also persuaded that the Roman Christians ...
"became slaves of righteousness." (Rom 6:18)?

Because he was also persuaded to tell them what they should be doing ...
"so now present your members as slaves of righteousness" (Rom 6:19)

Being persuaded is akin to having an opinion.
By no means is Paul presenting this as a rock solid truth.

Generally speaking, we really need to understand the exact value and meaning of words.
The Lord has produced quite a miraculous document full of carefully-crafted words!
Such that, very often it is necessary for the Holy Spirit to reveal their meaning.
25
Theology Forum / Re: The Free Gift of Salvation
« Last post by fish153 on Today at 02:22:34 PM »
Fish,you just contradicted yourself,if you didn't choose to be in Christ then why does He have to correct you,you did nothing,made no choices didn't obey Him so how can you disobey Him?you have no responsibility for any anything so there can be no correction.You cant have freewill and yet nothing to do with your eternal life with God at the same time,it is a contradiction.Unless you believe in total predestination making it a done deal from eternity past.At any rate its still predestination if you believe you have no part in it even after you are saved,in other words you are locked in and nothing can change it,even if you don't want to go to heaven youre going anyway,anything different imposes a condition upon it,even if you say God wont let you be evil or change your mind because of His power over you,thats called irresistible grace and still imposes an interruption in freewill thus imposing a condition.So however you slice it,its still all conditional,So do you choose to be saved and continue to be or does God make you stay saved after you choose,its one or the other,either way it still remains conditional,you don't just remain in some kind of spiritual neither world. ::headscratch::

I didn't "choose" to be born into the family I was, and yet my parents corrected me.  What's your point? I am a child of God--born into his family. I make mistakes and errors and he corrects me just as a Father would.  Because I am eternally saved does not mean that God will not chastise me---of course He will---He loves me!

You chose to be spiritually reborn.

I no more chose to be spiritually born then I did to be physically born.  That is the mistake that many in this life make. They hear the call of God to repent and say "Not today. I will choose to do so in the future when I am ready".

When I was saved the next door neighbor handed me a Gospel of John to read. I wasn't looking for God in the least.  But God was looking for me!  Just as he once called out "Adam where are you?" when Adam hid in the bushes.

I did not leave a throne to seek out God--God the Son left his throne in glory to seek me out. When a person is born-again it is a gift of God---it is not something the person chose to do. How many people do you know that could say "I woke up this morning and decided I would be born-again?"

"For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us for adoption to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will— to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves". (Eph. 1:4-6)
Your text disagrees with your statement.  Believers were chosen in Christ, but not chosen to be in Christ. Huge difference.  One needs to believe, before ONE is IN Christ, repent, be baptised, thus you have regenerated the union with God that He purposed from the beginnig.  Adam was created in union with God, but chose to fall out. You were redeemed from the fall so that you could choose to get back in.  Now, you also have the same choice to remain or to leave.  The end is the same as the beginning.

Actually, Thaddeus, what you say makes no sense.  It says he "chose us in him before the creation of the world.." If I was chosen to be in Christ before the creation of the world that sounds like a plan God has had in effect for a very long time.  As I mentioned earlier I did not find God---God found me--I wasn't even looking for God at all. God found me according to his plan, called me, and he gave me eternal life.  I take no credit for anything.  ALL OF GRACE.
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http://www.foxnews.com/science/2014/04/23/secret-to-surviving-mass-extinctions-dont-be-picky-eater/
Published April 23, 2014 ∙ Discovery News

Finicky eaters usually do not survive mass extinction events, suggests a new study on prehistoric big cats.

Cougars, which will eat meat, guts, bones — the proverbial whole enchilada, survived the mass extinction event 12,000 years ago, while their finicky cousins the saber tooth cat and American lion bit the dust. The study, published in the journal Biology Letters, determined that eating habits probably saved cougars, and possibly jaguars too.
27
Theology Forum / Re: The Free Gift of Salvation
« Last post by TruthScientist on Today at 02:10:55 PM »
The seed is sown and life comes forth but not the same in every individual,some in hard ground some in thorns,some in good ground,no doubt it all comes to life,some grows while others wither while others are choked.salvation may not be an instant process for all,the bible does speak of being sanctified as a process,those being saved,those being sanctified.Those sowed in the good earth never failed of the grace of God while others did,even tho they were alive once.If ones heart is right with God he should never doubt God will carry him thru to the end,but realize there may be others of his brethren whose hearts left something to be desired when the word brought life to  them and that eternal life may grow differently in every heart.

God is no respecter of persons Dougie...  what He does for one heart is available and done for each who come to Him in sincerity. 

Getting the heart right with God is done not through a work but through understanding that only He can do it.  The pleasures of this world will cause you to halt when the gospel is preached and sin is exposed.  That is where the rubber meets the road.  Can I leave the rum demon, fornication, dependence upon illegal drugs, lying, gossip, wrath and all the things that work against the will of God...  Those things can not be done away with on our own.  They have to be committed to Him and by faith we believe He will and we live as if He has done it by submitting to the walk of the Spirit.  other wise of necessity we will suffer lose of some kind at the judgment seat of Christ. 

the question is whether one who professed salvation really is when he lives any way.  The bible says that there will be some who will be turned away and that he never knew them.  I believe that anyone who lives any way before men and God is suspect for the words "depart from me, I never knew you"...  I can not judge except what I see, not their heart.  That is God's work.  I never take it for granted when I preach that everyone is saved.  I let the Holy Spirit guide me during the invitation for salvation... 

I was riding with a friend a few days ago who has been in church for 30 years and we were sharing and I explained to him one of the methods I use during witnessing. 

I explained that I in essence ask them "if they were to die the next moment and find themselves standing before Jesus and He were to ask them why should He let them in heaven what would their answer be...  his jaws dropped and he gave me a few common answers; he has been baptised, he lives a pretty good life and a couple other...  I took him to the scriptures Romans 10:8 - 10 in particular...  and explained that this how cults end up getting people mixed up...  And I explained what those verses were saying and he confessed and I forgot to mention that he ought to be baptized since he was saved not to be saved but because he is saved... 
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http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mlb/news/20140423/wrigley-field-100th-anniversary-chicago-cubs/
Posted: Wed April 23, 2014 9:51AM; Updated: Wed April 23, 2014 3:27PM

This story appears in the Sports Illustrated Presents commemorative issue Wrigley: Celebrating 100 Years Of The Friendly Confines. Copies can be purchased by clicking here or by going through the
Sports Illustrated magazine app on the iPad, Kindle Fire, Google Play and Nook Tablet or by calling 800-274-6800. To buy other past issues of SI, go to backissues.si.com.

The great patriarch of baseball calls us home every year with benevolence, familiarity and heaps of that epoxy that binds a family: memories. Wrigley Field puts us on his knee, the summer air redolent of freshly cut grass, grilled meats, cold beer and suntan lotion, and begins again, "Did I ever tell you about that time...?" We're entranced, childlike in wonderment at the simplicity of it, losing ourselves in this comforting continuum that is baseball at the corner of Clark and Addison. Wrigley is grandfatherly, comfortable in its wrinkles and proud of its aging. Largely without filigree, accoutrement or other architectural baubles, Wrigley at 100 years old is not necessarily beautiful. Certainly it does not try for such effect.
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Theology Forum / Re: Food for Thought
« Last post by Vision on Today at 01:59:28 PM »
Where did God put the water above the firmament?
Genesis 1:6-9 KJV
[6] And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. [7] And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. [8] And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. [9] And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

The word firmament is coming from the Hebrew word Raqira with root raqa. it is a verb used to describe a blacksmith hammering out a metal to spread it or stretch it out in making a panel. The word there for means to stretch or to spread.

It is widely accepted that water totally covered the Earth during its formation or in the beginning. How would we apply this word that means spreading to the creation. We would have to view things from the Creator's perspective during the formation.

Imagine you were above the Earth looking at it when it was covered with water and observing it when land began to appear. You would have seen land rising from beneath the waters separating waters from waters and giving a running effect of land spreading out in forming the single large continent. This is description of the Hebrew word raqira.

The land became in the midst of the waters dividing it between waters. this is a continent in the middle of the ocean when land appeared. The Genesis verse left out the word that meant between and just used divide.

Also, below the land form is water and above the land form is the source of providing water. Bear in mind that the Hebrew word for water is mayim and the sky/heaven is shamayim meaning the source providing water. in this sense water is below the spreading land form(raqira) and above the spreading land form (raqira)

Also, the high parts(mountains) of the land form is between heaven and Earth when looking from the foot of a mountain you would call the top is in heaven and call it heaven.

The Hebrew symbol for raqa is indicating seeing the horizon of the sun from the top as resh means head or top, ayin is to see, and the qaf is a sun on the horizon.
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http://gma.yahoo.com/minnesota-man-accused-murdering-teens-entered-home-131438361--abc-news-topstories.html
By GIO BENITEZ | Good Morning America – Tue, Apr 22, 2014 9:23 AM EDT

The trial against a 65-year-old man accused of murdering two teens who entered his home is underway in Minnesota, stirring debate about how far people can go in defending their homes.

Byron Smith, a retired security engineer for the U.S. Department of State, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of cousins Nick Brady, 17, and Haile Kifer, 16, on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The killings rocked the small city of Little Falls.

Prosecutors say Smith was sitting in his basement when he heard a window breaking upstairs. When Brady started walking down the basement stairs, Smith shot him twice.
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