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Are you trying to tell us that SDA's are not proselytizing as they once did so they are not baptizing and accepting members in ever increasing numbers?

The SDA denomination likes to broadcast that they are the fastest growing protestant denomination in the world.....  even though almost 50% of their converts leave the denomination every year...

That means that every one of those new members have vowed to accept the MINISTRY of Ellen White as inspired by God in the same way the prophets of the Bible times were inspired prophets.

I don’t know the numbers involved, nor do I care. Quality ranks high above quantity. Quantity means nothing, save to those who lean on numbers over truth.

I’m not sure where you get your info., nor do I concern myself with such things. Perhaps you make such up as you go along. You are free of course to share the source of your statistics. Though it would mean little to me one way or another.

If so many people are accepting EGW as a prophet of God and then changing their minds, apparently they didn’t put enough time or effort into their investigation in the first place. Of course such people changing their minds is no proof at all, that what they once accepted as truth but then rejected, is therefore not the truth. The Lord Jesus Christ addressed the same problem concerning His own teachings.

Mt 13:1The same day went Jesus out of the house, and sat by the sea side. 2 And great multitudes were gathered together unto him, so that he went into a ship, and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the shore. 3 And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow; 4 And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up: 5 Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth: 6 And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away. 7 And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them: 8 But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold. 9 Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. 10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. …………
18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower. 19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side. 20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; 21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended. 22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful. 23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
General Discussion Forum / Re: If God is loving then why.....
« Last post by 4WD on Today at 11:47:07 AM »
The question was:
If God knows the future, and if God is such a loving God, then why would He make people that He knew ahead of time would choose not to follow Him, and go to hell?
God did not make people individually, physically in the flesh.  He created of system of procreation through which we were all brought into this world.  In addition, God made us in His image by giving/making/forming in each of us, individually, our own spirits. And in doing that He gave each of us the free will to choose.  He clearly desires a body of believing people who have freely, based upon their own decision, chosen love Him, obey him as best they can and want to be with Him.  That can't happen unless He also permits people to not choose Him. Were that not the case, then there is no answer to the question.
General Discussion Forum / Re: If God is loving then why.....
« Last post by NorrinRadd on Today at 11:43:41 AM »
The same reason God does everything.  For His glory.  Not a satisfying answer, but it's true.

Does Scripture ever actually say that anywhere?
Why don't you attend “regularly”?

Because the local churches close by preach sermons I could hear at any Sunday keeping church much closer down the street. Our prophetic distinctness is disappearing along with certain aspects of doctrinal distinctness. We exist to give the final warning of the three angels messages of Revelation chapter 14 to this world, accompanied by correct bible doctrine combining to rightly represent the character of God to humanity that all may be decided when Christ returns. The health message also being part of the same allowing for optimal physical and mental health to help correctly perceive and relate to others the true character of God during this critical time of earths history as the coming of Christ ever approaches sooner.

The three angels messages and certain defining doctrines are no longer even addressed from the pulpits of many SDA churches anymore, apart from perhaps being mentioned or referred to on occasion. It’s been about ten years since any real examination or discussion of such has emanated from the pulpit of the church I used to attend. I know this, because my wife still attends and we discuss the same. Our Pastors stand right in front of a depiction of the three angels of Revelation every Sabbath and preach, but have spoken nothing of them for a decade now. Meanwhile, one event after another in relation to these prophecies has been transpiring in front of all eyes. After several years of this and other developments along the same lines, I stopped attending.

The SDA church is headed down the same road most other once Protestant denominations have headed down. They first deemphasize biblical prophecy and the views of the reformers themselves concerning the church of Rome, then abandon it altogether as a relic of the past. then begin to head down the road back to Rome. I decided I would not sit in a pew and be part of the apostasy.

Making the assertions you have shows you haven't kept up with what is happening in the denomination.

As I said, my wife and other family members still attend regularly. I am aware of that described above, and quite a bit more happening within the denomination. Even EGW predicted that the church would appear to fall. In any case, apart from a few ministries, the denomination certainly is not giving the three angels messages the time and importance they require near the end of this earth’s history. EGW herself had quite a bit to say about the importance of giving these messages.

Yes, the vows to accept Ellen as a prophet are for those who wish to be an SDA.

In order to join the SDA, the person  must accept Ellen and her ministry with the prophetic status assigned by those vows.

Yea that makes sense. If you believe someone to be a prophet with a message for the final generations of this world, and your church is supposed to be giving that message, then it would be a pretty good idea to have everyone whose going to be a member of your church on the same page concerning the messenger and their message. This is just common sense. Nevertheless, the denomination is not heeding her advice concerning the giving of the three angels messages. To the contrary, they are slipping into an unbalanced position they began to once before under misguided leadership which EGW addressed at the time. Making the health message of more importance than the three angels messages. So while they are magnifying one aspect of her writings, they are neglecting others of equal or greater significance.

Ellen’s writings are being promoted more than ever within the SDA denomination

Not so. I know from first hand experience, and the continued witness of family members still regularly attending. 

Ellen’s writings are being used as much as ever - with modifications to hide the authorship of Ellen -- for their evangelism

Some have always done that, afraid that people already prejudiced against her won’t read or listen. Others, most I would say do not.

Ellen’s messages are the infallible interpreter of scripture for SDA's and the corrector of errors in interpretation of the Scriptures.

The scriptures themselves are the final authority of any issue as Ellen White herself testified many times over. This you know because I have already shared many quotes of her’s with you regarding the same in the past. I can share them again if you like, though I know you care not. You are interested in accusing, but not defending your positions once they have been exposed for the error which they are. Nevertheless, we can go through this again if you wish. 

The ability to correct inaccurate interpretation of scriptures also gives the ability to determine what is inaccurate about the interpretation done by others.


As delegates to the 2015 General Conference Session in San Antonio, Texas, we express our deep gratitude to God for the continuing presence of the various spiritual gifts among His people (1 Cor 12:4-11; Eph 4:11-14), and particularly for the prophetic guidance we have received through the life and ministry of Ellen G White (1827-1915). 

On the centennial of her death, we rejoice that her writings have been made available around the globe in many languages and in a variety of printed and electronic formats. We reaffirm our conviction that her writings are divinely inspired, truly Christ-centered, and Bible-based. Rather than replacing the Bible, they uplift the normative character of Scripture and correct inaccurate interpretations of it derived from tradition, human reason, personal experience, and modern culture.

We commit ourselves to study the writings of Ellen G White prayerfully and with hearts willing to follow the counsels and instructions we find there. Whether individually, in the family, in small groups, in the classroom, or in the church, a combined study of the Bible and her writings provide a transforming and faith-uplifting experience. We encourage the continued development of both worldwide and local strategies to foster the circulation of her writings inside and outside the church. The study of these writings is a powerful means to strengthen and prepare His people for the glorious appearing of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Anyone who accepts the writings of Ellen White or any other person for that matter, without comparing them with scripture for correctness and authenticity, is on their own. They will not be commended by God for such. So says scripture itself, so says Ellen White herself, and so say I myself.
My oldest son is going to enter middle school and I am looking for great books for him.  Please let me know what books your kids (boys or girls) like for middle school and high school. 
Parenting and Family Life Forum / Good books for Elementary Age kids?
« Last post by tifischer on Today at 11:38:49 AM »
Please let me know what books your children like to read for elementary school ages.  I am trying to find great books for my three kids.  My son really enjoyed the Spirit Fighter by Jerel Law.  God bless!
Parenting and Family Life Forum / Good books for Preschoolers?
« Last post by tifischer on Today at 11:36:05 AM »
What books do you and your preschoolers like to read?  We just started reading Snuggle Time Psalms that we got from the Christian Book Fair and love reading it with my children!  Please share your favorites too.

God bless!
General Discussion Forum / Re: If God is loving then why.....
« Last post by Jason_NC on Today at 11:28:30 AM »
The same reason God does everything.  For His glory.  Not a satisfying answer, but it's true.
General Discussion Forum / Re: Wow, our Bible study group
« Last post by chosenone on Today at 11:27:59 AM »
You are so lucky.
The last small group I attended were living corpses. Nobody said anything.

I know, this is an awesome group.  I have to drive 20 minutes out of town but it's worth it.

We get people like that here on this forum from to time who also think they are sinless and above reproach. You can't reason with them at all.
Paul says that things must be done decently and in order, and I am sure that applies to small groups as well as larger ones.
What may happen here is that others may start leaving the group so you may have to act. I would ask someone to talk to her about what is and isn't acceptable and that she must treat others with respect. If she carries on being very disruptive and is making the others really upset and causing them to leave, you may need to ask her to leave.
Has she been to other groups in your church before yours? 
We had a lady at our last church who would do the 'taking for ages about herself' thing. She would literally take over and would go on for the whole of the groups time if you let her. I would think 'how can she think she is is so important that we should all have to listen to her talk for an hour or more' I can only think that such people are narcissistic and don't even realise that others may not be interested or may be totally bored.

I talked to the group leader yesterday and we both agreed that we think this is a "need to prove she's worth something" issue. I knew there was some abuse in her history but it turns out there was quite a bit of other nasty stuff that I didn't know about. The leader is going to talk to her today .  Fortunately our main core is tightly knit from a small well established church so it's likely that they will individually pull her aside if things don't change in good time.  They'll also keep watch that the "young ones" don't wander off.  It's a really awesome group! :)

Dont let her use that as an excuse to act badly though. I know loads of people with serious issues/abuse in their past who act properly and respectfully. Maybe she has never had to keep to boundaries before, so now is a good time to start

We are blessed to have many really good local fellowship groups in our church. I have also had many good groups in past churches.
We did have an older lady in one who no other group in the church wanted because of her past bad behaviour.She was never that bad when I was there, but I know she did upset a lot of people.
Movie Reviews Forum / Re: The Shack
« Last post by Rella on Today at 11:27:30 AM »
I read the Shack and enjoyed it, though I know people who do believe it was a real story.

The book was called fiction and for me I read it just like the Left Behind series... for entertainment but not real guidance....

I do not plan to see the movie... though when it come on TV I will.
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