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91
Churches of Christ Forum / Immortality Of The Soul
« Last post by Tyler on Yesterday at 09:26:16 AM »
Does the church of Christ teach the immortality of the soul?   
I was asked this by a Jehovah Witness who likes to bend my ear. 
One has to be careful when answering this question to a JW or they will eat your lunch on the soul of man.  I knew what he believed, but not sure how to answer without getting caught up in Greek, "innate immortality" and their teaching of  "Instant Annihilation."

Augustine, a Neo-Platonist, introduced innate immortality into the Catholic Church which has become dogma for Protestantism.  Meaning: the soul of you and I eternally existed in the past as well as in the future, or by its very nature,-- cannot NOT exist. 
Augustine taught the soul existed before it took on a human body; and exists while in the human body and post existence>> or, shall always exist. The doctrine of predestination is attached to this dogma.
The JW's will tell you that they do not "teach predestination"---but in theory they do.

Innate immorality would mean that the soul/spirit would have its own character.
I knew from study that the JW's did not teach this, but a Trojan horse that leads into a discussion of a no hell.
Does the Bible teach innate immortality?  Yes ---but NOT Greek immortality.
The Bible teaches that God alone is immortal. By His very nature, God cannot NOT exist. God derives His existence by His very nature. "I Am that I AM."  ( Read 1 Timothy 6:16)

I turned the tables on my JW friend by asking >>Did not Paul write in 1 Corinthians that Jesus brought immorality and life by the Gospel?  When God "breathed" into the nostrils of Adam was Adam's life not from God? If so, then man is a derivative of God,  Man's life as all life comes from God? Jesus said to man, "I came that you might have life"  (John 10:10).

Therefore, the human soul can be destroyed  because there was a time the human soul did not exist. Whether the living soul lives or not>>depends upon the will of God.  What we have here is an intelligent God that created everything from nothing. (Psalms 33:6)

92
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by LexKnight on Yesterday at 09:20:09 AM »
Lex, in my opinion and many others, the 14th amendment doesn't need to be clarified. It ahould mean what the people that drafted it said it meant. It was to ensure that babies of slaves would be citizens. It has been misapplied for decades. It never was meant to foster the "anchor baby" conundrum that really isn't a conundrum. That stance will ensure vietually Ero Hispanic vote and no chance of getting elected, but it is the correct stance.

It wouldn't be that difficult to put in an asterick that says national born citizens means babies who are born in the nation by legal citizens. It is taken advantage of a lot, and I'm really not against changing that loophole.
93
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by Jaime on Yesterday at 09:12:37 AM »
Lex, in my opinion and many others, the 14th amendment doesn't need to be clarified. It ahould mean what the people that drafted it said it meant. It was to ensure that babies of slaves would be citizens. It has been misapplied for decades. It never was meant to foster the "anchor baby" conundrum that really isn't a conundrum. That stance will ensure virtually zero Hispanic vote and no chance of getting elected, but it is the correct stance.
94
General Discussion Forum / Re: Curious to know how you came to know God
« Last post by Jd34 on Yesterday at 09:09:33 AM »
Why would you assume that?
Well, do you believe in unconditional election of grace?

I do. God himself made us His children . He made us for His glory and He has a purpose and a plan for every one of us.  ::bowing::
95
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by TruthScientist on Yesterday at 08:55:02 AM »
I agree I don't see why the Church wouldn't be here (if anything they need to be), but we digress...

Even if Trump is elected, and so far he seems to be an unstoppable force so it's a chance, I doubt he'll be enough to change things. The Oval Office is a pretty powerful throne, but the Constitution acknowledge Congress with much more power, and they're practically useless. What comes for this nation will come for this nation, and to no offense to Mr. Trump, as far as I know he hasn't been anointed to deviate the nation from what's coming. But time will tell.

One thing is for sure, though. The nation cannot expect to be in the Lord's favor unless they change a LOT, and if they don't it will fall.

we are falling, and fast...  many of us don't like to hear that... but it is like a cancer diagnosis, hear is and ignore it, then except GOD works a miracle it will only get worse...

I came to learn a while ago that I want the truth regardless of what comes with it...  and I will not lie to myself nor you...

the fact that believers are willing to hail a man who has said that he had not asked GOD for forgiveness and some have defended him by saying that he goes to church on holidays and every once in a while speaks to the depth of where we are...

The thing is, though, you're focused on his spiritual state. I don't believe he is a man of God and if he is a believer, no way do I respect him enough for the Oval Office. If anything, if Ben Carson comes out and say he stands on the principles of the Lord, I would register and vote for him.

Rather... it's the fact that he's an anti-politician politician.

Here are facts about Trump that makes me like him above the rest (except for Carson).

He called it when he said we were basing our economy too much on China. Crap happened there, and the Dow went down up to 1100 points, a major drop.He saw it and he called it.

He has a stance on dealing with immigration and, despite receiving a lot of hate, stands on it and refuse to compromise. I happen to agree with his plan, including editing the 14th amendment to give it clarity and prevent further loopholes.

He speaks in a crude manner (like regular joes), and in a politically incorrect way (like regular joes). He's not afraid to call people out by name, he isn't afraid to speak his mind in a lot of ways. I'm not saying a lot of what he says is wise, but that resonates with people because we as a nation are starting to see that Political Correctness is bs. Trump will call leadership stupid, he will say Bush and Clinton is in the pocket of those who lend to their campaign, he will actually go so far to call someone a bimbo (and she could very well be to be honest, but I don't know). Is it truly any wonder why he keeps growing? People like his honesty and crudeness, they like the fact that, and I cannot say this enough, he is not a politician.

For that reason I like him too. Not so much as a worthy candidate of the Presidency (though in some aspects, especially with immigration and the economy, he could be), but the fact that he's pissing DC off (including Fox News) yet still growing in support.

And the fact that he doesn't need anyone to fund his campaign, so he's in no one's pocket.


Do you see why people like him?

yep and much of it is a sad commentary...  but I do understand the anxiety some feel but I do not believe that a trump will help by just being a verbal abuser.  extremists are not easy to deal with and being inflexible is dangerous...  he does not have the qualities to lead but is rattling the cage... calling other politicians whom he has to work with is not a wise thing to do...

ever heard of playing to the crowd...
96
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by LexKnight on Yesterday at 08:46:02 AM »
Google #TrumpBible  There were a few comments in there that were funny.

"I'm not saying Jesus wasn't born in Bethlehem. I'm just saying show me the birth certificate." #trumpbible

That's the one that got me.
97
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by Texas Conservative on Yesterday at 08:28:13 AM »
Google #TrumpBible  There were a few comments in there that were funny.
98
Theology Forum / Re: the washing of regeneration
« Last post by TruthBeTold on Yesterday at 08:26:54 AM »
Romans 4 : 3-8
2 Corinthians 5:19


Romans 4:3-8King James Version (KJV)

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without work7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.


This is not a salvation type righteousness, else Abraham didn't need Jesus(and only needed faith in God) and we all know it was impossible to go to heaven without Jesus.  The lord does not impute sin AT THE END to those who obey and believe. obviously sin is still imputed since people still die and the wages of sin is death. this is at the resurrection.


2 Thessalonians 1:7-8King James Version (KJV)

7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

taking vengence on those that know not God (belief) and obey not the gospel.


1 John 3:24King James Version (KJV)
24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

recieving the holy ghost is something that requires both belief and obedience(or at start repentance)


Acts 5:32King James Version (KJV)
32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.


As far as Corinthians Paul laid down the foundations before making that statement


2 Corinthians 5:9-21King James Version (KJV)

9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.12 For we commend not ourselves again unto you, but give you occasion to glory on our behalf, that ye may have somewhat to answer them which glory in appearance, and not in heart.13 For whether we be beside ourselves, it is to God: or whether we be sober, it is for your cause.14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.



2 Peter 2:20-22King James Version (KJV)

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.


these are clearly people who believed and turned BACK in which he is basically saying it would have been better had they not believed at all

1 John 5:3King James Version (KJV)
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
99
Christian Politics Forum / Re: Consolidated Donald Trump Thread
« Last post by LexKnight on Yesterday at 08:21:50 AM »
I agree I don't see why the Church wouldn't be here (if anything they need to be), but we digress...

Even if Trump is elected, and so far he seems to be an unstoppable force so it's a chance, I doubt he'll be enough to change things. The Oval Office is a pretty powerful throne, but the Constitution acknowledge Congress with much more power, and they're practically useless. What comes for this nation will come for this nation, and to no offense to Mr. Trump, as far as I know he hasn't been anointed to deviate the nation from what's coming. But time will tell.

One thing is for sure, though. The nation cannot expect to be in the Lord's favor unless they change a LOT, and if they don't it will fall.

we are falling, and fast...  many of us don't like to hear that... but it is like a cancer diagnosis, hear is and ignore it, then except GOD works a miracle it will only get worse...

I came to learn a while ago that I want the truth regardless of what comes with it...  and I will not lie to myself nor you...

the fact that believers are willing to hail a man who has said that he had not asked GOD for forgiveness and some have defended him by saying that he goes to church on holidays and every once in a while speaks to the depth of where we are...

The thing is, though, you're focused on his spiritual state. I don't believe he is a man of God and if he is a believer, no way do I respect him enough for the Oval Office. If anything, if Ben Carson comes out and say he stands on the principles of the Lord, I would register and vote for him.

Rather... it's the fact that he's an anti-politician politician.

Here are facts about Trump that makes me like him above the rest (except for Carson).

He called it when he said we were basing our economy too much on China. Crap happened there, and the Dow went down up to 1100 points, a major drop.He saw it and he called it.

He has a stance on dealing with immigration and, despite receiving a lot of hate, stands on it and refuse to compromise. I happen to agree with his plan, including editing the 14th amendment to give it clarity and prevent further loopholes.

He speaks in a crude manner (like regular joes), and in a politically incorrect way (like regular joes). He's not afraid to call people out by name, he isn't afraid to speak his mind in a lot of ways. I'm not saying a lot of what he says is wise, but that resonates with people because we as a nation are starting to see that Political Correctness is bs. Trump will call leadership stupid, he will say Bush and Clinton is in the pocket of those who lend to their campaign, he will actually go so far to call someone a bimbo (and she could very well be to be honest, but I don't know). Is it truly any wonder why he keeps growing? People like his honesty and crudeness, they like the fact that, and I cannot say this enough, he is not a politician.

For that reason I like him too. Not so much as a worthy candidate of the Presidency (though in some aspects, especially with immigration and the economy, he could be), but the fact that he's pissing DC off (including Fox News) yet still growing in support.

And the fact that he doesn't need anyone to fund his campaign, so he's in no one's pocket.


Do you see why people like him?
100
Theology Forum / Re: the washing of regeneration
« Last post by ljs on Yesterday at 07:26:14 AM »
Romans 4 : 3-8
2 Corinthians 5:19
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