I don't get it.

[MyrtleBeach]

Why do some people not believe? 

[yogi bear]

I would say that there is a number of reasons. The display of religious differences is one. Too many different views to choose from it is complicated for most. They see it as if Gods children can't agree on  the answers then they can't see God as being the one in lead.

Then some are just to rapped up in the world and don't want to give it up.
The list could go on and on.

[janine]

Most people who don't believe, aren't unbelievers because they have thought it out carefully and examined the evidence and chosen not to believe.  Most people who don't believe, don't believe out of laziness or out of drifting along the path of least resistance.

Actually, most believers sort of drift into it too. 

People are pretty much creatures of habit.

[memmy]

People are pretty much creatures of habit.

True Janine, and some of them are pretty much just habitual creatures too.  

[twd]

Many of the unbelievers I know are unbelievers because they think smart people are unbelievers.  It's may be another form of that laziness Janine mentioned, or it may be peer pressure.  Probably both.

Some others I know are unbelievers in reaction to people like Pat Robertson.  Not really rational, but certainly not surprising.

[PEGGY JOYCE]

And you know some of the unbelievers I know say at one time they believed but God didn't save someone they loved when they were ill, and let them die,   and they just can't believe that God would be like that and let so and so die,  because he or she was such a good person.

It is so hard to explain to them that God's ways are not ours, and we can't always see why He does what He does.   And that death is a result of sin in this world, not necessarily their loved ones sin but sin in general.   Satan is very active in this world and we have to cope with him daily.

Of course, people who say they believe can't understand when someone they love dies, and they have prayed sincerely and over and over for that person to live.    But it is so sad that you can't reach them.   

[MyrtleBeach]

PEGGY JOYCE,  he only didn't save them because the safest place they could be was heaven. If it's your time, he'll tell your guardian Angel not to save you so you can be safe in heaven. 

  American Heart forever   

[MyrtleBeach]

twd, I am very smart and I believe. It doesn't matter how smart you are and I do not see how they think that. 

  ::holingupflag::  American Heart forever

  AMDG 

[twd]

MyrtleBeach,
Agreed.  Yet, people do think that way.

[admin]

Albert Einstein believed. His IQ was 180 something if I remember correctly.

[janine]

What was that he said -- "God doesn't play dice with the universe"?

[twd]

Isaac Newton believed as well.  I'm not claiming it's a good argument, I'm just pointing out that it's one many people use.

I'm a programmer, and as such, all the people I regularly work with are college graduates, and many have advanced degrees.  I am a Christian, as are several of my colleagues.  But there are several others who essentially adhere to the (nonsensical) belief that intelligent people are athiests or agnostics, and so they must be too.

I've had long discussions about it with one, who expressed frank surprise that, intelligent and educated as I am, I could possibly be a believer.  I don't fit his stereotype of the dim witted, ignorant religious nut.  Yet, he still holds to his atheism, without giving me any stronger argument than that smart people are atheists.

Rational?  No.  But people aren't always rational, even smart ones.

[Jimbob]

The last couple popes I recall were certainly no dunces, either, so far as intelligence goes.  Satan knows how to appeal to our pride, and encouraging us to feel smugly intelligent for our unbelief is an all too effective tool of his.

[twd]

Yep.

[marc]

I've had long discussions about it with one, who expressed frank surprise that, intelligent and educated as I am, I could possibly be a believer.  I don't fit his stereotype of the dim witted, ignorant religious nut.  Yet, he still holds to his atheism, without giving me any stronger argument than that smart people are atheists.

Rational?  No.  But people aren't always rational, even smart ones.

I remember hearing about a conversation that Cardinal O'Connor had with his friend Carl Sagan in which Sagan said something to the effect of, "I don't understand how a man as intelligent as you are believes in God."  The Cardinal, of course, responded, "and I don't understand how a man as intelligent as you does not."

It seems to me that sometimes we choose the realm we want to live in among the physical, mental, and spiritual.  A person who relies on their mental abilities to the extent that they discount the spiritual is akin to the "religious fanatic" who lives in the spiritual world to the point that he loses touch with the physical world around him.

I believe that if we keep the balance, we will believe in God.

[WileyClarkson]

I have heard from aethiests numerous times why they don't believe.  One thing that I have heard numerous times is that there is no empirical evidence that can show them that God is real.  Those who have said this are usually of a modern scientific thinking on everything and demand hard evidence on just about everything.  They don't seem to grasp the idea of faith, which is exactly what they use when looking at the evolutionary tree and say they have proved man evolved from a supposed puddle of the basic organic building blocks of life over several billion years.  With all its many holes and supposed paths over the years, that is more representative of emperical evidence to them than looking around in nature or into the nighttime sky and seeing everything as being made by a supreme being.

[memmy]

With all its many holes and supposed paths over the years, that is more representative of emperical evidence to them than looking around in nature or into the nighttime sky and seeing everything as being made by a supreme being.

Yeah, it just seems so amazing that someone can not see that as perfect as nature is, sky, the clouds, the sun, the birds, bees, and the most amazing of all amazing, the human body and the way it is put together, not only just the organs, but the awesomely complex electrical system it is run by.

Every cell, every molecule perfected crafted to run and fire up the energy it does, to keep it running smoothly. Our organ and gland system, all in allignment to run as a ticking clock, even better running, when we keep it in tune, well oiled, and the charger charged up.

Our God is just an incredible amazing God!  

I find it sad who don't see Him as that. They seem to really miss out on the Joy of life we were meant to have when we were first put in the garden.

The condition we are in without our creator, and the life He has planned for each of us, by His Son's sacrifice of life on earth, and the Hope He gave us through that act of undying love, how can it be?  

Amazing.  

Memmy

[BH]

You're not going to trick me into getting into this.  My stockpile of manna has gotten pretty high, and I don't want to lose any.

[memmy]

That's ok, Barry, some strange way mine was at 19, and now down to 8.

It doesn't hurt that bad.  

I wonder   .

Not quite sure this topic was about, or aimed at you though.

Memmy

[Lee Freeman]

As has been said, Christianity is not a religion for dummies (in spite of the book by the same name) which asks you to check your brain at the door

Many people put more real rational thought into buying a home or a used car than they do in picking a belief system/religion/philosophy. No sane person would buy a used car on "faith alone." You'd get in it, pop the hood, kick the tires, check the mileage, take it for a test drive, etc. In other words, you'd investigate the claims made for the car by the salesman before you decided to buy it. Why should adopting a religious belief be any different?

Pax.

[Follower the Heaven Bound]

They dont believe because they need "proof" whatever that is.

"Blessed are ye who have not seen, yet still believe."

[Marzipan]

I think society in general (at least in a lot of western cultures, if not others) has come to lack an appreciation about their past and a seriousness about their future. I almost wish I could say that we have an excuse for our unbelief because of the times we live in, but we know that there has always been unbelief.
And we have in Romans: "For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. "
The root cause has to be something that affects every person in every place and in every era.
Would it make sense to say that a person's unbelief is actually just a symptom of very serious denial? That some awareness of the truth is present (because "His eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen.... so that we are without excuse") in every person, but is basically shoved away out of pride, and denied out of a fearful realization of what they have rejected?

Have I gotten in over my head already?
Probably.

[James Rondon]

Why do some people not believe? 

Another question... why do some people believe?

[marc]

That's ok, Barry, some strange way mine was at 19, and now down to 8.

It doesn't hurt that bad.  

I wonder   .

Not quite sure this topic was about, or aimed at you though.

Memmy

Well, my manna has disappeared completely!     Oh, wait....

[Shadow]

I think what's even worse than not believing is putting that belief into something else, into other "gods".  In some ways I think it would be better for the individual to just not believe in any god at all, whatsoever, then to believe in and put all their faith and trust into some make believe, mythological god or goddess.  That's like giving God the finger as far as I'm conserned.

[James Rondon]

I wonder if one can truly be said to not believe in any god... When someone claims to believe in no god at all, they normally look at themselves, and more particularly "self" as a "god".

[yogi bear]

I don't think that honestly anyone can say that they don't believe there could be a God but more accurately they don't want to believe there is. It is easier to feel you don't have to answer to God than to admit there is God and he will judge one in the way they live. But I am sure that everyone has heard of God. I even will go as far to say that I feel that if they would be honest they do believe that there is a strong possibility that there is God.

[James Rondon]

Well, the Scripture says "the fool hath said in his heart there is no God"... It doesn't say that he or she really believes it.

[BH]

Why do some people not believe? 

Because they see no reason why they should.

[BH]

Then some are just to rapped up in the world and don't want to give it up.

Talking about invalidation techniques.  I could turn around and say that people believe because they are weakminded and cowardly.

I am NOT saying that.  I am just saying that to say such is as invalidating as what bvaug said.

[BH]

Most people who don't believe, aren't unbelievers because they have thought it out carefully and examined the evidence and chosen not to believe.  Most people who don't believe, don't believe out of laziness or out of drifting along the path of least resistance.

Actually, most believers sort of drift into it too. 

People are pretty much creatures of habit.

I believe I have examined enough evidence to justify the conclusion I have formed.

[BH]

Many of the unbelievers I know are unbelievers because they think smart people are unbelievers.  It's may be another form of that laziness Janine mentioned, or it may be peer pressure.  Probably both.

Some others I know are unbelievers in reaction to people like Pat Robertson.  Not really rational, but certainly not surprising.

I'm definitely smart.

However, there are a lot of folks over at the Infidel Board I would classify as fools.

[BH]

As has been said, Christianity is not a religion for dummies (in spite of the book by the same name) which asks you to check your brain at the door

Many people put more real rational thought into buying a home or a used car than they do in picking a belief system/religion/philosophy. No sane person would buy a used car on "faith alone." You'd get in it, pop the hood, kick the tires, check the mileage, take it for a test drive, etc. In other words, you'd investigate the claims made for the car by the salesman before you decided to buy it. Why should adopting a religious belief be any different?

Pax.

The BIble says that greedy people are subject ot excommunication from the church.  Now, go, define just what greed is in an absolute objective unchallengeable way.


If a used car you speak of is broken down, I can see it and know it.  Define greed using the Bible as your reference material in such a way to where I can identify it when I see it like I can a broken down car.  *No room for opinion either.

[yogi bear]

Then some are just to rapped up in the world and don't want to give it up.

Talking about invalidation techniques.  I could turn around and say that people believe because they are weakminded and cowardly.

I am NOT saying that.  I am just saying that to say such is as invalidating as what bvaug said.

Oh Barry come on buddy you know that there is just as much a chance that God is real as there is that he is not. Both are a faith issue. I have faith that he is who he said and you have faith that he isn't. If I am right Then Praise God I will see him face to face and live in joy in his presence. If you are right then it doesn't matter anyway. Since it is as we know a matter of faith either way then I find more joy in accepting that he is who he said he was. I feel there is enough history and findings to support his claims.

Barry whether you will ever admit it or not you don't know 100% either way. You have read enough of his word and know enough to think about it. That my friend is the spirit trying to reach you. God is reaching out for you just as he promised. You are just not allowing him to come in. You chose your doubt as a comfort zone but if you would just allow him in you would find much more joy in your spiritual side.

There is not one soul here on earth that the spirit has not tried to reach. The spirit has made god known to all. Everyone responds to the Spirit differently. Some just blow him off and some just give a casual notice and some full accepts the Spirits work in their lives. All have been somewhat told of God. Just let the Spirit work in you to soften your heart and you will see things you can not see. You will understand things you do not understand. Have the Faith in God and don't fight his reaching out and you will receive blessing. You may never fully understand everything about God because there is just more than we as earthling can understand of the spiritual world but when we get there it will all be so simple .

Well enough rambling just open up your heart and let God touch your intermost being and you will find joy in him.

[James Rondon]

there is just as much a chance that God is real as there is that he is not.

There is a 100% chance that God is real. There is a 0% chance that He is not.