Author Topic: Vineyard churches (Some questions)  (Read 6920 times)

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Lively Stone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #105 on: Sun Aug 05, 2012 - 21:43:29 »
You appear to be avoiding my question.You claim to know all about the vineyard church but have you even been to one?. Have you even been filled with the spirit and been used in the spiritual gifts?Are you against the spiritual gifts such as tongues and prophecy?
<My vineyard church was nothing like you describe. My son was converted at a vineyard church and is an amazing man of God.
All you know is what you have read apparently. ::shrug::


No not avoiding I just don't live online.... I gave My story about Rodney Howard browne in this Post I believe.... When the spirit came to make me laugh I knew it was a devil....

Maybe it was, and maybe it wasn't.

Quote
Since mr browne is a Vineyard man I believe I have knowledge about holylaughter..

Browne is not Vineyard. You have no knowledge of the manifestation of the Spirit because you have disdain for it.

Quote
No where did I say all vineyard churches do this, but these manifestations ARE a product of the Vineyard churches and the leaders who started them!

No they aren't.

Quote
Therefore it's not of God....

No matter how much you love your church
or the pastor or friends orhow good it makes you feel...

Were suppose to test the spirits

and we do this by finding it in scripture.... If we can't then we should know it's not of God!

When it has happened to me, it has passed the test. When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.

Offline fenton

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #106 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:15:31 »
when you look for satan in everything, you will find him in everything.....

Offline fenton

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #107 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:25:44 »
i wonder if crying uncontrollably is of satan....  ::pondering::  ::shrug::   


 ::frown::   ::frown:: 
 

Offline DaveW

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #108 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:28:34 »
When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.
So explain this passage from Job 1 then:

6 Now it happened on the day when God’s sons came to present themselves before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”
Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “From going back and forth in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Job? For there is none like him in the earth, a blameless and an upright man, one who fears God, and turns away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing?
10 Haven’t you made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will renounce you to your face.”
12 The LORD said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only on himself don’t put forth your hand.”

Rev 12.10 describes the devil's CURRENT job:

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

Not from somewhere else but right "before God."  That does not sound "allegic" to me.

Offline fenton

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #109 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:31:48 »
When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.
So explain this passage from Job 1 then:

6 Now it happened on the day when God’s sons came to present themselves before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”
Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “From going back and forth in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Job? For there is none like him in the earth, a blameless and an upright man, one who fears God, and turns away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing?
10 Haven’t you made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will renounce you to your face.”
12 The LORD said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only on himself don’t put forth your hand.”

Rev 12.10 describes the devil's CURRENT job:

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

Not from somewhere else but right "before God."  That does not sound "allegic" to me.

i have never realy understood this either... evil and God in the same place...   ::shrug::  ::shrug::

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #109 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:31:48 »



Offline Willie T

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #110 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:33:25 »
i wonder if crying uncontrollably is of satan....  ::pondering::  ::shrug::   
 ::frown::   ::frown:: 
My wife just cleared this up for me.  "Uncontrollable crying"....... no, not of Satan... normally.  It's only of Satan when it happens within the walls of the church... er I mean "the building".

Offline Willie T

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #111 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:36:34 »
Trust me.  If you want to find Satan, just open the doors to most any church on any Sunday morning.  He'll be right there, sitting on the first pew, smiling.

Ever notice that Jesus performed almost NO miracles in churches?  Probably because there is too much unbelief in many churches.  (See my left bar info.... Religion is unbelief.)
« Last Edit: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:42:06 by Willie T »

Offline chosenone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #112 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:38:09 »
You appear to be avoiding my question.You claim to know all about the vineyard church but have you even been to one?. Have you even been filled with the spirit and been used in the spiritual gifts?Are you against the spiritual gifts such as tongues and prophecy?
<My vineyard church was nothing like you describe. My son was converted at a vineyard church and is an amazing man of God.
All you know is what you have read apparently. ::shrug::


No not avoiding I just don't live online.... I gave My story about Rodney Howard browne in this Post I believe.... When the spirit came to make me laugh I knew it was a devil....

Since mr browne is a Vineyard man I believe I have knowledge about holylaughter..


No where did I say all vineyard churches do this, but these manifestations ARE a product of the Vineyard churches and the leaders who started them!  Toronto blessing (go ahead and read about it) had the laughter ..... And barks and grunts..... And MANY pastor have come over the years to get the BLESSING or ANOINTING..... no where does scripture tell believers the Holy spirit does this to us....

I'm can't say I'm sorry in the least for going against you... The bible doesn't support it


Therefore it's not of God....

No matter how much you love your church
or the pastor or friends orhow good it makes you feel...

Were suppose to test the spirits

and we do this by finding it in scripture.... If we can't then we should know it's not of God!

  Rodney Howard Brown in one man in one church in one country.
The vineyard church that I went to was amazing and I would reccommend to anyone. I wish that we had one locally now. Nothing ever happened there that I felt in the least uncomfortable about and I am quite spiritually discerning I am told.  Maybe you need to go to a few before you judge.

Offline chosenone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #113 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:39:56 »
i wonder if crying uncontrollably is of satan....  ::pondering::  ::shrug::   


 ::frown::   ::frown:: 
 


 Well that did occur to me also fenton. I mean laughing and crying are pretty close in the human enotions. Maybe we arent allowed to show any emotion at all.. ::shrug::

Offline chosenone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #114 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:41:53 »
KB have you been baptised in the spirit? Does your church allow God to work using the gifts that He has given?

Lively Stone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #115 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:42:12 »
when you look for satan in everything, you will find him in everything.....

You got that right, fenton.

Offline chosenone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #116 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:43:35 »
Trust me.  If you want to find Satan, just open the doors to most any church on any Sunday morning.  He'll be right there, sitting on the first pew, smiling.

Ever notice that Jesus performed almost NO miracles in churches?  Probably because there is too much unbelief in many churches.  (See my left bar info.... Religion is unbelief.)



 Isnt that the truth Willie, especially the more 'religious' churches (believe me I know, I've been to a few)

Offline Willie T

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #117 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:45:05 »
Oh, c'mon, Chosenone.  Those fanatical so-called "gifts" are of Satan, too.  Everybody (well, "true" believers) knows that.
« Last Edit: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:46:46 by Willie T »

Lively Stone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #118 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:46:51 »
When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.
So explain this passage from Job 1 then:

6 Now it happened on the day when God’s sons came to present themselves before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”
Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “From going back and forth in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Job? For there is none like him in the earth, a blameless and an upright man, one who fears God, and turns away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing?
10 Haven’t you made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will renounce you to your face.”
12 The LORD said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only on himself don’t put forth your hand.”

Rev 12.10 describes the devil's CURRENT job:

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

Not from somewhere else but right "before God."  That does not sound "allegic" to me.

Satan cannot stand to be around those who know who they are in Christ, because we will put him down every time. Those who don't really understand how the Kingdom of God works, and what authority we have in Christ will be deceived.

When Holy Spirit's presence is heavy on a person, the devil is powerless, and he'd be an idiot to try to intervene. He goes after Christians with chinks in their spiritual armour.

Offline DaveW

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #119 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:51:21 »
Quote from: DaveW
Quote from: Lively Stone
When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.
So explain this passage from Job 1 then:

6 Now it happened on the day when God’s sons came to present themselves before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”
Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “From going back and forth in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Job? For there is none like him in the earth, a blameless and an upright man, one who fears God, and turns away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing?
10 Haven’t you made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will renounce you to your face.”
12 The LORD said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only on himself don’t put forth your hand.”

Rev 12.10 describes the devil's CURRENT job:

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

Not from somewhere else but right "before God."  That does not sound "allegic" to me.

Satan cannot stand to be around those who know who they are in Christ, because we will put him down every time. Those who don't really understand how the Kingdom of God works, and what authority we have in Christ will be deceived.

When Holy Spirit's presence is heavy on a person, the devil is powerless, and he'd be an idiot to try to intervene. He goes after Christians with chinks in their spiritual armour.
At least Fenton was honest that he did not understand the scripture. 

You are completely ignoring it.

Please read the passage and explain how your position can be true if these verses are true.

I think it is not as cut and dry as you make it to be.

Offline fenton

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #120 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 10:55:39 »
its not that i don't understand the scriptures.. i do... very well......

if evil is exposed to light...  how could satan stay in Gods presence 

Offline Willie T

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #121 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 11:00:09 »
I posted this once before.  It is from a Canadian friend, Gary Best.  It shows how he feels we have to be careful to be certain God is right there with us at the moment we decide to step out.

When I was younger, I was quite taken with a cartoon advertisement that used to appear regularly in various magazines. The purpose was to highlight how the Charles Atlas exercise program could change your life.  Each cartoon strip followed the same script.  It always began with a skinny young man (that I always identified with) that miraculously had the most beautiful girlfriend.  Often he would make the same grievous mistake: He would take her to the beach.  (“No, don’t do it!”  I would caution – he never listened.)  Invariably, they would be confronted by a buff, powerful man (on steroids?), who would kick sand in the young man’s face and humiliate him in front of his girlfriend.

Discouraged, he would walk away, only to discover the magazine ad.  Immediately he would send away for this extraordinary secret program and, within minutes of receiving it and putting it into practice, he would be transformed into the ultimate specimen of macho manhood.  With new confidence, he would head for the beach and impress the girl by asserting his newfound power.  (“She’s bad news,” I warned, but he still never listened.)

This is a classic example of power over power.  Often we approach our kingdom commission just that way, looking for the magic program that will transform us into “men and women of power”, who will be able to overcome our evil opponents single-handedly.  How could this story be changed to illustrate the true nature of our commission, that of ambassadorial authority?

I suppose the story might play out much the same way until the young man wanders despondently away from the beach.  This time, however, he doesn’t encounter a magazine advertisement; he runs into an old friend – Arnold Schwarenegger.  As he pours out his heart to Arnie, his friend says, “Let’s go back and right this wrong!”  Excitedly, our young friend returns, finds the beach bully, and puffing up his chest, announces, “You’re outta here!”  With a frightening stare, the man forgets all about the beautiful girl and literally races for safety.

Who is he staring at?  At first it might appear that he is looking at our new hero.  In reality, he is looking just past him to the one riding shotgun off his right shoulder – Arnold!.  “Hasta la vista, baby!” he says.  This is authority over power.  Our man hasn’t gained a pound or grown an inch.  He has, however, gained authorization from a superior power that has agreed to “back his act”.

This kind of support can be intoxicating.  I can imagine our young man becoming so zealous that he decides to rid the beach of every undesirable.  This could work well… until Arnold breaks for lunch or decides that the mission has now exceeded what he originally “authorized”.  So it is with our kingdom mission.  Our success is commensurate to the authority that backs us and that backing is totally dependent on our obedience.  When we are simply walking out what we have been commissioned to do, we can expect God’s full support

Lively Stone

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #122 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 11:07:29 »
Quote from: DaveW
Quote from: Lively Stone
When Holy Spirit is in a place, there is no room for a devil. He's so allergic, he's out of there.
So explain this passage from Job 1 then:

6 Now it happened on the day when God’s sons came to present themselves before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”
Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “From going back and forth in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Job? For there is none like him in the earth, a blameless and an upright man, one who fears God, and turns away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing?
10 Haven’t you made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will renounce you to your face.”
12 The LORD said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only on himself don’t put forth your hand.”

Rev 12.10 describes the devil's CURRENT job:

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

Not from somewhere else but right "before God."  That does not sound "allegic" to me.

Satan cannot stand to be around those who know who they are in Christ, because we will put him down every time. Those who don't really understand how the Kingdom of God works, and what authority we have in Christ will be deceived.

When Holy Spirit's presence is heavy on a person, the devil is powerless, and he'd be an idiot to try to intervene. He goes after Christians with chinks in their spiritual armour.
At least Fenton was honest that he did not understand the scripture. 

You are completely ignoring it.

Please read the passage and explain how your position can be true if these verses are true.

I think it is not as cut and dry as you make it to be.

The verses were true. God isn't allergic to evil. Nothing can stop Satan from communicating with God when He commands it. He has to present himself if commanded. Now, because of Holy Spirit, we can also command him to get lost when he presents himself before us. Holy Spirit as God is massive in power, and Satan is not a masochist...he will not get in the way of a move of the Holy Spirit on a person who is seeking and enjoying His presence. When we worship with all we've got, God comes, and Satan's little imps' hands are tied.

Lily76

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #123 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 19:21:25 »
You appear to be avoiding my question.You claim to know all about the vineyard church but have you even been to one?. Have you even been filled with the spirit and been used in the spiritual gifts?Are you against the spiritual gifts such as tongues and prophecy?
<My vineyard church was nothing like you describe. My son was converted at a vineyard church and is an amazing man of God.
All you know is what you have read apparently. ::shrug::


unholy laugher is not from God. And I did not notice anything ungodly in vineyard church that I visited.

I have so much respect for this Pastor. I think his teaching is godly. He said nothing about unholy laugher:

What It Means To Be Spirit Filled Small | Large


Ask For The Holy Spirit Small | Large

Lily76

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #124 on: Mon Aug 06, 2012 - 19:30:19 »
Question: "What is holy laughter?"

Answer: The term "holy laughter" was coined to describe a phenomenon during which a person laughs uncontrollably, presumably as a result of being filled with the Holy Spirit's joy. It is characterized by peals of uncontrollable laughter, sometimes accompanied by swooning or falling down to the floor. Firsthand accounts from those who have had this experience vary somewhat, but all seem to believe it to be a sign of a "blessing" or "anointing" of the Holy Spirit.

The experience of holy laughter is, by nature, a subjective one. Therefore, in an effort to find the truth of the matter, we must try to be objective. When our definition of truth depends upon our experience of the world, we are a very short way from becoming entirely relative in our thinking. In short, feelings do not tell us what is true. Feelings are not bad, and sometimes our feelings are aligned with scriptural truth. However, they are more often aligned with our sin nature. The fickle nature of the heart makes it a very unreliable compass. "The heart is more deceitful than all else, and is desperately sick; who can understand it?" (Jeremiah 17:9). This deceitful-heart principle is specifically applicable to the phenomenon known as "holy laughter." There is no doubt that people have indeed begun to laugh uncontrollably at revival meetings. That is a fact. But what does it really mean?

Laughter is addressed a number of times in the Bible. Often it is used to describe a mocking or scornful response, as was the case with Abraham and Sarah who laughed when God told them they would bear a child in their old age. Some verses use it as a sign of derision (Psalm 59:8; Psalm 80:6; Proverbs 1:26), and still others make pointed statements about the nature of laughter itself. Solomon, for example, made the following observation in Ecclesiastes 2:2: "I said of laughter, ‘It is madness,’ and of pleasure, ‘What does it accomplish?’" He then goes on to say, in 7:3, "Sorrow is better than laughter, for when a face is sad a heart may be happy." Proverbs 14:13 says the reverse: "Even in laughter the heart may be in pain, and the end of joy may be grief." Both of these verses are true: a sad person may laugh to cover his sadness, and a person may cry although he is inwardly happy. So, not only does emotion fail to give us truth, but we also see that laughter is not always indicative of joy. It can mean anger, sadness, or derision. Likewise, the lack of laughter does not automatically mean sadness. Laughter is clearly subjective.

The most convincing scriptural argument against what is called "holy laughter" is found in Galatians 5:22-23. It says, "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law." If self-control is a fruit of the Spirit of God, how can uncontrollable laughter also be a fruit of His Spirit? Revival leaders claim that being filled with the Spirit means that we are sort of "tossed about" by His whims. But the idea that God would make people act drunk or laugh uncontrollably or make animal noises as a result of the Spirit's anointing is directly opposed to the way the Spirit acts, according to Galatians 5:22-23. The Spirit described in Galatians 5 is one who promotes self-control within us, not the opposite. Finally, there was no one in the Bible more filled with the Holy Spirit than Jesus, and not once does the Bible ever record Him laughing.

In light of these things, it is profitable to take a look at the following passage from 1 Corinthians 14, where Paul talks about speaking in tongues: "But now, brethren, if I come to you speaking in tongues, what will I profit you unless I speak to you either by way of revelation or of knowledge or of prophecy or of teaching?" (v.6).

"For if the bugle produces an indistinct sound, who will prepare himself for battle? So also you, unless you utter by the tongue speech that is clear, how will it be known what is spoken? For you will be speaking into the air” (vv. 8-9).

"What is the outcome then, brethren? When you assemble, each one has a psalm, has a teaching, has a revelation, has a tongue, has an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification. If anyone speaks in a tongue, it should be by two or at the most three, and each in turn, and one must interpret; but if there is no interpreter, he must keep silent in the church; and let him speak to himself and to God" (vv. 26-28).

"...for God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints" (v. 33).

In those days, many people in the churches were speaking in languages that were unrecognizable to others, and, therefore, Paul says they were useless in the church because the speaker could not edify others with his speech. The same could be applied to holy laughter. What does it profit (Paul asks) unless we speak to one another with revelation, teaching, knowledge and truth? Again, he says, "Let all things be done for edification." He caps off his argument by saying, "God is not a God of confusion, but of peace," which makes it clear that he does not want the atmosphere within the church to be one of confusion and meaninglessness, but one of knowledge and edification.

It seems, from what Paul is saying, that which is called "holy laughter" would fall under the category of what is "not edifying" to the body of Christ, and should therefore be avoided. We have recognized that a) laughter is an unreliable emotional response; b) it can be a sign of several different emotions; and c) it does not accomplish anything useful. Furthermore, uncontrollable spasms of emotion are contrary to the nature of the Holy Spirit. It is advisable, therefore, not to look to "holy laughter" as a means of growing nearer to God or as a means of experiencing His Spirit.

http://www.gotquestions.org/holy-laughter.html

Lily76

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Re: Vineyard churches (Some questions)
« Reply #125 on: Tue Aug 07, 2012 - 22:34:12 »
KNOWLEDGE BOMB,

Ok did not get enough time to read what you said.

Quote
“They are ALSO into demonic holy laughter and slain in the spirit.... Neither is backed up by scripture and infact they use scripture incorrectly to back their claim that it is from God and it is NOT!
Again RUN don't walk....”

Holy laughter is not demonic. read what I posted. I do not feel comfortable about it myself. I’ll definitely put a question mark there. But God can make you laugh and smile because it is healthy (not in uncontrollable way though) That could be a sign of the Holy Spirit. We laugh a lot in my Anglican church but not in way that we can’t control it. That is because the sermons are fun :)

I have not witnessed such a thing. Anyway, Holy laughter is not something I feel comfortable about but laughing in a good manner can be godly thing.

Quote
“Holy laughter or drunk in the spirit is in vineyard churches so what in the bible backs that up?”

The antichrist Jews accused Christ and the apostles of being drunkards. Some people seem drunk when they speak in tongues. I have seen it in the reformed Anglican Church. My husband and sister in law spoke in tongues many times. I think you just attend a very formal church and never experienced this.
 
Quote
“If it's not based on scripture it's demonic!”


LOL another fairy tales stories eveything has to be from demons on this site!!!?

No, it is not. God can make you laugh and have happiness, but not out of control.

Quote
“a mans NOT suppose to get his learning from a woman!”

Why not? You’re not a better creature just because you’re a man. We got so many bigots on these forums! yak! And you did not understand what you read. In the church I used to go to we had women pastors including my sister in law and we were blessed by them, indeed. Yes they were the teachers and men learn from us. Your mind is polluted by ignorance about ladies. Also, you judge all vineyard churches to be demonic and unbiblical?! you just copy/past things. I did not notice anything unusual in the vineyard church I go to now. As I said you can laugh, but not out of control, and that can be of God and speaking in tongues is biblical even if it looks weird to you.
 
So ok you do not accept holy laughter. That is ok. I do not feel comfortable about it either, and it is not demonic. Demons do not want to be in a church.  ::doh::

Stop making stupid false comments about vineyard churches. I did not notice anything unusual! :/