Ask a pentecostal

[zoonance]

At the moment, I would settle for being papercut by the Spirit.     Just a glimpse and move beyond the rhetoric.

[James Rondon]

At the moment, I would settle for being papercut by the Spirit.

[renee-1]

At the moment, I would settle for being papercut by the Spirit.     Just a glimpse and move beyond the rhetoric.

Not me. There is so much more to God that little box that mankind has put Him in. I want all I can get of Him. God is so vast. We have not yet seen His vastness.

[Barabbas]

Hi Renee,  Did you ever see the movie "Jesus Camp"?   If you did - did you think it was a fair portrayal of penticostal evangelicals?

[kensington]

umm.... I'm going to say no to this question.  Based on a movie trailer I saw of this movie. I do not send my kids out into the world to fight for life or to save souls, I am training them up in the way they should go and when it is time, if they are to be preachers, teachers or missionaries... God will call them.

I am not laying hands on them to be slain or speak in tongues.... but I lay hands on them for their daily needs and for God's hand to be on them. My kids go to "kids camp" where they have fun and fellowship, they have chapel at evening fireside and they swim and play. I teach them the ways of the LORD, in their coming in, and their goings out. In their rising up, and their laying down.

They are children... I am called to go into the world and preach the gospel, and I am called to try to reach a sick and dying world. They are not the tools God gave me to use to do that. They are the children He entrusted me with and to "suffer them not to come unto Him".  If they want to speak of faith or speak the name of jesus to someone, or Help them in any way.. I support that and I will help. But, I am not putting them in the ministry. That is a calling from God.

And NO we are not like Ted Haggart. We are in prayer daily, we are fighting the good fight, we are raising our hands in worship and praise unto the LORD OF LORDS...  We are striving against sin in our own lives, and praying for those who need it to do the same. We are waiting on Jesus to return to take us home.

We are willing to meet the call to witness, preach, teach or love someone who needs the LORD.  And... we believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, we believe they are in action in the body of Christ today. We believe in the laying on of hands.  We speak the word of God in our daily lives, and we believe it.

We teach one another, we disciple. We forgive and we lift one another up in prayer. I do not teach my children the souls of the world are on their shoulders... I teach my children that they are on HIS. 

We are not dolts who just fall down because some man who stands in the pulpit lays hands on us and gives a push. But, if the Spirit of God decides to lay us out on the floor, we go.  There is a difference.  It's happened to me once... ONCE in 27 years of being saved.  And I did not roll, or toss and turn.  I was not unconscious or unaware of my surroundings. I was in a "BLESSED" state and very aware.  It lasted moments. But, I know what it was. 

We do not spend Sunday jumping up and down and shouting. Every service is not a service where any one would be slain, or speak in tongues or even get excited.  We spend time in worship on our knees, we glean from the word of God, we spend time at the altar.  And we go home and keep our hands clean.  We LOVE the LORD.

I hope this in someway answers your question. 

[renee-1]

Hi Renee,  Did you ever see the movie "Jesus Camp"?   If you did - did you think it was a fair portrayal of penticostal evangelicals?

I saw bits and pieces.  Sorry but that just looked like a cult to me.

[Barabbas]

I found myself strangely attracted yet repulsed by the movie,  attracted to the obvious zeal and passion that the followers had, yet repulsed by what seemed to me a manipulation of young children's minds.

[renee-1]

I found myself strangely attracted yet repulsed by the movie,  attracted to the obvious zeal and passion that the followers had, yet repulsed by what seemed to me a manipulation of young children's minds.

yep

I have no problem with christians teaching their children bout christ. We are teaching our boy bout Jesus. But man there is such a thing as let them be kids while your teaching them.

[trifecta]

OP question,

Renee and other Pentacostals,

Do you believe in the Trinity?   I know that some pentacostals do and others do not.
Can you tell me which Pentacostals do and which do not?

For those who reject the Trinity, why do they do so? 

[Gracious]

OP question,

Renee and other Pentacostals,

Do you believe in the Trinity?   I know that some pentacostals do and others do not.
Can you tell me which Pentacostals do and which do not?

For those who reject the Trinity, why do they do so? 

Hello "trifecta", and how are you?

Good question(s) ... Amen?

Now, I'm not Pentecostal but ... here's how I'm led.

As with Jehovah's Witnesses, Oneness Pentecostals reject the historic biblical doctrine of the Trinity.

They teach that Jesus IS the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit (no distinction of Persons).

In Oneness theology God exists as a unipersonal monad, that temporarily manifested as the "modes," "roles," or "offices" of the "Father," the "Son," or the "Holy Spirit" at different times. The unipersonal deity of  Oneness theology lives in absolute solitude. Hence they deny that God has revealed Himself in three distinct coequal, coeternal, and coexistent Persons. In the end, their theology is decidedly unitarian, which denies the Person Jesus Christ as revealed in Scripture (e.g. Jesus “IS” The Father).

The most common proof texts that the modalists present, are Isaiah 9:6; John 5:43; 10:30; John 14:9; and Colossians 2:9.

There is also a technical argument asserted by Bernard, which has to do with the Greek conjunction kai (“and”) in the salutations of Paul.

Isaiah 9:6
For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the Government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.

Because of the phrase “Eternal Father” Oneness advocates see this passage as teaching that Jesus is the Father. However, there are several flaws in interpreting Jesus here as the Father of the New Testament revelation.

Gracious

[Gracious]

The Assembly of God Pentecostals Baptize in the Mat 28:19 formula. That would include most of the TBN Pentecostals. T.D. Jakes would be Jesus name only.

Apostolic Pentecostals Baptize in the name of Jesus only. Acts 2:38, and 4:12.

FTL

Hello Harold,

Interesting observation ... Amen?  But to my knowledge, T.D. Jakes is not a "TBN Apostolic Pentecostal".

[Gracious]

The History of your beginning? Just what movement did your church come from. What set your church at difference than others?

I’m led that there are four waves of Pentecostalism and they are:

1. The "Classical Pentecostal Movement" started in 1901 by Parham and Seymour has now over 11,000 pentecostal denominations throughout the world.

2. The "Neo-Pentecostal" movement started in 1960 in Van Nuys, California, under Dennis Bennett, Rector of St Marks Episcopal (Anglican) Church. In ten years it spread to all major Protestant families of the world, reaching a total of 55 million people by 1990.

3. The Catholic Charismatic Renewal movement started in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in 1967 among students and faculty of DuQuesne University, and by 19993 it has touched the lives of over 100 million Catholics in over 238 nations.

4. The Evangelicals started in 1981 at Fuller Theological Seminary with John Wimber. By 1990, 33 millions in the world were moving in signs and wonders, though they disdain labels such as "Pentecostal" and "charismatic".

Gracious 

[renee-1]

OP question,

Renee and other Pentacostals,

Do you believe in the Trinity?   I know that some pentacostals do and others do not.
Can you tell me which Pentacostals do and which do not?

For those who reject the Trinity, why do they do so? 

Gracious was correct. It is the oneness, apostolic and unity or united pentecostal sect that are unitaritan or reject the trinity.

I was raised Assemblies of God which are trinitarian presently we are with the Pentecostal Church of God which is also trinitarian.

[Harold]

The Assembly of God Pentecostals Baptize in the Mat 28:19 formula. That would include most of the TBN Pentecostals. T.D. Jakes would be Jesus name only.

Apostolic Pentecostals Baptize in the name of Jesus only. Acts 2:38, and 4:12.

FTL

Hello Harold,

Interesting observation ... Amen?  But to my knowledge, T.D. Jakes is not a "TBN Apostolic Pentecostal".

T D Jakes came out of the UPC a oneness pentecostal fellowship. He still explains the trinity the same as they do. One caveat I have not searched out his web site lately.

Alister McGrath offered some insight pertaining to the word persons in reference to the Trinity that modern Oneness believers completely agree with:

The word "person" has changed its meaning since the third century when it began to be used in connection with the "threefoldness of God." When we talk about God as a person, we naturally think of God as being one person. But theologians such as Tertullian, writing in the third century, used the word "person" with a different meaning. The word "person" originally derives from the Latin word persona, meaning an actor’s face mask-and, by extension, the role which he takes in a play.
By stating that there were three persons but only one God, Tertullian was asserting that all three major roles in the great drama of human redemption are played by the one and the same God. The three great roles in this drama are all played by the same actor: God. Each of these roles may reveal God in a somewhat different way, but it is the same God in every case. So when we talk about God as one person, we mean one person in the modern sense of the word, and when we talk about God as three persons, we mean three persons in the ancient sense of the word. … Confusing the word "person" inevitably leads to the idea that God is actually a committee….49
Alister E. McGrath, Studies in Doctrine (Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 1987)

The complete article can be read at this location.

http://www.apostolic.net/biblicalstudies/trinoneness.htm

Modern day oneness Pentecostals are not modalists. They are not as with the JW's. The above quote from a trinitarian would sound the same in a Oneness Fellowship.

The two largest groups in the Pentecostal churches are the UPC (Oneness) and The Assemblies of God (Trinitarian) they split over their differing views. Most Pentecostals that are apostolic are oneness in theology.

FTL

[Harold]

At the moment, I would settle for being papercut by the Spirit.     Just a glimpse and move beyond the rhetoric.

Do you believe the Spirit can give you a paper cut, are you asking God to give you a paper cut?

Get the analogy?

FTL