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Author Topic: And they say it had no Designer  (Read 685 times)

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Offline Ohan

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And they say it had no Designer
« on: Thu Apr 18, 2019 - 18:34:57 »


The Human Body ```
« Last Edit: Thu Apr 18, 2019 - 18:37:29 by Ohan »

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And they say it had no Designer
« on: Thu Apr 18, 2019 - 18:34:57 »

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #1 on: Thu Apr 18, 2019 - 20:46:57 »
No mere "space alien" designer suggested by the IDers.   The Creator.

Inferior creatures design.   God creates.

Interestingly, engineers have figured this out, and are copying God's way when they have problems that are too difficult for design.  Genetic algorithms use evolutionary processes to obtain optimal solutions.


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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #1 on: Thu Apr 18, 2019 - 20:46:57 »

Offline Ohan

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #2 on: Mon Apr 29, 2019 - 00:48:52 »
Are you saying Human is not a wonderful design ~ or that God did not Create ~ looking in the mirror might give you that view ~ maybe you haven't lived up to your potential ```

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #3 on: Mon Apr 29, 2019 - 22:20:38 »
Are you saying Human is not a wonderful design

Lots of suboptimal parts.   So not very good as a "design."   On the other hand, remarkably good as an evolved species.

Would you like to learn more about some of them?

 

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #3 on: Mon Apr 29, 2019 - 22:20:38 »

Offline Ohan

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #4 on: Tue Apr 30, 2019 - 15:57:23 »
Well, I'm a mechanic & Med Tech ~ I see the Human body a wonderful design ~ and of course I love the Designer ~ looking in the mirror ~ I imagine you get a different view ~ and being an atheist you are naturally standing on a different scale ~ you know being as smart/wise as you are ```


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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #4 on: Tue Apr 30, 2019 - 15:57:23 »



Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #5 on: Tue Apr 30, 2019 - 20:19:00 »
Well, I'm a mechanic & Med Tech ~ I see the Human body a wonderful design ~ and of course I love the Designer

According to the IDers, the "designer" "might be a space alien."   Not the God I know.  He's the Creator.    And He never has to design.  "Design" is what a limited creature must do.   

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I imagine you get a different view ~ and being an atheist you are naturally standing on a different scale

If you're an atheist, then one of us is.    Is that the problem?   

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~ you know being as smart/wise as you are ```

C'mon.   You know how dumb old barbarians are...  ::tippinghat::

Offline Ohan

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #6 on: Thu May 09, 2019 - 19:31:18 »
Old worn out barbarian are dumb like you point out ~ but not all are ignorant ~ well they'r dumb if they spend their time trying to belittle Christian faith and they wast their time trying to bolster their lame story ~ when they could look deeper and find the the truth before the decay become complete ~ still some keep going on as if they are nothing and no higher potential being just alert organisms ~ even the dumbest atheist is loved by their Creator ~ but some will continue to give the glory to bang until they rot ```


Park Austtoozo ~ Glory to God ```







Ohan

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #7 on: Sun May 12, 2019 - 21:29:21 »
Old worn out barbarian are dumb like you point out ~ but not all are ignorant ~ well they'r dumb if they spend their time trying to belittle Christian faith

I don't think you intend to belittle Christian faith, but sometimes, what you say makes it look bad.     And no one said you were an atheist.   Sometimes, atheists make odd claims about God, pretending to be Christians, but I don't think that's what you're doing.


 




 

Offline Ohan

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #8 on: Mon May 13, 2019 - 10:48:09 »
Please excuse my asking ~  you are an atheist and Lesbian or have I jumped to a wrong conclusion ~ I don't mean to offend by asking ```

 

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #9 on: Sat May 18, 2019 - 22:40:13 »
I don't think you intend to belittle Christian faith, but sometimes, what you say makes it look bad.     And no one said you were an atheist.   Sometimes, atheists make odd claims about God, pretending to be Christians, but I don't think that's what you're doing.

I could be wrong about you, of course.

The point is that numerous suboptimal structures in humans make it clear that we were created, not "designed."

« Last Edit: Sat May 18, 2019 - 22:42:40 by The Barbarian »

Offline seekingHiswisdom

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #10 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 06:57:54 »
Lots of suboptimal parts.   So not very good as a "design."   On the other hand, remarkably good as an evolved species.

Would you like to learn more about some of them?

Do you believe what was written in the bible? I am referring to Genesis 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. (Must I include the definition of image? Suffice it to say image has its roots in the Latin word imitari, meaning "to copy or imitate"; images are judged by how realistically they capture the person or thing they show.)

If so, then how do you tie man as being an evolved species. ARE you saying that God lied? Are you saying that God created man to evolve from a lesser entity that we assume to have less intelligence then we do as we have evolved to what we are today? Are you saying if it is the latter that  God , Himself, though spirit has a form that does not at all resemble what mankind has been led to believe for millennia as posted in the written word?


Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #11 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 08:57:36 »
Do you believe what was written in the bible?

You shouldn't doubt what's in the Bible.   Why do you doubt it?

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I am referring to Genesis 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 

As Jesus says, God is a spirit.   And Jesus says a spirit has no body.   So, if Jesus is telling the truth, God doesn't have a nose or arms or whatever.    The image is, as God says in Genesis is in our souls and minds.   We are living souls, as God is, and we know good and evil as God does.

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If so, then how do you tie man as being an evolved species.

Would it offend you if God created our bodies the way He created the bodies of other animals?   Why not just let Him do it His way?

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ARE you saying that God lied?

I'm trying to show you that God told you the truth, if you'll just set your pride aside and believe Him.

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Are you saying that God created man to evolve from a lesser entity that we assume to have less intelligence then we do as we have evolved to what we are today?

Why would that offend you?    And why do you assume a "lesser entity?"    Do you think it matters to God if  Neandertals happened to be smarter or dumber than we are?    You're letting your pride talk for you.   Not a good idea.

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Are you saying if it is the latter that  God , Himself, though spirit has a form that does not at all resemble what mankind has been led to believe for millennia as posted in the written word?

If we can believe Jesus, God has no form.    And since scripture does not describe His form, those who think they know what it is, are depending on their imaginations, not God's word.


Online 4WD

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #12 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 09:06:11 »
Do you believe what was written in the bible? I am referring to Genesis 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. (Must I include the definition of image?)
No, you do not have to include the definition of "image", but you do have to include the definition of God in which the image is created.  Clearly you do not understand that image has nothing to do with the physical being of man.  And the evolution of man, if that is how God did it, has everything to do with the physical being and not the spiritual.  It is in, and only in, the spiritual being of man that he is in God's image.  It can be no other given that God is spiritual, not physical.
« Last Edit: Sun May 19, 2019 - 09:09:07 by 4WD »

Offline seekingHiswisdom

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #13 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 15:55:24 »
No, you do not have to include the definition of "image", but you do have to include the definition of God in which the image is created.  Clearly you do not understand that image has nothing to do with the physical being of man.  And the evolution of man, if that is how God did it, has everything to do with the physical being and not the spiritual.  It is in, and only in, the spiritual being of man that he is in God's image.  It can be no other given that God is spiritual, not physical.

That is the silliest thing I have ever heard.

Of course it has to do with the physical being of man.

It is you evolutionists that are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.

Online 4WD

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #14 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 16:29:52 »
That is the silliest thing I have ever heard.

Of course it has to do with the physical being of man.
You think man physically looks like God? Now that is silly.
Quote from: Seeking
It is you evolutionists that are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
If you think the "in the image of God" relates to physical appearance, you are the one messing with the square peg and round hole.

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #15 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 17:11:09 »
You shouldn't doubt what's in the Bible.   Why do you doubt it?

As Jesus says, God is a spirit.   And Jesus says a spirit has no body.   So, if Jesus is telling the truth, God doesn't have a nose or arms or whatever.    The image is, as God says in Genesis is in our souls and minds.   We are living souls, as God is, and we know good and evil as God does.

Would it offend you if God created our bodies the way He created the bodies of other animals?   Why not just let Him do it His way?

I'm trying to show you that God told you the truth, if you'll just set your pride aside and believe Him.

Why would that offend you?    And why do you assume a "lesser entity?"    Do you think it matters to God if  Neandertals happened to be smarter or dumber than we are?    You're letting your pride talk for you.   Not a good idea.

If we can believe Jesus, God has no form.    And since scripture does not describe His form, those who think they know what it is, are depending on their imaginations, not God's word.

Well, for my first post permit me to say I believe in part of what you say here, but disagree based on Exodus 33.

While God is a spirit, no one can deny, when He met with Moses it is recorded the following.

19 Then He said, “I will make all My goodness pass before you, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before you. I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.” 20 But He said, “You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” 21 And the Lord said, “Here is a place by Me, and you shall stand on the rock. 22 So it shall be, while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock, and will cover you with My hand while I pass by. 23 Then I will take away My hand, and you shall see My back; but My face shall not be seen.”

“You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” Would that not indicate this spirit that is God has a face?

"while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock". Any guess if that would have been mind control to move him?

"will cover you with My hand while I pass by." "Then I will take away My hand, ". Do you truly suppose God had a hand with no arm?

"and you shall see My back;". Moses saw God's back. If God had no form what did Moses see?

" but My face shall not be seen.” And God it seems, does have a face.

It would seem, at the very least , that when man was made he would have had a hand, back, and face in the image of God for we are told God at minimum had these.


Offline soterion

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #16 on: Sun May 19, 2019 - 19:40:02 »
Well, for my first post permit me to say I believe in part of what you say here, but disagree based on Exodus 33.

While God is a spirit, no one can deny, when He met with Moses it is recorded the following.

19 Then He said, “I will make all My goodness pass before you, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before you. I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.” 20 But He said, “You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” 21 And the Lord said, “Here is a place by Me, and you shall stand on the rock. 22 So it shall be, while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock, and will cover you with My hand while I pass by. 23 Then I will take away My hand, and you shall see My back; but My face shall not be seen.”

“You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” Would that not indicate this spirit that is God has a face?

"while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock". Any guess if that would have been mind control to move him?

"will cover you with My hand while I pass by." "Then I will take away My hand, ". Do you truly suppose God had a hand with no arm?

"and you shall see My back;". Moses saw God's back. If God had no form what did Moses see?

" but My face shall not be seen.” And God it seems, does have a face.

It would seem, at the very least , that when man was made he would have had a hand, back, and face in the image of God for we are told God at minimum had these.

Welcome to the forums, 139.72.

God is a Spirit and spirits do not have physical bodies. Spirits can inhabit physical bodies, but God, being a Spirit (John 4:24) is not inherently a physical being with physical body parts.

No one has actually ever seen God (John 1:18). Only when looking at Jesus can we know what God would be like in the flesh. However, even that physical body was a tabernacle being inhabited by God (John 1:14); that tabernacle itself was not uniquely God's physical body.

Any references to body parts, as they are attributed to God, have to be understood as either symbolic or manifestations of God temporarily inhabiting some physical form (theophanies). In the case of Exodus 33, Moses wanted to see God's glory, and God manifested Himself to Moses in a verbal and physical way that Moses could just relate to. Moses did not see some inherently physical aspect of God that makes Him who He is.

To be created in the image of God has to refer to some inner aspects of human nature that separates us from the rest of the earthly sentient creation. Things such as freewill, morality, etc.

Offline Rexenm

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #17 on: Mon May 20, 2019 - 03:25:51 »
The design of the human body, is the conversation between acceptance and regret, and dualism...

Offline seekingHiswisdom

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #18 on: Mon May 20, 2019 - 08:49:49 »
The design of the human body, is the conversation between acceptance and regret, and dualism...

You are saying God did not design the human body?

Offline Rexenm

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #19 on: Mon May 20, 2019 - 09:31:05 »
No.. At least, science were involved. I think it was to do with unavoidable facts, though anything could be possible. Just because we know a certainty, doesn't mean it is what God has said.

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #20 on: Wed Jun 05, 2019 - 08:17:32 »
Well, for my first post permit me to say I believe in part of what you say here, but disagree based on Exodus 33.

While God is a spirit, no one can deny, when He met with Moses it is recorded the following.

19 Then He said, “I will make all My goodness pass before you, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before you. I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.” 20 But He said, “You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” 21 And the Lord said, “Here is a place by Me, and you shall stand on the rock. 22 So it shall be, while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock, and will cover you with My hand while I pass by. 23 Then I will take away My hand, and you shall see My back; but My face shall not be seen.”

“You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.” Would that not indicate this spirit that is God has a face?

"while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock". Any guess if that would have been mind control to move him?

"will cover you with My hand while I pass by." "Then I will take away My hand, ". Do you truly suppose God had a hand with no arm?

"and you shall see My back;". Moses saw God's back. If God had no form what did Moses see?

" but My face shall not be seen.” And God it seems, does have a face.

It would seem, at the very least , that when man was made he would have had a hand, back, and face in the image of God for we are told God at minimum had these.

God can assume a body as He will.  Angels are given bodies when they interact with humans, even though they are spirits, of whom Jesus tells us they have no bodies.


Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #21 on: Wed Jun 05, 2019 - 08:22:14 »
Quote
You are saying God did not design the human body?

Something far greater and more amazing than that.  He created it.  Limited creatures like humans must "design."   God creates.  Our kind was brought forth by the Earth, God's creation serving His purposes.

If it was a lengthier and more involved process than merely poofing man into a mass of clay, then so be it.





Offline seekingHiswisdom

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #22 on: Wed Jun 05, 2019 - 09:08:11 »
Something far greater and more amazing than that.  He created it.  Limited creatures like humans must "design."   God creates.  Our kind was brought forth by the Earth, God's creation serving His purposes.

If it was a lengthier and more involved process than merely poofing man into a mass of clay, then so be it.

At what point in evolution into mankind did God give each a spirit, (for we know it returns to God when we die) ? Or do you believe every thing living has a spirit?

Offline The Barbarian

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #23 on: Wed Jun 05, 2019 - 17:02:29 »
At what point in evolution into mankind did God give each a spirit

I don't know.  Would it offend you if H. erectus was the first?    Or does it have to be H. sapiens?   Since our particular race came about after archaic H. sapiens, and both Neandertals and Denesovans show signs of human intelligence,  perhaps H. sapiens heidelbergensis was the first.   
 
Why would it matter?

Offline Ohan

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #24 on: Mon Jul 08, 2019 - 23:00:56 »
Atheist and puftas like to detract from the work of God ~ and to do it on Christian sites ~ don't judge the world or any of His creation by what you see in the mirror ```

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #25 on: Tue Jul 09, 2019 - 06:45:44 »
Atheist and puftas like to detract from the work of God ~ and to do it on Christian sites ~ don't judge the world or any of His creation by what you see in the mirror ``
I am not really a promoter of biological evolution; I think there are more than a few problems with it as it is presented. However, if some form of evolution is how God did actually cause things to happen, I do not see how that detracts from the work of God.

Also, what is a pufta?

Offline Jaime

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #26 on: Tue Jul 09, 2019 - 07:36:26 »
I knew an Australian once that referred ro Gays as Puftas.

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #27 on: Tue Jul 09, 2019 - 07:41:50 »
Is it just some sort of a general derogatory designation?

Offline Jaime

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Re: And they say it had no Designer
« Reply #28 on: Tue Jul 09, 2019 - 07:46:15 »
I would say yes.

 

     
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