Lee,

I am thoroughly disgusted by what you've done.  I cannot believe you would post those pictures whose sole purpose was to inflame your sister in Christ.

I don't agree with Kari's stance on when life begins, but she has been far more reasonable and Christlike in her approach to this than you - you don't even come close to her in terms of attitude and having a loving spirit.

Lee, either you edit those pictures off this sight, or you've seen the last of me on this board.

Duckman

I still don't think it was wrong of Lee to post the pictures.

I do think it was counter-productive.

I worked about five years in a Midwestern newsroom.  There were lots of photos we didn't publish, both from the wire services and from our own photographers.

Some I wish we had.  Trouble is, while you use a graphic image hoping to inform the ignorant and rattle the complacent, everyone gets exposed.

Now that everyone seems convinced that Lee is a slanderer, may I remark that I, and my profession, have also been slandered?

The comment has been made over and over that even scientists do not know “when life begins.”  That is tantamount to saying that we are too stupid to tell the difference between living and non-living objects.  

By all biological definition, a human embryo is a living entity at the point of conception.

Now theologians can argue when s/he receives a Soul, and the courts can decide when s/he becomes a Person, but saying that scientists are ambivalent about when his or her life begins is slanderous.

Any more apologies out there?

[!--QuoteBegin--][/span][table border=\"0\" align=\"center\" width=\"95%\" cellpadding=\"3\" cellspacing=\"1\"][tr][td]Quote (Roman @ Jan. 09 2003,3:03)[/td][/tr][tr][td id=\"QUOTE\"][!--QuoteEBegin--]One is a case of families and children dying as a result of a war or a battle that is being fought for a noble cause or the protection of a nation. It is still tragic and sad, and yes God still hates that it happens.

But if you read in the Old Testament there wre times when God told his people to wipe out an entire people.[/quote]
Roman:  Would you believe a war with Iraq (and the resultant killing of innocents of many countries, including ours) is noble if it could be proven that it was oil related (driven by our consumer needs and greedy large corporations)?   Are you sure it's not?   Would that be a "good enough" reason for you (kind of like convenience on abortion but on a grander scale)?   Did Iraq have anything to do with 9/11?   Wouldn't it be more noble to peacefully invest the war dollars into technologies that made us less dependent on oil?  

Do you believe God has directed the US to go to war?...I don't think a call has come from God on this one.   Abortion sickens me but a potential World War III sickens me more...

Kari,

I took it that way, but I sure don't hold it against you!!!  Just a part of learning how committed we each are to our views.


I really love reading your posts.

Many women can't concieve at all -- and many men produce dead sperm. I have known many of these people in my life. I can't explain it, or understand it, but they grieve as deeply for children they can't even put in utero for a second as those who have lost children full-term. The children they will never have are so vivid and live in their minds, but they can't release them into the world. They are tormented by grief all the more because no one will grieve with them over the loss of the ability to have these "mind" children. You parents who have had miscarriages have experienced the insensitivities of those who don't understand the loss of a person you have never seen. So, in my opinion and experience, grief over the loss of a child in utero is not unlike never being able to concieve at all. Therefore such loss is not an adequate reason to strike out in anger toward our Christian brothers and sisters who differ in opinions over abortion.

I am a fertile woman who has chosen not to have children (and no, I have never had an a abortion. Abortion is against my conscience.) From the time I was about 9 years-old and living in Italy, my heart went out to the millions of homeless orphans there who live on the streets. I vowed never to have children, but to adopt older children and when I met my husband I told him not to pursue me unless he was willing to put aside his desire to perpetuate his family genes (He must really love me because he is the last male in his family tree!)

I have advised many of my friends who can't concieve to adopt older children. Those who have taken me up on it have been healed of their depression and longing to reproduce and blessed beyond their wildest dreams! I have never seen one of those "bad adoption" stories come true. One couple we have counselled have been married and childless for almost twenty years and this month they will have three new daughters in their home! But I have also seen great sadness in the lives of some of the couples who resort to every medical "marvel" to concieve or to live childless rather than adopt ... rather than put their own "need" or "human right" to procreate aside for the happy memories of raising children, their lives are benchmarked by fertility clinics, miscarriages, depression, therepy and divorce.  

I don't understand why pro-life people do not argue as vehemently about the moral and social crime of silence while millions and millions of children live without parents? As I see it, homeless children are not in need of advocates -- advocates can be found protesting on any street corner -- they are in need of PARENTS!

Someone might mistake your logo to mean "Christian Conservatives".