GCM Home | Your Posts | Rules | DONATE | Bookstore | RSS | Facebook | Twitter | FAQs


Author Topic: How can a Christian vote Democrat?  (Read 6999 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline forklift

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 55
  • Manna: 5
    • View Profile
How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« on: Wed Mar 14, 2012 - 19:18:10 »
Seriously. OK, they support social programs to help people. So what? So do our Churches, and our Churches provide the care and help much more effectively without near the amount of waste. So give us the money that is spent on social programs and we can give it to our Churches. As far as I can tell, that has to be the only reason.

Not to mention that those on the left support abortion. I don't care how much good you are doing, if you support the killing of innocent life then I have no use for you. I know the same can be said for war and the death penalty. I'm against both of those as well. However, both sides create and fund wars and the death penalty is avoidable by not committing crimes. For me it all comes down to abortion. Jesus told us to love one another, how are we loving one another by sanctioning the murder of the unborn? Those that do it, those that support it, and those that vote for those that support all have innocent blood on their hands.

Christian Forums and Message Board

How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« on: Wed Mar 14, 2012 - 19:18:10 »

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #1 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 05:47:35 »
How can a Christian vote democrat?

 ::pondering:: ::headscratch:: ::reading:: ::shrug::

If you are speaking of voting a straight ticket, I have no idea.........now, I would suppose that there are some democrats who do not support abortion on demand, and quite often are more center-right than some republicans, so, in that case, I could see someone voting for an "individual" candidate who represents their values.

The abortion issue (while very important) isn't the only reason someone may choose to be a member of the democrat party instead of the repubs...............

 ::pondering::

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #1 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 05:47:35 »

Offline Mere Nick

  • Lee's Inner Circle Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12641
  • Manna: 307
  • Gender: Male
  • Reckon you could make me some biscuits?
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #2 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 08:11:30 »
Seriously. OK, they support social programs to help people. So what? So do our Churches, and our Churches provide the care and help much more effectively without near the amount of waste. So give us the money that is spent on social programs and we can give it to our Churches. As far as I can tell, that has to be the only reason.

Ah, but there is a major difference.  The churches raise money from people who voluntarily contribute.  The government takes whatever it wants from people under the real threat of coercive force. 

Quote
Not to mention that those on the left support abortion. I don't care how much good you are doing, if you support the killing of innocent life then I have no use for you. I know the same can be said for war and the death penalty. I'm against both of those as well. However, both sides create and fund wars and the death penalty is avoidable by not committing crimes. For me it all comes down to abortion. Jesus told us to love one another, how are we loving one another by sanctioning the murder of the unborn? Those that do it, those that support it, and those that vote for those that support all have innocent blood on their hands.

I'm hip.

Offline the_last_gunslinger

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 726
  • Manna: 8
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #3 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 15:56:28 »
I'm Christian, and I've voted straight ticket Democrat the last two elections. Won't be this year, but there is nothing inherently evil about the Democratic Party any more than the Republicans. If you agree mostly with one side, you're more likely to vote for multiple people who represent your position.

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #3 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 15:56:28 »

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #4 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 16:57:59 »
Nothing inherently evil except their blatant and unashamed support for abortion rights and ever increasing sicialism. Supporting Democrats nowadays makes no more sense than supporting George Wallace in 1968 because he had some good ideas. One bad one is more than enough.
« Last Edit: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 17:04:28 by Jaime »

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #4 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 16:57:59 »



Amo

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #5 on: Sat Mar 17, 2012 - 18:46:16 »
Quote
Ah, but there is a major difference.  The churches raise money from people who voluntarily contribute.  The government takes whatever it wants from people under the real threat of coercive force. 

I'm not sure that is true anymore, since the establishment of faith based initiatives.  Just how does one go about finding out which denominations or religions are receiving funds, and how much they get?  This is a reversal of attitude from that of the founding fathers.

    BILL FOR ESTABLISHING RELIGIOUS FREEDOM IN VIRGINIA (1799)

Well aware that Almighty God hath created the mind free; that all attempts to influence it by temporal punishments or burdens, or by civil incapacitations, tend only to beget habits of hypocrisy and meanness, and are a departure from the plan of the Holy Author of our religion, who being Lord both of body and mind, yet chose not to propagate it by coercions on either, as was in his Almighty power to do; that the impious presumption of legislators and rulers, civil as well as ecclesiastical, who, being themselves but fallible and uninspired men have assumed dominion over the faith of others, setting up there own opinions and modes of thinking as the only true and infallible, and as such endeavoring to impose them on others, hath established and maintained false religions over the greatest part of the world, and through all time; that to compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves, is sinful and tryannical; that even the forcing him to support this or that teacher of his own religious persuasion, is depriving him of the comfortable liberty of giving his contributions to the particular pastor whose morals he would make his pattern, and whose powers he feels most persuasive to righteousness, and is withdrawing from the ministry those temporal rewards, which proceeding from an approbation of their personal conduct, are an additional incitement to earnest and unremitting labors for the instruction of mankind; that our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions, more than our opinions in physics or geometry; that, therefore, the proscribing any citizen as unworthy the public confidence by laying upon him the incapacity of being called to the offices of trust and emolument, unless he profess or renounce this or that religious opoinion, is depriving him injuriously of those priviledges and advantages to which in common with his fellow citizens he has a natural right; that it tends also to corrupt the principles of that very religion it is meant to encourage, by bribing, with a monopoly of worldly honors and emoluments, those who will externally profess and conform to it; that though indeed these are criminal who do not withstand such temptation, yet neither are those innocent who lay the bait in their way; that to suffer the civil magistrate to intrude his powers into the feild of opoinion and to restrain the profession or propagation of principles, on the supposition of their ill tendency, is a dangerous fallacy, which at once destroys all religious liberty, because he being of course judge of that tendency, will make his opinions the rule of judgment, and approve or condemn the sentiments of others only as they shall square with or differ from his own; that it is time enough for the rightful purposes of civil government, for its offices to interfere when principles break out into overt acts against peace and good order; and finally, that truth is great and will prevail if left to herself, that she is proper and sufficient antagonist to error, and has nothing to fear from the conflict, unless by human interposition disarmed of her natural weapons, free argument and debate, errors ceasing to be dangerous when it is permitted freely to contradict them.
     Be it therefore enacted by the General Assembly, That no man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place or ministry whatsoever, nor shall be enforced, restrained, molested, or burthened in his body or goods, nor shall otherwise suffer on account of his religious opinions or belief; but that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of religion, and that the same shall in no wise diminish, enlarge, or affect their civil capacities.
     And though we well know this Assembly, elected for the people for the ordinary services of legislation only, have no power to restrain the acts of succeeding assemblies, constituted with the powers equal to our own, and that therefore to declare this act irrevocable, would be of no effect in law, yet we are free to declare, and do declare, that the rights hereby asserted are of the natural rights of mankind, and that if any act shall be hereafter passed to repeal the present or to narrow its operation, such act will be an infringement of natural right.



p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #6 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 05:04:18 »
Nothing inherently evil except their blatant and unashamed support for abortion rights and ever increasing sicialism. Supporting Democrats nowadays makes no more sense than supporting George Wallace in 1968 because he had some good ideas. One bad one is more than enough.


...........uh,  ::pondering::, many Repubs support abortion rights............  ::pondering::, and, in truth, every time the Repubs have had control of Congress, they have done ZILCH to address this issue...............  ::pondering::

The Repubs SAY the things Christian Conservatives want to hear, but they DO NOT (IMO) walk the walk.  So, if it's evil for the Dems, how is it not evil for the Repubs?  ::pondering:: ::shrug::

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #7 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 05:42:58 »
Quote from Jaime:

Supporting Democrats nowadays makes no more sense than supporting George Wallace in 1968 because he had some good ideas. One bad one is more than enough.
============================================================================


As I actually lived in Alabama during the 60's, and witnessed first hand the transformation that took place here during those years with regards to the racial attitudes, I will offer some thoughts on this comment.

1)  I saw the racial hatred of whites for blacks every day on display, howeve, not all who lived in Bama were racists who hated blacks, there were a minority who could see past racial hatred, and spoke of and sought equality.

2)  I saw the Selma to Montgomery march.............google video and you will see that not all the marchers were black.  Most?  Yes, but not all.

3)  I saw the Church bombing in Birmingham.  A horrible crime based completely on racial hatred, and in my opinion went a great way to being the end of segregation, for most everyone was outraged by this horrible crime, even some white racists paused to reflect on this act, and began to move away from their racst attitudes and seek a better understanding of the events taking place.

4)  As for Wallace, you would do well to remember that in his elections as Govenor, he received about 95% of the black vote every time.  Not all blacks wanted intergration.  There was a political powerbase of blacks who were just fine with segregation.  What they wanted was equal financial support, not intergration.  During his terms as Govenor, Wallace workd hand in hand with the black powerbase, and black school systems were greatly improved.  Housing for blacks was greatly improved as well.  As were health care, and job opportunities.  In some cities, when the State constructed new public housing for poor whites, right across the street, new public housing for poor blacks was constructed as well.  One such example of this was in Huntsville where Butler Terrace (projects for whites) was litterally only separaed from Bensen Court (project for blacks) by a narrow two lane road.

5)  Over the years there have been many rumors concerning just how close Wallace was working with the black political powerbase here in Bama.  One such rumor put foward (which I heard from two black buisness men in '71), was that the night before Wallace stood on the steps of the University of Alabama to deny black students entrance there, he had met with several members of the black community in Birmingham to discuss with them what would occur the next day, and why it had to be that way.

6)  Was Wallace a racist?  I suppose only God knows that for sure, he probably was in my opinion.  But FIRST, he was a Politician.  Wallace understood that in order to be elected, he needed BOTH the racist white votes, and the black vote.  Many people consider Bill Clinton to be the perfect Politician, but it is quite possible that Wallace had him beat at playing one side against another, and doing/saying what it took to be elected.

Now, I never voted for Wallace, nor would I have, but from what I saw firsthand of his Governorship, he was not the horrible racist he has always been made out to be.  He did what was necessary to win elections PUBLICLY, as for his private thoughts, I suppose no one knows what they were for sure.  Over the years, I saw "hardened" white racists transform into people I would never have believed they could become.  Former members of the KKK, were taking employment in new industries which hired both white and blacks, and as the two interacte with, and learned of eachother, much of the "hatred" disapeared, and some friendships were born where they would have never existed before.  

Many blacks will tell you/did tell me on several occasions, that they did not resent the Soutern white racists nearly as much as the Northern white racists?  Why?  Because, they said, with the Redneck Crackers, YOU KNEW they were racists, but the Northerners PRETENDED to be your friend, and were JUST AS racists as the Rednecks.  In essence, if you were black, you knew where you stood in the South, but up North, you never knew who would stab you in the back.  It's like that old saying "better the devil you know, than the one you don't."

............................................ ...........my thoughts.................................... .........

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #8 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 06:50:14 »
Nothing inherently evil except their blatant and unashamed support for abortion rights and ever increasing sicialism. Supporting Democrats nowadays makes no more sense than supporting George Wallace in 1968 because he had some good ideas. One bad one is more than enough.


...........uh,  ::pondering::, many Repubs support abortion rights............  ::pondering::, and, in truth, every time the Repubs have had control of Congress, they have done ZILCH to address this issue...............  ::pondering::

The Repubs SAY the things Christian Conservatives want to hear, but they DO NOT (IMO) walk the walk.  So, if it's evil for the Dems, how is it not evil for the Repubs?  ::pondering:: ::shrug::

Not true AT ALL. Without Republicans, we would not have Alito and Roberts on the supreme court. If we gain the Presidency in 2012, we will probably get to select at least one more, hopefully it will be replacing a liberal justice. But it will definitely not happen or get even close with a Democrat Presidency. If A Republican is pro-choice, he is a RINO. There are some Dems that are pro-life, but it makes no sense supporting and being part of party that is adamanatly pro-choice. Plus, to DO anything in Congress requires a 60+ majority in the Senate that hasn't happened for the GOP, YET. A 51/59 or a 54/46 majority won't do it. If people will get off their keester and vote, it could happen in 2012, for such things as the We the People Bill. As it has been, it is useless to bring up.

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #9 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 19:34:02 »
Nothing inherently evil except their blatant and unashamed support for abortion rights and ever increasing sicialism. Supporting Democrats nowadays makes no more sense than supporting George Wallace in 1968 because he had some good ideas. One bad one is more than enough.


...........uh,  ::pondering::, many Repubs support abortion rights............  ::pondering::, and, in truth, every time the Repubs have had control of Congress, they have done ZILCH to address this issue...............  ::pondering::

The Repubs SAY the things Christian Conservatives want to hear, but they DO NOT (IMO) walk the walk.  So, if it's evil for the Dems, how is it not evil for the Repubs?  ::pondering:: ::shrug::

Not true AT ALL. Without Republicans, we would not have Alito and Roberts on the supreme court. If we gain the Presidency in 2012, we will probably get to select at least one more, hopefully it will be replacing a liberal justice. But it will definitely not happen or get even close with a Democrat Presidency. If A Republican is pro-choice, he is a RINO. There are some Dems that are pro-life, but it makes no sense supporting and being part of party that is adamanatly pro-choice. Plus, to DO anything in Congress requires a 60+ majority in the Senate that hasn't happened for the GOP, YET. A 51/59 or a 54/46 majority won't do it. If people will get off their keester and vote, it could happen in 2012, for such things as the We the People Bill. As it has been, it is useless to bring up.

So you are saying that with the addition of Alito and Roberts, the Republican Congress and President immediately moved to end abortion rights?  And gosh, golly gee whizzzzzzzzzzzzzz .................they did it!

 ::disco:: ::juggle:: ::clappingoverhead::

 ::headscratch:: I musta missed the announcement, 'cause the last I heard the abortion mills in this Country were still going quite strong.

It does not require a 60 + majority in Congress to "WRITE, INTRODUCE, AND FIGHT FOR" anti-abortion legislation.  It does not require a 60 + majority to use every political tool available to shut down Congress until the issue is brought front and center in Congress and the demanding of a "up or down" vote outlawing any abortion other than "rape, incest, or life of the mother."

What it requires is courage, and someone ACTUALLY having CONVICTIONS!

Your response is the "potted meat" response of all repubs when they try to defend WHY they have not done a DING-DANG thing about the critical issues facing our Nation.

"well, gee, golly whizzzzzzzzzzzzz, those mean old nasty dems just won't let us do any thing, 'n' aw shucks, we don't have a 60 + majority, or a repub prez ya know?"

What the repubs need to do is GROW A PAIR, and have the courage of their convictions, AND GO TO WAR/TOE TO TOE with the dems.................yeah, right, like that will ever happen.

And iffin they ain't gonna do this, then they need to JUST SHUT UP about these "hot-button" campaign fodder issues.


Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #10 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 19:54:37 »
I never said or indicted that Roberts and Alito addition to the Supreme Court would immediately end abortion. Abortion itself is a 40 year old boil on the butt of the country, and to overturn it, we need to replace justices with good conservative ones in the hopes that a couple of liberal ones will retire.

What they need to do is get a 60 + majority in the Senate just as I said, and maintain the House. The Senate filibuster rules were to protect the minority party from the tyranny of the simple majority party. You know this. Even if every Republican in the Senate was adamantly anti-abortion, if they don't have more than 60% majority, the 40+% percent minority can stop anything they want stopped. Let's get a 60+ majority and the see what happens. Yeah if they screw up then we hang 'em. But you have to be cognizant of how both houses of comgress operate. It ain't at all where the simple majority gets its way. There has been duscyssions before about doing away with the Senate Filibuster rules, but both partiea realize what they would be giving up when they get in the minority. You do understand that a 52 to 48 majority in the Senate doesn't mean Jack Squat as to doing anything legislatively as to abortion? Remember 60+ majority, including removal of about 3 or 4 Northeastern Rinos, then we'll talk about getting something done. It is WAY more complicated than the GOP "growing a pair." Something to remember, PLEASE: a simple majority in the Senate don't mean much in the way of getting your way legislatively.

In the meantime adding conservative pro-life justices is an absolute must, but we have to achieve at least a dependable 5 to 4 majority, or we can just hope the Dems populate our courts with common sense conservatives. Also, Alito and Roberts might just come in handy in hopefully overturning Obamacare.

If we experience another foolish voter tantrum like 2006, we can kiss this country goodbye along with any hope of ever slowing the abortion mills down. With a GOP President and a 60+ majority for the GOP in the Senate, and some timely Supreme Court retirements of a couple of liberal justices, a whole paradigm shift will occur in regards to abortion.

Or we can foolishly claim one party is no better than the other one.

AGAIN, don't tell me that the GOP has had a majority and done nothing about it. A simple majority won't do it! It might as well be a simple minority. Think Super Majority of 60+ to overcome a fillibuster, which is the minority's trump card, and a very powerful one for sure.

Of course with Obama as President or any other Dem for that matter, BOTH houses of congress would have to muster a 2/3 vote to override a veto, therefore  it is not only a 60+ majority, it should be a 67+ majority in BOTH houses, not just the Senate. Right now of course, the Dems control the Senate, with a little more than a simple majority. We got a lotta work to do, and it involves hundreds of Statewide congressional races where Dems need to be replaced by Republicans. I'll do my part in Texas, if you will do your part in Alabama.
« Last Edit: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 20:20:10 by Jaime »

Lehigh

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #11 on: Thu Mar 22, 2012 - 20:52:32 »

     How can a Christian vote for Obama?

     He voted three times to let infant survivors of abortion die of neglect, forbidding their treatment.

     Now that bothers me a lot, on the abortion issue with Obama.

     

Offline the_distance_betweenus

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 16
  • Manna: 1
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #12 on: Fri Mar 23, 2012 - 02:07:04 »
Honestly, I don't believe in voting party line, never have, never will. There are great ideas out of each camp, but I would personally like an intelligent moderate to come out of the bleachers and make a solid run. Yes, abortion may be hideous, but the reality is, the president isnt going to change that. Theres too much political gain in leaving it be because of swing voters like yourself. If republicans 'fix it' in the next election they can't levy it the election after that or the one after that and they lose those one issue voters which they prey on.

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #13 on: Fri Mar 23, 2012 - 05:23:40 »
I never said or indicted that Roberts and Alito addition to the Supreme Court would immediately end abortion. Abortion itself is a 40 year old boil on the butt of the country, and to overturn it, we need to replace justices with good conservative ones in the hopes that a couple of liberal ones will retire.

What they need to do is get a 60 + majority in the Senate just as I said, and maintain the House. The Senate filibuster rules were to protect the minority party from the tyranny of the simple majority party. You know this. Even if every Republican in the Senate was adamantly anti-abortion, if they don't have more than 60% majority, the 40+% percent minority can stop anything they want stopped. Let's get a 60+ majority and the see what happens. Yeah if they screw up then we hang 'em. But you have to be cognizant of how both houses of comgress operate. It ain't at all where the simple majority gets its way. There has been duscyssions before about doing away with the Senate Filibuster rules, but both partiea realize what they would be giving up when they get in the minority. You do understand that a 52 to 48 majority in the Senate doesn't mean Jack Squat as to doing anything legislatively as to abortion? Remember 60+ majority, including removal of about 3 or 4 Northeastern Rinos, then we'll talk about getting something done. It is WAY more complicated than the GOP "growing a pair." Something to remember, PLEASE: a simple majority in the Senate don't mean much in the way of getting your way legislatively.

In the meantime adding conservative pro-life justices is an absolute must, but we have to achieve at least a dependable 5 to 4 majority, or we can just hope the Dems populate our courts with common sense conservatives. Also, Alito and Roberts might just come in handy in hopefully overturning Obamacare.

If we experience another foolish voter tantrum like 2006, we can kiss this country goodbye along with any hope of ever slowing the abortion mills down. With a GOP President and a 60+ majority for the GOP in the Senate, and some timely Supreme Court retirements of a couple of liberal justices, a whole paradigm shift will occur in regards to abortion.

Or we can foolishly claim one party is no better than the other one.

AGAIN, don't tell me that the GOP has had a majority and done nothing about it. A simple majority won't do it! It might as well be a simple minority. Think Super Majority of 60+ to overcome a fillibuster, which is the minority's trump card, and a very powerful one for sure.

Of course with Obama as President or any other Dem for that matter, BOTH houses of congress would have to muster a 2/3 vote to override a veto, therefore  it is not only a 60+ majority, it should be a 67+ majority in BOTH houses, not just the Senate. Right now of course, the Dems control the Senate, with a little more than a simple majority. We got a lotta work to do, and it involves hundreds of Statewide congressional races where Dems need to be replaced by Republicans. I'll do my part in Texas, if you will do your part in Alabama.

........geessssshhhhhhh............stop with the "potted meat" excuses will ya?  Seriously, BOTH sides use the same argument to explain WHY they don't EVER get anydarnthing done............

I always do my part with regards to Alabama, but I will not vote for someone who does not deserve to be, nor is qualified to be President..............That ain't gonna happen, and folks can cry all they want to about it..............

HOW ABOUT THIS!  LET THE REPUBS TRY NOMINATING SOMEONE WHO IS ACTUALLY QUALIFIED?  Instead of crying about folks not voting for their worthless nominees..........AW SNAP!, what a strange concept.............

 ::pondering:: ::headscratch:: ya mean we gotta actually find someone who is QUALIFIED to be President?  ::shrug::

......yeah, repubs, that would be nice for a change......the nearest you've come since Ike was Ronnie, but he's long gone ya know?  Quit trying to live offin his coat tails, 'n' actually put forth a worthy candidate...........then see how many folks come out to vote.,.,

 ::pondering:: ::doh:: ::shrug:: ::frustrated:: ::destroyingcomputer::

(........yeah, right........like that's ever gonna happen)

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #14 on: Fri Mar 23, 2012 - 05:57:41 »
I never said or indicted that Roberts and Alito addition to the Supreme Court would immediately end abortion. Abortion itself is a 40 year old boil on the butt of the country, and to overturn it, we need to replace justices with good conservative ones in the hopes that a couple of liberal ones will retire.

What they need to do is get a 60 + majority in the Senate just as I said, and maintain the House. The Senate filibuster rules were to protect the minority party from the tyranny of the simple majority party. You know this. Even if every Republican in the Senate was adamantly anti-abortion, if they don't have more than 60% majority, the 40+% percent minority can stop anything they want stopped. Let's get a 60+ majority and the see what happens. Yeah if they screw up then we hang 'em. But you have to be cognizant of how both houses of comgress operate. It ain't at all where the simple majority gets its way. There has been duscyssions before about doing away with the Senate Filibuster rules, but both partiea realize what they would be giving up when they get in the minority. You do understand that a 52 to 48 majority in the Senate doesn't mean Jack Squat as to doing anything legislatively as to abortion? Remember 60+ majority, including removal of about 3 or 4 Northeastern Rinos, then we'll talk about getting something done. It is WAY more complicated than the GOP "growing a pair." Something to remember, PLEASE: a simple majority in the Senate don't mean much in the way of getting your way legislatively.

In the meantime adding conservative pro-life justices is an absolute must, but we have to achieve at least a dependable 5 to 4 majority, or we can just hope the Dems populate our courts with common sense conservatives. Also, Alito and Roberts might just come in handy in hopefully overturning Obamacare.

If we experience another foolish voter tantrum like 2006, we can kiss this country goodbye along with any hope of ever slowing the abortion mills down. With a GOP President and a 60+ majority for the GOP in the Senate, and some timely Supreme Court retirements of a couple of liberal justices, a whole paradigm shift will occur in regards to abortion.

Or we can foolishly claim one party is no better than the other one.

AGAIN, don't tell me that the GOP has had a majority and done nothing about it. A simple majority won't do it! It might as well be a simple minority. Think Super Majority of 60+ to overcome a fillibuster, which is the minority's trump card, and a very powerful one for sure.

Of course with Obama as President or any other Dem for that matter, BOTH houses of congress would have to muster a 2/3 vote to override a veto, therefore  it is not only a 60+ majority, it should be a 67+ majority in BOTH houses, not just the Senate. Right now of course, the Dems control the Senate, with a little more than a simple majority. We got a lotta work to do, and it involves hundreds of Statewide congressional races where Dems need to be replaced by Republicans. I'll do my part in Texas, if you will do your part in Alabama.

........geessssshhhhhhh............stop with the "potted meat" excuses will ya?  Seriously, BOTH sides use the same argument to explain WHY they don't EVER get anydarnthing done............

I always do my part with regards to Alabama, but I will not vote for someone who does not deserve to be, nor is qualified to be President..............That ain't gonna happen, and folks can cry all they want to about it..............

HOW ABOUT THIS!  LET THE REPUBS TRY NOMINATING SOMEONE WHO IS ACTUALLY QUALIFIED?  Instead of crying about folks not voting for their worthless nominees..........AW SNAP!, what a strange concept.............

 ::pondering:: ::headscratch:: ya mean we gotta actually find someone who is QUALIFIED to be President?  ::shrug::

......yeah, repubs, that would be nice for a change......the nearest you've come since Ike was Ronnie, but he's long gone ya know?  Quit trying to live offin his coat tails, 'n' actually put forth a worthy candidate...........then see how many folks come out to vote.,.,

 ::pondering:: ::doh:: ::shrug:: ::frustrated:: ::destroyingcomputer::

(........yeah, right........like that's ever gonna happen)


Just tell me you understand the fillibuster thing. If you do, then you won't use the potted meat description. The congressional rules are what they are. The 60+ rule is there for a reason and both parties don't like it when they are in the majority, but they think it is absolutely necessary when they are in the minority. I would not want to unleash a Harry Reid led Senate on the country without the fillibuster rule. Nor would most Democrats with a Republican majority. Yes there are 3 or 4 Rinos that consistently vote with the Dems and give them the edge they need on some stuff like Obamacare, but it ain't a problem with all Republicans. You sift out 3 or 4 Northeastern Republicans, and you've got a whole different looking mix. Of course that is up to the Northeastern voters and not me or you, but it is what it is.

Alfred Combes

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #15 on: Fri Mar 23, 2012 - 09:37:33 »
By not voting or voting a write in candidate, P. Rehbein is voting Democrat.

Offline Roscoe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 13
  • Manna: 0
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #16 on: Sat Mar 24, 2012 - 12:48:43 »
I'm a Christian Conservative.  I'm not a Conservative just because I'm a Christian, nor the other way around.

I also associate myself with the "Conservative" school of thought, rather than as a "Republican."  The Republican Party is a corrupt and unconstitutional entity, just like the Democratic Party.  These organized parties have overrun our system and corrupted it beyond belief.  I will not associate with either.

I used logic to decide both my faith and politics.

In my eyes, Democrats claim to be doing "the Christian thing" by helping the poor.  That's how they spin it, while simultaneously making Conservatives look like a bunch of old religious men who care about nothing but corporations and greed.

However, I think the Bible says that we should all give willingly.  Where this diverges from the Dems is that they are essentially forcing people to give to flawed social welfare programs.  Add to this the fact that our corrupt government (I'm talking about Repubs AND Dems here) has never run any of these programs in a sustainable fashion.  EVER.

When Dems force people to pay into these programs they are, in effect, punishing those who are working hard for their livings.  The world view that Dems share, that everyone should be EQUAL, is just plain wrong, sick, and unrealistic to maintain.  The truth is that we have laws in place that allow everyone an equal opportunity at employment.  Many of the unfortunate find their way back into the workforce eventually, but many more people exploit the system.  The fallacy that Dems fall into is that life isn't "fair" to those people, but what they ignore is that when they force us to bail these people out, it isn't FAIR to those who are trying to put food on their own tables.

VOLUNTARY.  That's the key word here.

Conservatives want to help people too, we just go about it in a more sustainable way.  Yes, this may mean cutting back on benefits while we figure out something that works.  Sacrifices.  These are the kinds of things Dems just don't understand.  They want miracles, and they want them NOW.. at whatever cost (usually yours and mine).

On Abortion:
There are fallacies here too.

Republicans are viewed as those who will stop this abortion madness.  Have any of them lifted a serious finger to do so?  No.  We should let go of this fallacy and quit voting for people simply on this issue.  The only thing that will stop abortion is when Jesus returns.

The Republicans' actions on this closely mirror those of Dems and they all have the same interests: getting votes for re-election.  It's selfish on their part, and therein lies the corruption that hinders progress.

On Homosexuality:
This is another huge fallacy.

Republicans are viewed as those who will stop homosexual marriage.  Dems are touted as the harbingers of this issue.  The truth is that every time a state brings this up for vote, the local legislature struggles with it and party lines are blurred.  These never turn out to be partisan votes.  There are Repubs voting 'yes' and Dems voting 'no.'  Every time. 

These are all spins that I pin on the Democrats, who want to put up the facade that they and they alone are the progressive force pulling against the woebegone Republicans who only want to hold society back and discriminate against anyone who isn't a straight white Christian male.  False.  People who believe this bullcrap are soft-headed and should not walk outside of their own front doors without assistance, because it is apparent that they have no self-guided thought whatsoever.  I choose to not live like a robot.  You?

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #17 on: Sat Mar 24, 2012 - 19:20:29 »
Rosco, abortion will be addressed when The GOP can overcome a Dem Fillibuster. When the GOP has had a simple majority un the senate, the Sems have always had the fillibuater trump card. for something so momentus to come out of congress, the GOP or conservatives must have a 60+ majority, AND if we don't get the Presidency, we must have a 2/3 or 67 vote majority in the Senate. Let's get to work and make it happen or complain about why a sumple majority cannot get it done. Truth is a simple majority CAN'T. It's really a simple math issue. Plus the confirmation of Supreme Court justices is ALL important. If Obama gets a second term and gets the opportunity to replace a conservative justice or 2, abortion will be out of reach for another generation.

I vote Republican because it is the best available option to defeat Democrats, but I have no live for the party structure. I would align myself with a tribe of pygmies with uncontrolable flatulence if they had the best chance to defeat Democrats.
« Last Edit: Sat Mar 24, 2012 - 19:29:34 by Jaime »

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #18 on: Sun Mar 25, 2012 - 05:32:16 »
By not voting or voting a write in candidate, P. Rehbein is voting Democrat.


That is so very completely untrue that you should be ashamed of yourself............sigh............not only am I not voting democrat (for Obama which is what you really mean, I'm not voting republican, for those other unqualified guys either).

Y'all can make up all the sorry junk you want, it doesn't change the real truth.............vote for who you wish, it is your right, I don't care who you vote for, or why, or how many times for that matter, but you guys need to get a life, and a grip on reality.....


p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #19 on: Sun Mar 25, 2012 - 05:37:04 »
From Jaime:

Just tell me you understand the fillibuster thing. If you do, then you won't use the potted meat description. The congressional rules are what they are. The 60+ rule is there for a reason and both parties don't like it when they are in the majority, but they think it is absolutely necessary when they are in the minority. I would not want to unleash a Harry Reid led Senate on the country without the fillibuster rule. Nor would most Democrats with a Republican majority. Yes there are 3 or 4 Rinos that consistently vote with the Dems and give them the edge they need on some stuff like Obamacare, but it ain't a problem with all Republicans. You sift out 3 or 4 Northeastern Republicans, and you've got a whole different looking mix. Of course that is up to the Northeastern voters and not me or you, but it is what it is.
=======================================================

reposting my earlier comment..................which shows that I understand the Fillibuster thingy, and, I also have an acceptable knowledge of Congressional proccess, as well as a better than average knowledge of the Constitution.  

(earlier comment)  It does not require a 60 + majority in Congress to "WRITE, INTRODUCE, AND FIGHT FOR" anti-abortion legislation.  It does not require a 60 + majority to use every political tool available to shut down Congress until the issue is brought front and center in Congress and the demanding of a "up or down" vote outlawing any abortion other than "rape, incest, or life of the mother."

What it requires is courage, and someone ACTUALLY having CONVICTIONS!

Your response is the "potted meat" response of all repubs when they try to defend WHY they have not done a DING-DANG thing about the critical issues facing our Nation.

"well, gee, golly whizzzzzzzzzzzzz, those mean old nasty dems just won't let us do any thing, 'n' aw shucks, we don't have a 60 + majority, or a repub prez ya know?"

What the repubs need to do is GROW A PAIR, and have the courage of their convictions, AND GO TO WAR/TOE TO TOE with the dems.................yea h, right, like that will ever happen.

And iffin they ain't gonna do this, then they need to JUST SHUT UP about these "hot-button" campaign fodder issues.

========================================

"potted meat" is not in reference to Congressional process, but, rather, in reference to the "canned excuses" BOTH parties spew forth each time they are questioned on why they haven't done anydarnthing to address the real issues that face our Nation.


Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #20 on: Sun Mar 25, 2012 - 06:47:05 »
I understand potted meat and your responses are that. Take your time  and give us a serious response as to how a Republican Majority in Congress (2002 thru 2006) with less than 60+ in the Senate would have passed a bill curtailing abortion.

And obviously from your response(s) you don't understand the filibuster rule. Which is a pretty simple concept even for baloney purveyors.  ::smile:: A simple majority is capable of getting little done without being STOPPED in its tracks by the opposition. We are not talking quantum physics here. It's simply one of the well thought out, extremely effective checks and balances installed by the wise founders, who designed a system where if you want to make big big changes, you must have way more than just a simple majority. Ingenious, but extremely frustrating. Control of the House and 52 or 53 GOP Senators ain't gonna feed the bulldog. It must be 60+. That is if you want to see conservative change that can't be thwarted constitutionally thwarted. Or we can scream uselessly like a stuck hog when nothing gets done, and we well know why, we don't have a big enough majority - an national electoral problem, even though you and I may HAVE done our part in Texas and Alabama.

Roe v Wade was the result an over reaching activist court. Therefore we still must ensure that conservative justices are put in, which will only happen with the GOP in total control, not just partial control as with Reagan and Bush Sr. When they had to nominate more moderate justices to get them confirmed by their Democrat Senates.

Plus Alfred is correct.  ::takingphoto::
« Last Edit: Sun Mar 25, 2012 - 18:23:06 by Jaime »

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #21 on: Wed Mar 28, 2012 - 18:02:46 »
I've commented on the "how to" many times in the past...............

Read the Constitution, and you will discover the "how to."

Especially if you read the Article which outlines the powers of SCOTUS.


Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #22 on: Wed Mar 28, 2012 - 21:31:10 »
All you need to remember is that a Democrat President and a Democrat Senate will ensure a liberal supreme court.

Lehigh

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #23 on: Wed Mar 28, 2012 - 21:33:59 »
 

       

     

p.rehbein

  • Guest
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #24 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 06:03:02 »
Reposted from my comment earlier:

It does not require a 60 + majority in Congress to "WRITE, INTRODUCE, AND FIGHT FOR" anti-abortion legislation.  It does not require a 60 + majority to use every political tool available to shut down Congress until the issue is brought front and center in Congress and the demanding of a "up or down" vote outlawing any abortion other than "rape, incest, or life of the mother."

What it requires is courage, and someone ACTUALLY having CONVICTIONS!
====================================================================

Quoted from Jamie's comment earlier:

I understand potted meat and your responses are that. Take your time  and give us a serious response as to how a Republican Majority in Congress (2002 thru 2006) with less than 60+ in the Senate would have passed a bill curtailing abortion.

And obviously from your response(s) you don't understand the filibuster rule. Which is a pretty simple concept even for baloney purveyors
=======================================================================

Perchance had you fully understood my comment earlier, you would have seen that I was speaking of today's Congress, where the Repubs have a majority in the House, but not the Senate.  And, had you fully understood my comment earlier, you would have noticed that I clearly stated "IT DOES NOT REQUIRE A 60+ MAJORITY TO USE EVERY POLITICAL TOOL AVAILABLE......." which directly referrs to the "filibuster" option, as well as other options that are available to Congressional personnel.

Now, that being said....................I have stated several times in the past here that had the Republicans and "W" really wanted to address the issue of abortion during the two years that they held the majority in both Houses and the Presidency, they could have done so.  In most cases, it ONLY REQUIRES a "simple majority" to pass legislation, and send it to the President for signature.  To assure that the legislation is "veto proof," the Senate would need a 60+ majority of votes to overturn a Presidential veto.  Howeverm in this case I seriously doubt that "W" would have vetoed legislation restricting abortions.

Two Repub members of the House, and two Repub Senators had only to write legislation that stated (in a nutshell) that the only lawful abortions that could be performed in America were ones which were specifically related to "rape, incest, or life of the mother."  In this legislation, they would be certain to include language that stated that SCOTUS would not have the Judicial authority to entertain any legal challenge to this legislation.  As SCOTUS would not have that authority, neither would any "lesser court."  Effectively, this legislation (when passed and signed) would overturn Roe v. Wade, and severly decrease the number of abortions that are currently performed every year in America.  My best guess estimation (based on info read in the Journal of American Medicin) is that of the over 50 million abortions that have been performed, only about 1 and 1/2 to 2 percent of them were based on "rape, incest, or life of the mother."  Given that information, it is easy to understand that millions upon millions of unborn children would have been saved from the abortionists trade. 

It would only require a simple majority in both the House and the Senate to pass this legislation.  A simple majority is 50% of those members present to vote + 1.  It would not have required a 60+ majority.  NOW, given todays situation, it would require a 60+ majority in the Senate to be sure to have the votes to override Obama's veto of the legislation.......however, since the Dems are in control of the Senate currently, even the possibility of the legislation being brought up for a up or down vote is nigh impossible to imagine.

HOWEVER, in many of my comments (which folks just seem to skim over without fully understanding what I'm saying), I have stated again and again, IF THE REPUBS REALLY HAVE THE COURAGE OF THEIR CONVICTIONS as they tell us all during the campaigns for reelection, and the really want to do something about the abortion issue.  THEY CAN!  They could have at any time since Roe v. Wade was spewed out upon America by an unConstitutional ruling from a liberal activist SCOTUS.

They can at any time during Congress being in session, bring up the issue and CLEARLY STATE to one and all that UNTIL this issue is ADDRESSED, DEBATED, AND THE UNCONSTITUTIONAL RULING OF SCOTUS IN ROE V. WADE is corrected,

THERE WILL BE NO FURTHER BUISNESS CONDUCTED!  NONE! NADA! ZIP! ZILCH! ZERO!

FORGETABOUTIT!  Government SHUTDOWN.....................

(...............yeah, your right, that would require that the Repubs ACTUALLY have the courage of their convictions, regardless of the consenquences they might face for their actions............and that ain't gonna happen, 'cause as I stated earlier, they just ain't got what it takes to DO WHATEVER IT TAKES to address and correct this wrongdoing by SCOTUS)

In truth, I believe that the Repubs actually believe that this issue of abortion is more valuable to them as a "hot-button" campaign issue than one they should actually address and correct.

(.............my thoughts...................)

   

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #25 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 06:46:25 »
How is that going to change the minds of the entrenched folks in Congress that are pro-choice? Most voters with sense know what it takes to get something DONE about abortion. It takes a sufficient majority to overcome a fillibuster and a sufficient majority to overcome a Presidential veto when a Dem is in that office. It isn't an issue of stomping our feet and grinding congress to a halt unsuccessfully. The Constitution defined exactly how these things should be addressed. We could amend the constiitution to change the rules, but of course that is even more difficult, for a reason. It's about working within the system to correct something that was fostered within the system. It's an issue that needs to be defeated at the voting booth. That's how a free people speak out.

But yeah, you need to stay home p.rhebein. Please don't vote.
« Last Edit: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 06:53:36 by Jaime »

Offline DaveW

  • Lee's Inner Circle Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 14274
  • Manna: 189
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #26 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 07:05:35 »
How can a Christian vote Democrat?  Good question.

A second is likened unto it: How can a Christian vote Republican?

Democrats embrace gay "rights" and are pro abortion.
Republicans embrace racism and oppress the poor.

Democrats oppose any religion.
Republicans tell us that Islam is a peace loving religion.

Democrats lean toward a 'big brother' type of government which is involved in every area of life.
Republicans are for little or no government.

I find all these positons to be unbiblical - even the "little or no government" part which is described as a curse in the bible.

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #27 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 07:40:18 »
Dave, I disagree with the statement that Republicans oppress the poor. Is the Slavery of dependence that Dems foist on the poor not oppression? Is the Republican desire to EMPOWER the poor, "teach them to fish" stance oppression, I don't think so. And where are you getting that Republicans embrace racism? Ever heard of southern Democrats opposed to the Civil Rights bill? I am a Republican and I don't know anyone who want's no government. Less? Of course. And a WHOLE lot of Republicans disagree with Bush's declaration that Islam is a peace loving religion. It was probably expedient to say that at the time, but that's about all it was. Also, I don't think it's fair to say Democrats oppose religion. Some don't understand religions place in the public arena.



Online Johnb

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11642
  • Manna: 168
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #28 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 07:48:04 »
How can a Christian vote Democrat?  Good question.

A second is likened unto it: How can a Christian vote Republican?

Democrats embrace gay "rights" and are pro abortion.
Republicans embrace racism and oppress the poor.

Democrats oppose any religion.
Republicans tell us that Islam is a peace loving religion.

Democrats lean toward a 'big brother' type of government which is involved in every area of life.
Republicans are for little or no government.

I find all these positons to be unbiblical - even the "little or no government" part which is described as a curse in the bible.






1. Republicans do not embrace racism.  The republican party was formed on one issue that being the end of slavery.  The civil rights law was passed with 90plus percent of republicans voting for in and would not have passed if left to the democrat party.  It was democrats standing in the school house doors with ball bats and ax handles to block integration of the schools.

2. Republicans do not as a group claim Islam is a peace loving religion.  I know I do not claim that.

3. How do republican oppress the poor by not voting for more income for no work bills? Facts please.

4.  Republicans are for smaller government with more individual responsibility.  It is the LP that favor almost no government.  

5. Perhaps you might want to do a little fact checking before declaring absurd positions for others.  
  

Offline DaveW

  • Lee's Inner Circle Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 14274
  • Manna: 189
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #29 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 08:06:30 »
1 - David Duke, a grand dragon of the Louisiana KKK ran for President on the Repubilcan ticket.  The GOP national committe supported him.  That is very racist.

2 - It was all president Bush jr had to say about islam. He incorrectly stated that islam is frendly to us and our cause, and that only "radicals" and "extremists" who had a "hijacked" form of islam were opposed to us.

3 - The GOP is traditonally free trade and anti minimum wage and worker protection.  They would LOVE for manufacturers to be able to hire people for 5 cents an hour. They oppose OSHA rules and seek to minimize liability in workplace injury and death. They also oppose any kind of workmans comp, unemployment benefits and any form of welfare. 

4 - Ron Paul is running as a republican and has formerly been involved with the Liberatarians who are for NO GOVERNMENT.  As with David Duke, the national and state GOP councils are allowing and supporting his candidacy in the primary season. THat means they are prepared to support HIS agenda should he take the nomination. (unlikely I know)

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #30 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 08:13:00 »
David Duke's voter support or lack thereof should be the measure. The GOP is not racist anymore than the Dems are racists because Robert Byrd was once in the KKK. Let's use some sense here.

http://hnn.us/blogs/entries/3554.html
« Last Edit: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 08:23:14 by Jaime »

Offline DaveW

  • Lee's Inner Circle Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 14274
  • Manna: 189
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #31 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 08:26:35 »
David Duke's voter support or lack thereof should be the measure. The GOP is not racist anymore than the Dems are racists because Robert Byrd was once in the KKK. Let's use some sense here.
Yeah - the dems are probably more racist than the repubs. Their elaborate welfare scheme seems custom engineered to keep blacks in poverty. And their over-the-top support of Planned Parenthood proves it.  That orginization was started to eliminate blacks, Italians and other lower classes from the US via birth control.

My point is that both main parties are corrupt and unbiblical.

Online Johnb

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11642
  • Manna: 168
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #32 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 08:36:55 »
You can find corruption in any system including Christianity.  Your individual cases are no more valid than condemning Christianity because of Jim Jones or a pedophile priest or a CoC preacher that gets arrested for sexual assault.

The parties can not be unbiblical because the powers that be are there by the will of God.

Offline Jaime

  • (Pronounced Hi-Me, not Ja-Me)
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30686
  • Manna: 627
  • Gender: Male
  • I AM A DEPLORABLE
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #33 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 09:41:19 »
It's always a case of least worst or most worst, since Jesus ain't running.

Offline Captain Shays

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 181
  • Manna: 7
    • View Profile
Re: How can a Christian vote Democrat?
« Reply #34 on: Thu Mar 29, 2012 - 14:46:27 »
1 - David Duke, a grand dragon of the Louisiana KKK ran for President on the Repubilcan ticket.  The GOP national committe supported him.  That is very racist.

2 - It was all president Bush jr had to say about islam. He incorrectly stated that islam is frendly to us and our cause, and that only "radicals" and "extremists" who had a "hijacked" form of islam were opposed to us.

3 - The GOP is traditonally free trade and anti minimum wage and worker protection.  They would LOVE for manufacturers to be able to hire people for 5 cents an hour. They oppose OSHA rules and seek to minimize liability in workplace injury and death. They also oppose any kind of workmans comp, unemployment benefits and any form of welfare. 

4 - Ron Paul is running as a republican and has formerly been involved with the Liberatarians who are for NO GOVERNMENT.  As with David Duke, the national and state GOP councils are allowing and supporting his candidacy in the primary season. THat means they are prepared to support HIS agenda should he take the nomination. (unlikely I know)
Did you EVER tyake the time to read WHY David Duke supports Ron Paul? If you had, you would know that it's not because Ron Paul is a racist or agrees with David Duke's positions.

Don't believe me. Take the time to go there yourself and read it for yourself. Duke supports Ron Paul beccause Ron Paul is for lower taxes, limited government, non interventionist foreign policy and sound money. David Duke agrees with those things and NEVER mentions that he thinks Ron Paul is a racist or agrees with him.

It's like this. Suppose Charles Mansion is opposed to child molestors and so do you. Does that mean you agree with his murders?