You know, that's what I used to think, but I'm not so sure anymore.  This way, the Republicans will have to take the heat for bringing him down, and she still comes out smelling like a rose.  She's patient.

Yes, phoebe that is how I see it but I also think there is a lot more going on than any of us can even imagine that involves both parties.  I always felt that it was decided long before any of us even heard of Obama that he was going to be elected in 2008 and I think that even Clintons knew this.  Just a gut feeling (no proof) the way everything came down and I could be wrong.

Gizzy

Hillary could make huge gains by resigning and playing triangulation like Bill did....NOW, even challenging Obama in the next primary, even if losing, setting herself for the next cycle. As it stands, if she hangs thru 4 or 8 years, she can forget ANY moderate support, which she will need.

Prove it. Here is the law that defines natural born citizens (see paragraph G).

The president spending a million dollars on lawyers is not an absurd amount of money and its for all legal services provided from a certain law firm over a certain period of time--some of which was dealing with frivolous lawsuits. Presidents have spent far more on lawyers in a much shorter period of time like Bush spent $8 million on lawyers in Florida during the recount (I voted for Bush twice BTW).

So the reason you believe in this urban legend is because...I should watch the youtube video and then look up the information myself. That IS persuasive logic...

A question by whom? Ann Dunham, Obama's mother, was born on November 29th 1942 in Wichita, Kansas.

Concerning what is a natural-born citizen, BOTH parents must be U.S. citizens or the person must be born in the mainland United States according to the U.S. Constitution, Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5 and was upheld in the court cases U.S. versus Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898) and Perkins versus Elg, 307 U.S. 325 (1939).


How many times do people here have to repeat it? It's much easier to post a video then to type it all up. You can play dumb all you want, you're really good at it, but it's easy to see past your game.

There were several reports when he won senate election that he was Kenyan born. That's not a problem because to be a senator you don't have to be a natural-born citizen. Obama himself stated that the political experts he consulted with wrongly estimated that the highest he could possibly go in the election was 4th behind Hillary, Edwards, some other candidate whose name I can't think of but is irrelevant. So it's likely that he, as others before him, ran for President for his own publicity without even thinking he had a real shot of winning. What could he have wanted to promote you might ask? His books for one thing. And even before the election he had sold millions of dollars worth of books. So why worry about the detail of his birth. It would be even more publicity he had to stop his campaign because of it. Think of the book deals!

Obviously that's a possibility of why he'd run knowing he wasn't eligible. But I've also talked to my lawyer friends and they say that he can keep it tied up in the courts until he's out of the White House if he has slick lawyers. And being a lawyer himself, well you could see why he might himself believe that as well.

Anyway there are all kinds of evidences and if you watch that YouTube video I posted, it is not THE source, it provides the sources. But that's only if you want honest discussion in which you objectively weigh the evidence. If you want to just keep laying a game of debate, then by all means pretend that I'm presenting some random video on YouTube as THE source even though I'm not. The YouTube video I'm linking to now and have before is the case of Phillip Berg who, in addition to being a lifelong Democrat, served as a Democratic Committeeman for 31 years. He is and also a paid-up life member of NAACP. The YouTube video (linked to again) is Phillip Bergs actual case. So rather than type out what the video says, why not one of the actual prosecuting lawyers who is also a lifelong Democrat actually tell you the evidence he has?

But the most obvious reason to suspect Obama is not a natural-born citizen is that he has spent $1.4 million dollars hiding the very document that would show if he is or is not. Since the negative consequences of revealing such a document would be that it would show he's not a natural-born citizen, it is perfectly reasonable to believe that to be the reason he has spent so much money and time hiding it from judges.

That alone is all the evidence one needs to believe that Barack Obama should produce his birth certificate. Obama spending any amount of money to keep from showing his birth certificate begs the question of anyone with a logical cell between their ears: WHY? Why would the United States President allow there to be any questions unless the questions did less harm to him than revealing the facts?

If there's nothing TO hide, he wouldn't BE hiding. A very simple request has been made of him by a federal judge and it's a shame that it has gone this far without him producing it. If he is a natural born citizen there would be no problem in simply showing his birth certificate to the judge. It's just that simple. No one who is honest and in his right mind could conclude that Obama is NOT hiding his birth certificate.

HUH? The section you cited says this "No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President" and it is related to the qualifications of the presidency and does not define what a natural born citizen is. It doesn't say any of that stuff that you just said it does.

Both of Wong Kim Ark's parents were foreign born immigrants and he was born here in the US. This case established the principle that if a baby is born in the US then it is automatically a citizen. It doesn't address the question of a baby born to a US citizen outside the country.

This case again relates to an immigrant who has two foreign parents and the precedent of the case deals with dual citizenship. What does this have to do with anything?

Did you even look at those cases or did you just copy and past that from somewhere? I mean really, with all due respect, I'm pointing you to the actual law of the US that explicitly defines what a natural born citizen is and it seems as though you responded with a blatantly incorrect claim about the constitution and then two completely irrelevant court cases. The law explicitly states that a kid born outside the country to a US citizen parent and an alien parent is still a natural born citizen. How do you argue around paragraph G of this immigration law? Its not new either, its been a similar principle since the original Naturalization Act of 1790. I ultimately don't know that all of the  requirements would be satisfied for Obama to be a natural born citizen in the hypothetical case that he was not born in the US, but I do know that a kid does not literally have to be born inside US territory to be a natural born citizen--that is a myth and a very common misunderstanding of citizenship laws.

Those court cases established interpretations where the court had to define what a natural-born citizen was. It was the outlying statements from the court that I wanted to be seen. But feel free to try to distract and muddy the waters by suggesting I "copied and pasted" something (the horror!).

But before I get into that, you posted a link where you say that "the law explicitly states that a kid born outside the country to a US citizen parent and an alien parent is still a natural born citizen." You stopped there. But your source didn't. I'll just "copy and paste" it here. I'm sure that discredits the content or me in some way.

(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
             (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
             (B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and

(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

It says exactly what I said and others. If someone is born outside of the United States, then one of his/her parents must be U.S. military or with the appropriate international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22. Obama's mother was not in the military or with any international organization.

Therefore, the only way for Obama to be a natural-born citizen is for him to be born within the United States or a territory. And if he was born in the United States he would have already handed over his birth certificate because he'd have nothing to hide. But he does, so he's hiding.