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Offline LightHammer

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Obama-Opposers
« on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 05:10:22 »
While using "opposers" for the lack thereof of a better word, I just wanted to better underdstand why people don't like Obama so much? Now I'm a black guy from Indiana and all I ever hear when I ask other black people I know why they think other people oppose Obama they alsways try to make it out to be a race issue. I know racism still exists in the world but I don't think its the main underlying platform for "Obama-haters".

I don't really know too much when it comes to politics. "A soldier has the pleasure of looking his enemy in the eye", Maximus Decimus Meredius, Gladitor

But really I'm an independent by default so I'm really just asking.

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Obama-Opposers
« on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 05:10:22 »

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #1 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 05:46:42 »
I'd better get in here now, because I know most will disagree with this.

Many white people I know also think that race is behind the rhetoric. I certainly think it contributes to it. So much of what you hear has a 'he's not one of us' subtext--see the birth certificate flap (many who use this don't see its racist origins) or Gingrich's Kenyan tribesman comment. While that's part of it, I think there's more.

The right has moved further and further to the right over the last few decades, and now many, with their views constantly reinforced by a special brand of media that's sprung up, see themselves as the center, and this distorts the whole spectrum. Policies that are similar to ones actually supported by Reagan now become socialism. Everything center-left (and some moderate right) becomes a threat to our way of life.

And Obama personifies that threat. Muslim name. Not the type of guy we usually elect. Again, there's a racial subtext, but, perhaps more importantly, there's a fear of change, a fear of losing hold on the country and its traditions. You would have seen the same kind of attacks, if not worse, had Hillary been elected president, I think.

Now, having said that, I'll leave the discussion to those who will tell you Obama's a radical liberal socialist commie Nazi.

btw, I'm disappointed with him because he has continued too many of Bush's policies, particularly regarding government secrecy and mining private data, his health bill was weak, and he hasn't rallied the American people behind him. Unlike many here, however, I want him to succeed.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #1 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 05:46:42 »

Offline Mere Nick

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #2 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 06:55:50 »
While using "opposers" for the lack thereof of a better word, I just wanted to better underdstand why people don't like Obama so much?

He seems a likable guy and would probably be a better guy to go with fishing or to a ballgame than most politicians.  He seems a strong family man and I suspect that is due in part to his family situation growing up.

What do I not like about him?  In short, his policies are a disaster.  He comes across as a hyper-statist and, accordingly, most folks are economically hunkered down and not so concerned about building for the future right now but just trying to weather the storm.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #3 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 06:56:24 »
I oppose Obama because I disagree with his policies, like I did with Carter and Clinton. I thought it was high time we had a black President as most Americans did ecidenced by Pres. Obama's approval right after being elected. It was over 70 percent if I remember. I just would have preferred a conservative black person such as JC Watts. There are many many white people I would not want as President. All that said, are there people that have racist motives? Sure. Just like I think a lot of people hated Bush for simplistic reasons like him being a Texan with a funny drawl, I respect all Presidents and their demonstrated personal grit and intelligence to have gotten where they are, Obama included. 

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #3 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 06:56:24 »
Pinterest: GraceCentered.com

Offline Mere Nick

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #4 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 08:03:00 »
I respect all Presidents and their demonstrated personal grit and intelligence to have gotten where they are . . .

One could say the exact same thing about cat burglars.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #4 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 08:03:00 »



Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #5 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 08:32:52 »
Touche' Mon Ami'

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #6 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 08:54:53 »
There is a new book out by D'Souza called "The Roots of Obama's Rage".  It presents a very scary picture of the man that is POTUS.  I am not sure that what is presented there is really what has so many people down on Obama, but certainly some of it is.

It is very interesting reading.  An interesting aspect of the book is that the author is Indian (India not Native American) and so perhaps sees Obama from a little different perspective that many of us.

One of the points that D'Souza makes, and perhaps what is frustrating even Obama's black supporters, is that Obama does not identify with the typical black in the racial overtones of America's past.  He has not endured the quiet racism of even today.  He has not experienced the effects of segregation of even his immediate family, since they did not experience that.  His mother was white, his father was black Kenyan.  The history of American segregation is foreign to him.  He, in a lot of ways, enjoyed a very sheltered upbringing so far as any racism is concerned.

One of the other points that D'Souza makes is that much of Obama comes from his own efforts to connect with his fathers ideology of anti-colonialism.  Much of that, D'Souza gleans from Obama's own book, "Dreams From My Father".  I have not read that book, but I plan to.

All of this goes to suggest that much of the opposition that has risen against Obama is because Obama isn't really the person that anyone, black or white, right or left, thought he was.

Personally, I think a lot of the animosity stems from the fact that Obama is fundamentally a secular socialist and is working very hard to turn America into a secular socialist nation and only about 20% of the population is in agreement with that effort.  That is, most people do not like the direction that they see Obama trying to move the country.  They simply do not like his policies.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #7 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 08:57:31 »

While using "opposers" for the lack thereof of a better word, I just wanted to better underdstand why people don't like Obama so much? Now I'm a black guy from Indiana and all I ever hear when I ask other black people I know why they think other people oppose Obama they alsways try to make it out to be a race issue. I know racism still exists in the world but I don't think its the main underlying platform for "Obama-haters".

I don't really know too much when it comes to politics. "A soldier has the pleasure of looking his enemy in the eye", Maximus Decimus Meredius, Gladitor

But really I'm an independent by default so I'm really just asking.

 

Hi Brother Lighthammer. I have no opposition to the power that God put into the White House for we read that there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. On top of that we read that whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God.

In fact I like many things about our president, and those seemingly against him are the very ones that say that God uses them to vote in the man in office. Let me add this up; Obama is in office, their vote put him there, and now they cry that he is there.   ???

Offline jonmower

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #8 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:03:09 »
It's not surprising that conservatives disagree with many of Obama's policies.  What is odd is how vehement and over-the-top the oppositions is.  He's trying to destroy the country! We've got to take our country back!  He's a socialist!  He's a communist!  He's a Luo tribesman!  He wants to impose the secular socialist machine!

The health care law is strikingly similar to Romneycare, to Dole/Baker/Daschle's proposal, and to Chafee's bill from 1993.  The individual mandate was originally a conservative proposal.  TARP and the auto bailouts happened under Bush.  Bush practiced stimulus spending during his term too.  Bush added more to the deficit than Washington to Reagan combined.  On the wars and the expansion of government power post-9/11, Obama is right in line with Bush. 

The facts suggest Obama is a conventional, relatively centrist, liberal who is married to the existing power structures of American politics and believes in making incremental progress (as he sees it) through political compromise. 

Many conservatives can rightly claim that they were opposed to many of Bush's policies too.  Many conservatives can rightly claim to not liking McCain either.  However, the opposition to Bush policies and dislike of McCain was not on the same level as the reaction to Obama.

How can we explain the intensity of opposition to Obama?  I think subconsciously it's easier to strongly dislike Obama because he is different.  I think economic suffering also amplifies discontent.

Ultimately, however, I think it is mainly just that Obama is on the other team.  The us vs. them postures that both sides adopt in their struggle for power obscures the reasonableness of we...that WE are actually all on the same team.  Many liberals have an irrational hatred of Bush.  Many conservatives have an irrational hatred of the Clintons (impeachment over Lewinsky, suspicions that the Clintons murder their enemies, etc.).  Obama's continuation of many Bush-era policies doesn't prompt the same response that they did under Bush.

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #9 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:12:46 »
Obama's recent statements that the Republicans are welcome aboard but they "have to go to the back of the bus" and his reference to those who oppose him as "enemies" tells us a lot about the man.

Neither of those statements are in the least "Presidential".  They are not what we expect from the most powerful man on the earth.

His associations with the likes of Jeremiah Wright, William Ayres, Van Jones etc, and the fact that he is straight out of the Chicago Democratic Machine all suggest a less than honorable man is our President.  Most are beginning to see through the facade and they don't like what they see.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #10 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:16:26 »
I think a lot of folks hope he would one to tear down walls, but he appears to many as extremely divisive. His fault or not.

I also think a lot of his associations in the past have dismayed some folks.
It's politics, every opposition has claimed to want to "take back" the country for decades. It isn't at all because a black man is in the Whitehouse.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #11 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:17:49 »
Nancy Pelosi promised to "drain the swamp" and no one believes that we have an improvement.

Offline jonmower

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #12 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:22:47 »
There is a new book out by D'Souza called "The Roots of Obama's Rage".  It presents a very scary picture of the man that is POTUS.  I am not sure that what is presented there is really what has so many people down on Obama, but certainly some of it is.


David Frum's take on the D'Souza's thesis, his cover story in Forbes, and Gingrich taking the ball and running with it: link.  Money quote:

Quote
Conservatives object to the Obama administration as too expensive, too regulatory, too intrusive, too beholden to Democratic special interest groups, and too apologetic about America’s role in the world. It’s a libel to claim that we object to the administration as too black or too alien. Bad enough when the libel is issued by liberals. Much worse when it is heard from our own writers, from magazines that speak to us, from political leaders who would speak for us.


From Andrew Ferguson's (senior editor at The Weekly Standard) review of D'Souza's book (link):

Quote
...Jack Kemp, a man not known for terseness: President Clinton, Kemp said, had brought to Washington something it had never seen before, the “first frankly left-wing administration in history.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #13 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:27:42 »
Just so long as the Left doesn't take this election coming up seriously. Obama will be rescued to be a good President by a Republican House and hopefully a Republican Senate, just as Clinton was.

Or he could go the way of Carter with a Democrat Congress.

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #14 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:41:50 »
Just so long as the Left doesn't take this election coming up seriously. Obama will be rescued to be a good President by a Republican House and hopefully a Republican Senate, just as Clinton was.

Or he could go the way of Carter with a Democrat Congress.

I think that Carter should thank Obama.  Obama is probably the only thing that will make Carter look good by comparison.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #15 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:50:52 »
Too bad the GOP House and Senate couldn't rescue that liberal named Bush. Of course they wanted to be Dem-lites, thus enhancing the liberal things Bush advocated.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #16 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 09:56:31 »
There is a new book out by D'Souza called "The Roots of Obama's Rage".  It presents a very scary picture of the man that is POTUS.  I am not sure that what is presented there is really what has so many people down on Obama, but certainly some of it is.


David Frum's take on the D'Souza's thesis, his cover story in Forbes, and Gingrich taking the ball and running with it: link.  Money quote:

Quote
Conservatives object to the Obama administration as too expensive, too regulatory, too intrusive, too beholden to Democratic special interest groups, and too apologetic about America’s role in the world. It’s a libel to claim that we object to the administration as too black or too alien. Bad enough when the libel is issued by liberals. Much worse when it is heard from our own writers, from magazines that speak to us, from political leaders who would speak for us.


From Andrew Ferguson's (senior editor at The Weekly Standard) review of D'Souza's book (link):

Quote
...Jack Kemp, a man not known for terseness: President Clinton, Kemp said, had brought to Washington something it had never seen before, the “first frankly left-wing administration in history.

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #17 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 10:11:19 »
David Frum's take on the D'Souza's thesis, his cover story in Forbes, and Gingrich taking the ball and running with it: link.  Money quote:

Quote
Conservatives object to the Obama administration as too expensive, too regulatory, too intrusive, too beholden to Democratic special interest groups, and too apologetic about America’s role in the world. It’s a libel to claim that we object to the administration as too black or too alien. Bad enough when the libel is issued by liberals. Much worse when it is heard from our own writers, from magazines that speak to us, from political leaders who would speak for us.




Who has claimed the administration is either too black or too alien?


Offline Mere Nick

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #18 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 10:20:35 »
It's politics, every opposition has claimed to want to "take back" the country for decades. It isn't at all because a black man is in the Whitehouse.

The one thing I remember being said on election night in 1992 was Algore, the premier blowhard of our era, shouting to the crowd "We have our country back!!!"

I also find it interesting that political derangement syndrome is now only worth giving the cursory review now that a Democrat is in the white house.  Also, it seems to be news that there are some who think he's a muslim.  Well, if the questions "Is the Pope a muslim?" or "Is Osama Bin Laden a Southern Baptist?" there would be some yes answers.  But, like the yes answers to the question of Obama's Islamitude, the yes answer would still be less than the yes answer from Democrats who believe 9/11 was an inside job.

Offline OldDad

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #19 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 10:53:58 »

Many conservatives can rightly claim that they were opposed to many of Bush's policies too.  Many conservatives can rightly claim to not liking McCain either.  However, the opposition to Bush policies and dislike of McCain was not on the same level as the reaction to Obama.


Not by the right, understandably. But if you're trying to say that there was not vehement, even violent opposition to Bush from Democrats and other liberals, you're obviously wrong.

There was a reason the phrase "Bush Derangement Syndrome" entered public discourse.

Offline OldDad

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #20 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 10:56:14 »
I oppose Obama because he is a Democrat.  There are quite a few planks of the party's platform that I reject outright.

That's why I have never voted for a Dem and see no reason to start now.

Offline tennman

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #21 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 11:07:44 »
Lighthammer,

Here are my reasons and I think any American, of any ethnicity, should take them very seriously and look beyond his skin color.

1. He wants higher taxes (income tax increase for "the rich," capital gains (investment) tax for us all, inheritence tax, to tax so-called Cadillac insurance plans, etc. He penalizes success and hard work. We already have the second highest corporate tax in the world and he's wanting to raise it).

2. He's a socialist. I don't say that as name calling, I say that after simply witnessing his policies. In addition to seeing number one, look at all he's had the government take over - the auto industry, healthcare, and banking. The government was the very source of the economy's failure (Forcing banks to loan to people who couldn't pay it back, they did this by the establishment and failure to oversee Freddie Mae and Fannie Mac (
SOURCE Small | Large
and SOURCE and SOURCE and SOURCE) and he's repeatedly promised and demonstrated an unending conveyor belt of new and unnecessary government programs that he will pay for by continually digging deeper into the pockets of Americans. Wouldn't you know it! He's socialist there as well despite having the gawl to attack Bush on spending when Obama has spent more in 2 years than Bush did in 8!

3. He's the most pro-abortion president ever. He was the only senator of EITHER PARTY to oppose the Born Alive Infant Protection Act (SOURCE)

4. He's weak on national defense in that he said if he is elected President the United States would stop investing in the development of missile defense systems and would stick only with what we have. See him say it at
Small | Large


5. His communist connections (SOURCE and SOURCE) and this is very scary because his policies seem very much like communism (a big government controlling the economy and taking money from the people).

6. He claimed he'd have the most transparent and open administration in history, but just the opposite is true. I would list sources but based on polling data even Democrats think Obama is very secretive and not transparent.

7. He stands opposed to Arizona and other states defending the boarder against illegal aliens and clearly stands with illegal aliens on them being here illegally (he's fine with that and wants them as a voting block).

There are so many other reasons but just talking about this stuff gets me pretty angry and so I'm done. Any honest thinker can see major problems with the Obama administration and NONE OF THEM have anything to do with the color of his skin. And I think supporting him or voting for him just because he's black is incredibly racist.

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #22 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 11:27:17 »
Given that he has the support of 92% of black voters and that may be one of the major reasons he won the Presidential election, one might conclude that he won because he is black.  That seems to me to define racism, at least in this instance.  That doesn't mean that he himself is necessarily a racist.  But neither does it mean that he isn't.

Offline jonmower

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #23 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:17:49 »
Who has claimed the administration is either too black or too alien?

That's Frum's take on what the D'Souza/Gingrich stuff is about...Obama is not one of us.  He is the other.

marc

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #24 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:19:43 »
That was my immediate take as well. Using a minority to prop up this view is pretty typical stuff as well (See Williams, Walter.)

Offline jonmower

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #25 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:32:28 »
Not by the right, understandably. But if you're trying to say that there was not vehement, even violent opposition to Bush from Democrats and other liberals, you're obviously wrong.

I acknowledged that many liberals have an irrational hate for Bush.  My point is that in so many ways the Obama presidency has been substantially consistent with Bush's, yet the right has reacted very differently to Obama than to Bush.  Curiously, they waited until they were in a state of powerless that was unique in recent history (Republicans controlling neither Congress nor the presidency) to take to the streets in protest of out-of-control government spending (a problem that started in the Reagan-era and since then has only improved during the Clinton years).

On the substance of policy, the right's reaction to Obama vs. Bush is not "understandable" like you suggested.  There must be something else significant driving it.  I think that something, whether overt or subconscious, is partisanship.  The same drives the reactions of many liberals relative to Bush and Obama.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #26 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:43:14 »
LOL Jonmower, yeah it couldn't be that I don't want my taxes to go up, the government to take over continually more segments of the economy, record spending, that I oppose abortion or that I fear Obama is woefully weak when it comes to national defense...not it's go to be that I'm partisan. Yeah, that's it.

Spoken like a true liberal: "If you disagree with us you're either racist or partisan."

 ::rollingeyes::

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #27 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:50:51 »
...I think supporting him or voting for him just because he's black is incredibly racist.

Given that he has the support of 92% of black voters and that may be one of the major reasons he won the Presidential election, one might conclude that he won because he is black.  That seems to me to define racism, at least in this instance.  That doesn't mean that he himself is necessarily a racist.  But neither does it mean that he isn't.

African Americans have been voting overwhelmingly Democrat in presidential elections for the last 50 years.  This trend, not coincidentally I think, also parallels the Republicans' "southern strategy," via which they are purported to have attempted to improve their electoral success by exploiting racism among whites in the south.  Yes, Obama won 95 % of the black vote, but that's hardly a striking anomaly compared to the level of support all the white Democratic candidates have received during the last 50 years.  If blacks or the electorate as a whole just wanted a black person (any black person) as president, we've had several other options in the recent past (Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Alan Keyes, Shirley Chisholm, Lenora Fulani, and Carol Moseley Braun).  Furthermore, black voters were famously tepid in the support for Obama until after he won the Iowa primary and showed that he was a viable candidate able to convince whites to give him their votes.  It's not surprising that blacks would tend to be excited to have a president that shares their ethnicity.  Whites have had that luxury since the country was founded.  It's not surprising that many of us are excited that out country has elected it's first black president and will (presumably and hopefully soon) elect its first female president, its first Hispanic president, etc.  Despite the results of all of our previous elections, we know that white men are not the only good candidates for president.  There are plenty of capable women and minorities, and it is exciting to see an election reflect that fact rather than continuing the legacy of discrimination.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #28 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:52:37 »
Not by the right, understandably. But if you're trying to say that there was not vehement, even violent opposition to Bush from Democrats and other liberals, you're obviously wrong.

I acknowledged that many liberals have an irrational hate for Bush.  My point is that in so many ways the Obama presidency has been substantially consistent with Bush's, yet the right has reacted very differently to Obama than to Bush.  Curiously, they waited until they were in a state of powerless that was unique in recent history (Republicans controlling neither Congress nor the presidency) to take to the streets in protest of out-of-control government spending (a problem that started in the Reagan-era and since then has only improved during the Clinton years).

On the substance of policy, the right's reaction to Obama vs. Bush is not "understandable" like you suggested.  There must be something else significant driving it.  I think that something, whether overt or subconscious, is partisanship.  The same drives the reactions of many liberals relative to Bush and Obama.

I think the conservatives in the country were just as dismayed with the GOP Congress and Bush. Obviously they hoped their worst nightmares weren't true, but they were. Electing a crew that by all indications is vastly more liberal than even the errant GOP bunch during Bush, mobilized a large segment of the nation to try to reverse a trend they see as catastrophic. I certainly understand the liberal concern, but it is simply a pendulum swing, which I'm sure will swing the other way in the not too distant future. The end of Conservatism was no more factual than any cries that the end of liberalism is at hand.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #29 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:55:05 »
...I think supporting him or voting for him just because he's black is incredibly racist.

Given that he has the support of 92% of black voters and that may be one of the major reasons he won the Presidential election, one might conclude that he won because he is black.  That seems to me to define racism, at least in this instance.  That doesn't mean that he himself is necessarily a racist.  But neither does it mean that he isn't.

African Americans have been voting overwhelmingly Democrat in presidential elections for the last 50 years.  This trend, not coincidentally I think, also parallels the Republicans' "southern strategy," via which they are purported to have attempted to improve their electoral success by exploiting racism among whites in the south.  Yes, Obama won 95 % of the black vote, but that's hardly a striking anomaly compared to the level of support all the white Democratic candidates have received during the last 50 years.  If blacks or the electorate as a whole just wanted a black person (any black person) as president, we've had several other options in the recent past (Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Alan Keyes, Shirley Chisholm, Lenora Fulani, and Carol Moseley Braun).  Furthermore, black voters were famously tepid in the support for Obama until after he won the Iowa primary and showed that he was a viable candidate able to convince whites to give him their votes.  It's not surprising that blacks would tend to be excited to have a president that shares their ethnicity.  Whites have had that luxury since the country was founded.  It's not surprising that many of us are excited that out country has elected it's first black president and will (presumably and hopefully soon) elect its first female president, its first Hispanic president, etc.  Despite the results of all of our previous elections, we know that white men are not the only good candidates for president.  There are plenty of capable women and minorities, and it is exciting to see an election reflect that fact rather than continuing the legacy of discrimination.

Yes, the election of Barack Obama is evidence we have come far as a nation. I am personally rooting for the Hispanic Marco Rubio if he runs in 2012. Or JC Watts, a conservative black man if he would only run.

Offline Mere Nick

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #30 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 12:59:20 »
I am personally rooting for the Hispanic Marco Rubio if he runs in 2012. Or JC Watts, a conservative black man if he would only run.


Oh, but they are just props, dontcha know.

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #31 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 13:00:33 »
I am personally rooting for the Hispanic Marco Rubio if he runs in 2012. Or JC Watts, a conservative black man if he would only run.


Oh, but they are just props, dontcha know.

You mean token minorities????

Offline jonmower

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #32 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 13:01:12 »
LOL Jonmower, yeah it couldn't be that I don't want my taxes to go up, the government to take over continually more segments of the economy, record spending, that I oppose abortion or that I fear Obama is woefully weak when it comes to national defense...not it's go to be that I'm partisan. Yeah, that's it.

No.  I acknowledged that there are reasons of substance that explain why a conservative might oppose Obama's policies.  What I've been trying to discuss is the difference in tone and tenor and vigor of the reaction to Obama vs. Bush when their actual policies shared so many similarities.  As I pointed out previously, enormous expansion of entitlements (e.g. Medicare prescription drug benefit), enormous stimulus spending, government takeovers and bailouts, etc. happened under Bush.  Were you posting daily attacks on Bush and his policies during that period?

Offline Jaime

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #33 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 13:02:32 »
We were hoping he was going to come to his senses, but to no avail. The libs knew he was destroying conservatism, and he almost did.

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Re: Obama-Opposers
« Reply #34 on: Wed Oct 27, 2010 - 13:06:50 »
Were you posting daily attacks on Bush and his policies during that period?

At the same rate you were posting about Bush Derangement Syndrome.