GCM Home | Your Posts | Rules | DONATE | Bookstore | RSS | Facebook | Twitter | FAQs


Author Topic: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare  (Read 1732 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile

Christian Forums and Message Board

Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 16:30:30 »

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #1 on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 17:45:00 »
Here is Rand's plan. I like it.

It will never happen.

http://ih8hillary.com/2017/01/03/rand-pauls-plan-repeal-replace-obamacare/

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #1 on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 17:45:00 »

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #2 on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 17:50:02 »
Here is Rand's plan. I like it.

It will never happen.

http://ih8hillary.com/2017/01/03/rand-pauls-plan-repeal-replace-obamacare/


You like it.

Trump likes it.

Careful now.... There just might be a meeting of the minds on something  rofl

And there is a lot of similarity to what Trump was campaigning on.

« Last Edit: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 17:52:26 by Rella »

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #3 on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 19:06:33 »
Here is Rand's plan. I like it.

It will never happen.

http://ih8hillary.com/2017/01/03/rand-pauls-plan-repeal-replace-obamacare/


You like it.

Trump likes it.

Careful now.... There just might be a meeting of the minds on something  rofl

And there is a lot of similarity to what Trump was campaigning on.


"We don't want anyone who currently has insurance to not have insurance."- Kellyanne Conway on the Morning Joe show Jan.3, 2017

Sorry, but Rand's plan is nowhere close to Trump's. Millions would lose coverage. That's why it ain't gonna happen.

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #3 on: Sat Jan 07, 2017 - 19:06:33 »

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #4 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 07:51:47 »
Here is Rand's plan. I like it.

It will never happen.

http://ih8hillary.com/2017/01/03/rand-pauls-plan-repeal-replace-obamacare/


You like it.

Trump likes it.

Careful now.... There just might be a meeting of the minds on something  rofl

And there is a lot of similarity to what Trump was campaigning on.


"We don't want anyone who currently has insurance to not have insurance."- Kellyanne Conway on the Morning Joe show Jan.3, 2017

Sorry, but Rand's plan is nowhere close to Trump's. Millions would lose coverage. That's why it ain't gonna happen.


Not wanting anyone to lose insurance is not the same as saying if you have insurance we will guarantee you will never lose it.

I have car insurance.

If I have an accident or two I will still be covered.

If I have multiple accidents I will lose it.

The state of PA requires I have insurance in order to obtain my owners card every year.

But the state of PA will not force my insurance to keep me on if I become a liability.

So I would possibly need to be uninsured and lose my owners card.

What any one or agency or group wants does not a guarantee make and KellyAnn did not say it was a guarantee.

She never has.

If you are on Obamacare with a $5,000.00 deductible... (Yes, I know this to be a fact cause I know someone with this situation) and Obamacare is no more.... Then they will be able to Buy...with their own money... just like Ocare...into a different plan. They are not going to be out in the cold.


Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #4 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 07:51:47 »



crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #5 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 08:16:21 »
Here is Rand's plan. I like it.

It will never happen.

http://ih8hillary.com/2017/01/03/rand-pauls-plan-repeal-replace-obamacare/


You like it.

Trump likes it.

Careful now.... There just might be a meeting of the minds on something  rofl

And there is a lot of similarity to what Trump was campaigning on.


"We don't want anyone who currently has insurance to not have insurance."- Kellyanne Conway on the Morning Joe show Jan.3, 2017

Sorry, but Rand's plan is nowhere close to Trump's. Millions would lose coverage. That's why it ain't gonna happen.


Not wanting anyone to lose insurance is not the same as saying if you have insurance we will guarantee you will never lose it.

I have car insurance.

If I have an accident or two I will still be covered.

If I have multiple accidents I will lose it.

The state of PA requires I have insurance in order to obtain my owners card every year.

But the state of PA will not force my insurance to keep me on if I become a liability.

So I would possibly need to be uninsured and lose my owners card.

What any one or agency or group wants does not a guarantee make and KellyAnn did not say it was a guarantee.

She never has.

If you are on Obamacare with a $5,000.00 deductible... (Yes, I know this to be a fact cause I know someone with this situation) and Obamacare is no more.... Then they will be able to Buy...with their own money... just like Ocare...into a different plan. They are not going to be out in the cold.


Nice spin. Maybe later we can debate what the meaning of "is" is? No, neither Kellyanne or Trump has said they want to "guarantee" everyone has health insurance, but it's inferred that everyone be covered, and that the government fill the gap for those that can't afford coverage.  Parsing words does not change the overall intent.

"able to buy.........with their own money...?" 

What money? By far the majority of folks that have insurance under Obamacare did not have insurance before because they have no money. Same with the notion of health savings accounts being the answer. A savings account requires you have something to save. For those that can't afford health insurance, unless government provides a means for them to get that insurance, they are way out in the cold.

I like Rand Paul's plan. It puts a stake through the heart of Obamacare and gets government out of the healthcare business (at least for the most part). Now, it would mean millions losing coverage and would restore the limits of pre-existing conditions. It would also greatly lower the cost of insurance premiums. Why it will never happen is because it's political suicide. All the folks losing coverage would vote against in the next election. It's what's needed, but no one in Washington has the courage to actually make it happen. Talk is cheap, actions have consequences.

Offline Johnb

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11732
  • Manna: 170
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #6 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 08:30:33 »
Not true many that had insurance had to change because their plan did not meet the ACA standards and are now paying much more for poor insurance. There are almost as many uninsured today as there was before the ACA.  Have a number of friends that that lost their insurance because of ACA and make to much to get free or supplemented insurance and now have an approved plan that if they do not use the right medical facilities have a $12000 deductible.  Before ACA that was called a catastrophic plan and was dirt cheap.  One lady with no major health problems that I know cost has gone from $650 t0 $870 to $1140 per month.  a deduct of $5000 is the same as having no health insurance to the avg. person.     

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #7 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 08:35:34 »
Not true many that had insurance had to change because their plan did not meet the ACA standards and are now paying much more for poor insurance. There are almost as many uninsured today as there was before the ACA.  Have a number of friends that that lost their insurance because of ACA and make to much to get free or supplemented insurance and now have an approved plan that if they do not use the right medical facilities have a $12000 deductible.  Before ACA that was called a catastrophic plan and was dirt cheap.  One lady with no major health problems that I know cost has gone from $650 t0 $870 to $1140 per month.  a deduct of $5000 is the same as having no health insurance to the avg. person.   

Perfect example of why Obamacare needs to be repealed. Not repealed and replaced, just repealed. And that's the nuts and bolts of Rand Paul's approach. Won't happen, because Trump wants everyone to have coverage, but should happen because it's either that or more of the socialist/progressive boot on all our necks.


Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #8 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 09:18:07 »
Not true many that had insurance had to change because their plan did not meet the ACA standards and are now paying much more for poor insurance. There are almost as many uninsured today as there was before the ACA.  Have a number of friends that that lost their insurance because of ACA and make to much to get free or supplemented insurance and now have an approved plan that if they do not use the right medical facilities have a $12000 deductible.  Before ACA that was called a catastrophic plan and was dirt cheap.  One lady with no major health problems that I know cost has gone from $650 t0 $870 to $1140 per month.  a deduct of $5000 is the same as having no health insurance to the avg. person.   

Perfect example of why Obamacare needs to be repealed. Not repealed and replaced, just repealed. And that's the nuts and bolts of Rand Paul's approach. Won't happen, because Trump wants everyone to have coverage, but should happen because it's either that or more of the socialist/progressive boot on all our necks.

Read it and weep...

Rand Paul does have  a plan..

"What should we replace Obamacare with? Perhaps we should try freedom:

1.  The freedom to choose inexpensive insurance free of government dictates.

2.  The freedom to save unlimited amounts in a health savings account.

3. The freedom to buy insurance across state lines.

4.  The freedom for all individuals to join together in voluntary associations to gain the leverage of being part of a large insurance pool."

These are from the link you provided above.

The first 3 are exactly what Trump talked about in all his town halls while campaigning. And the many discussions he has with Hannity while campaigning.

Will the professional politicians let him have this? Only time will tell.

But it is what T wants.


crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #9 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 10:17:09 »
Well, since I'd already provided a link to Rand's plan, I had read it- without weeping. And yes, Trump expresses what Paul puts forth, but the problem arrives in that he doesn't stop there. And even those first three bullet points are little more that hype. "Inexpensive insurance"? Wasn't inexpensive before Obamacare. You want good coverage with a low deductible, it will be a pretty penny, with or without government dictates. Already discussed health savings accounts. That assumes (rather boldly) you have money to save. Selling across state lines? Companies already can in certain regions. They don't want to. It's too burdensome and not cost effective. It could well cause premiums to rise  not to fall.

Rather than rehash the socialist/progressive ideals of Trump, there's only one issue that really needs to be discussed as it forces the hand of all else- Pre-existing conditions. As long as there's no restrictions on that, nearly all of Obamacare has to stay in place. His stance on pre-existing tells you everything you need to know about what Trump wants for healthcare. Rand says scrap it, and if you don't agree with Rand on pre-existing, you really don't agree with Rand on anything.

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #10 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 11:09:23 »
Well, since I'd already provided a link to Rand's plan, I had read it- without weeping. And yes, Trump expresses what Paul puts forth, but the problem arrives in that he doesn't stop there. And even those first three bullet points are little more that hype. "Inexpensive insurance"? Wasn't inexpensive before Obamacare. You want good coverage with a low deductible, it will be a pretty penny, with or without government dictates. Already discussed health savings accounts. That assumes (rather boldly) you have money to save. Selling across state lines? Companies already can in certain regions. They don't want to. It's too burdensome and not cost effective. It could well cause premiums to rise  not to fall.

Rather than rehash the socialist/progressive ideals of Trump, there's only one issue that really needs to be discussed as it forces the hand of all else- Pre-existing conditions. As long as there's no restrictions on that, nearly all of Obamacare has to stay in place. His stance on pre-existing tells you everything you need to know about what Trump wants for healthcare. Rand says scrap it, and if you don't agree with Rand on pre-existing, you really don't agree with Rand on anything.

Pre-existing conditions ARENOT... REPEAT, ARE NOT, coverered under obama care.

Had a friend who move to another state...Was covered by insurance in FL but when he got to CA (yea... I know and yes he is as strange as all those from there) but aside from that he had to resign for coverage in CA.

He did not get around to it soon enough.

He had joined a local soccer team and got his knee totally screwed up.

Even though he had had it in FL he had to  apply in CA and the accident happened before he got the coverage approval.....
End result....

He got approved but had to wait months for the necessary surgery until he got the ok from Ocare.

Today he can no longer play soccer.... and needs to wear a knee brace very often because of needing to wait.

DO YOU PERSONALLY think that having had coverage in FL, then moving... and waiting for the "new" Ocare to
cover him.... Do you think he should have not been covered?

BTW He is 32 years old.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #11 on: Sun Jan 08, 2017 - 16:30:44 »
His problem was lapsed coverage, not pre-existing conditions.

Offline notreligus

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4058
  • Manna: 152
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #12 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 16:14:04 »
I want to believe that Obamacare will be repealed and replaced but I'm having a hard time believing that it will.    One of the reasons I have my doubts is because of a man named Mitch McConnell, the majority leader.   McConnell has tradtionally favored the suppliers of healthcare and pharmaceuticals.   Humana is headquartered in his home state.   He has been receiving regular financial support from pharmaceutical companies.  If the competitive market that Trump talks about comes into play then a lot of these companies stand to lose a lot of money.   McConnell is known to speak one way to the public while his real view is very different.   

If they are serious a good place to start is to let the Canadian pharmaceutical suppliers have more of a green light.  The one thing I heard that Hillary said that I agree with is that she felt like pharmaceutical companies were allowed to keep patents too long before generics could be introduced.   Lipitor has been protected seemingly forever and coming up about July 1st I believe that a generic is finally going to be introduced.   

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #13 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 17:55:46 »
If they could be honest (I know, way too much to expect), the right word is "repair". Now, I personally think it should be repealed and forgotten as fast as possible, but since socialism has infected both political parties, it's certain government run healthcare is here to stay. Repeal and replace is a joke at best, and more accurately an outright lie. Supposedly, they plan on repealing the mandates, but keeping the things they like such as no pre-existing and subsidies for those that can't afford the premiums. Well, that's wanting to have it both ways. Without the mandates and tax penalties, the cost is prohibitive. However they spin it, not only do the existing mandates have to stay in place, but they have to be expanded to account for the current revenue shortfall.

If they want to keep this socialist/progressive program, an easy repair would be either single payer or allow those that can afford buying insurance to do so, but then hit all of them with a tax. If you can afford private health insurance or your employer can afford providing you with insurance, then you and the employers can afford being taxed to cover everyone else; plus the no pre-existing clause. Do I like it? Not the least, but that would be the honest approach.

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #14 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 18:34:28 »
I want to believe that Obamacare will be repealed and replaced but I'm having a hard time believing that it will.    One of the reasons I have my doubts is because of a man named Mitch McConnell, the majority leader.   McConnell has tradtionally favored the suppliers of healthcare and pharmaceuticals.   Humana is headquartered in his home state.   He has been receiving regular financial support from pharmaceutical companies.  If the competitive market that Trump talks about comes into play then a lot of these companies stand to lose a lot of money.   McConnell is known to speak one way to the public while his real view is very different.   

If they are serious a good place to start is to let the Canadian pharmaceutical suppliers have more of a green light.  The one thing I heard that Hillary said that I agree with is that she felt like pharmaceutical companies were allowed to keep patents too long before generics could be introduced.   Lipitor has been protected seemingly forever and coming up about July 1st I believe that a generic is finally going to be introduced.

+1.

I could not agree with you more.  We go to Canada for a number of meds that are too costly in the US.

One med I am on jumped so high that it was going to cost $555. here in the US for a 3 month supply,
yet in Canada I could have gotten it for $355.00.. Smae med, same packageing and my doc approved.

As luck would have it though he did switch me to one that is only $112.50 for a 3 month supply.

I am happy with that... even as I sit and watch the ambulance chaser attorneys adverising if you or a loved one have taken XXXXX and suffered sever bleeding to call them....

Something must be done and I hope someone gets that ball rolling once DT is firmly in place it might....

But I also know the gutless congress likely wont due to the lobbyists...

Just like McConnell having Humana do their number at him.

Online Texas Conservative

  • Resident Board Genius
  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
  • Manna: 229
  • My church is 100% right, Your church is 100% wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #15 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 18:35:56 »
If they could be honest (I know, way too much to expect), the right word is "repair". Now, I personally think it should be repealed and forgotten as fast as possible, but since socialism has infected both political parties, it's certain government run healthcare is here to stay. Repeal and replace is a joke at best, and more accurately an outright lie. Supposedly, they plan on repealing the mandates, but keeping the things they like such as no pre-existing and subsidies for those that can't afford the premiums. Well, that's wanting to have it both ways. Without the mandates and tax penalties, the cost is prohibitive. However they spin it, not only do the existing mandates have to stay in place, but they have to be expanded to account for the current revenue shortfall.

If they want to keep this socialist/progressive program, an easy repair would be either single payer or allow those that can afford buying insurance to do so, but then hit all of them with a tax. If you can afford private health insurance or your employer can afford providing you with insurance, then you and the employers can afford being taxed to cover everyone else; plus the no pre-existing clause. Do I like it? Not the least, but that would be the honest approach.

Your "easy repair" would be even more damaging to healthcare.

Offline chosenone

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 29422
  • Manna: 523
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #16 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 18:45:50 »
I know a young man there aged 16 who, along with his brother aged 20, suffers from various mental health issues.   They are both on various medications which enable them to live a normal life and go to school/college and work part time. Their father is dead and their mother is out of the picture. At the moment they get the medications free under Obhamacare, but he seems to think that because of what Trump has said, they will no longer have them free. Neither will be able to afford them themselves as both are trying to pay rent/bills etc as well. He is very fearful of what will happen if they have to come off the medication.
They both also have a heart condition which may mean they need medication for that at some point.

Online Texas Conservative

  • Resident Board Genius
  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
  • Manna: 229
  • My church is 100% right, Your church is 100% wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #17 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 18:50:55 »
I know a young man there aged 16 who, along with his brother aged 20, suffers from various mental health issues.   They are both on various medications which enable them to live a normal life and go to school/college and work part time. Their father is dead and their mother is out of the picture. At the moment they get the medications free under Obhamacare, but he seems to think that because of what Trump has said, they will no longer have them free. Neither will be able to afford them themselves as both are trying to pay rent/bills etc as well. He is very fearful of what will happen if they have to come off the medication.
They both also have a heart condition which may mean they need medication for that at some point.

They get them free from Medicaid , not Obamacare, I would bet.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #18 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 19:02:07 »
If they could be honest (I know, way too much to expect), the right word is "repair". Now, I personally think it should be repealed and forgotten as fast as possible, but since socialism has infected both political parties, it's certain government run healthcare is here to stay. Repeal and replace is a joke at best, and more accurately an outright lie. Supposedly, they plan on repealing the mandates, but keeping the things they like such as no pre-existing and subsidies for those that can't afford the premiums. Well, that's wanting to have it both ways. Without the mandates and tax penalties, the cost is prohibitive. However they spin it, not only do the existing mandates have to stay in place, but they have to be expanded to account for the current revenue shortfall.

If they want to keep this socialist/progressive program, an easy repair would be either single payer or allow those that can afford buying insurance to do so, but then hit all of them with a tax. If you can afford private health insurance or your employer can afford providing you with insurance, then you and the employers can afford being taxed to cover everyone else; plus the no pre-existing clause. Do I like it? Not the least, but that would be the honest approach.

Your "easy repair" would be even more damaging to healthcare.

How about an explanation to that? You're great at throwing out one liners, somewhat lacking in meaningful details.

Online Texas Conservative

  • Resident Board Genius
  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
  • Manna: 229
  • My church is 100% right, Your church is 100% wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #19 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 19:09:30 »
If they could be honest (I know, way too much to expect), the right word is "repair". Now, I personally think it should be repealed and forgotten as fast as possible, but since socialism has infected both political parties, it's certain government run healthcare is here to stay. Repeal and replace is a joke at best, and more accurately an outright lie. Supposedly, they plan on repealing the mandates, but keeping the things they like such as no pre-existing and subsidies for those that can't afford the premiums. Well, that's wanting to have it both ways. Without the mandates and tax penalties, the cost is prohibitive. However they spin it, not only do the existing mandates have to stay in place, but they have to be expanded to account for the current revenue shortfall.

If they want to keep this socialist/progressive program, an easy repair would be either single payer or allow those that can afford buying insurance to do so, but then hit all of them with a tax. If you can afford private health insurance or your employer can afford providing you with insurance, then you and the employers can afford being taxed to cover everyone else; plus the no pre-existing clause. Do I like it? Not the least, but that would be the honest approach.

Your "easy repair" would be even more damaging to healthcare.

How about an explanation to that? You're great at throwing out one liners, somewhat lacking in meaningful details.

More expensive,  worse healthcare, more government control.  Obamacare was designed to fail and pave the way for single payer. 

Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #20 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 19:12:18 »
I know a young man there aged 16 who, along with his brother aged 20, suffers from various mental health issues.   They are both on various medications which enable them to live a normal life and go to school/college and work part time. Their father is dead and their mother is out of the picture. At the moment they get the medications free under Obhamacare, but he seems to think that because of what Trump has said, they will no longer have them free. Neither will be able to afford them themselves as both are trying to pay rent/bills etc as well. He is very fearful of what will happen if they have to come off the medication.
They both also have a heart condition which may mean they need medication for that at some point.

Yes, I agree with what Crow said.  Most likely Medicaid.... Not to mention that there are many pharmaceutical companies who have a patient aid policy for those who cannot afford the meds...
and they are free.

So, the first thing they need to do is ask their doctor who offers help and follow his/her advice.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #21 on: Tue Jan 10, 2017 - 19:13:59 »
If they could be honest (I know, way too much to expect), the right word is "repair". Now, I personally think it should be repealed and forgotten as fast as possible, but since socialism has infected both political parties, it's certain government run healthcare is here to stay. Repeal and replace is a joke at best, and more accurately an outright lie. Supposedly, they plan on repealing the mandates, but keeping the things they like such as no pre-existing and subsidies for those that can't afford the premiums. Well, that's wanting to have it both ways. Without the mandates and tax penalties, the cost is prohibitive. However they spin it, not only do the existing mandates have to stay in place, but they have to be expanded to account for the current revenue shortfall.

If they want to keep this socialist/progressive program, an easy repair would be either single payer or allow those that can afford buying insurance to do so, but then hit all of them with a tax. If you can afford private health insurance or your employer can afford providing you with insurance, then you and the employers can afford being taxed to cover everyone else; plus the no pre-existing clause. Do I like it? Not the least, but that would be the honest approach.

Your "easy repair" would be even more damaging to healthcare.

How about an explanation to that? You're great at throwing out one liners, somewhat lacking in meaningful details.

More expensive,  worse healthcare, more government control.  Obamacare was designed to fail and pave the way for single payer.

Err, didn't say I thought it was right, and did say single payer is one of the "easy repairs". I'm simply postulating what the Repubs might do to have it both ways. You will note, I'm for complete repeal.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #22 on: Wed Jan 11, 2017 - 21:12:55 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home. 

Online Texas Conservative

  • Resident Board Genius
  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
  • Manna: 229
  • My church is 100% right, Your church is 100% wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #23 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 06:08:08 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #24 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 06:25:15 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.
« Last Edit: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 06:42:11 by crowcamp »

Online Alan

  • I AM Canadian!
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5045
  • Manna: 168
  • Gender: Male
  • Politically Incorrect
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #25 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:04:26 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #26 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:17:47 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

Certainly we all would like to have full and readily available healthcare. The issue in America (at least to me) is the sacrifice of individual freedom and self determination that at least used to define this nation. If healthcare is to be provided though some collective grand bargain, then why not provide food, shelter, clothing, etc? Why even get out of bed if everything is just handed to you? Yes, it may sound harsh, but my bad luck, my errors, are not the responsibilities of others- unless they freely choose to make them so. Would I love to get something done to a bad knee and hip? Of course. Would I like to get the thousands of dollars of dental work I need, or at least know what's been wrong with my right hand for several years? Without a doubt. Do I think someone else should pitch in to pay for it? Not for a second. Life is about winning and losing. It's about good fortune and bad. It's not society's responsibility to level all that out. At least not a society where freedom is supposed to be honored above all else.
« Last Edit: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:30:16 by crowcamp »

Online 4WD

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5183
  • Manna: 94
  • (T)ogether (E)veryone (A)chieves (M)ore
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #27 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:36:35 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

Your government can afford the cost of such coverage because, in part at least, you have given up the ability to defend yourself as a country.  You depend almost entirely upon the U.S. for your national security.  That was the sacrifice that Obama had planned into the ObamaCare system, simply because, down deep, he does not believe there are any serious national security issues  --  other than global warming of course.

Online Alan

  • I AM Canadian!
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5045
  • Manna: 168
  • Gender: Male
  • Politically Incorrect
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #28 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:42:37 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.
Why even get out of bed if everything is just handed to you?


That's certainly far from reality, if a healthcare program could be implemented by reasonable means then why not?


People that do not drive pay for roads, bridges, etc, and people that do have children pay for schools and the education administration, the list could go on.



Offline Rella

  • EVANGELICAL PRESBYTERIAN: A MINORITY OF ONE ON GRACE CENTERED
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 4304
  • Manna: 620
  • Gender: Female
  • NO CHURCH IS 100% RIGHT! NO CHURCH IS 100% WRONG!
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #29 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:48:11 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

Your government can afford the cost of such coverage because, in part at least, you have given up the ability to defend yourself as a country.  You depend almost entirely upon the U.S. for your national security.  That was the sacrifice that Obama had planned into the ObamaCare system, simply because, down deep, he does not believe there are any serious national security issues  --  other than global warming of course.

In defense of our Canadian friend and neighbor there may be an element of truth in what you say, but their system certainly is far from perfect.

Everyone who lives in a bordering state to Canada knows how many people actually come
to their states for medical treatment when they seemingly so often fall between the cracks waiting for often urgent and necessary treatment.

Quite similar to our own government rum VA.

Englad also has the same system as Canada... I believe....

Total government run will only lead to major tax increases for all. But government oversight and guidance could put some much needed checks in place.

Online Alan

  • I AM Canadian!
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5045
  • Manna: 168
  • Gender: Male
  • Politically Incorrect
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #30 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:54:28 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

Your government can afford the cost of such coverage because, in part at least, you have given up the ability to defend yourself as a country.  You depend almost entirely upon the U.S. for your national security.  That was the sacrifice that Obama had planned into the ObamaCare system, simply because, down deep, he does not believe there are any serious national security issues  --  other than global warming of course.


I agree to an extent, Canada still spends a fair bit on national security on a per capita basis, roughly the same as Great Britain but I'm sure our current liberal government would like to change that  ??? 



crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #31 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 07:55:08 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.
Why even get out of bed if everything is just handed to you?


That's certainly far from reality, if a healthcare program could be implemented by reasonable means then why not?


People that do not drive pay for roads, bridges, etc, and people that do have children pay for schools and the education administration, the list could go on.

Apples and oranges. People who do not drive still benefit from infrastructure. Unless completely house bound, they still go out on those roads, bridges, etc. Even if house bound, necessities come to them over those roads, bridges, etc. Now, on education, you are apples to apples. Those who have children should pay for their education. You don't have the right to an education any more than you have a right to healthcare. In America, you have the right to "pursue" happiness, including better health, better education. You do not have the right to expect happiness will be handed to you.

Online 4WD

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5183
  • Manna: 94
  • (T)ogether (E)veryone (A)chieves (M)ore
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #32 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 08:22:22 »
Government bureaucracies are almost always wasteful, inefficient, ineffective.  They almost never do a good job at what they are commissioned to do.  I can believe that our VA system is a lot like the Canadian and English healthcare systems; simply not very good on the whole, even if they do manage to help in some individual cases.

Online Texas Conservative

  • Resident Board Genius
  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
  • Manna: 229
  • My church is 100% right, Your church is 100% wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #33 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 08:23:50 »
NEWS FLASH!!!!    The Republicans have revealed their replacement plan!

It's absolute genius and can be implemented on day one! Two very simple steps-

1- Don't get sick

2- If you do get sick, die immediately- at home.

 
Awesome.  What liberal site did ya pull this humdinger from?

It was a reply to a Yahoo report. Guess I'm a plagiarist.  ::shrug::
Thought it was darkly humorous.

Likely bad of me, but up to a point, I agree. Healthcare is not a God given right. If you can afford it, you can afford it. If you can't, it should be up to voluntary charity- not a government given right. I can't afford it, so sometimes I suffer. Such is life.


It's kinda difficult to fathom NOT having healthcare. I suppose we take for granted what others are without, my Provincial Health Card ensures that I am treated in the hospital of my choice with no charge to me, also my Doctors appointments, physicals, etc, are all covered. We do not see fees and disbursements or any paperwork for that matter, yes, it's a product of a socialist government but I couldn't imagine being without it nor paying the premiums my American brothers and sisters are paying.


I'm sure something similar was likely Obama's vision when the idea was first presented but far from practical for a country that has so many levels of healthcare and insurers. I feel for all of you.

You are still paying for it.  Your income tax rates are higher in Canada, and you have a government sales tax (GST) in addition to provincial sales tax.

crowcamp

  • Guest
Re: Rand Paul talks to Trump aout Obamacare
« Reply #34 on: Thu Jan 12, 2017 - 08:40:05 »
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"- Favored line of Karl Marx.

Those that can pay for it, pay for everyone. But, we Americans can't say anything about that anymore. We loves to elect our socialists! ::doh::

 

     
anything