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Offline Ginger Rella

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Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« on: Sun Feb 11, 2018 - 21:22:29 »

After taking care of his first batch of issues, he progressed onto the next by establishing a new federal office for vaccine freedom, which has the purpose of providing people a way out of vaccination easily via religious preference


http://tapnewswire.com/2018/02/trump-moves-against-mandatory-vaccination/

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Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« on: Sun Feb 11, 2018 - 21:22:29 »

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #1 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 06:11:32 »
After taking care of his first batch of issues, he progressed onto the next by establishing a new federal office for vaccine freedom, which has the purpose of providing people a way out of vaccination easily via religious preference


http://tapnewswire.com/2018/02/trump-moves-against-mandatory-vaccination/


Another office?

More government is what we need just like a hole in the head.

I am against mandatory vaccines, but come on.

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #1 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 06:11:32 »

Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #2 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 06:39:36 »
I am also against mandatory vaccinations.  However if you want you kids attending the same school as my kids, then vaccinations must be a prerequisite.  Vaccinations need not be mandatory, but if no vaccinations then no school attendance.

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #3 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:05:25 »
I am also against mandatory vaccinations.  However if you want you kids attending the same school as my kids, then vaccinations must be a prerequisite.  Vaccinations need not be mandatory, but if no vaccinations then no school attendance.

Nope.  You sound liberal.  Even then you need to provide for medical and religious exemptions.

Your wants do not preclude the rights of others.

I could not get many vaccines until I was nearly an adult due to severe allergic reactions to certain ingredients in many vaccines.  I think I was 16 when I got the MMR vaccines.


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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #3 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:05:25 »

Online AVZ

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #4 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:10:39 »
I am also against mandatory vaccinations.  However if you want you kids attending the same school as my kids, then vaccinations must be a prerequisite.  Vaccinations need not be mandatory, but if no vaccinations then no school attendance.

I don't understand his.
If your kids are vaccinated, then they are immune to the disease.
So why would you mind your kids are exposed to other kids who are not vaccinated? Those other kids are the ones at risk, not yours.

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #4 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:10:39 »



Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #5 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:33:01 »
I don't understand his.
If your kids are vaccinated, then they are immune to the disease.
So why would you mind your kids are exposed to other kids who are not vaccinated? Those other kids are the ones at risk, not yours.

And that thinking is precisely why some diseases have made a comeback in recent years.

Offline mommydi

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #6 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 07:59:15 »
A friend of mine is a senior scientist at a large pharmaceutical company developing cancer treatments. When he had his own kids, he said, "I know what's in that ****, and I'm not pumping all that into my 7 lb baby at one time." He and his wife followed a delayed vaccination program where no immunizations are given until the baby is 6 months old, then only one at a time, with a minimum of 3-6 months between each shot. My oldest daughter followed the same delayed schedule for her children.


Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #7 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 08:14:51 »
But they are vaccinated.

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #8 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 08:32:33 »
But they are vaccinated.

Your argument is a statist one.

Online AVZ

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #9 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:02:40 »
And that thinking is precisely why some diseases have made a comeback in recent years.

Huh? How would diseases know what I think?

Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #10 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:17:37 »
Your argument is a statist one.
No, the my argument is a rational individualist one. An individualist needs to be attuned to the needs of his neighbor, even though it is not mandated by the State.  The local school system simply says that to be enrolled in the community school system, your child needs to be vaccinated.  It is your choice.  The local school system says your child needs to wear clothes, he needs to pay attention and obey the teacher, he needs to get certain minimum grades in order to advance to the next grade, it says he needs to attend enough days in the year. etc., etc.  And I think he should also be vaccinated.  Nothing statist about it.

Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #11 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:18:49 »
Huh? How would diseases know what I think?
In your case probably not to tough.

Offline Ginger Rella

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #12 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:24:08 »
Huh? How would diseases know what I think?

When you stop and think of the fact that some microorganism is capable of knocking some strapping healthy adult ( not to mention child) off their feet for days to months at a time.... THEY are smarter then we are and YES, I believe they know exactly what we think as it is programmed into their DNA  ::tippinghat::

I had all the possible innoculations you can think of over my life. Most as a child and as a baby I am certain too many, too soon.

I think they are necessary but agree that to space them out, only makes sense, as Mommydi was talking about.

In today's world, there is just too must "experimentation" done by and permitted by the government that I do not trust any of it.

After all, they were the ones that permitted the genetically altered foods back in the 80s and beyond.

Now so many epidemics, ( in a way)  of diabetes, celiac disease, add, hdad, and much more have exploded in the population.

It has to stop somewhere.

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #13 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:32:34 »
No, the my argument is a rational individualist one. An individualist needs to be attuned to the needs of his neighbor, even though it is not mandated by the State.  The local school system simply says that to be enrolled in the community school system, your child needs to be vaccinated.  It is your choice.  The local school system says your child needs to wear clothes, he needs to pay attention and obey the teacher, he needs to get certain minimum grades in order to advance to the next grade, it says he needs to attend enough days in the year. etc., etc.  And I think he should also be vaccinated.  Nothing statist about it.

Absolutely statist if you insist someone must comply to vaccines via mandate regardless of medical or religious exemptions.

Offline 4WD

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #14 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:44:23 »
Absolutely statist if you insist someone must comply to vaccines via mandate regardless of medical or religious exemptions.
No, it is your choice.  It is not a mandate.  It is a prerequisite for attending.  Now if one mandates attendance amd vaccination is a prerequisite then I suppose it could be considered statist but I don't think attendance should be mandated either.
« Last Edit: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:46:44 by 4WD »

Offline Texas Conservative

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #15 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:52:44 »
No, it is your choice.  It is not a mandate.  It is a prerequisite for attending.  Now if one mandates attendance amd vaccination is a prerequisite then I suppose it could be considered statist but I don't think attendance should be mandated either.

My children cannot attend a public school supported with my property tax dollars unless I conform to a governmental  requirement on vaccination? 

That is a mandate.  Whether you believe attendance should be mandated is already moot because most state laws require attendance or some other proof of schooling.

Offline Ginger Rella

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #16 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 09:59:29 »
Absolutely statist if you insist someone must comply to vaccines via mandate regardless of medical or religious exemptions.

Which is why he made another office.

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #17 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 10:19:20 »
Which is why he made another office.

Which is still more beauracracy.

Offline mommydi

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #18 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 10:41:38 »
Which is still more beauracracy.

For every new regulation, he's cut 22, so I'll give him his office for vaccine freedom.


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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #19 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 11:05:56 »
For every new regulation, he's cut 22, so I'll give him his office for vaccine freedom.

His & Republicans new budget blows.

Offline mommydi

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #20 on: Mon Feb 12, 2018 - 11:24:28 »
His & Republicans new budget blows.

I'm not too happy with it, either. I didn't expect miracles, though. This goes into the file I mentioned early on titled "I'm sure he'll do some things I don't like."

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #21 on: Tue Feb 13, 2018 - 02:49:40 »
When you stop and think of the fact that some microorganism is capable of knocking some strapping healthy adult ( not to mention child) off their feet for days to months at a time.... THEY are smarter then we are and YES, I believe they know exactly what we think as it is programmed into their DNA  ::tippinghat::

I had all the possible innoculations you can think of over my life. Most as a child and as a baby I am certain too many, too soon.

I think they are necessary but agree that to space them out, only makes sense, as Mommydi was talking about.

In today's world, there is just too must "experimentation" done by and permitted by the government that I do not trust any of it.

After all, they were the ones that permitted the genetically altered foods back in the 80s and beyond.

Now so many epidemics, ( in a way)  of diabetes, celiac disease, add, hdad, and much more have exploded in the population.

It has to stop somewhere.

Well here is the thing with that.
Vaccination is not going to root out disease. It only makes you immune against an existing disease.
It does not necessarily provide you protection against a new variety or modified strand.
On top of that, some diseases actually become more aggressive once they become immune to the vaccine.
And finally, to top it off, being immune to a disease does not mean you cannot be a carrier of that disease. You may not be affected by it, but you can still pass it on.

I am just wondering why non vaccination is such a big issue.
If you are vaccinated, and I am not, then the risk is on me. So why would that be your problem?
I cannot make you sick, so whats the deal.

There is also another thought.
Some diseases become resistant against vaccines. They can only do that in a person who is vaccinated.
The disease that arises is more resilient and therefore more dangerous than the previous version.
So to some extend being vaccinated is more threatening to society than not being vaccinated.

And the final thought
Diseases thrive best in populated areas. So in effect vaccination is somewhat self-destructive.
More vaccination -> more people, more people -> more diseases, more diseases -> more casualties, more casualties -> more vaccinations etc


Anyway, my point is not that people should protect themselves as best as they can against disease.
My point was that it makes no sense to say "you children cannot be in the same school as my children, because my children are vaccinated and yours are not"

Offline mommydi

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #22 on: Tue Feb 13, 2018 - 07:51:52 »
If only we put as much emphasis on building strong bodies and immune systems as we do vaccinations. I never take the flu shot and got Type A last winter. So I'm working on some things to build my immune system - less sugar, better sleep, more sunshine and fresh air, vitamin D plus K2, and whole food vitamin C. Twice a week I stop by Whole Foods for a large, fresh, Chlorophyll Up juice. It tastes disgusting since there are no sweeteners or fruit in it - just straight up dark green veggies high in chlorophyll and nutrients. Everyone around me has some sort of flu or bronchitis type of thing, but so far, it hasn't hit me. With this much sickness swirling around, my immune system must be stronger than last winter.


*Now watch me be struck down to my death bed next week for posting this.  rofl


Offline tooldtocare

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #23 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 11:29:37 »
Trump revokes background checks to buy guns
NEWS  FEB 28 2017, 8:39 PM ET
Trump Signs Bill Revoking Obama-Era Gun Checks for People With Mental Illnesses
President Donald Trump quietly signed a bill into law Tuesday rolling back an Obama-era regulation that made it harder for people with mental illnesses to purchase a gun.

The rule, which was finalized in December, added people receiving Social Security checks for mental illnesses and people deemed unfit to handle their own financial affairs to the national background check database.
Had the rule fully taken effect, the Obama administration predicted it would have added about 75,000 names to that database.

https://tinyurl.com/ycz7qp4j

Please, someone, tell me why he would do this too-?
 ::frustrated::
« Last Edit: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 11:32:52 by tooldtocare »

Offline tooldtocare

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #24 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 11:35:47 »
Sorry, I didn't mean to change the subject; just wanted to vent my frustration

carry on

Offline Ginger Rella

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #25 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 11:40:22 »
Trump revokes background checks to buy guns
NEWS  FEB 28 2017, 8:39 PM ET
Trump Signs Bill Revoking Obama-Era Gun Checks for People With Mental Illnesses
President Donald Trump quietly signed a bill into law Tuesday rolling back an Obama-era regulation that made it harder for people with mental illnesses to purchase a gun.

The rule, which was finalized in December, added people receiving Social Security checks for mental illnesses and people deemed unfit to handle their own financial affairs to the national background check database.
Had the rule fully taken effect, the Obama administration predicted it would have added about 75,000 names to that database.

https://tinyurl.com/ycz7qp4j

Please, someone, tell me why he would do this too-?
 ::frustrated::

Well.... as you can see.... it did not stop a mentally ill person from obtaining guns... before he was president.... in FL so Obama's plan had flaws.

In addition... it did not stop that mentally ill person from being part of his high schools ROTC program before being expelled.. and
still the Obama rules were fairly in effect as President Trump could not roll back everything at once

People that FL guy worked with saw nothing in him that would have made them think he was mental.... so how would a background
check have stopped him?

Offline tooldtocare

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #26 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 12:06:52 »
Ginger Rella, .... so how would a background check have stopped him?

I am not suggesting that it would have stopped them or anyone from carrying out mass murder but should it catch just one from murdering a dozen (12) folks or one in a church or public place it makes the law worthwhile.

At least in my view of things

Offline Ginger Rella

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #27 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 12:25:58 »
Ginger Rella, .... so how would a background check have stopped him?

I am not suggesting that it would have stopped them or anyone from carrying out mass murder but should it catch just one from murdering a dozen (12) folks or one in a church or public place it makes the law worthwhile.

At least in my view of things

You have to find a way to stop them from getting guns.  Background checks do not catch the mental people.

The fault in FL was that that one was reported to the FBI by more then one source and it was basically ignored.

The only way to be reasonable certain background check would catch them would be to make it so you needed to list your primary care and then  a physician report be part of things where a physician would have to report suspected things about their patient or note if
their patient was seeing another doc for mental issues or their patient was seeing another doc like a psychiatrist type or  taking meds for such.

and there goes all issue of medical privacy if you want to obtain a gun.

Then there are those who get guns illegally.

You know that Chicago has one of the toughest gun controls of any city in the US and yet had 650 murders in 2017.

Most of those from illegal guns..... AND guaranteed that those gang murders were definitely mentally unhinged.


Offline Jaime

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #28 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 12:38:09 »
The FBi leadership was WAY too busy with fake Trump collusion to worry about school children being endangered by a guy who should have been in neon lights on The FBI’s threat assessment.
« Last Edit: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 12:46:53 by Jaime »

Offline mommydi

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Re: Trump moves against mandatory vaccination
« Reply #29 on: Sun Feb 18, 2018 - 13:04:59 »
The FBi leadership was WAY too busy with fake Trump collusion ...

That and sexting (Page and Strzok) I have a feeling they weren't the only two obsessed with sexting and raging against Trump instead of honorably carrying out their duties.