Author Topic: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming  (Read 996 times)

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thethinker

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John 14:1-3:

Quote
“Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

Jesus said that He would come again and receive the disciples to Himself.  He went on to discuss many other things with THEM about prayer, the intermediate ministry of the Holy Spirit and the gift of peace. He gave THEM the parable of the vine and told them that THEY would be hated by the world.

He foretold His rejection and the sorrow which would come upon THEM as the result. Then He assured THEM that THEIR sorrow would be turned to joy upon His return. The disciples were confused about His saying that He would go away and return to them in a "little while." Then He said to THEM,

Quote
19 Now Jesus knew that they desired to ask Him, and He said to them, “Are you inquiring among yourselves about what I said, ‘A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me’? 20 Most assuredly, I say to you that you will weep and lament, but the world will rejoice; and you will be sorrowful, but your sorrow will be turned into joy. 21 A woman, when she is in labor, has sorrow because her hour has come; but as soon as she has given birth to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish, for joy that a human being has been born into the world. 22 Therefore you now have sorrow; but I will see you again and your heart will rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
 
23 “And in that day you will ask Me nothing. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full.
 
25 “These things I have spoken to you in FIGURATIVE language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly from the Father.

There it is! In verse 25 Jesus said that He had been speaking to them figuratively about His return. This is solified by the fact that after He returns THEY may ask anything in His name and THEY will receive it.

"And in that day you will inquire nothing of me. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you petition the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have petitioned nothing in My name."

Jesus explicitly said that His coming would be "figurative." His follow up statement about their petitioning Him "in that day" CLEARLY infers that His return would indeed be figurative and that THEY would continue to have an earthly ministry afterwards.

thinker


thethinker

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2012, 09:22:11 AM »
This is really the essence of preterism .... the Lord does not mean what He says ..... when it does not fit the preterist's theology

So the Lord's promise is just a ruse according to thinker

When Jesus said He was speaking figuratively He meant it. You are not permitted to put words in His mouth. His coming was REAL but not physical.

Quote
whether dead or alive when the Lord makes good on His promise

Yet you imply that He did not make good on His promise to come from heaven and give the Thessalonians relief from THEIR persecutions. You guys ignore all scripture that does not fit your paradigm. Paul promised the Thessalonians that THEY would get relief from THEIR persecutions "when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven."

You guys think that the bible was written just for you. You read other people's mail with total disregard for the original recipients.

thinker

Offline KNOWLEDGE BOMB

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2012, 09:56:14 AM »
25 “These things I have spoken to you in FIGURATIVE language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly from the Father.

KNOWLEDGE BOMB replies:
Parables were spoken not because it was figurative..

Mark 13:10-11 the reason was only those selected could understand
13:13 so that they can hear but not understand.
Luke 8:10 so that they can't understand...

It's just as important to KNOW what's NOT in the Bible
as it is to KNOW what IS

Offline fenton

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2012, 04:57:38 PM »


You guys think that the bible was written just for you.

thinker

 ::nodding::  ::nodding::   ::nodding::   ::nodding::  ::nodding:: ::amen!:: ::amen!:: ::amen!::
yep yep, it sure was,

thinker if the Word was not written to you then why in the world do you read it.. put it up, leave it alone, burn it, get rid of it............ its just for you to argue about something........   ::frown::  ::frown::
 i bet you can find a fence post to listen to you and it wont tell you, you are wrong. if you paint a smiley face on it , it will smile at you.
::frustrated:: Headaches

I am not living in hell and if this is heaven then God lied and God is not a liar!!!

Pro 1:23  Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

1Jn 2:27  But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Lehigh

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2012, 10:28:02 AM »


You guys think that the bible was written just for you.

thinker

 ::nodding::  ::nodding::   ::nodding::   ::nodding::  ::nodding:: ::amen!:: ::amen!:: ::amen!::
yep yep, it sure was,

thinker if the Word was not written to you then why in the world do you read it.. put it up, leave it alone, burn it, get rid of it............ its just for you to argue about something........   ::frown::  ::frown::
 i bet you can find a fence post to listen to you and it wont tell you, you are wrong. if you paint a smiley face on it , it will smile at you.

 No, thinker is correct. Proper Biblical hermeneutics requires "audience relevance." 

16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.[2Tim.3:16,17]

The Bible was written for us today, but not immediately "to" us. 

For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven. [Ps.119:89]


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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2012, 10:28:02 AM »



Offline fenton

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2012, 10:51:50 AM »


You guys think that the bible was written just for you.

thinker

 ::nodding::  ::nodding::   ::nodding::   ::nodding::  ::nodding:: ::amen!:: ::amen!:: ::amen!::
yep yep, it sure was,

thinker if the Word was not written to you then why in the world do you read it.. put it up, leave it alone, burn it, get rid of it............ its just for you to argue about something........   ::frown::  ::frown::
 i bet you can find a fence post to listen to you and it wont tell you, you are wrong. if you paint a smiley face on it , it will smile at you.

 No, thinker is correct. Proper Biblical hermeneutics requires "audience relevance." 

16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.[2Tim.3:16,17]

The Bible was written for us today, but not immediately "to" us. 

For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven. [Ps.119:89]


I am relevant to Christ,  and so are you Lehigh!

and it is meant immediatley to me, it is my personal instruction manual on everyday life.  ::clappingoverhead::

and.............. No!!!  thinker is not correct.... anyone who thinks God was not smart enough to see into the future on how we would read and comprehend His word is "way out there" and thinks more highly of himself then he ought to.
::frustrated:: Headaches

I am not living in hell and if this is heaven then God lied and God is not a liar!!!

Pro 1:23  Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

1Jn 2:27  But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Offline Shawn_CR

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2012, 12:56:41 PM »
John 14:1-3:

Quote
“Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

Jesus said that He would come again and receive the disciples to Himself.  He went on to discuss many other things with THEM about prayer, the intermediate ministry of the Holy Spirit and the gift of peace. He gave THEM the parable of the vine and told them that THEY would be hated by the world.

He foretold His rejection and the sorrow which would come upon THEM as the result. Then He assured THEM that THEIR sorrow would be turned to joy upon His return. The disciples were confused about His saying that He would go away and return to them in a "little while." Then He said to THEM,

Quote
19 Now Jesus knew that they desired to ask Him, and He said to them, “Are you inquiring among yourselves about what I said, ‘A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me’? 20 Most assuredly, I say to you that you will weep and lament, but the world will rejoice; and you will be sorrowful, but your sorrow will be turned into joy. 21 A woman, when she is in labor, has sorrow because her hour has come; but as soon as she has given birth to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish, for joy that a human being has been born into the world. 22 Therefore you now have sorrow; but I will see you again and your heart will rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
 
23 “And in that day you will ask Me nothing. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full.
 
25 “These things I have spoken to you in FIGURATIVE language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly from the Father.

There it is! In verse 25 Jesus said that He had been speaking to them figuratively about His return. This is solified by the fact that after He returns THEY may ask anything in His name and THEY will receive it.

"And in that day you will inquire nothing of me. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you petition the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have petitioned nothing in My name."

Jesus explicitly said that His coming would be "figurative." His follow up statement about their petitioning Him "in that day" CLEARLY infers that His return would indeed be figurative and that THEY would continue to have an earthly ministry afterwards.

thinker



Maybe im a little confused as to what verse your talking about but in my bible John 14:25 says "These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you."

There is no talk of figuratively speaking to anyone. Where do you get "figuratively" from?

Lehigh

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2012, 09:18:54 PM »
John 14:1-3:

Quote
“Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

Jesus said that He would come again and receive the disciples to Himself.  He went on to discuss many other things with THEM about prayer, the intermediate ministry of the Holy Spirit and the gift of peace. He gave THEM the parable of the vine and told them that THEY would be hated by the world.

He foretold His rejection and the sorrow which would come upon THEM as the result. Then He assured THEM that THEIR sorrow would be turned to joy upon His return. The disciples were confused about His saying that He would go away and return to them in a "little while." Then He said to THEM,

Quote
19 Now Jesus knew that they desired to ask Him, and He said to them, “Are you inquiring among yourselves about what I said, ‘A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me’? 20 Most assuredly, I say to you that you will weep and lament, but the world will rejoice; and you will be sorrowful, but your sorrow will be turned into joy. 21 A woman, when she is in labor, has sorrow because her hour has come; but as soon as she has given birth to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish, for joy that a human being has been born into the world. 22 Therefore you now have sorrow; but I will see you again and your heart will rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
 
23 “And in that day you will ask Me nothing. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full.
 
25 “These things I have spoken to you in FIGURATIVE language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly from the Father.

There it is! In verse 25 Jesus said that He had been speaking to them figuratively about His return. This is solified by the fact that after He returns THEY may ask anything in His name and THEY will receive it.

"And in that day you will inquire nothing of me. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you petition the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have petitioned nothing in My name."

Jesus explicitly said that His coming would be "figurative." His follow up statement about their petitioning Him "in that day" CLEARLY infers that His return would indeed be figurative and that THEY would continue to have an earthly ministry afterwards.

thinker



Maybe im a little confused as to what verse your talking about but in my bible John 14:25 says "These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you."

There is no talk of figuratively speaking to anyone. Where do you get "figuratively" from?

Jesus said He would speak to them plainly "from the Father"  That meant through the Holy Spirit when the H.S. would come to them. The "figurative" language was the Jesus' reference to a "woman's birthing pains" that would turn to "joy"

Offline Shawn_CR

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Re: Jesus said He used FIGURATIVE speech regarding His second coming
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2012, 11:04:26 PM »
John 14:1-3:

Quote
“Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

Jesus said that He would come again and receive the disciples to Himself.  He went on to discuss many other things with THEM about prayer, the intermediate ministry of the Holy Spirit and the gift of peace. He gave THEM the parable of the vine and told them that THEY would be hated by the world.

He foretold His rejection and the sorrow which would come upon THEM as the result. Then He assured THEM that THEIR sorrow would be turned to joy upon His return. The disciples were confused about His saying that He would go away and return to them in a "little while." Then He said to THEM,

Quote
19 Now Jesus knew that they desired to ask Him, and He said to them, “Are you inquiring among yourselves about what I said, ‘A little while, and you will not see Me; and again a little while, and you will see Me’? 20 Most assuredly, I say to you that you will weep and lament, but the world will rejoice; and you will be sorrowful, but your sorrow will be turned into joy. 21 A woman, when she is in labor, has sorrow because her hour has come; but as soon as she has given birth to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish, for joy that a human being has been born into the world. 22 Therefore you now have sorrow; but I will see you again and your heart will rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
 
23 “And in that day you will ask Me nothing. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full.
 
25 “These things I have spoken to you in FIGURATIVE language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly from the Father.

There it is! In verse 25 Jesus said that He had been speaking to them figuratively about His return. This is solified by the fact that after He returns THEY may ask anything in His name and THEY will receive it.

"And in that day you will inquire nothing of me. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you petition the Father in My name He will give you. 24 Until now you have petitioned nothing in My name."

Jesus explicitly said that His coming would be "figurative." His follow up statement about their petitioning Him "in that day" CLEARLY infers that His return would indeed be figurative and that THEY would continue to have an earthly ministry afterwards.

thinker



Maybe im a little confused as to what verse your talking about but in my bible John 14:25 says "These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you."

There is no talk of figuratively speaking to anyone. Where do you get "figuratively" from?

Jesus said He would speak to them plainly "from the Father"  That meant through the Holy Spirit when the H.S. would come to them. The "figurative" language was the Jesus' reference to a "woman's birthing pains" that would turn to "joy"

Jesus spoke in many parables, these parables was "figurative" language.