Author Topic: Should We???  (Read 1555 times)

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EdwardGoodie

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Should We???
« on: January 27, 2012, 01:20:57 PM »
Can we step back a bit and ask ourselves this question?

Let's say that Christ has not yet come to die on Calvary but it is still 2012, the temple has not been destroyed, we are still observing old covenant procedures, and still going to synagogues.

If Christ appeared on the scene today, and started explaining things to us, should He explain them from the point of view of the educational and cultural equivalent from the year 3992?

And when the apostles are chosen and make their rounds to our known world, should they teach using the culture, science, and language from the year 3992? 

The answer is an obvious NO. Their knowledge would be so far advanced that we would not have a clue what was being said.  For instance, can you imagine the reaction you would receive by telling a 1st century individual about an email you sent to your friend living in another country?  Or how about basic television broadcasts?  They would think you as crazy people.  One could not listen with any coherence whatsoever!

So, why then must we attempt to interpret 2,000+ year old Scripture (and way further back) from the educational and cultural standpoint of the year 2012?

Using this unreliable method is the reason why the mark of the beast gets such ludicrous understandings as laser implants...this is why 2 Peter 3's "elements" must mean the atomic components of the universe.  And on and on it goes...

Shouldn't Scripture be interpreted according to the culture, customs, and language of their day in which it was spoken or written? Wouldn't this also mean that every generation could understand the Bible if they used this hermeneutic?  What we seem to have today is that only individuals from the 20th century and later have access to a full understanding of the Bible
« Last Edit: January 27, 2012, 02:01:25 PM by EdwardGoodie »

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2012, 01:45:14 PM »
i agree with you on trying to understand the Word of God by listening to all these people that completely dissect the Word in this day and age

if i went to a coc church and asked them for some of their books, then to a lsd church and asked them and so on, how many different version would i get?


if all i had was the Word and no other books, and nobody telling me that, that isn't what that means,  then i would have to interpret it the best way i could, with the help of God. right?

does that mean that God is not going to let me into heaven because i havnt heard thousands of different opinions?

i should hope not, then there would be no grace.

EdwardGoodie

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2012, 02:15:26 PM »
Fenton, I am not sure why you brought up being let into heaven but I think you may have missed my point.

If it is just you and the Bible, what valid reason is there to attempt an understanding of the Scriptures by using our present Western 21st century science, culture, and language to interpret Eastern ancient texts from 2,000 to 4,000 years ago?

Can you imagine someone from the year 5369 trying to interpret what was meant when a 21st century individual was quoted saying, "Did you see the ravens slaughter the bears the other day?"  The only way to understand what was said is to GO BACK to the culture and customs of the period it was said.  The NFL may have ceased to exist for thousands of years.  Do you get my point?

We most certainly realize that the "gay" clothing from James 2:3 does NOT represent homosexuality in any way, shape, or form...but we fail to carry this same 1st century context into several other passages and even whole doctrines.

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2012, 04:44:41 PM »
I understood what you wrote, but maybe i am not able to put into words what i am saying.  ::blushing::

ok--i just landed on a deserted island from a time capsule and i found a bible in an abandoned building, i came from the  year 5656 and i landed in 2012.


i have no idea who Christ is, except by what i read in the Word
how am i going to know and understand what to do by just reading the bible, WITHOUT, commentaries, references and dictionaries?


which is what i meant by getting to heaven, sorry. i still believe in the mansion ::smile:: He is building for me.

thethinker

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2012, 05:01:57 PM »
EdwardGoodie said:
Quote
Using this unreliable method is the reason why the mark of the beast gets such ludicrous understandings as laser implants...this is why 2 Peter 3's "elements" must mean the atomic components of the universe.  And on and on it goes...

Exactly! The word 'elements' back then had reference to the things of the old covenant system of things. The complete destruction of those 'elements' brought in the new heaven and earth. It was speaking about revolution. If our old system of government in America dissolved and we adopted a new form of government we would be creating a New America.

And the word 'atom' had reference to TIME in ancient thought. So if some saints from the first century were transported to our day and heard us talking talking the atom bomb they would think that it had something to do with TIME when we use the word to speak about matter.

thinker




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Re: Should We???
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2012, 05:01:57 PM »



larry2

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2012, 06:09:15 PM »

Preterists continue to talk of 70 AD? Get REAL!

Is that what a stuck record must FEEL?

Oh I hear of prophesies of Ravens TOO,

Looking at the results we all say BOO.

EdwardGoodie

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2012, 09:32:57 PM »
I understood what you wrote, but maybe i am not able to put into words what i am saying.  ::blushing::

ok--i just landed on a deserted island from a time capsule and i found a bible in an abandoned building, i came from the  year 5656 and i landed in 2012.


i have no idea who Christ is, except by what i read in the Word
how am i going to know and understand what to do by just reading the bible, WITHOUT, commentaries, references and dictionaries?

which is what i meant by getting to heaven, sorry. i still believe in the mansion ::smile:: He is building for me.

First, I would look very carefully in that abandoned building for some history books about ancient Rome to give you an understanding of the vernacular.  There might even be some abandoned building tools to help fix up the old place.  You will need a roof over your head.

Second, if you already came from an established time, the Gospel would have been present there.  You would have been aware of it and therefore accountable.  Unless you believe there will be no Gospel presence in 5656 "when man is still alive."  ::smile::  Hopefully, you would have learned a bunch about biblical history, the customs, the language, and the culture in that future existence.  They had invented thought transfer, hadn't they?

Third, if I was you on that deserted island, it would give me lots of time to think about why didn't Christ come (thinking in reference to your future) when everyone said it was such a near event in 2012.  3,500 years have transpired and still He didn't come.  I could tell you the answer but it will likely have no effect... ::smile::

And lastly, as long as you are the mansion (ABODE) in Christ, you will be just fine...

EdwardGoodie

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2012, 09:41:45 PM »

Preterists continue to talk of 70 AD? Get REAL!

Is that what a stuck record must FEEL?

Oh I hear of prophesies of Ravens TOO,

Looking at the results we all say BOO.



Cute limerick Larry.  Maybe we can call you LL from now on.  That will make Lois Lane, Lana Lang, Lex Luther, and Limerick Larry...can you imagine.

I can do much better than that:

Source: http://www.poetryfans.com/p312goodie.html

True Freedom
    by Edward Goodie


Worn down faces and desolate places
Bring to mind a troubled faith.
But distant traces and empty embraces
“Makes great your reward

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2012, 09:42:18 PM »
I understood what you wrote, but maybe i am not able to put into words what i am saying.  ::blushing::

ok--i just landed on a deserted island from a time capsule and i found a bible in an abandoned building, i came from the  year 5656 and i landed in 2012.


i have no idea who Christ is, except by what i read in the Word
how am i going to know and understand what to do by just reading the bible, WITHOUT, commentaries, references and dictionaries?

which is what i meant by getting to heaven, sorry. i still believe in the mansion ::smile:: He is building for me.

First, I would look very carefully in that abandoned building for some history books about ancient Rome to give you an understanding of the vernacular.  There might even be some abandoned building tools to help fix up the old place.  You will need a roof over your head.

Second, if you already came from an established time, the Gospel would have been present there.  You would have been aware of it and therefore accountable.  Unless you believe there will be no Gospel presence in 5656 "when man is still alive."  ::smile::  Hopefully, you would have learned a bunch about biblical history, the customs, the language, and the culture in that future existence.  They had invented thought transfer, hadn't they?

Third, if I was you on that deserted island, it would give me lots of time to think about why didn't Christ come (thinking in reference to your future) when everyone said it was such a near event in 2012.  3,500 years have transpired and still He didn't come.  I could tell you the answer but it will likely have no effect... ::smile::

And lastly, as long as you are the mansion (ABODE) in Christ, you will be just fine...


i was being serious --  but that is funny

change the year to 399bc then  ::smile::

EdwardGoodie

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2012, 10:20:14 PM »
[
i was being serious --  but that is funny

change the year to 399bc then  ::smile::

Coming from or going to?  Did you like my poem?  Whose was better, mine or Larry's? (Don't be biased now)

larry2

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2012, 10:27:15 PM »

Preterists continue to talk of 70 AD? Get REAL!

Is that what a stuck record must FEEL?

Oh I hear of prophesies of Ravens TOO,

Looking at the results we all say BOO.



Cute limerick Larry.  Maybe we can call you LL from now on.  That will make Lois Lane, Lana Lang, Lex Luther, and Limerick Larry...can you imagine.

I can do much better than that:

Source: http://www.poetryfans.com/p312goodie.html

True Freedom
    by Edward Goodie


Worn down faces and desolate places
Bring to mind a troubled faith.
But distant traces and empty embraces
“Makes great your reward

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2012, 10:33:34 PM »
[
i was being serious --  but that is funny

change the year to 399bc then  ::smile::

Coming from or going to?  Did you like my poem?  Whose was better, mine or Larry's? (Don't be biased now)


LOL --Larry's was funnygood, yes yours was thoughtfulgood, how about that

well i would be coming from 399bc because i fell into a futuristic black hole, and the only knowledge i had was about sheep, no teaching of any kind about the law. and all i had to read was a book i found called the Bible. no tools cause they were rusty

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2012, 10:41:33 PM »

Preterists continue to talk of 70 AD? Get REAL!

Is that what a stuck record must FEEL?

Oh I hear of prophesies of Ravens TOO,

Looking at the results we all say BOO.



Cute limerick Larry.  Maybe we can call you LL from now on.  That will make Lois Lane, Lana Lang, Lex Luther, and Limerick Larry...can you imagine.

I can do much better than that:

Source: http://www.poetryfans.com/p312goodie.html

True Freedom
    by Edward Goodie


Worn down faces and desolate places
Bring to mind a troubled faith.
But distant traces and empty embraces
“Makes great your reward

EdwardGoodie

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2012, 11:03:56 PM »
[
i was being serious --  but that is funny

change the year to 399bc then  ::smile::

Coming from or going to?  Did you like my poem?  Whose was better, mine or Larry's? (Don't be biased now)


LOL --Larry's was funnygood, yes yours was thoughtfulgood, how about that

well i would be coming from 399bc because i fell into a futuristic black hole, and the only knowledge i had was about sheep, no teaching of any kind about the law. and all i had to read was a book i found called the Bible. no tools cause they were rusty
First off, if you say you were coming from 399BC, I would have to call you a liar.  Time travel wasn't invented until 4039 (I know, I was there).  So, for all intents and purposes, I am going to leave you there in 399BC and give you the following advice:

Well, I am pretty confident that you would have heard of the Jews return from captivity - probably page 8 of the Roman Report or on page 1 of the Jewish Journal...

I would suggest that you make your way to the temple complex because the Bible you had in your possession would be the OT - the same Scriptures that Paul preached from (Acts 24:14, Acts 28:3)

It is good that you were knowledgeable about sheep.  It will enable you to understand the lamb sacrifice.  I just hope you wouldn't get too engrossed with following the Law so much that it made you think that righteousness was earned by attempting to keep it...your great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandchildren might be the very ones who would persecute the Messiah because of such reasoning...

Offline fenton

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Re: Should We???
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2012, 11:15:46 PM »

First off, if you say you were coming from 399BC, I would have to call you a liar.  Time travel wasn't invented until 4039 (I know, I was there).  So, for all intents and purposes, I am going to leave you there in 399BC and give you the following advice:

i fell in a futureistic blackhole -- come on man -- "football pun intended"

Well, I am pretty confident that you would have heard of the Jews return from captivity - probably page 8 of the Roman Report or on page 1 of the Jewish Journal...

nope never heard of them

I would suggest that you make your way to the temple complex because the Bible you had in your possession would be the OT - the same Scriptures that Paul preached from (Acts 24:14, Acts 28:3)

so in the year  2012 there is only the OT??  boy am i in trouble then, cause i cant get to the temple from here

It is good that you were knowledgeable about sheep.  It will enable you to understand the lamb sacrifice.  I just hope you wouldn't get too engrossed with following the Law so much that it made you think that righteousness was earned by attempting to keep it...your great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandchildren might be the very ones who would persecute the Messiah because of such reasoning...

just one problem, i was never taught the law or sacrifices, so how do i understand the Word of God