Christian Forums and Message Board

This isn't a bible verse but I couldn't find an appropriate place to put this.

Jay Leno Quote

With hurricanes, flooding, tornados, mud slides, fires out of control, severe thunderstorms tearing up the country from one end to another, and with the threat of bird flu and terrorist attacks, are we sure this is a good time to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance?

There's no good time to take God out. It galls me to the core that the minority of atheist jerks in this country think they can dictate to the rest of us that religous reference isn't appropriate in the Pledge.

As a Christian myself, I don't know if I really agree with having Under God in the pledge of allegiance, or sustaining In God we Trust as our national motto. It comes dangerously close to making Christianity the official religion of the country. And it's not like Under God and In God we Trust have ALWAYS been there. They weren't added until the 1950s, primarily to distinguish ourselves from Communist countries who were espousing Atheism.

For me, I just don't like the connotation that in order to pledge allegiance to the country, one must first believe in God. I don't think the two are inexorably linked.

Saying In God we trust has nothing to do with Christianity.  It has to do with believing in God.  Muslims believe in God, Jews believe in God, lots of religions believe in God.  All it's saying is that we believe that there was a Creator, and that under Him, we are all equals.

I guess it doesn't specifically say the "Christian God" but that is most definitely the connotation, since most consider us a Christian Nation, and since most of the members who voted on this as our national slogan are Christian. But even so, stating that the nation's official stance is that there is a God is still dangerously close to overstepping that wall between church and state. In order to pledge allegiance to this country, one must still recite "under God," even if he or she does not believe in one. Again, I don't like the notion that one must believe this country is "under God" in order to pledge allegiance.

The separation of church and state seems to be one of the most misunderstood aspects of our country.  Let's look at the actual words for a second.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

What does this actually say, and where did "separation of church and state" actually come from?

What the first amendment actually states is that congress will stay out of religion.  Nowhere does it say that religion should stay out of congress.  It says that there will not be an official religion of the US, or any laws restricting religious freedoms.

To say that the US as an entity is "one nation, under God." does not cross this line as there is no law passed to enforce anyone to actually believe in God.  There is nothing stating that we can't display the ten commandments in a court, just that we can't enforce them as our own laws. (which kinda makes it pointless to put them in the courtroom, but it's still legal.)  There is nothing stating that we can't have public prayer, we just can't force people to participate in it.  There is nothing stating that we can't have God on our currency, we just can't make people swear by it to spend that money.  This country has freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

Saying In God we trust has nothing to do with Christianity.  It has to do with believing in God.  Muslims believe in God, Jews believe in God, lots of religions believe in God.  All it's saying is that we believe that there was a Creator, and that under Him, we are all equals.

yes..but all these groups believe in a false God.

No they don't.  Jews and Muslims believe in the same God that we do.  They just believe different things about him.  One believes that they are the chosen people and that a savior is coming at some point in the future(jews).  One believes that Jesus was a lesser prophet and that Mohammad was the greatest prophet (muslims) and we believe that Jesus was the savior and Son of God.

Muslims believe in Allah and follow the koran, they are instructed by the koran to kill christians and jews wheverever they find them. They do not believe or follow our God at all.
There is only one way to the father and that is through Jesus.

Muslims are not saved, they do not believe Jesus is God's son or that He died for us and as a consequence they are on their way to hell.

Jews follow the same God but without a Messiah they are lost.

No Mohammed wasn't a Jew. And the muslims claiming to worship the same God as we do, doean't make him the same God. Allah is a counterfeit and all counterfeits have somethimg in common or look like the real thing. Mohammed simply tried to concoct a single God from the many tgat the polytheistic Arab tribes worahipped such as Allah the moon God to be like the monotheiatic Jews and Christian's God Jehovah. Islam is a product of the Great Deceiver, Satan.