The "Five Steps"

[koscheiman]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

[koscheiman]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

[Mere Nick]

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

"Church" buildings are not specifically mentioned, but upper rooms are, mmm hmm.

[HRoberson]

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

"Church" buildings are not specifically mentioned, but upper rooms are, mmm hmm.

Well, right you are.....upper rooms in someone's three-story house, with an open window on the third floor. 

[koscheiman]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

[herlovingmother]

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6XJkNlAk9c

Paul Washer says it all.

You should look him up, cause he's really, really cool.

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

[koscheiman]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

Elders in the plural are authrized by Scripture. Having a chairman for decorums sake is not a bad idea so long as he is not lording over the other elders. A bishop over several churces is not found in Dcripture it is an inovation. The pope is likewise an innovation. The Scriptures say there is one head over the church Jesus the Christ, The creation of the position entiled pope creates two heads over the church this is not the Scriptural plan for the church. I believe the following is quite possibly referring to the pope:

Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 NKJV)

[zoonance]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

That a guy called a pope exists is a different issue than this guy called a pope setting salvatic policy.

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

Elders in the plural are authrized by Scripture. Having a chairman for decorums sake is not a bad idea so long as he is not lording over the other elders. A bishop over several churces is not found in Dcripture it is an inovation. The pope is likewise an innovation. The Scriptures say there is one head over the church Jesus the Christ, The creation of the position entiled pope creates two heads over the church this is not the Scriptural plan for the church. I believe the following is quite possibly referring to the pope:

Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 NKJV)

....and so, if you agree with the innovation, it's OK. But if you object to it, it isn't?

Cool by me.

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

That a guy called a pope exists is a different issue than this guy called a pope setting salvatic policy.

I'm not defending whether the Pope is always correct. I am simply arguing that there are a host of things not authorized by Scripture. If a local group of bishops can elect a chairman, why can't a worldwide set of bishops do the same thing?

[koscheiman]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

Elders in the plural are authrized by Scripture. Having a chairman for decorums sake is not a bad idea so long as he is not lording over the other elders. A bishop over several churces is not found in Dcripture it is an inovation. The pope is likewise an innovation. The Scriptures say there is one head over the church Jesus the Christ, The creation of the position entiled pope creates two heads over the church this is not the Scriptural plan for the church. I believe the following is quite possibly referring to the pope:

Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 NKJV)

....and so, if you agree with the innovation, it's OK. But if you object to it, it isn't?

Cool by me.

I do not agree with any innovations or addititions. An expedient is not an innovation or addition.

[HRoberson]

Actually He just said "Feed my sheep".

yeah....but He said that to the first Pope, so the rest of us don't need to pay attention.........

The position of pope does not exist in the Bible it is a Catholic addition.

.....yeah......neither does President of the United States.

The President of the United States has nothing to do with the church and its structure. What exactly is your point?

Well, if you don't like that example, let's use songbooks, or church buildings, or long-term located preachers, or .....pick your favorite innovation that isn't mentioned in Scripture. Shall we also outlaw those because they aren't in Scripture?

You are talking about expedients not additions to the Scripture. We are commanded to sing a songbook is an aid to singing it does not add anything to the command. We are commanded to meet a church building aids in this it does not add anything to the command. Do you understand?

Yes, I understand just fine, thank you.

Our elders organize themselves with a chairman, whose "term" lasts three months at a time. This chairman isn't authorized in Scripture any more than the Pope. Since it appears that church organization is for the convenience of the church in question, it seems to me that the existence of the Pope per se, isn't a big deal.

Elders in the plural are authrized by Scripture. Having a chairman for decorums sake is not a bad idea so long as he is not lording over the other elders. A bishop over several churces is not found in Dcripture it is an inovation. The pope is likewise an innovation. The Scriptures say there is one head over the church Jesus the Christ, The creation of the position entiled pope creates two heads over the church this is not the Scriptural plan for the church. I believe the following is quite possibly referring to the pope:

Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
(2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 NKJV)

....and so, if you agree with the innovation, it's OK. But if you object to it, it isn't?

Cool by me.

I do not agree with any innovations or additions. An expedient is not an innovation or addition.

And, pray tell, who's decided this?

A rose by any other name.........