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Offline Michael G

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Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« on: September 02, 2010, 09:22:18 PM »
Hebrew 4 Reference scripture

Heb 4:4  For He has spoken in a certain place of “THE
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 08:32:39 AM by Michael G »

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Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« on: September 02, 2010, 09:22:18 PM »

Offline Michael G

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2010, 06:38:04 PM »
These people were not born Israelites or Jews and they ended up keeping the Sabbath

Mat 1:5 Salmon begot BOAZ by RAHAB, Boaz begot OBED by RUTH, Obed begot Jesse,
Mat 1:6 and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot SOLOMON by her who had been the WIFE of URIAH.

“RAHAB
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 08:34:35 AM by Michael G »

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2010, 06:38:04 PM »

Offline Michael G

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2010, 02:45:15 PM »
The Sabbath is sign between Us and Our Father the Creator of Heaven and Earth and the Sea and all thats in them...


God set apart a special day of the week in the Beginning of the Bible and he says in the NT he made it for Mankind which is the name given to the first ADAM . There was no other day specified as a HOLY day in Bible, it is a SPECIAL day of our God at creation.   
We are not to question this special day of REST for it is specified in the Fourth Commandment and God asks us to REMEMBER it and keep it.

 
The point is the Bible has always said it is the 7th day of the week in the book of Genesis to the end of the Bible simply put the Sabbath Seventh day REST of God was made for ADAM which if you look at the Hebrew definition for ADAM it means “MANKIND
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 08:43:53 AM by Michael G »

Offline Michael G

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2010, 05:49:30 AM »
Encarta encyclopedia 1999
Saturday, seventh day of the week, named in honor of the Roman god Saturn. In Latin, Saturday was called dies Saturni; it was called Sater-daeg by the Anglo-Saxons. It is the holy day of the Israelites of the Old Testament and in Hebrew is called Sabbath, the only day of the week with a name, the rest being numbered. The word Sabbath  derives from the Hebrew word meaning "to rest or cease"; the Jews were enjoined from working on the seventh day. It begins at sunset Friday and lasts until sunset Saturday. In the early days of Christianity, the holy day gradually shifted to Sunday,

Sunday, first day of the week. Its English name and its German name ( Sonntag) are derived from the Latin dies solis, "sun's day," the name of a pagan Roman holiday. In the New Testament (see Revelation 1:10) it is called the Lord's Day (Dominica  in the Latin version), from which the name of Sunday is derived in Romance languages (French Dimanche; Italian Domenica; Spanish Domingo; Roman Duminica). In the early days of Christianity, Sunday began to replace the Sabbath and to be observed to honor the resurrection of Christ. Sunday was instituted as a day of rest, consecrated especially to the service of God, by the Roman emperor Constantine the Great. Since the 4th century, ecclesiastical and civil legislation has frequently regulated work on Sunday and service attendance. In the United States, laws limiting business activity and amusements on Sundays have become known as blue laws.

About 196 AD the Bishop of Rome Attempted to force all the churches to commemorate Christ’s resurrection on what we call Easter Sunday instead of Passover
The first Secular law was enacted by Emperor Constantine in 321 AD making Sunday a Family holiday. When Practice of keeping lent was instituted, each Sunday during that time period was kept in honor of the resurrection.  Sunday & Sabbath were kept together. Saturday for the Sabbath and Sunday for the resurrection. The First Sunday law was enacted in 538 AD by the Bishop of Rome, throughout the Ages the ages the Seventh day Christ’s followers kept Sabbath.


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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2010, 05:49:30 AM »

Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2010, 07:45:44 PM »
Hebrews 4 says nothing about anyone keeping the Sabbath.  I don't see a command or even an encouragement anywhere in that chapter about keeping a 7th day Sabbath.  I see the author of Hebrews encouraging the people he is writing to to embrace Christ as their Savior.  Our Sabbath rest is Jesus Christ, not some day or commandment:

Hebrews 4:9-10  9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;  10 for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his.

Observing a day is not going to save us.  Only through Christ's finished work on the cross can we rest from our own 'work.'  That is the point of the entire chapter.  It has nothing to do with the Sabbath day.  Anyone placing emphasis on keeping a seventh day Sabbath is not resting on Christ, they are attempting to become finishers of their own faith instead of relying upon Christ to do so.

Are you writing this stuff yourself or are you copying and pasting it from some SDA site?  Because I notice that although you change thread titles, alot of it is highly repetitious.

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2010, 07:45:44 PM »



Amo

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2010, 11:30:57 AM »
Quote
Our Sabbath rest is Jesus Christ, not some day or commandment:

The bible says nowhere, that Jesus is the Sabbath rest, or that this is the seventh day.  These statements are wholly extra biblical.  You may search the scriptures and find many different titles for Christ, but you will never see Him called the Sabbath rest.  The Sabbath has always been a sign of entering into God’s rest.  It was instituted by Christ Himself at creation, which is why Christ is Lord of the Sabbath, not the Sabbath.

You correctly state that Jesus is the rest of God, this is scriptural.

Matt 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

The Sabbath day itself is not that rest, it is a specific time allotted by Christ Himself to enter into that rest in a way that is not possible on other days.  Number one, because the day was blessed and sanctified by God, who alone can bless and sanctify anything.  Number two, because, having set the day aside for nothing other than quality time with God, there are not the distractions of every day life to interfere.  The day is observed by faith alone.  There is nothing apart from the word of God alone that makes the day appear different from any other in any way.  Therefore, it is observed by faith in the word of God alone, rather than because the one who observes it is under the law.

What is entering into God’s rest, if it is not having faith in His word, and acting accordingly?  Being under the law, involves facing the penalty of the law.  Those only who have broken the law, and do not embrace Christ's intercession, face the penalty of the law.  Christ did not do away with the law, so that we wouldn’t have to face the penalty.  No sir, He paid the penalty so that we would no longer be under the law.  It is not the law that needs to change, this is not the gospel.  It is us that needs to change. We need to be brought back into conformity with the law, not the other way around.  This is what Christ came to accomplish.

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Rom 7:13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful. 14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.


















Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2010, 07:18:21 PM »
The bible says nowhere, that Jesus is the Sabbath rest, or that this is the seventh day.  These statements are wholly extra biblical.  You may search the scriptures and find many different titles for Christ, but you will never see Him called the Sabbath rest.  The Sabbath has always been a sign of entering into God’s rest.  It was instituted by Christ Himself at creation, which is why Christ is Lord of the Sabbath, not the Sabbath.

And again I ask you, as I have many times, where is the command for anyone to keep the Sabbath before Exodus?  And where is the command for anyone besides Israel to observe the Sabbath?  Where does Jesus or one of the Apostles command us to keep the Sabbath?  The entire point of Hebrews is to not be chained to the law and that Christ is our Sabbath rest.  No one can come to God without doing so through Christ's sacrifice, so when you say we do not entire our Sabbath rest through Christ, you are not quite getting it.  Try reading Hebrews again, but try taking off the SDA spectacles off before you do so.
















[/quote]

Amo

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2010, 09:23:08 PM »
Quote
And again I ask you, as I have many times, where is the command for anyone to keep the Sabbath before Exodus?  And where is the command for anyone besides Israel to observe the Sabbath?  Where does Jesus or one of the Apostles command us to keep the Sabbath?  The entire point of Hebrews is to not be chained to the law and that Christ is our Sabbath rest.  No one can come to God without doing so through Christ's sacrifice, so when you say we do not entire our Sabbath rest through Christ, you are not quite getting it.  Try reading Hebrews again, but try taking off the SDA spectacles off before you do so.

Every admonition to keep the commandments of God, is an admonition to keep also the fourth commandment of God.  There is nowhere in the bible that anyone ever says anything about keeping only some of the commandments of God.  Perhaps I am not the one who needs to take off a pair of preconception glasses.

Show the scriptures that say entering into Christ's rest means there is no longer a Sabbath.  This would directly contradict the words of Christ in relation to Him not coming to change the law.  Lets look at the verses in question.

Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

The problem being addressed in the above scriptures is a lack of faith.  You will notice that the writer says that the Jews also had the gospel preached to them.  You know, all those sacrifices of the sanctuary and it's services, which represented Christ.  Many of the Jews did not believe, therefore they could not enter into God's rest.

The seventh day Sabbath is mentioned in the above scriptures as an example of that rest.  There is no indication anywhere that it is being done away with.  The Jews had a problem keeping the Sabbath, and the rest of the law, because of unbelief.  They never understood or believed God, that the sacrifices representing Christ saved them, so they tried to keep God's law in order to be saved, instead of because they already were saved.  Which thing is impossible. 

The Sabbath has not lost it's significance since Christ died for the ungodly, to the contrary, it's significance has increased.  Now it is more than the memorial of creation, and resting by faith in the power of Him who created heaven and earth and all that is in it, including us.  Now it is also resting by faith in the power of Him who redeemed us, and is able to make us new creatures in Christ Jesus.  For just as God blessed and sanctified the seventh day, as only God can, so now has He also blessed and sanctified us sinners in and through His Son Jesus Christ.  The Sabbath is a memorial of God's creation, and his recreation in us.  It has not lost it's significance or been changed, and there is no scripture that teaches it has.  It's meaning remains the same.  Thus it will be observed in heaven also.

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.


God established the seventh day Sabbath at creation.  He reiterated it's importance to Israel by commanding it's observance with His own voice, and writing the command with His own finger.  Christ kept, and taught proper Sabbath observance, and the bible conclusively states that it will be observed in the new heaven and new earth.  It is certainly greater presumption on your part, to believe that no one payed it any attention at all from creation to it's command to the Jews, and to believe it has no significance now, than it is on my part to seriously doubt your presumption.  Well, that is to say, I don't believe you at all.










Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2010, 07:36:56 PM »
Quote
And again I ask you, as I have many times, where is the command for anyone to keep the Sabbath before Exodus?  And where is the command for anyone besides Israel to observe the Sabbath?  Where does Jesus or one of the Apostles command us to keep the Sabbath?  The entire point of Hebrews is to not be chained to the law and that Christ is our Sabbath rest.  No one can come to God without doing so through Christ's sacrifice, so when you say we do not entire our Sabbath rest through Christ, you are not quite getting it.  Try reading Hebrews again, but try taking off the SDA spectacles off before you do so.

Every admonition to keep the commandments of God, is an admonition to keep also the fourth commandment of God.  There is nowhere in the bible that anyone ever says anything about keeping only some of the commandments of God.  Perhaps I am not the one who needs to take off a pair of preconception glasses.

Show the scriptures that say entering into Christ's rest means there is no longer a Sabbath.  This would directly contradict the words of Christ in relation to Him not coming to change the law.  Lets look at the verses in question.

Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

The problem being addressed in the above scriptures is a lack of faith.  You will notice that the writer says that the Jews also had the gospel preached to them.  You know, all those sacrifices of the sanctuary and it's services, which represented Christ.  Many of the Jews did not believe, therefore they could not enter into God's rest.

The seventh day Sabbath is mentioned in the above scriptures as an example of that rest.  There is no indication anywhere that it is being done away with.  The Jews had a problem keeping the Sabbath, and the rest of the law, because of unbelief.  They never understood or believed God, that the sacrifices representing Christ saved them, so they tried to keep God's law in order to be saved, instead of because they already were saved.  Which thing is impossible. 

The Sabbath has not lost it's significance since Christ died for the ungodly, to the contrary, it's significance has increased.  Now it is more than the memorial of creation, and resting by faith in the power of Him who created heaven and earth and all that is in it, including us.  Now it is also resting by faith in the power of Him who redeemed us, and is able to make us new creatures in Christ Jesus.  For just as God blessed and sanctified the seventh day, as only God can, so now has He also blessed and sanctified us sinners in and through His Son Jesus Christ.  The Sabbath is a memorial of God's creation, and his recreation in us.  It has not lost it's significance or been changed, and there is no scripture that teaches it has.  It's meaning remains the same.  Thus it will be observed in heaven also.

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.


God established the seventh day Sabbath at creation.  He reiterated it's importance to Israel by commanding it's observance with His own voice, and writing the command with His own finger.  Christ kept, and taught proper Sabbath observance, and the bible conclusively states that it will be observed in the new heaven and new earth.  It is certainly greater presumption on your part, to believe that no one payed it any attention at all from creation to it's command to the Jews, and to believe it has no significance now, than it is on my part to seriously doubt your presumption.  Well, that is to say, I don't believe you at all.

Once again, I ask, please show me the command, in Genesis, for mankind to observe the Sabbath.  Please show me anyone even observing the Sabbath, before Exodus.  From scripture.  If you can do so, then there is an issue to be resolved, if not, all your assertions that the Sabbath was instituted for mankind at Creation are just your own words.  You cannot "assume" anything when it comes to scripture, you have to have evidence, so when you say that God instituted the Sabbath for mankind at creation, you have to have scriptural evidence.

Why is it just the Sabbath that is so important?  Why not the entire package?  It would seem to me that if the Sabbath was so important, and that the church, as the Body of Christ, should be observing it, that God would not have allowed the Temple, and along with it, the Levitical priesthood, to be destroyed, so that it could be observed as God directed it to be.  Because if you are going to say that God's laws have not changed and we need to do exactly as He has commanded, the observance of the Sabbath has very specific parameters that one cannot accept or dismiss piecemeal or any old way they want.  Because SDA's pick and choose which parts of the law they wish to keep and which parts they don't, but will never even touch on that issue.  Because there are 613 individual Mosaic laws.  Not just 10 commandments Amo.  Are you keeping all 613 of them?

Jesus observed the Sabbath.  Before His death on the cross, as a Jew, He had to, He had no choice.  His Godly covenant was now binding on Himself as flesh.  His resurrection changed that.  I ask, again, as I have so many times before, to please show me a command in the NT from Jesus or anyone else for the church to keep the Sabbath.  Because if it has the importance that you and the SDA church place upon it, the command would be there and it would be very plain and impossible to mis-understand.  God does not leave His people in the dark as to what is required of them.

So I am waiting for a few scriptures from you, still.  A re-cap:

1.  Scripture that commands man to observe the Sabbath before Exodus.

2.  Scripture in the NT that commands the church to keep the Sabbath.

Offline djconklin

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2010, 08:12:24 AM »
Quote
1.  Scripture that commands man to observe the Sabbath before Exodus.
Where's the command in Scripture to worship only God, before the Sinai event?  Where's the command in Scripture not to make or bow down to idols before Sinai? Where's the command in Scripture not to take God's name in vain before Sinai? Where's the command in Scripture not to kill, or steal or committ adultery, bear false witness before Sinai? etc..

Since there were only Jews present at Sinai does that mean that the Gentiles are excluded from having to obey the Ten commandments because no commandments were given to them?

Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2010, 03:03:29 PM »
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1.  Scripture that commands man to observe the Sabbath before Exodus.
Where's the command in Scripture to worship only God, before the Sinai event?  Where's the command in Scripture not to make or bow down to idols before Sinai? Where's the command in Scripture not to take God's name in vain before Sinai? Where's the command in Scripture not to kill, or steal or committ adultery, bear false witness before Sinai? etc..

Since there were only Jews present at Sinai does that mean that the Gentiles are excluded from having to obey the Ten commandments because no commandments were given to them?

Logical fallacy.  The command for anyone to worship God isn't there, so I wouldn't try and argue it, but the implication is there by references to Enoch, Noah, Abraham, etc.  who communicated with God and were faithful to Him as opposed to people like Nimrod, the entire population of the earth besides Noah and his family prior to the flood, the entire population of Sodom and Gomorah, etc., etc. The same applies for idols.  The Tower of Babel was obviously an allusion to idols and God scattered mankind because of it.  Before the 10 commandments are given, idols are referred to as "gods" with a small "g" and it is clear they are not to be worshipped.  Your bringing up subjects that haven't even been talked about.  I repeat, if you had solid proof, you would simply provide it instead of constantly trying to lead people down rabbit trails.

Once again:  If you are going to claim that Genesis 2:2-3 institutes Sabbath for mankind at creation, you have to be able to show that command plainly within scripture, and you can't.  You don't have a single mention of the Sabbath before the Exodus or even an implication of it anywhere in the Bible until that time and you have clear scripture saying that that covenant was not in existance until Mt. Sinai.  That is like coming up to a fence when you are hunting and it has a great big "NO HUNTING" sign plastered all over it and you say to yourself  "I don't think it really means no hunting at all."  Like I said, just re-work what you think the Bible says and you no longer need the Bible at all.

As for the commandments, read Exodus 31 again.. It says Israelites.  That means Israel.  That means God's chosen people.  I am quite sure that since He is God and He created everything and is in control of everything, if He had wanted to give the 10 commandments to Egypt, or the Caananites, etc. He would have arranged for them to be there.  They are called God's chosen people for a reason.  Once again, you are taking what scripture clearly says and dismissing it because you don't like what it says because it doesn't gel with your doctrine. 

Offline DaleinTn

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2010, 01:18:01 AM »
I would like to chime in if I may

In John chapter 1, we know that Jesus is the active "person" of the God-head doing the creating.

Joh 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2  He was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3  All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.


So, Jesus is the "God" spoken of in the book of Genesis when God was creating the earth.

Gen 1:1  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Gen 2:2  And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.
Gen 2:3  Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.


So, Jesus blessed the seventh day and sanctified it because He rested from all His work.  In 1John it tells us that we should walk as He walked

1Jn 2:6  He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

Jesus rested on the seventh day.  He is my example.  This to my mind is a clear teaching of the 4th commandment before Mt. Sinai.  This is also a clear teaching, to my mind, of the 4th commandment to all mankind.  The only humans around that first Sabbath was Adam and Eve.  They weren't Jews.  They kept the 4th commandment.  It is also interesting to note that this was God's (Jesus') plan before sin ever entered mankind.  This was before the fall of Adam and Eve.  There are 2 things that God instituted in a perfect world and that is marriage and the Sabbath.

Jesus also says that He is Lord of the Sabbath day.

Luk 6:5  And He said to them, "The Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath."

He is Lord of the Sabbath because He created it!  He created everything!

Lets also look at another example of the Sabbath commandment before Exodus 20

Exo 16:21  So they gathered it every morning, every man according to his need. And when the sun became hot, it melted.
Exo 16:22  And so it was, on the sixth day, that they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for each one. And all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.
Exo 16:23  Then he said to them, "This is what the LORD has said: 'Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the LORD. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.' "
Exo 16:24  So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it.
Exo 16:25  Then Moses said, "Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the LORD; today you will not find it in the field.
Exo 16:26  Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none."
Exo 16:27  Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none.
Exo 16:28  And the LORD said to Moses, "How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws?
Exo 16:29  See! For the LORD has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day."
Exo 16:30  So the people rested on the seventh day.


The miracle of the manna is another example of the 4th commandment.  The manna would only last 1 day the first day of the week thru the fifth day of the week.  Then, miraculously, on the sixth day or the preparation day, it lasted 2 days.  And then, on Sabbath, no manna fell at all!  And this lasted for 40 years!  

I believe that the word that starts the 4th commandment "Remember" is prophetic with a dual application.  The first application came to light when God gave audibly the 10 Commandments in Exodus.  The Jews had forgotten all about the Sabbath, so they needed a reminder.  I also believe that it has an application to everyone living here and now.  During the Dark Ages, Bibles were only allowed to be read by the church leaders.  It is during this time that all the fallacies in Christianity came into the church.  The immortality of the soul and a forever burning hell, just to name 2.  So, when you and I read Exodus chapter 20 starting with verse 8, the first word is "Remember."  Why remember?  Because we forgot about the Sabbath, too.  

True Sabbath keeping has nothing to do with legalism.  It has everything with love!

Exo 20:6  but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Deu 5:10  but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Deu 5:29  Oh, that they had such a heart in them that they would fear Me and always keep all My commandments, that it might be well with them and with their children forever!

Joh 14:15  "If you love Me, keep My commandments.

Joh 15:10  If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.


1Jn 5:3  For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.

Jesus is very plain to me, you don't have to keep His commandments.  But you should if you love Him!  I didn't say it, He did and if that is legalism, then Jesus is the one who instituted it, not me.

One more note, you and I are Jews.  If we were not, we would have no hope!

Gal 3:28  There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29  And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


These verses, in my opinion, reveal to us that by accepting Jesus as our personal Savior, we are adopted into the family, hence "Abraham's seed."  Heirs according to what promise?

Joh 14:1  "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me.
Joh 14:2  In My Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3  And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.



Heaven!  An eternity with the very definition of Love!

1Jn 4:8  He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.

my two cents

Job 13:15  Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him. Even so, I will defend my own ways before Him.

« Last Edit: November 20, 2010, 01:43:32 AM by DaleinTn »

Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2010, 07:42:45 PM »
I would like to chime in if I may

In John chapter 1, we know that Jesus is the active "person" of the God-head doing the creating.

Joh 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2  He was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3  All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.


So, Jesus is the "God" spoken of in the book of Genesis when God was creating the earth.

Gen 1:1  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Gen 2:2  And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.
Gen 2:3  Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.


So, Jesus blessed the seventh day and sanctified it because He rested from all His work.  In 1John it tells us that we should walk as He walked

1Jn 2:6  He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

Jesus rested on the seventh day.  He is my example.  This to my mind is a clear teaching of the 4th commandment before Mt. Sinai.  This is also a clear teaching, to my mind, of the 4th commandment to all mankind.  The only humans around that first Sabbath was Adam and Eve.  They weren't Jews.  They kept the 4th commandment.  It is also interesting to note that this was God's (Jesus') plan before sin ever entered mankind.  This was before the fall of Adam and Eve.  There are 2 things that God instituted in a perfect world and that is marriage and the Sabbath.

Jesus also says that He is Lord of the Sabbath day.

Luk 6:5  And He said to them, "The Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath."

He is Lord of the Sabbath because He created it!  He created everything!

Lets also look at another example of the Sabbath commandment before Exodus 20

Exo 16:21  So they gathered it every morning, every man according to his need. And when the sun became hot, it melted.
Exo 16:22  And so it was, on the sixth day, that they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for each one. And all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.
Exo 16:23  Then he said to them, "This is what the LORD has said: 'Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the LORD. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.' "
Exo 16:24  So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it.
Exo 16:25  Then Moses said, "Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the LORD; today you will not find it in the field.
Exo 16:26  Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none."
Exo 16:27  Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none.
Exo 16:28  And the LORD said to Moses, "How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws?
Exo 16:29  See! For the LORD has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day."
Exo 16:30  So the people rested on the seventh day.


The miracle of the manna is another example of the 4th commandment.  The manna would only last 1 day the first day of the week thru the fifth day of the week.  Then, miraculously, on the sixth day or the preparation day, it lasted 2 days.  And then, on Sabbath, no manna fell at all!  And this lasted for 40 years!  

I believe that the word that starts the 4th commandment "Remember" is prophetic with a dual application.  The first application came to light when God gave audibly the 10 Commandments in Exodus.  The Jews had forgotten all about the Sabbath, so they needed a reminder.  I also believe that it has an application to everyone living here and now.  During the Dark Ages, Bibles were only allowed to be read by the church leaders.  It is during this time that all the fallacies in Christianity came into the church.  The immortality of the soul and a forever burning hell, just to name 2.  So, when you and I read Exodus chapter 20 starting with verse 8, the first word is "Remember."  Why remember?  Because we forgot about the Sabbath, too.  

True Sabbath keeping has nothing to do with legalism.  It has everything with love!

Exo 20:6  but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Deu 5:10  but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

Deu 5:29  Oh, that they had such a heart in them that they would fear Me and always keep all My commandments, that it might be well with them and with their children forever!

Joh 14:15  "If you love Me, keep My commandments.

Joh 15:10  If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.


1Jn 5:3  For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.

Jesus is very plain to me, you don't have to keep His commandments.  But you should if you love Him!  I didn't say it, He did and if that is legalism, then Jesus is the one who instituted it, not me.

One more note, you and I are Jews.  If we were not, we would have no hope!

Gal 3:28  There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29  And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


These verses, in my opinion, reveal to us that by accepting Jesus as our personal Savior, we are adopted into the family, hence "Abraham's seed."  Heirs according to what promise?

Joh 14:1  "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me.
Joh 14:2  In My Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3  And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.



Heaven!  An eternity with the very definition of Love!

1Jn 4:8  He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.

my two cents

Job 13:15  Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him. Even so, I will defend my own ways before Him.



Everything you've assumed is based on silence.  No one is shown observing the Sabbath until Mt. Sinai.  You can't say Adam & Eve observed the Sabbath because you were not there, and because the Bible does not say they kept the Sabbath.  That is conjecture on your part and that is really reaching.  Again, if SDAs had solid proof of their doctrine, they would provide it when asked for proof.  I will ask you this, since no other SDA in the 30 some-odd years I have been asking it has ever answered the question:

How, exactly, do you 'keep' the Sabbath?

Our Sabbath rest is in Christ.  The NT is abundantly clear on the subject.  Only a person wishing to base their belief system on an outside source, not the Bible itself, would choose to say otherwise.

Offline djconklin

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2010, 01:58:24 PM »
>Our Sabbath rest is in Christ.

That is correct.  As we say: when you physically rest on the Sabbath you show that you are resting in him spiritually.  In fact, the only way you can "keep the Sabbath holy" is to rest in Christ.

Offline Cobalt1959

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Re: Hebrews 4 Reveals the Sabbath Day
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2010, 07:05:57 PM »
>Our Sabbath rest is in Christ.

That is correct.  As we say: when you physically rest on the Sabbath you show that you are resting in him spiritually.  In fact, the only way you can "keep the Sabbath holy" is to rest in Christ.

Only our Sabbath rest in Christ is never directed or commanded in physical terms, it is always defined in spiritual terms, 24-7.  SDA's hinge it on a day.