Sunday Worship is not sanctioned in Scripture.

[GB]

Just a comment. One must understand the following passage in the context of scriptures.

1 Tim. 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

Consider, God gave commandment (a law for that matter) to Adam who is not a sinner at the time.

By the way, you mentioned "Christ's Sabbath", where can we find that in scriptures?

What do you mean by "Christ's Sabbath"?

 God also gave Jesus a "LAW" even though Jesus wasn't a sinner. The text says the Law is not "MADE" for the righteous, it doesn't say it was not given to the righteous. The "do not shoplift" law is there for all to see, it just wasn't made for folks who don't shoplift.

As for the Christ's Sabbath. I am going by the actually teaching of the holy Scriptures, not ancient religious tradition.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Col. 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

Gen. 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2 And on the seventh day God (Christ) ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God (Christ) blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Lev. 23:1 And the LORD (Christ) spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

4 These are the feasts of the LORD,(Christ) even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

28 Therefore the Son of man (Christ) is Lord also of the sabbath.

There can be no doubt that the Christ, before becoming a man, at least according to the Word's of the Holy Scriptures, created His Holy Sabbath. Therefore it is the Christ's Sabbath that HE gave to man, for man.

[4WD]

God also gave Jesus a "LAW"....

Where do you read that?

[GB]

Where do you read that?

Gal. 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,



Is. 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. 15 Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good.

John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Phil. 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Heb. 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Luke 2:21 And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called JESUS, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb.

22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;

23 (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord;)

[Michael2012]

Hi @Cathlodox; @winsome

I just like to comment regarding what you call "Moral Laws" of God.

Consider the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. When Eve and Adam ate of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they came to know good and evil. By that, mankind know what is good and what is evil, don't you agree?

Genesis 3:22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Michael, are you suggesting that Adam and Eve really didn't know that it was wrong to disobey God when He told them to not eat of the fruit of the tree of good and evil?  I think the God's message to us in the narrative of eating the forbidden fruit carries a much deeper meaning that you are giving it.  But perhaps that is for another time.

Adam and Eve have no knowledge of good and evil before their disobedience. For the  implication is clear concerning the following scriptures:

Gen.3:22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

The implication is that, before their disobedience, they know not good and evil. It seems that you don't agree with me on this. If not, then are you suggesting that they have knowledge of good and evil even before they have eaten of the forbidden fruit? To that I could not agree.

What they knew at the time is that God's will is for them to not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. In my view, such knowledge isn't that of good and evil. In my view, obedience or disobedience isn't a matter of the knowledge of good and evil, or of right and wrong, but is a matter of faith in God.

[winsome]

God also gave Jesus a "LAW" even though Jesus wasn't a sinner. The text says the Law is not "MADE" for the righteous, it doesn't say it was not given to the righteous. The "do not shoplift" law is there for all to see, it just wasn't made for folks who don't shoplift.

As for the Christ's Sabbath. I am going by the actually teaching of the holy Scriptures, not ancient religious tradition.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Col. 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

Gen. 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2 And on the seventh day God (Christ) ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God (Christ) blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Lev. 23:1 And the LORD (Christ) spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

4 These are the feasts of the LORD,(Christ) even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

28 Therefore the Son of man (Christ) is Lord also of the sabbath.

There can be no doubt that the Christ, before becoming a man, at least according to the Word's of the Holy Scriptures, created His Holy Sabbath. Therefore it is the Christ's Sabbath that HE gave to man, for man.

The word Sabbath is not found in Genesis.

God rested on the 7th day of creation but it does not say he rested every seventh day.

There is nothing in the Bible about any one keeping a seventh day sabbath until God gave it to the Israelites in the desert (Ex 20:23)Clearly they were not familiar with the idea of a seventh day sabbath.

Ezekial writes:
So I led them out of the land of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness. I gave them my statutes and showed them my ordinances, by whose observance man shall live. Moreover I gave them my sabbaths, as a sign between me and them, that they might know that I the Lord sanctify them.(Ez 20:10-12).

Sabbath observance was only ever commanded to the Jews and that was when God was forming them into a nation in the desert.

[Michael2012]

God also gave Jesus a "LAW" even though Jesus wasn't a sinner. The text says the Law is not "MADE" for the righteous, it doesn't say it was not given to the righteous. The "do not shoplift" law is there for all to see, it just wasn't made for folks who don't shoplift.

To whom was the commandment/law "Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." made for? Was it not for sinless Adam? So, I would have to repeat, one must understand 1 Tim. 9-10 in the context of scriptures.

As for the Christ's Sabbath. I am going by the actually teaching of the holy Scriptures, not ancient religious tradition.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Col. 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

Gen. 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2 And on the seventh day God (Christ) ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God (Christ) blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Lev. 23:1 And the LORD (Christ) spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

4 These are the feasts of the LORD,(Christ) even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

28 Therefore the Son of man (Christ) is Lord also of the sabbath.

There can be no doubt that the Christ, before becoming a man, at least according to the Word's of the Holy Scriptures, created His Holy Sabbath. Therefore it is the Christ's Sabbath that HE gave to man, for man.

So, according to you, by saying Christ's Sabbath, you mean to refer to the seventh day spoken in Gen. 2:2-3 and in Lev. 23:3 and also that spoken in Mark 2:27-28. Thank you for the clarification.

My next clarificatory question to you is, what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?

[winsome]

Hi @Cathlodox; @winsome

I just like to comment regarding what you call "Moral Laws" of God.

Consider the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. When Eve and Adam ate of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they came to know good and evil. By that, mankind know what is good and what is evil, don't you agree?

Genesis 3:22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Hi,
I've been thinking about this.

A few comments: 

1. The Catholic Church teaches that when Adam and Eve sinned they lost the original holiness which they had at the beginning. To me that implies that they would have no experience of evil. But when they lost that original holiness they did.

2. Note that the text says they would  know good and evil not that they would know right and wrong.

3. The word for 'know' is Strong H3045 which can mean knowing in as experiencing (rather than know about). It's the same word used in Gen 4:1 "Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain" and Gen 4:17 "Cain knew his wife, and she conceived and bore Enoch".

So perhaps it's more about them experiencing evil than just knowing about morality.

[GB]

The word Sabbath is not found in Genesis.

God rested on the 7th day of creation but it does not say he rested every seventh day.

There is nothing in the Bible about any one keeping a seventh day sabbath until God gave it to the Israelites in the desert (Ex 20:23)Clearly they were not familiar with the idea of a seventh day sabbath.

I appreciate your zeal, but you are leaving out some very important Biblical Facts.

Gen. 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

So the God of Abraham, the creator of "all things" set apart a certain day of the week, the 7th day, and "Sanctified it".

Hebrew for Sanctified = "to make, pronounce, or observe as clean (Ceremonially or morally) :- appoint, bid, consecrate, dedicate, defile, hallow, (be, keep,) Holy, keep, proclaim, purify, sanctify.

The God who made all things that are made, by Him and for Him, did this in the very beginning. You are free to assume that this same God withheld this sanctification from Adam or Noah, or Abraham if you like. But you have no evidence to support this assumption.

Gen. 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Again, we know Abraham kept God's Laws, statutes, Commandments, etc. Did God share with us what those Laws were? I say He did after the Children of Israel had forgotten them in Egypt.

You are free to believe this same God gave Abraham different Laws (except the Levitical Priesthood Abraham didn't have, as Levi wasn't born yet) than He gave Abraham's Children if you like, but you have no evidence to support this.

Ex. 20: 8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Again, the Lord Thy God set apart, blessed above all others, and Sanctified this day long before there were "Children of Israel". This Sanctified Day is the "Sabbath of the Lord thy God".

11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

You can make the argument that God "withheld" His Hallowed, Sanctified Sabbath from all men, even Noah and Abraham, if you like. But it is only an assumption. How did Noah know what animals were Clean, and what animals were unclean? Is there any written instruction from God showing Noah His Creation? No, there isn't. And yet Noah, who walked with God, knew what God had "sanctified as food". We find out later, after Abraham's Children had lost sight of God's Laws that Abraham obeyed, what He created for food. But the "creation" was always there.

Ezekial writes:
So I led them out of the land of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness. I gave them my statutes and showed them my ordinances, by whose observance man shall live. Moreover I gave them my sabbaths, as a sign between me and them[/b], that they might know that I the Lord sanctify them.(Ez 20:10-12).

Sabbath observance was only ever commanded to the Jews and that was when God was forming them into a nation in the desert.

It's important to remember what God Himself said about HIS OWN Laws, and who they were for.

Ex. 12:48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.

49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, (Jew) and unto the stranger (Non-Jew) that sojourneth among you.

It is a popular doctrine of the religions of the land that God's Laws were only for the Jews. But as you can see, God's own Word exposes this doctrine as from man and not God.

Is. 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.

2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.

3 Neither let the son of the stranger, (NON-Jew) that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.

4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs (non-Jew) that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

6 Also the sons of the stranger, (Non-Jews) that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

The teaching that God's Holy, Sanctified Sabbath was not created for all men is a falsehood. As Jesus said "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath". He could have said "made for the Jews", but He didn't. Religious men added that part.

The 7th Day Sabbath, or the Christ's Sabbath, as He is said to be the creator of all things, is Holy because the Christ made it Holy, according to His Own Words. It has nothing to do with Jew or Gentile.

"for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people."

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

It's not about the Day, it's about Honoring the creator of the Day. Believing Him when HE says something even if there are "Other Voices" who say different. As the Story of Eve clearly demonstrated.

Sure the religions of the land have created their own sabbaths, as did the Pharisees. Given the warnings of the Christ and His Prophets and Disciples about religious men, it is to be expected.

Ez. 20:5 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when I chose Israel, and lifted up mine hand unto the seed of the house of Jacob, and made myself known unto them in the land of Egypt, when I lifted up mine hand unto them, saying, I am the LORD your God;

God gave Israel "HIS LAWS". God is no respecter of persons.

Ez. 20:13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Can you find even one Commandment that God spent so much time warning people against polluting in the Law and Prophets? How can a person read God's Word and not know how Holy and important to Man this Sanctified Day is?

Yet, the Mainstream Preachers of Ezekiel's time despised it, polluted it. And the Mainstream Preachers in Jesus' time also despised and polluted it. And the Mainstream Preachers of our time also Despise and Pollute it.

It's simply a matter of believing the Christ and His Word's and Sanctification, or rejecting His Word's and believing the "Other Voices" out there.

Personally I stay away from all religious franchises, including SDA. Paul said the Holy Scriptures can make me "wise unto Salvation", and are also for doctrine, correction. instruction in Righteousness so that the servant of God can be thoroughly furnished unto all "GOOD WORKS".

Shall I not trust these Word's?

My advise is to stop listening to those who refuse to Honor and accept the Sanctification of the Holy Christ of the Bible.

Sorry so long, but the topic was important to God, He inspired a lot to be said about it.

[4WD]

Gal. 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

Just as I thought.  That verse says not one thing about what you said, i.e.,

"God also gave Jesus a "LAW"....

And for what it is worth that is another faulty translation in KJV; a better one is

Gal 4:4  But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

Jesus wasn't made; He wasn't created; He was born of Mary.

[GB]

To whom was the commandment/law "Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." made for? Was it not for sinless Adam? So, I would have to repeat, one must understand 1 Tim. 9-10 in the context of scriptures.

So, according to you, by saying Christ's Sabbath, you mean to refer to the seventh day spoken in Gen. 2:2-3 and in Lev. 23:3 and also that spoken in Mark 2:27-28. Thank you for the clarification.

My next clarificatory question to you is, what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?

It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath. You asked a question, I answered it.

If this statement is true, then you shouldn't be asking me questions, you should be asking yourself.

[Michael2012]

Hi,
I've been thinking about this.

A few comments: 

1. The Catholic Church teaches that when Adam and Eve sinned they lost the original holiness which they had at the beginning. To me that implies that they would have no experience of evil. But when they lost that original holiness they did.

2. Note that the text says they would  know good and evil not that they would know right and wrong.

3. The word for 'know' is Strong H3045 which can mean knowing in as experiencing (rather than know about). It's the same word used in Gen 4:1 "Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain" and Gen 4:17 "Cain knew his wife, and she conceived and bore Enoch".

So perhaps it's more about them experiencing evil than just knowing about morality.

I would have to say that while Strong H3045 can mean to know a person carnally, of sexual intercourse, as the sense used in Gen.4:1, it is certainly not the sense used in Gen. 3:22. The word is used in the same sense as in Gen. 3:22, in Gen. 3:,7 (consider reading). Further, the verse says "the man is become as one of us". That strongly suggest what is the sense of knowing good and evil. Further still, scriptures says "tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil".

With regards your comment #2, with regards to morality, what is good is right, and what is evil is wrong.

[winsome]

I would have to say that while Strong H3045 can mean to know a person carnally, of sexual intercourse, as the sense used in Gen.4:1, it is certainly not the sense used in Gen. 3:22. The word is used in the same sense as in Gen. 3:22, in Gen. 3:,7 (consider reading). Further, the verse says "the man is become as one of us". That strongly suggest what is the sense of knowing good and evil. Further still, scriptures says "tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil".

.
There is mental knowledge and experiential knowledge.

[GB]

Just as I thought.  That verse says not one thing about what you said, i.e.,
And for what it is worth that is another faulty translation in KJV; a better one is

Gal 4:4  But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

Jesus wasn't made; He wasn't created; He was born of Mary.

I posted scripture which answered your question. "Where did I read that God gave Jesus Law."

Your reply has nothing to do with your question the scriptures answered.

[winsome]

I appreciate your zeal, but you are leaving out some very important Biblical Facts.

Gen. 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

So the God of Abraham, the creator of "all things" set apart a certain day of the week, the 7th day, and "Sanctified it".
Hebrew for Sanctified = "to make, pronounce, or observe as clean (Ceremonially or morally) :- appoint, bid, consecrate, dedicate, defile, hallow, (be, keep,) Holy, keep, proclaim, purify, sanctify.

The God who made all things that are made, by Him and for Him, did this in the very beginning. You are free to assume that this same God withheld this sanctification from Adam or Noah, or Abraham if you like. But you have no evidence to support this assumption.

Gen. 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Again, we know Abraham kept God's Laws, statutes, Commandments, etc. Did God share with us what those Laws were? I say He did after the Children of Israel had forgotten them in Egypt.

You are free to believe this same God gave Abraham different Laws (except the Levitical Priesthood Abraham didn't have, as Levi wasn't born yet) than He gave Abraham's Children if you like, but you have no evidence to support this.

1. Scripture doesn't say that God " set apart a certain day of the week, the 7th day". You made that up.
2. Scripture doesn't say that God blessed and sanctified every 7th day. You made that up.
3. Scripture doesn't say that keeping a 7th day sabbath every week is one of God's laws that Abraham kept. You made that up.

Ex. 20: 8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Again, the Lord Thy God set apart, blessed above all others, and Sanctified this day long before there were "Children of Israel". This Sanctified Day is the "Sabbath of the Lord thy God".

11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

.
In Ex 16 God gave the sabbath day to the Israelites. They seem to have a problem grasping the idea. It was new to them.
Therefore in Ex 20: God reminded them- "Remember the sabbath day". The remember was to remember what he taught them in Ex 16

You can make the argument that God "withheld" His Hallowed, Sanctified Sabbath from all men, even Noah and Abraham, if you like. But it is only an assumption. How did Noah know what animals were Clean, and what animals were unclean? Is there any written instruction from God showing Noah His Creation? No, there isn't. And yet Noah, who walked with God, knew what God had "sanctified as food". We find out later, after Abraham's Children had lost sight of God's Laws that Abraham obeyed, what He created for food. But the "creation" was always there.

It's important to remember what God Himself said about HIS OWN Laws, and who they were for.

Ex. 12:48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.

49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, (Jew) and unto the stranger (Non-Jew) that sojourneth among you.

It is a popular doctrine of the religions of the land that God's Laws were only for the Jews. But as you can see, God's own Word exposes this doctrine as from man and not God.

Ex 12:48 & 49 are for those foreigners who wish to eat the Passover with the Jews - not for everyone. They had to be circumcised and follow the Jewish laws. In other words they had to become Jews.

If you start with verse 43 instead of cherry picking vs 48-49 you will read:43 And the Lord said to Moses and Aaron, “This is the ordinance of the passover: no foreigner shall eat of it;  44 but every slave that is bought for money may eat of it after you have circumcised him.
45 No sojourner or hired servant may eat of it.
.....
48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with you and would keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, then he may come near and keep it; he shall be as a native of the land. But no uncircumcised person shall eat of it.
49 There shall be one law for the native and for the stranger who sojourns among you.”
Note that "he shall be as a native of the land". In other words he becomes a Jew and therefore must follow Jewish laws.
There is no suggestion that other aliens must keep the Jewish laws.
In being circumcised they came into the Abrahamic Covenant and into the Mosaic Covenant.
Therefore they had to keep the Covenant laws.

Is. 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.

2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.

3 Neither let the son of the stranger, (NON-Jew) that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.

4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs (non-Jew) that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

6 Also the sons of the stranger, (Non-Jews) that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

Again it's all about belonging to the Covenant.
In verse 6 you emphasise "every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it" but not "and taketh hold of my covenant". Why not. It's all about Covenant keeping - the Mosaic Covenant.
We, Christians, do not belong to the Mosaic Covenant. We belong to the New Covenant.

The teaching that God's Holy, Sanctified Sabbath was not created for all men is a falsehood.

No it isn't. Claiming that we are obliged to j]keep the 7th day sabbath is false teaching.

As Jesus said "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath". He could have said "made for the Jews", but He didn't. Religious men added that part.

Jesus was speaking to Jews.
He could have said "The sabbath was made for all men not just Jews". But he didn't.SDA's invented that.

The 7th Day Sabbath, or the Christ's Sabbath, as He is said to be the creator of all things, is Holy because the Christ made it Holy, according to His Own Words. It has nothing to do with Jew or Gentile.

It has everything to do with Jews and Gentiles.

"for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people."

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

It's not about the Day, it's about Honoring the creator of the Day. Believing Him when HE says something even if there are "Other Voices" who say different. As the Story of Eve clearly demonstrated.

Sure the religions of the land have created their own sabbaths, as did the Pharisees. Given the warnings of the Christ and His Prophets and Disciples about religious men, it is to be expected.

Ez. 20:5 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when I chose Israel, and lifted up mine hand unto the seed of the house of Jacob, and made myself known unto them in the land of Egypt, when I lifted up mine hand unto them, saying, I am the LORD your God;

God gave Israel "HIS LAWS". God is no respecter of persons.

Ez. 20:13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Can you find even one Commandment that God spent so much time warning people against polluting in the Law and Prophets? How can a person read God's Word and not know how Holy and important to Man this Sanctified Day is?

Yet, the Mainstream Preachers of Ezekiel's time despised it, polluted it. And the Mainstream Preachers in Jesus' time also despised and polluted it. And the Mainstream Preachers of our time also Despise and Pollute it.

It's simply a matter of believing the Christ and His Word's and Sanctification, or rejecting His Word's and believing the "Other Voices" out there.

Personally I stay away from all religious franchises, including SDA. Paul said the Holy Scriptures can make me "wise unto Salvation", and are also for doctrine, correction. instruction in Righteousness so that the servant of God can be thoroughly furnished unto all "GOOD WORKS".

Shall I not trust these Word's?

My advise is to stop listening to those who refuse to Honor and accept the Sanctification of the Holy Christ of the Bible.

Sorry so long, but the topic was important to God, He inspired a lot to be said about it.

You keep trying to apply God's laws for the Jews to all people.They don't.
I made a long post  -#145 - about this. But you have ignored it.

[4WD]

I posted scripture which answered your question. "Where did I read that God gave Jesus Law."

Your reply has nothing to do with your question the scriptures answered.

And that is but one more demonstration of your total inability in reading and understanding. The Scripture you posted has nothing to do with what you claimed. It says nothing about God giving Jesus anything.

[GB]

And that is but one more demonstration of your total inability in reading and understanding. The Scripture you posted has nothing to do with what you claimed. It says nothing about God giving Jesus anything.

But it is evidence that Jesus was born with and under the same Law given by God to Israel.

Which is more support, along with the other scriptures posted, for the answer to the question you asked "Where did I read that God gave Jesus Law".

If your understanding of this scriptures is different than mine, that's OK. If you somehow believe that God didn't give Jesus Laws, that's OK too. You asked the question and I have given you my answer, along with the Holy Scriptures that led me to this doctrine.

If you don't believe my answer, that's OK as well.

 

[4WD]

But it is evidence that Jesus was born with and under the same Law given by God to Israel.

Which is more support, along with the other scriptures posted, for the answer to the question you asked "Where did I read that God gave Jesus Law".

If your understanding of this scriptures is different than mine, that's OK. If you somehow believe that God didn't give Jesus Laws, that's OK too. You asked the question and I have given you my answer, along with the Holy Scriptures that led me to this doctrine.

If you don't believe my answer, that's OK as well.

Not only do you not read and comprehend very well, you have almost no understanding of basic logic.

It is not whether I believe your answer; it is not even about believing you or your answer.  It is that your answer is just wrong. And any one with even a modest ability to read and understand would realize that immediately.

[Michael2012]

.
There is mental knowledge and experiential knowledge.

Perhaps. But if the sense is knowing by experience, that would then mean that the eating of the forbidden fruit would be an experience of good and evil which brings out the issue as to how that could be. And as I said the verse says "the man is become as one of us". That would make God as having such knowledge of good and evil in the experiential sense. To that I have a problem accepting. For while God definitely have knowledge of good and evil, it is not knowledge by the experience of good and the experience of evil. For even from eternity past, when there is yet no evil that came about, with God, from eternity, have knowledge of good and evil.

Also, if the meaning is that of the sense of knowing by experience, that would be problematic for verse 10 wherein it says "And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself." How then does Adam suddenly have issue with nakedness?

[Michael2012]

To whom was the commandment/law "Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." made for? Was it not for sinless Adam? So, I would have to repeat, one must understand 1 Tim. 9-10 in the context of scriptures.

So, according to you, by saying Christ's Sabbath, you mean to refer to the seventh day spoken in Gen. 2:2-3 and in Lev. 23:3 and also that spoken in Mark 2:27-28. Thank you for the clarification.

My next clarificatory question to you is, what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?

It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath. You asked a question, I answered it.

If this statement is true, then you shouldn't be asking me questions, you should be asking yourself.

The question is "what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?"

Your answer: It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath.

To me, your answer does not give any definition of the Sabbath.

Here's one definition. The Sabbath is the seventh day of the week.

[GB]

author=winsome link=topic=74624.msg1055154333#msg1055154333 date=1578574313]
1. Scripture doesn't say that God " set apart a certain day of the week, the 7th day". You made that up.

2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Not the 1st day, or the 3rd day, but the 7th day. To preach God didn't set this Day apart from the other 6 days of the week is a popular religious doctrine of the land, but is contrary to the Word's of God Himself. So I didn't make this up, I just believe the Word's of the Christ who created HIS Sabbath "For man".

2. Scripture doesn't say that God blessed and sanctified every 7th day. You made that up.

Can you show me any scripture that says, implies, or even suggests that the Sabbath that God created only referred to certain 7th days? 

3. Scripture doesn't say that keeping a 7th day sabbath every week is one of God's laws that Abraham kept. You made that up.

Gen. 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

You can teach that God's Holy Sabbath Commandment was not intended to be hallowed every week if you like, but I find no support for this religious doctrine. You can also teach that God's Law doesn't include the 10 Commandments as well. But I don't think the scriptures support that doctrine either.

In Ex 16 God gave the sabbath day to the Israelites. They seem to have a problem grasping the idea. It was new to them.
Therefore in Ex 20: God reminded them- "Remember the sabbath day". The remember was to remember what he taught them in Ex 16

Actually God gave HIS LAWS and HIS Commandments to the Children of Israel.

The 4th Commandment, one of the Laws of God, was given to remind Abraham's Children that in 6 days God created the heavens and earth, and rested on the 7th day. And that God Blessed the 7th day, and Sanctified it according to the Scriptures. It said to "Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy" then goes on to explain why.

It's in your own Bible.

Ex 12:48 & 49 are for those foreigners who wish to eat the Passover with the Jews - not for everyone. They had to be circumcised and follow the Jewish laws. In other words they had to become Jews.

Again, it is a falsehood to preach that God promoted Jewish Laws. He gave Abraham and Abraham's Children HIS LAWS, and said that a Non-Jew, who loved God enough to trust His Word's of instruction, would be considered one of His Children just as the Jews. "One Law for the Jew and non-Jew". Paul confirms this in his teaching.

Rom. 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Again;

Rom. 2:10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

The religious doctrine that implies that Non-Jews could reject God's Word's then, or now, and still be accepted can not be supported by scriptures.

If you start with verse 43 instead of cherry picking vs 48-49 you will read:43 And the Lord said to Moses and Aaron, “This is the ordinance of the passover: no foreigner shall eat of it;  44 but every slave that is bought for money may eat of it after you have circumcised him.
45 No sojourner or hired servant may eat of it.

Were these "Strangers" who trusted God enough to obey Him, not purchased with the Blood of the Passover Lamb they partook of, just as those who trust in this same Christ today?

1 Cor. 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

I am not cherry picking anything here. I am purchased with the Blood of the Passover Lamb, just as the stranger or foreigner that honored God was purchased.

Rom. 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with you and would keep the Passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, then he may come near and keep it; he shall be as a native of the land. But no uncircumcised person shall eat of it.
49 There shall be one law for the native and for the stranger who sojourns among you.”
Note that "he shall be as a native of the land". In other words he becomes a Jew and therefore must follow Jewish laws.

The teaching that God was a Jew, or that His Law are Jewish Laws is a deception that has snared "many" as prophesied.

When a person trusts God enough to be a "Doer" of His Instructions, they become a member of the Faithful "children of God, Spiritually Circumcised and becomes a "child of obedience" as opposed to a child of disobedience.

There is no suggestion that other aliens must keep the Jewish laws.

True, God never wanted men to keep the laws of the religions of the land, He wanted them to obey the Laws He created for man. Jew and Non-Jew as He tells us in His Word.

The Jews were not keeping His Sabbaths, nor His Judgments as it is written. They taught for doctrines the commandments of Men as Jesus exposed. Zechariahs was a faithful servant, and as a result he knew the Christ when He came to earth as a human. But those who polluted His Sabbaths were rejected.

As for Aliens honoring God with obedience, here is what the Christ sent Isaiah to teach us.

Is. 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.

2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.

3 Neither let the son of the stranger, (Non-Jew) that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.

4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

6 Also the sons of the stranger, (Non-Jew) that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

Are these not the Word's of the Christ we are to serve?

In being circumcised they came into the Abrahamic Covenant and into the Mosaic Covenant.
Therefore they had to keep the Covenant laws.
Again it's all about belonging to the Covenant.

Circumcision, like drinking the Blood of Jesus, and eating His Flesh, is a Spiritual practice. The point about Abraham is that he was called to "Deny himself, take up his cross, and follow the Christ" (Gen. 12) This same Christ requires the same thing today. (Mark 8:34)

You have been tricked into believing God's Laws are Jewish Laws.

In verse 6 you emphasise "every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it" but not "and taketh hold of my covenant". Why not. It's all about Covenant keeping - the Mosaic Covenant.
We, Christians, do not belong to the Mosaic Covenant. We belong to the New Covenant.

You should read how the Creator of the New Covenant defines His New Covenant is. You will find that His Definition, and the religions of the land's definition, are two different things. (It's in Jer. 31) In the Christ's definition, He claims that "After those days" He will write His Laws on our hearts. Not remove them, destroy them, amend them. Given all the warnings about religious men deceiving folks, I really hope you will look for yourself.

No it isn't. Claiming that we are obliged to j]keep the 7th day sabbath is false teaching.

Eve was also told that it was a false teaching that she would die if she rejected the commandment. This "other religious voice" used some of God's Word to deceive her into believing she could live by her own vision, her own rules.

These examples were written for my admonition. I am not saying, nor have I said we are obligated to do anything. What I have done is post the Word's of God and attempt to enter into a discussion about them.

Jesus was speaking to Jews.
He could have said "The sabbath was made for all men not just Jews". But he didn't.

He never ever said His Holy Sabbath was only for the Jews. This is a deception that we have been taught since our youth. Below is the Word's of the Christ defining who He created HIS Holy Sabbath for. Shall we not trust Him?

Is. 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

(I will write My Law on your heart, and I will forgive your sins)

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

So you preach "

He could have said "The sabbath was made for all men not just Jews". But he didn't"

But as you can see, this same Christ of the Bible did in fact tell us His Sabbath is for "ALL MEN", not just the Jews.

Now you have the same choice the mainstream preachers of Christ's time were faced with.

 Do you deny your own religious doctrine, taught for centuries by the religions of the land, and turn to the Christ's own Words?" Or you can reject these Word's of the Christ and work to preserve your religious traditions.

The Pharisees chose to defend their religion, while Nicodemus, in private, looked into this Same Christ's Words. I hope you will become a Nicodemus.

SDA's invented that. It has everything to do with Jews and Gentiles.

SDA did not invent the Sabbath, or the Commandment to remember it, nor the Commandment to keep it Holy. The Christ of the Bible did. It is His Sabbath, we should go to Him to find answers to our questions, not religious men.

You keep trying to apply God's laws for the Jews to all people. They don't.

It is the Christ, the Creator of all things, that has said God's Laws are for all people, not me. I just believe Him.

[GB]

It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath. You asked a question, I answered it.

If this statement is true, then you shouldn't be asking me questions, you should be asking yourself.


The question is "what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?"

Your answer: It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath.

To me, your answer does not give any definition of the Sabbath.

Here's one definition. The Sabbath is the seventh day of the week.

Experience has shown me that every time I answer your question, you just move to the next, and the next and the next.

So I will ask you some questions. Maybe we can actually have a discussion this time.

Is. 58:12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.

In your understanding, is this talking about the Christ? What is the Path He will restore, the one He Walked? Or is there another?

13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

In your religion, is there another way to "Delight myself" in the Lord of the Bible?

[winsome]

2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Not the 1st day, or the 3rd day, but the 7th day. To preach God didn't set this Day apart from the other 6 days of the week is a popular religious doctrine of the land, but is contrary to the Word's of God Himself. So I didn't make this up, I just believe the Word's of the Christ who created HIS Sabbath "For man".

No - you just made it up.
It's amazing that protestants keep pillorising Catholics for not keeping to scripture alone but then make up things that scripture doesn't say.

Can you show me any scripture that says, implies, or even suggests that the Sabbath that God created only referred to certain 7th days? 

So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all his work which he had done in creation. (Gen 2:3)The seventh day - singular. If you believe God blessed every seventh day then show me the scripture.

Gen. 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

You can teach that God's Holy Sabbath Commandment was not intended to be hallowed every week if you like, but I find no support for this religious doctrine. You can also teach that God's Law doesn't include the 10 Commandments as well. But I don't think the scriptures support that doctrine either. [/quqote]
Show me the scripture that says Abraham kept a 7th day sabbath.

Actually God gave HIS LAWS and HIS Commandments to the Children of Israel.
The 4th Commandment, one of the Laws of God, was given to remind Abraham's Children that in 6 days God created the heavens and earth, and rested on the 7th day. And that God Blessed the 7th day, and Sanctified it according to the Scriptures. It said to "Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy" then goes on to explain why.

It's in your own Bible.

Try answering my point instead of just re-iterating your opinions.
You still haven't answered my reply #145

[Michael2012]

Experience has shown me that every time I answer your question, you just move to the next, and the next and the next.

It's every time you don't really answer the question properly, I find myself the necessity to ask questions that I thought would lead you to answer properly.

Experience has shown me likewise that every time I ask a simple question, you either say something that really does not answer it or find a way to escape from it.

I hope you get to properly answer my question, which is simply a clarificatory question. The question is "what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?"

So I will ask you some questions. Maybe we can actually have a discussion this time.

Is. 58:12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.

In your understanding, is this talking about the Christ? What is the Path He will restore, the one He Walked? Or is there another?

No.

13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

In your religion, is there another way to "Delight myself" in the Lord of the Bible?

Yes. I delight and take great pleasure in the Lord not only in the seventh day of the week, but every day, calling everyday a delight and honorable, and striving to honor every day that the Lord has made, by not going my own way and not doing as I please, but going in the way of the Lord and doing His will.

[Michael2012]

Some here use the following passage to support their false teaching concerning the Sabbath commandment, the 4th of the ten commandments given by God to Israel through Moses.

Genesis 2: 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

They make and wanted the passage to be saying that, even from as early as this time, God had commanded man to keep the Sabbath day as can be read according to the 4th of the 10 commandments. But whoever has understanding, as those who have the Holy Spirit, would not fall for this lie, because he clearly don't see in the passage that God had made such a commandment.

[GB]

 author=winsome link=topic=74624.msg1055154367#msg1055154367 date=1578650614]

No - you just made it up.
It's amazing that protestants keep pillorising Catholics for not keeping to scripture alone but then make up things that scripture doesn't say.

Well, you are free to say what you please. But the Scriptures do say that God "Sanctified" the 7th Day of the 7 day week.

Your argument that He only blessed and sanctified the very first 7th day is made up, and frankly ridiculous. There isn't one place in the Bible that support this religious doctrine of yours. 

He also commanded "Thou shall not kill". Will you also preach to the world that God didn't mean "thou shall not kill" every day of the week.

The lengths religious men go to preserve their precious ancient religious traditions know no bounds.

So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all his work which he had done in creation. (Gen 2:3)The seventh day - singular.

Are you just joshing me here? Is this a prank? How many 7th days are there in a week?

If you believe God blessed every seventh day then show me the scripture.

You are serious aren't you. You have really been convinced that when God created the 7 day week, and sanctified the 7th day, He didn't mean "every week".

Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

But you preach this isn't talking about "Every week"?

Where is your Biblical support for this religious doctrine?


10 But the seventh day (singular) is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

But in your religion, not "Every 7th day" is Sanctified. Can you enlighten us as to which 7th days was to be hallowed, and which was to be rejected?

Try answering my point instead of just re-iterating your opinions.
You still haven't answered my reply #145

Actually I did answer your question regarding the Christ's New Covenant.

I don't believe the Catholic doctrine regarding it. I asked you to actually read what the Christ, the Creator of the New covenant, says HIS New Covenant is. It was prophesied by the Christ in Jer. 31.

So I did answer your question, you simply don't believe what the Christ says about His own New Covenant.

[winsome]

Well, you are free to say what you please. But the Scriptures do say that God "Sanctified" the 7th Day of the 7 day week.

No, scripture doesn't say that God sanctified every 7th day. 
Scripture describes God creating the world in seven days. On the seventh day he rested. 
It doesn't say he rests every 7th day.Just as it doesn't say he creates birds and fishes every 5th day, or animals every 6th day.

Each day was a one off event , not repetitive, just as creation was a one off event not repetitive.

Your argument that He only blessed and sanctified the very first 7th day is made up, and frankly ridiculous. There isn't one place in the Bible that support this religious doctrine of yours. 

On the contrary scripture only says he sanctified the 7th day of his creating, just as it only says he created birds and fished on the 5th day and only created animals on the 6th day.

So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all his work which he had done in creation.   
It - singular. 

He also commanded "Thou shall not kill". Will you also preach to the world that God didn't mean "thou shall not kill" every day of the week.

A frankly ridiculous argument, not relevant to this issue at all.

The lengths religious men go to preserve their precious ancient religious traditions know no bounds.

 

Try applying that to your claims
 

Are you just joshing me here? Is this a prank? How many 7th days are there in a week?

There was one 7th day in the week of creation. 


Creation concludes: These are the generations of the heavens and the earth when they were created.

God didn't go on creating and resting the following week(s).

You are serious aren't you. You have really been convinced that when God created the 7 day week, and sanctified the 7th day, He didn't mean "every week".

I asked: "If you believe God blessed every seventh day then show me the scripture."Evidently you have no scripture - just your personal opinion

But you preach this isn't talking about "Every week"?

Where is your Biblical support for this religious doctrine?


10 But the seventh day (singular) is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

But in your religion, not "Every 7th day" is Sanctified. Can you enlighten us as to which 7th days was to be hallowed, and which was to be rejected?

Now you have jumped to a totally different context. 
The context is the Covenant.  These are ongoing Covenant Law.
Just as the Covenant is ongoing so is the Law that pertains to it ongoing. 
If you break Covenant Law you break the Covenant. 

When the Covenant ceased the Law pertaining to it ceased.

Actually I did answer your question regarding the Christ's New Covenant.

I don't believe the Catholic doctrine regarding it. I asked you to actually read what the Christ, the Creator of the New covenant, says HIS New Covenant is. It was prophesied by the Christ in Jer. 31.

So I did answer your question, you simply don't believe what the Christ says about His own New Covenant.

Where did you answer it?Which post?

[GB]

 author=winsome link=topic=74624.msg1055154379#msg1055154379 date=1578669388]

No, scripture doesn't say that God sanctified every 7th day. 
Scripture describes God creating the world in seven days. On the seventh day he rested. 
It doesn't say he rests every 7th day. Just as it doesn't say he creates birds and fishes every 5th day, or animals every 6th day.

Each day was a one off event , not repetitive, just as creation was a one off event not repetitive.
On the contrary scripture only says he sanctified the 7th day of his creating, just as it only says he created birds and fished on the 5th day and only created animals on the 6th day.

That is a fascinating religious doctrine. I've heard a lot of differing religious views about God's Sabbath, but your preaching that when God "Sanctifies" something, it only stays sanctified for one day is a first.

If I was to follow your logic, then the Sabbath Commandment is based on a lie. According to you, the 7th day was only special one time, when God rested in it.

 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

So then according to you, only the first Sabbath was Holy, all subsequent 7th days are no different than any other because God never rested in it.

So this Commandment is based on a lie it seems, in your religion.

So then Israel was unjustly punished for despising and Polluting God's Sabbath, because in your religion, there is nothing special about the 7th day. It was only sanctified for one day.

So when Isaiah wrote;

 Is.56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, (non-Jews) that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

Isaiah is just making this up because in your religion, God didn't set apart and sanctify this day from the rest more than the one day He rested in it. And even if He did, it was only for the Jew in your religion.

I don't think the Christ lied to us through Isaiah.

And when this same alleged Prophet of the Most High said;
 
Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

He was just telling us more lies because the 7th day isn't Holy in your religion, It isn't Sanctified in your religion, and it isn't the Lord's Sabbath in your religion because God didn't rest "Every 7th day" even though His Ten Commandments tells us too.

So then when Jesus said "The Sabbath was made for man", in your religion this is also a lie, because there is no set apart,  "Sanctified" 7th day. It's all made up.

However, if a man believes "Every Word of God" as Jesus instructed, it become quite evident that God's Sanctification lasts for more than just one day. According to His Word, if a man believes in them as I do, the Sanctified Sabbath of the Lord will also be observed in the New Earth.

As for the New Covenant, I asked that you read in the Holy Scriptures where the Christ of the Bible Prophesied about HIS New Covenant. His Definition of His New Covenant is the one I choose to believe. It is quite different from the New Covenant taught in the religions of the land.

[GB]

 author=Michael2012 link=topic=74624.msg1055154368#msg1055154368 date=1578651393]

It's every time you don't really answer the question properly, I find myself the necessity to ask questions that I thought would lead you to answer properly.

Experience has shown me likewise that every time I ask a simple question, you either say something that really does not answer it or find a way to escape from it.

I hope you get to properly answer my question, which is simply a clarificatory question. The question is "what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?"

I'm not convinced that I must design my answers to fit your religion in order for them to be considered  "Proper". My definition of the Christ's Holy Sabbath is shaped by how HE describes His Holy Sabbath. One such place is Is. 58. Another is in Ex. 20, and another in Lev. 23. I have posted these scriptures over and over, so it would be foolish to do so again. But this is the answer to your question ""what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages". These "passages" are my definition.

No.

So then, in your religion, the Christ isn't the "repairer of the breach, or "the restorer of paths to walk in". OK, that explains a lot.

Yes. I delight and take great pleasure in the Lord not only in the seventh day of the week, but every day, calling everyday a delight and honorable, and striving to honor every day that the Lord has made, by not going my own way and not doing as I please, but going in the way of the Lord and doing His will.

Well I'm not sure how rejecting God's Commandment and creating your own is "Honoring Him".

You preach that there is nothing "Holy" about the Christ's Holy Sabbath. That it is not to be treated any differently than any other day.

In doing this, you, like the Jews are transgressing the Commandments of God by your own religious traditions.

Now maybe it doesn't matter. But to say you are "going in the way of the Lord" by rejecting the Sanctification of the Christ's Sabbath is a deception.

The Christ says;"“If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable

But by your own admission, you have created your own way. How can a person Honor God by rejecting His Instruction, and creating your own?

No one is saying not to Honor God every day, but according to HIM and HIS WORDS, He is telling us that "IF" we treat HIS Holy Sabbath differently than the other 6 days, "THEN" we shalt delight our self in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth,".

But you preach to the world that this isn't true. That you and your way is Holy, and the way of the Christ, that He is pleading with man to follow, isn't even worthy of your honor.

I delight and take great pleasure in the Lord not only in the seventh day of the week, but every day

How is purposely rejecting HIS Commandment, that HE is telling you to follow here, "Delighting yourself in the Lord"?

Why not just humble yourself to the Christ, and follow HIS way? Why must you pollute His Sabbath by injection your own religious tradition into it?

 

[beam]

author=Michael2012 link=topic=74624.msg1055154368#msg1055154368 date=1578651393]
I'm not convinced that I must design my answers to fit your religion in order for them to be considered  "Proper". My definition of the Christ's Holy Sabbath is shaped by how HE describes His Holy Sabbath. One such place is Is. 58. Another is in Ex. 20, and another in Lev. 23. I have posted these scriptures over and over, so it would be foolish to do so again. But this is the answer to your question ""what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages". These "passages" are my definition.

Question GB, God gave Israel somewhere in the neighborhood of 613 commands.  many of them concern the lay Israelite.   Why don't you consider observing all the other commands.  You pitch ten plus a form of tithing and the unclean meat law from the Book of the Law.  The remainder you treat just as do most of the Christians of the World.  You will not even consider that the Sinai covenant was given only to Israel and the remainder of the World has never been approached by God as a requirement.  The old covenant was replaced with the new one.  It happened at Calvary.  The words of that covenant were replaced by the words of the new one.  The weekly Sabbath was part of the covenant that was replaced.   There is no Sabbath command.  The SDA church, Messianics, and other churches that teach it is binding on all mankind have it wrong.  That is why Paul wrote for Christians to not allow law adherents to judge them for not abiding by the rules of the defunct covenant

So then, in your religion, the Christ isn't the "repairer of the breach, or "the restorer of paths to walk in". OK, that explains a lot.

It seems like some religions are not allowing the Holy Spirit as their guide.  Some prefer the defunct 10 commandments.  2Cor3:6-11

Well I'm not sure how rejecting God's Commandment and creating your own is "Honoring Him".

There is no Sabbath command to reject and who is creating a new one.  No one is saved by keeping days.

You preach that there is nothing "Holy" about the Christ's Holy Sabbath. That it is not to be treated any differently than any other day.

It was Holy for Israel.  God made the day to commemorate and remember creation and being taken out of bondage in Egypt.  The new covenant has a day of remembrance also,  Jesus dying for each of us.  We are to commemorate communion often.

In doing this, you, like the Jews are transgressing the Commandments of God by your own religious traditions.

Is there a law against tradition?  Where is the transgression?

Now maybe it doesn't matter. But to say you are "going in the way of the Lord" by rejecting the Sanctification of the Christ's Sabbath is a deception.

It was God's Sabbath.  Jesus was the Word until His birth.  Where there is no law there is no sin.  The Law was done away. 23Cor3:verse 11. KJV

The Christ says;"“If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable

Scripture was referring to Israel not Christians.

But by your own admission, you have created your own way. How can a person Honor God by rejecting His Instruction, and creating your own?

Man cannot create anything.  Man uses what it there that will be a benefit to mankind.  Where there is no law telling us we have to worship on a certain day then we are free to assemble when convenient.

No one is saying not to Honor God every day, but according to HIM and HIS WORDS, He is telling us that "IF" we treat HIS Holy Sabbath differently than the other 6 days, "THEN" we shalt delight our self in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth,".

the day was Holy for Israelites.  No other nation on Earth had the Sabbath.

But you preach to the world that this isn't true. That you and your way is Holy, and the way of the Christ, that He is pleading with man to follow, isn't even worthy of your honor.

I am sorry GB, if you are SDA you are preaching many things that are not scriptural.  Care to go into all of it?

How is purposely rejecting HIS Commandment, that HE is telling you to follow here, "Delighting yourself in the Lord"?

I have been on both sides of the issue and believe me Sabbath triers are no more blessed than anyone else.   

Why not just humble yourself to the Christ, and follow HIS way? Why must you pollute His Sabbath by injection your own religious tradition into it?

His way is the new covenant way.  A better way with better promises.  Israel failed miserably at Sabbath observance.  I suspect you pollute it just as they did.  For instance is your mind tuned to Holy conversation and THOUGHTS for the 24 hour period.  Tell me you don't think about what you are going to do the following week.  Tell me you don't ogle that new car coming into the parking lot or the nice looking opposite sex.   God relieved Israel of the requirement at Calvary. 

[Michael2012]

It's every time you don't really answer the question properly, I find myself the necessity to ask questions that I thought would lead you to answer properly.

Experience has shown me likewise that every time I ask a simple question, you either say something that really does not answer it or find a way to escape from it.

I hope you get to properly answer my question, which is simply a clarificatory question. The question is "what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages?"

I'm not convinced that I must design my answers to fit your religion in order for them to be considered  "Proper". My definition of the Christ's Holy Sabbath is shaped by how HE describes His Holy Sabbath. One such place is Is. 58. Another is in Ex. 20, and another in Lev. 23. I have posted these scriptures over and over, so it would be foolish to do so again. But this is the answer to your question ""what do you say is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages". These "passages" are my definition.

Dishonesty is of the devil not of God. Every child of God knows that.

Nobody is asking you to be convinced that you must design your answer to fit any one's religion. What is asked of you is simply one that properly answer what is asked. You speak of Sabbath. I asked of you what is the definition of the Sabbath spoken in those passages. And you answer saying "It is the Christ's Holy, Sanctified, Hallowed Sabbath.". It's like if one ask for the definition of "baptism" spoken in the NT scriptures, and one answers that it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit, he would not really be answering what is asked. That isn't a proper answer. You habitually answer that way it seems. A proper answer would go something like this: Baptism refers to the act of "immersing" of ......etc. Whether the definition is right or wrong is not the matter. The answer is proper in that it gives a definition of Baptism, which is what is asked.

So, what is the definition of "Sabbath" that you preach, so people would know what you are meaning by it? Do you mean by it as being the seventh day starting from the day that God created? Do you mean by it as being the seventh day of the 7 day calendar week? If so, what calendar would that be? Do you mean by it as being the day of God's rest from His creation work? Do you mean by it as being the day of man's rest from his work? What work of man would that be? I, and I guess others as well here, would like to know what Sabbath is to you, so we can all know what it is you mean by it when you refer to it and speak about it.

So I will ask you some questions. Maybe we can actually have a discussion this time.

Is. 58:12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.

In your understanding, is this talking about the Christ? What is the Path He will restore, the one He Walked? Or is there another?

No.

So then, in your religion, the Christ isn't the "repairer of the breach, or "the restorer of paths to walk in". OK, that explains a lot.

If you think that it is the Christ, then you have an erroneous opinion. That is not what can be read and understood in Isaiah 58 scriptures. That apparently is just what it is you want that scriptures to say. And that sure explains a lot.

Yes. I delight and take great pleasure in the Lord not only in the seventh day of the week, but every day, calling everyday a delight and honorable, and striving to honor every day that the Lord has made, by not going my own way and not doing as I please, but going in the way of the Lord and doing His will.

Well I'm not sure how rejecting God's Commandment and creating your own is "Honoring Him".

Why am I not surprised that you conclude and here make a false accusation that I reject God's commandment and that I create my own "honoring Him"? Are you presenting yourself as a natural liar? Well, you are doing a great job at that, I would have to say.

You preach that there is nothing "Holy" about the Christ's Holy Sabbath. That it is not to be treated any differently than any other day.

Another GB lie? I don't preach anything of that sort GB. In fact, I would consider every day that the Lord had made as "Holy", from the first day to the seventh day. And if you only know how to read posts, you would know that I said that I strive to honor every day that the Lord has made. 

In your religion, are the other six days unholy and only the seventh day is that which you take as "Holy"? Do you delight and take only the seventh day as honorable, but not the other six days?

In doing this, you, like the Jews are transgressing the Commandments of God by your own religious traditions.

Unlike the Jews, I don't have any issues with religious tradition GB. Where do those lies come from GB? Hearing "Voices" GB?

And here, you pass judgement on me that I am transgressing God's commandments by that.

Why, is there anything evil in delighting and taking great pleasure in the Lord everyday? Is there anything evil in calling everyday that the Lord has made a delight and honorable? Is there anything evil in striving to honor every day that the Lord has made, by not going my own way and not doing as I please, but going in the way of the Lord and doing His will? I am beginning to get the impression that in your religion, you find evil in those.
 

Now maybe it doesn't matter. But to say you are "going in the way of the Lord" by rejecting the Sanctification of the Christ's Sabbath is a deception.

Another fabricated lie. I am not surprised. That's you.

The Christ says;"“If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable

But by your own admission, you have created your own way. How can a person Honor God by rejecting His Instruction, and creating your own?

No GB. What you are accusing me of there is yet again another of your fabricated lies. So your question is coming from that. Have your strawman answer that.

No one is saying not to Honor God every day, but according to HIM and HIS WORDS, He is telling us that "IF" we treat HIS Holy Sabbath differently than the other 6 days, "THEN" we shalt delight our self in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth,".

GB, scriptures does not say that God says we treat "HIS Holy Sabbath differently than the other 6 days". It is you who say that.

Besides God says what is written in Isaiah 58:12 to the children of Israel. Is your father Jacob? Are you an Israelite, a descendant of any of them whom God had taken out from slavery in Egypt and had made a covenant with whose mediator is Moses? No?

But you preach to the world that this isn't true. That you and your way is Holy, and the way of the Christ, that He is pleading with man to follow, isn't even worthy of your honor.

The master creator of strawman never fails to strike when the going gets tough. Lies, lies, lies. It's all over your post. Oh my!

How is purposely rejecting HIS Commandment, that HE is telling you to follow here, "Delighting yourself in the Lord"?

Why not just humble yourself to the Christ, and follow HIS way? Why must you pollute His Sabbath by injection your own religious tradition into it?

There's nothing new. It's all the same things said, lies.


What is clear and true is that for you, if I got you right, seem to believe that one will not be saved if he fails to follow what God commanded of Israel, to "Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy", or that one who fails to do it will go from saved to lost.

It seems that the problem with that is the acknowledgment of the truth in scriptures, that God at times gave commandments to specific chosen persons, and to specific chosen people. The point is that, not every commandment of God is for all people. One must be careful to realize this and read scriptures in this light. Do you want me to show this truth to you in scriptures? 

[RB]

This thread and another one very close to this is one is going nowhere! Folks are missing the true teachings of the word of God when they get overly worked up concerning such subjects and miss so much of the truth on what truly is pleasing to God concerning practical godliness. Our religion is not limited to Sunday worship in a place designated for worship, or a home~ neither is it limited to Saturday worship~In fact, God rejects those who have a ritual of godliness but deny its authority in their personal lives (2nd Timothy 3:5). The word of God addresses our day-to-day life, and faithful and honest preaching includes the whole counsel of God, no matter how uncomfortable for the speaker or audience. Proverbs and even the church epistles are CAREFUL not to exalt a CERTAIN DAY over ANOTHER day, but deals with our worship of God in ALL OF OUR THOUGHTS WORDS AND DEEDS EVERY DAY OF OUR LIFE! 

Keeping Jesus Christ’s commandments in our private daily life proves more devotion than not worshipping or worshipping on certain DAYS OF THE WEEKS. Selah! Eating in MODERATION proves much more devotion to God than WHAT WE EAT! It amazes me of the outward, visual obesity that churchgoers on SATURDAY OR SUNDAY parade into their church services to worship God, when it is obvious that their God is their belly! How much do we love Him? Are we humble enough to hear what He has to say about us remembering the poor or the ones that you truly have to work hard to love when you are having banqueting with your friends and leaving them out...... all relationships, money, marring, facial expressions to parents, cremation, horoscopes, swearing, clothing, friends, savings, drinking, eating, etc.? 

I'm fully convinced that we worship God 24/7 and a certain day over another day proves nothing as far as how much do we truly love him and if we are INDEED serving him 24/7.

I'm convinced that the sabbath day is a day TO REST following SIX WORKING DAYS and it may vary from person to person according to their vocation!  The Jewish Sabbath days and their limitations are not the same for us under the NT~even though I believe in resting the SEVENTH DAY following six working days for man's BENEFIT for God gave it for that very purpose! The Sabbath day was instituted FOR MAN, not man for the Sabbath!

I'm fully convinced that the first day of the week in the NT is the Lord's day that he came forth VICTROIUSLY from the grave and that the first-century believers came together on the Lord's day to hear the word of God so that they could go forth and LIVE by what they had learned in word, deeds, and thoughts every day of their life. But, that being so, the scriptures said VERY LITLLE about a certain day OVER another and for GOOD REASONS! Men would do and say JUST AS THEY ARE DOING NOW, in exalting a day over another and leaving off God's many hundreds of other commandments, some of which I mentioned above.

Luke 14:12-14~"Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee. But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind: And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just."

If we do not practice such scriptures than we are hypocrites and it matters little what day of the week one goes through the motion of worshipping God, that man's religion IS VAIN and worthless!

James 1:26,27~"If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world."

No mention about observing a certain day~that only makes one a good Pharisee......"fair...I...SEE".....not a sincere humble child of God who loves God and keeps his many hundreds of commandments hidden in his heart!

[winsome]

That is a fascinating religious doctrine. I've heard a lot of differing religious views about God's Sabbath, but your preaching that when God "Sanctifies" something, it only stays sanctified for one day is a first. 

 
That is a false argument. You are extrapolating from one incident to a generality.
If I go to a cinema on a particular Thursday it doesn't mean I go to the cinema every Thursday.
As I have pointed out several times, each day of creation was unique.
 
God created fishes and birds on the 6th day. Does that mean he creates fished and birds every 6th day?
Of course not.
 

If I was to follow your logic, then the Sabbath Commandment is based on a lie. According to you, the 7th day was only special one time, when God rested in it.

That's not my logic so your argument fails. The 7th day of creation was special, not every 7th day until God made it special for the Israelites in the desert (Ex 16:23)
 

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

So then according to you, only the first Sabbath was Holy, all subsequent 7th days are no different than any other because God never rested in it.

So this Commandment is based on a lie it seems, in your religion.

So then Israel was unjustly punished for despising and Polluting God's Sabbath, because in your religion, there is nothing special about the 7th day. It was only sanctified for one day.

As I keep pointing out, God instituted the 7th day sabbath for the Israelites in the desert (Ex 16:23).
It was a sign of their Covenant with God. Keeping it was part of  keeping the Covenant.
God also made it a day for a sacred convocation (Lve 23:3) for them.
He made it part of Covenant Law to observe it every 7th day..
 
But none of this started until Ex 16:23.
 

So when Isaiah wrote;

 Is.56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, (non-Jews) that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

Isaiah is just making this up because in your religion, God didn't set apart and sanctify this day from the rest more than the one day He rested in it. And even if He did, it was only for the Jew in your religion.

I don't think the Christ lied to us through Isaiah.

And when this same alleged Prophet of the Most High said;
 
Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

He was just telling us more lies because the 7th day isn't Holy in your religion, It isn't Sanctified in your religion, and it isn't the Lord's Sabbath in your religion because God didn't rest "Every 7th day" even though His Ten Commandments tells us too.

So then when Jesus said "The Sabbath was made for man", in your religion this is also a lie, because there is no set apart,  "Sanctified" 7th day. It's all made up.

I've been through all this. Stop repeating the same refuted arguments and wasting my time.
 

However, if a man believes "Every Word of God" as Jesus instructed, it become quite evident that God's Sanctification lasts for more than just one day. According to His Word, if a man believes in them as I do, the Sanctified Sabbath of the Lord will also be observed in the New Earth.

You can believe what you like but your beliefs are not supported by scripture
 

As for the New Covenant, I asked that you read in the Holy Scriptures where the Christ of the Bible Prophesied about HIS New Covenant. His Definition of His New Covenant is the one I choose to believe. It is quite different from the New Covenant taught in the religions of the land.

I just want to know which posts you answered this about the New Covenant.
 
If you cannot point to it then your claim that you answered is false.
 
 

[GB]

 author=beam link=topic=74624.msg1055154415#msg1055154415 date=1578708528]

Question GB, God gave Israel somewhere in the neighborhood of 613 commands.

For 25 years I studied the Bible apart from any mainstream religious influence, at least as much as is possible in our world today. What I found is that what the Scriptures teach, and what religious men teach are two different things. Which confirmed all the Prophesies, including warnings from Jesus Himself, which warn of religious men teaching differently than what God teaches. And also aligns with all the examples of religious men through out the Bible who teach differently than what God teaches.

So given that God is not a liar, at least not in my mind, there are "many" religious men who teach differently than God.

This is a Biblical, Spiritual, truth that can not be denied if one relies on the Holy Scriptures for doctrine.

You have provided a perfect example of a man who has been influenced by "other Voices" of religious men that teach falsehoods. God did not command Israel to obey 613 laws. This number was made up by religious men to make God look like an unjust God who burdens His People with countless, burdensome laws. This is done to convince people to reject God's Laws, just as the "other religious voice" convinced Eve. It is a lie, a falsehood which you promote, but can not back up.

The Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time did the same thing. They also taught lies about God and His Laws to convince folks to follow the religious tradition of man, which transgressed the Commandments of God.

There is no 613 laws commanded by God for Israel to follow. It is an insidious lie that you will not even try to defend, if you actually really ever looked at the website that promotes this myth.

The sad thing is that because of Pride, even when religious men look at this myth and see that they were deceived, the humiliation of admitting their error is just too much to bear for most.

My hope for you is that you will look into this myth and be corrected. Then maybe we can have an intellectually honest discussion about scriptures. Until then, this conversation is a vanity.

many of them concern the lay Israelite.   Why don't you consider observing all the other commands.  You pitch ten plus a form of tithing and the unclean meat law from the Book of the Law.  The remainder you treat just as do most of the Christians of the World.  You will not even consider that the Sinai covenant was given only to Israel and the remainder of the World has never been approached by God as a requirement.

What I pitch is what the Scriptures say, all of them, not just a few that can be wrested to promote some religious tradition of men.

"the remainder of the World has never been approached by God"

See, you are doing it again. You are promoting falsehood you heard from some religious man somewhere.

Joshua 2:9 And she said unto the men, I know that the LORD hath given you the land, and that your terror is fallen upon us, and that all the inhabitants of the land faint because of you.

10 For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that were on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.

The whole city of Jericho knew of the God of Abraham and His Chosen People. They could all have become Rehab's if they chose and God would have accepted them just as HIS Laws that He gave Israel promised.

Did the Jews have an advantage? Yes, much in every way, because God did give HIS Laws to them. But with many God was not well pleased, because they rebelled against Him. They didn't follow God's Laws, but rejected them and "taught for doctrines the Commandments of men". But had they listened to God and taught the truth, there would have been a lot more Rehabs.

Is. 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, (Non- Jews)that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

But Israel refused to teach God's Way.

Ez. 36:20 And when they entered unto the heathen, whither they went, they profaned my holy name, when they said to them, These are the people of the LORD, and are gone forth out of his land.

21 But I had pity for mine holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the heathen, whither they went.

Paul confirms.

Rom. 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?

24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.

It wasn't God's Law that separated the rest of the world from Him, it was the corrupt Preachers of the first covenant God made with Israel, charged with the Priesthood duties of administering God's Laws and providing for atonement of sins.

  The old covenant was replaced with the new one.  It happened at Calvary.  The words of that covenant were replaced by the words of the new one.

Yes, and we can even go straight to the Creator of the New Covenant and hear the Christ Himself define it for us.

Jer. 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel;

OK Beam, here it is. You can read it for yourself without any "Priest" as a middle man. Just you, and the Word of God which became flesh.

 After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, (Just as He said, just you and the Word's of the Christ) and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. (No Levitical Priesthood "works of the Law" needed, just you and the Christ.

The weekly Sabbath was part of the covenant that was replaced.

 

There, you are doing it again. Preaching things about God's Word that are untrue. You just read HIM defining HIS New Covenant. Where does He say this anywhere in His Inspired Holy Scriptures?

He doesn't Beam. Religious man does, but God's Word doesn't. Read for yourself.

There is no Sabbath command.  The SDA church, Messianics, and other churches that teach it is binding on all mankind have it wrong.  That is why Paul wrote for Christians to not allow law adherents to judge them for not abiding by the rules of the defunct covenant

Paul never did any such thing. Here is what Paul said.

Col. 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

The Sabbaths of the Lord are HIS Sabbaths, created for man. They are not a creation of man, or a tradition of Man. It's in your own Bible.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Religious traditions of men are shadows of nothing.

Again, like your 613 laws myth, you are listening to "other religious voices" like Eve did. I implore you to "come out of her" and look into the scriptures your own self.

It seems like some religions are not allowing the Holy Spirit as their guide.  Some prefer the defunct 10 commandments.  2Cor3:6-11

This verse doesn't say God destroyed His Laws that He promised to write on the hearts of His People. The "Glory of Moses" was done away with, "Moses Seat", the manner in which God's Law is administered. No more death to atone for sins. You are being tricked by religious men if you think this verse wipes out the New Covenant the Christ promised.

There is no Sabbath command to reject and who is creating a new one.  No one is saved by keeping days.
It was Holy for Israel.

That is another myth you have learned from religious man. And have been convinced to promote it.

Is 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

It was only Holy for Israel because it was Holy to God.

It is the Christ's Holy Feast Beam. We are told to "Be Holy for I am Holy". Jesus didn't follow His Sabbath because it was a worthless Jewish Tradition, He followed it because He was Holy, and the Sabbath is Holy unto the Lord. At least according to the Christ of the Bible. 

God made the day to commemorate and remember creation and being taken out of bondage in Egypt.  The new covenant has a day of remembrance also,  Jesus dying for each of us.  We are to commemorate communion often.
Is there a law against tradition?  Where is the transgression?

If a man's religious traditions cause one to break the commandments of God, then this tradition is sin. Bible 101!

It was God's Sabbath.  Jesus was the Word until His birth.

Then why do you reject His Word where His Sabbaths are concerned? He didn't, and neither did Paul.

  Where there is no law there is no sin.  The Law was done away. 23Cor3:verse 11. KJV

That is what the serpent convinced Eve of. Religious man's twisting of this scriptures doesn't make the Word's of the entire Bible void. Well, in man's religion it does, but the Christ teaches no such thing.

Scripture was referring to Israel not Christians.

Rom. 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Man cannot create anything.  Man uses what it there that will be a benefit to mankind.  Where there is no law telling us we have to worship on a certain day then we are free to assemble when convenient.

The Law says to keep His Sabbath Holy, and don't work on it. You are confusing, once again, what the Christ says and what religious man says. You are free to accept or reject His Word. And the consequences for either path is clear spelled out.

the day was Holy for Israelites.  No other nation on Earth had the Sabbath.

Actually no it wasn't. It was Holy for Zechariahs and Simeon and Anna, but not the Pharisees. They "despised" God's Sabbaths, and greatly Polluted God's Sabbaths. But the Jews and Non-Jews alike who "joined themselves to the Lord", and refused to Pollute His Holy Sabbath, they will be given a name better than that of sons and daughters. At least that is what the Christ of the Bible said. It's in your own Bible.

I am sorry GB, if you are SDA you are preaching many things that are not scriptural. Care to go into all of it?

I am not SDA and neither was Jesus. But we both had respect unto the Father's Sabbaths. In my view, SDA and your religion are no different that Catholic or LDS, or AOG. They all transgress God's Commandments by their own, sometimes ancient, religious traditions. It is a mistake to think your transgressions or the falsehoods you promote and less important than theirs. As Jesus said;

Luke 13:1 There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.

2 And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?

3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

I have been on both sides of the issue and believe me Sabbath triers are no more blessed than anyone else. 

In your and their religion this may be true. But for the Jew or non-Jew that "joins himself to the Lord", and who doesn't pollute His Holy Sabbath, they are blessed. At least according to the Christ who created His Sabbath for man.

His way is the new covenant way.  A better way with better promises.  Israel failed miserably at Sabbath observance.

Yes, "many were overthrown in the Wilderness" because of their rebellion, but not all. Daniel, Zechariahs, Simeon.

And yes, we no longer are forced to go to the Levite Priests to hear God's Word, and we are no longer required to take an animal sacrifice to the Levite Priest for atonement of sins, according to the Priesthood covenant God made with Israel on Mt. Sinai. A new and better way. Besides God gave Israel His Sabbath before Mt. Sinai.

  I suspect you pollute it just as they did.

I would expect such a comment from you given the prophesies of religious men, and the fact that it was religious men who laid sin on the only perfect human ever born. This is why Paul taught believers not to judge them in their respect of His Sabbaths. And also not to let religious men beguile me of my reward in a voluntary humility.

I am striving to enter the narrow gate. And I believe, as does Paul, "all thing written in the Law and Prophets" that Jesus said would be here as long as this earth is here.

For instance is your mind tuned to Holy conversation and THOUGHTS for the 24 hour period.  Tell me you don't think about what you are going to do the following week.  Tell me you don't ogle that new car coming into the parking lot or the nice looking opposite sex.

Don't project your own sins on others. I have sin in me no doubt. I am a sinner. And Jesus created His Laws and Sabbaths for me. He created his Sabbath "FOR ME". This is not "another religious voice" saying this, but the Holy Christ.

You are doing exactly what the Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time did.

Matt. 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

Daniel, Zechariahs, Simeon, the Wise Men, Anna and whole host of other examples of the faithful in the Bible didn't "fail miserably". Don't project your own lawlessness on these folks either.

   God relieved Israel of the requirement at Calvary.

Rom. 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

My friend Beam, I hope with all my heart that you will stop listening to all those other religious voices out there, humble yourself to the Christ, and be a "doer" of His Sayings, and not just a hearer. Yes, religious men will make fun of you as they did Jesus and all His Prophets and Disciples, yes, you will suffer humiliation.

But the Christ of the Bible is faithful to perform His Promises. His Way is not a burden and a yoke of bondage, as we have been taught since our youth. Man's way is the path to destruction, not God's.

[GB]

 author=winsome link=topic=74624.msg1055154428#msg1055154428 date=1578744288]
 

That is a false argument. You are extrapolating from one incident to a generality.
If I go to a cinema on a particular Thursday it doesn't mean I go to the cinema every Thursday.
As I have pointed out several times, each day of creation was unique.
 
God created fishes and birds on the 6th day. Does that mean he creates fished and birds every 6th day?
Of course not.

Did God Sanctify the Cinema, or the Thursday? I agree that each day was unique. God only rested, Blessed and Sanctified the 7th day, at least according to Him.

I'm simply trying to find out where you got this teaching that God's Sanctification and Blessing only lasted one day. I have searched the scriptures and can find nothing to support this doctrine of yours, and you provide nothing but your own words.

Gen.2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
 
Ex. 16:22 And it came to pass, that on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one man: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.

23 And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.

Where do you get the religious doctrine that God's Holy Sabbath wasn't Holy until Israel forgot the God of Joseph?

Why was the Sabbath Rest Holy? Isn't it because God Blessed it, and Sanctified it?

Do you have any other example of a Sanctification of God that lasted only one day? Or in your religion, is this the only time God's Sanctification only lasted one day?

John 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

Was this another example of God's Sanctification only lasting one day?

You may be right, I just need more than your own words. Something from God's Word, just one scripture that I can see where God's Blessings and Sanctifications only lasted one day. Just one.

 I just want to know which posts you answered this about the New Covenant. If you cannot point to it then your claim that you answered is false.

#194;

You should read how the Creator of the New Covenant defines His New Covenant is. You will find that His Definition, and the religions of the land's definition, are two different things. (It's in Jer. 31) In the Christ's definition, He claims that "After those days" He will write His Laws on our hearts. Not remove them, destroy them, amend them. Given all the warnings about religious men deceiving folks, I really hope you will look for yourself.

I didn't falsely accuse you of anything. You are preaching that when God Blessed and Sanctified His Holy 7th Day, it only lasted one day. I'm trying to find where in scriptures you find this doctrine.

[GB]

 author=RB link=topic=74624.msg1055154426#msg1055154426 date=1578740170]

This thread and another one very close to this is one is going nowhere! Folks are missing the true teachings of the word of God when they get overly worked up concerning such subjects and miss so much of the truth on what truly is pleasing to God concerning practical godliness. Our religion is not limited to Sunday worship in a place designated for worship, or a home~ neither is it limited to Saturday worship

It has nothing to do about a day of worship, as we should honor and respect the Word of God every day. It has to do with Honoring the Christ and trusting HIS Word's over the religious voices of the land.

While it is true there is nowhere in the Bible where the Holy Sabbath of the Lord, was changed from the 7th to the 1st day, as you preach. It is also not true that the 7th Day is the only day of worship.

The Holy 7th day Sabbath is basically a fast from the wicked world we live in. A foreshadow of the time when our "work" to over come, even as He overcame, is over. A shadow of the time when we will no longer need to "Put on" His Armor to resist the devil, when we will no longer need "escapes" from temptation. But until then we Honor Him and are strengthened though Him by trusting His Word's over the religious voices of the land.

Yes, there are religious voices, men who come in Christ's Name, men who use God's Word, just as the serpent did, to convince men to reject the Path foreordained by God that we should walk in them.

And most folks will go in thereat. But for those who believe "Every Word of God", there is another path in which He tells us to "Strive to enter".

It is written;

Is. 58:12 And they that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.

And again;

Jer. 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls.

This is the Path Jesus walked and taught.

Matt. 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

But they said, We will not walk therein.

This is the Word of the Christ of the Bible, the Holy One of Israel who came to earth as a man. Listen to Him, not the "other religious voices" in the land. Take HIS Yoke upon you, not the religious traditions of man. "Live by" Every Word of God as He instructs.

Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

47 Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like:

48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

49 But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

Don't listen to those who would pervert the Holy Scriptures. God is not a Jew, His Laws and not Jewish Laws, nor are His Sabbaths "Jewish Sabbaths".

You will be ridiculed and insulted by religious men, there will be humiliation and divisions in your life for the Christ's Sake, but the knowledge you gain, and the freedom from deception that comes with true Faith is worth so much more than the loss of worldly religious doctrines and traditions.

Zech. 1:3 Therefore say thou unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Turn ye unto me, saith the LORD of hosts, and I will turn unto you, saith the LORD of hosts.

4 Be ye not as your fathers, unto whom the former prophets have cried, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Turn ye now from your evil ways, and from your evil doings: but they did not hear, nor hearken unto me, saith the LORD.

"Today, if you hear His Voice, harden not your hearts".