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Author Topic: What is Wrong With The Following Statement about the Plan of Salvation??  (Read 1488 times)

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Online beam

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Sorrow filled heaven, as it was realized that man was lost ... I saw the lovely Jesus and beheld an expression of sympathy and sorrow upon His countenance. Soon I saw Him approach the exceeding bright light which enshrouded His Father. Said my accompanying angel, He is in close converse with the Father.... Three times He was shut in by the glorious light about the Father, and the third time He came from the Father, His person could be seen.... He then made known to the angelic host that a way of escape had been made for lost man. He told them that He had been pleading with His Father, and had offered to give His life a ransom, to take the sentence of death upon Himself ... Jesus bade the heavenly host be reconciled to the plan that His Father had accepted...
Early Writings, pp. 149-151.

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Offline soterion

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It reads like dramatic fiction.

Online RB

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Such thoughts come from an unregenerate mind that reason outside of the scriptures, maybe from one that has never read them. 

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Online Shubee

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Early Writings, pp. 149-151.

I believe it was a true revelatory experience.

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I believe it was a true revelatory experience.
Well, there is a lot of issues with that statement, but the most obvious one is that Ellen placed the timing of the plan of salvation after the fall of man which is diametrically opposed to scripture.  For you to make the comment you did tells me you would not question almost anything she expressed.

Scripture tells us the Godhead is in one accord.  The Father denying Jesus two times tells us just the opposite. 

Ellen also made Jesus look like a subordinate to the Father.  She made God look like a hard hearted Creator that really didn't care about saving us from eternity in Hell. 

It seems very odd that if you really read the statement you didn't see any problems. 

Online Shubee

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Scripture tells us the Godhead is in one accord.

The Father knows the end from the beginning but the Son only knows what the Father reveals.

Proof:

Revelation 1:1
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place.

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Scripture tells us the Godhead is in one accord.

Genesis 6:6
And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart.


Just as I said, the Father knew what was coming but the Son did not.

Online RB

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I believe it was a true revelatory experience.
Not from God~you folks worship a false prophetess, whose mind was puffed up with what she thought was revelatory visions, but she was lead by another spirit, the spirit of her father, the devil himself. Saying that, that does not mean I'm judging everyone who is an SDA, but she for certain was under a strong delusion~and she did it with some truth, which is the only means that one has of deceiving anyone, or at least it should be....some it does not take very much, and you seem to be one of them.
Quote from: Shubee on: Yesterday at 19:08:09
I believe it was a true revelatory experience.
Whatever is true can be defended by the word of God, without very much work...the scriptures defend themselves against false prophets, even more so against a prophetess~the weaker vessel.
« Last Edit: Mon Oct 29, 2018 - 05:01:34 by RB »

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The Father knows the end from the beginning but the Son only knows what the Father reveals.

Proof:

Revelation 1:1
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place.


This is true, "only" in Jesus' humanity, but NOT true according to his Deity, which was the I'AM THAT I'AM~Jehovah God, eternal both ways! But, what would the followers of a false prophetess know about Jesus' complex nature? Not very much for sure.

You have a half true system mixed with blasphemous, damnable, doctrines of devils.
« Last Edit: Mon Oct 29, 2018 - 04:58:14 by RB »

Offline th1b.taylor

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Genesis 6:6
And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart.


Just as I said, the Father knew what was coming but the Son did not.
You are reading into scripture, what is not there.  YHWH

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The Father knows the end from the beginning but the Son only knows what the Father reveals.

Proof:

Revelation 1:1
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place.

I cannot help but wonder why you didn't address the following:

Well, there is a lot of issues with that statement, but the most obvious one is that Ellen placed the timing of the plan of salvation after the fall of man which is diametrically opposed to scripture.  For you to make the comment you did tells me you would not question almost anything she expressed.

John 10:29-31 New International Version (NIV)
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[a]; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”

31 Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him,

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This is true, "only" in Jesus' humanity, but NOT true according to his Deity

Define the human nature that you think Christ has now. I believe it was the resurrected Christ that received the revelation that He gave to John.

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But, what would the followers of a false prophetess know about Jesus' complex nature?

I accept Sister White's insight on The Mystery of Christ's Human Nature. I also accept the confession of R. C. Sproul as an honest confession of lesser minds.

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I cannot help but wonder why you didn't address the following:

John 10:29-31 New International Version (NIV)
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[a]; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”

It is answered completely in The Fundamental Beliefs of Seventh-day Millerites, Circa 2018.

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Define the human nature that you think Christ has now. I believe it was the resurrected Christ that received the revelation that He gave to John.
I accept Sister White's insight on The Mystery of Christ's Human Nature. I also accept the confession of R. C. Sproul as an honest confession of lesser minds.
I am not referring to Jesus human nature.  Why ar you changing the subject.  The question is was Ellen correct in her story about the Plan of Salvation.  Just answer the simple question.  Was the Bible wrong and should we accept Ellen instead of the Word?  Stay on the beam my friend.  Stop avoiding my questions.

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The question is was Ellen correct in her story about the Plan of Salvation.  Just answer the simple question.

I believe it's correct.

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Was the Bible wrong and should we accept Ellen instead of the Word?

Get the beam out. The Bible is God's word and Sister White received genuine revelations from God.

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Get the beam out. The Bible is God's word and Sister White received genuine revelations from God.
So Shubee, you will go on record that the plan of salvation was planned after the fall of man???   You recognize Ellen White over God's canon?  I find that stance one of defiance to the true Word if you really do believe Ellen was correct.

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So Shubee, you will go on record that the plan of salvation was planned after the fall of man???

I testify to believing that there are minor theological errors in the following, written by Ellen G. White:

The plan for our redemption was not an afterthought, a plan formulated after the fall of Adam. It was a revelation of "the mystery which hath been kept in silence through times eternal." Romans 16:25, R. V. It was an unfolding of the principles that from eternal ages have been the foundation of God's throne. From the beginning, God and Christ knew of the apostasy of Satan, and of the fall of man through the deceptive power of the apostate. God did not ordain that sin should exist, but He foresaw its existence, and made provision to meet the terrible emergency. So great was His love for the world, that He covenanted to give His only-begotten Son, "that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John 3:16.  {DA 22.2}  

I assert that the Father knows the end from the beginning but the Son only knows all possible futures with perfect comprehension plus all that the Father reveals to Him. Unquestionably, the Son, the Creator of the universe, knew of the possibility of Satan's fall, and the possible fall of Adam and Eve.

I believe God was “in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself” (2 Corinthians 5:19) and that God's intention to save the world existed before Christ made the universe.

I believe that the Son was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and that He was grieved in His heart. (Genesis 6:6.)


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Regarding the plan of redemption, I think it's pretentious to dare say exactly how much Christ knew and when He knew it.

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Regarding the plan of redemption, I think it's pretentious to dare say exactly how much Christ knew and when He knew it.
Is jesus God or is He just a subordinate?   According from what i see from your fingers on the key board I would have to believe you are of the opinion that He is the later.

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Is jesus God or is He just a subordinate?

Jesus Christ is the Logos, the greatest divine eternal representative of the only true God.

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Define the human nature that you think Christ has now. I believe it was the resurrected Christ that received the revelation that He gave to John.
It is a GLORIFIED human body that he lived in while on earth, one that shall SUBMIT itself to God~that God, who is a Spirit that inhabiteth eternity may be all in all. 1st Corinthians 15:24-28 This in ONE subject that I have given many years to understand and get my understanding around its truth.
Quote from: Shubee on: Yesterday at 10:06:52
I accept Sister White's insight on The Mystery of Christ's Human Nature. I also accept the confession of R. C. Sproul as an honest confession of lesser minds.
Neither one said enough in the link that you gave to really prove what they truly believe~even though Mr. Sproul said not anything that was against the truth but for it.

What do you mean by these words:
Quote from: Shubee on: Yesterday at 10:06:52
the confession of R. C. Sproul as an honest confession of lesser minds
Are you saying that the late R.C. Sproul had a lesser mind in understanding the truth than White possess?
« Last Edit: Tue Oct 30, 2018 - 04:55:22 by RB »

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Jesus Christ is the Logos, the greatest divine eternal representative of the only true God.
Believe what you like my friend.  I will stick to Jesus as God.  He is God as is the Father and the Holy Spirit.  One in mind, thought and purpose.  One God in three persons.   The Father did not create or make an angel His co-partner.  The Godhead has been present from eternity.

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The Godhead has been present from eternity.
As "ONE" LORD GOD~revealed as "three" IN TIME according to their respective work in the salvation of God's elect.
« Last Edit: Tue Oct 30, 2018 - 08:08:59 by RB »

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As "ONE" LORD GOD~revealed as "three" IN TIME according to their respective work in the salvation of God's elect.
So then is God now sitting at His own right hand?  How does that happen?

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So then is God now sitting at His own right hand?  How does that happen?
God in three persons blessed trinity.  It is all a mystery to me.  Many thing I have to believe by faith.  What I do know is that because I believe and love I have a great life.   1Jn3:19-24  My faith keeps me uplifted even when bad things happen.   I have the blessed hope that an unbeliever cannot fathom.   

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The Father did not create or make an angel His co-partner.

Thanks for confessing that you don't know the meaning of the word "eternal."

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Are you saying that the late R.C. Sproul had a lesser mind in understanding the truth than White possess?

Didn't you notice Sister White's beautiful insight that completely answered the mystery that  R.C. Sproul said was impossible to understand?

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Didn't you notice Sister White's beautiful insight that completely answered the mystery that  R.C. Sproul said was impossible to understand?
Didn't you notice that Ellen wrote that the plan of salvation was drummed up after the fall of man?   Didn't you notice that God the Father was not one with Jesus in that the Father refused Jesus two times?  Didn't you notice that Ellen made Jesus subordinate to the Father?  Didn't you notice her statement was diametrically opposed to scripture?

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So then is God now sitting at His own right hand?  How does that happen?
God IS a Spirit and does NOT have hands~God’s right hand is the place of “highest favor with God the Father”~and the phrase is used throughout Scripture to indicate His power and sovereignty (Exodus. 15:6; Isaiah. 48:13). To say that Jesus is seated at the right hand of the Father is to say, that “Christ was invested with lordship over heaven and earth, and solemnly entered into possession of the government committed to him~and that he not only entered into possession once for all, but continues in it, until he shall come down on Judgment Day” .

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Didn't you notice that Ellen wrote that the plan of salvation was drummed up after the fall of man?

Did you notice that Sister White wrote the exact opposite?

The plan for our redemption was not an afterthought, a plan formulated after the fall of Adam. It was a revelation of "the mystery which hath been kept in silence through times eternal." Romans 16:25, R. V. It was an unfolding of the principles that from eternal ages have been the foundation of God's throne. From the beginning, God and Christ knew of the apostasy of Satan, and of the fall of man through the deceptive power of the apostate. God did not ordain that sin should exist, but He foresaw its existence, and made provision to meet the terrible emergency. So great was His love for the world, that He covenanted to give His only-begotten Son, "that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John 3:16.  {DA 22.2}  

Did you read Sister White's entire three page account of her vision (Early Writings, pp. 149-151)?

Did you notice my opinion on the subject:

Regarding the plan of redemption, I think it's pretentious to dare say exactly how much Christ knew and when He knew it.

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Did you notice that Sister White wrote the exact opposite?

The plan for our redemption was not an afterthought, a plan formulated after the fall of Adam. It was a revelation of "the mystery which hath been kept in silence through times eternal." Romans 16:25, R. V. It was an unfolding of the principles that from eternal ages have been the foundation of God's throne. From the beginning, God and Christ knew of the apostasy of Satan, and of the fall of man through the deceptive power of the apostate. God did not ordain that sin should exist, but He foresaw its existence, and made provision to meet the terrible emergency. So great was His love for the world, that He covenanted to give His only-begotten Son, "that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John 3:16.  {DA 22.2}  

Did you read Sister White's entire three page account of her vision (Early Writings, pp. 149-151)?

Did you notice my opinion on the subject:

Regarding the plan of redemption, I think it's pretentious to dare say exactly how much Christ knew and when He knew it.
Well isn't that something.  Which account should we believe.  You uphold her as true for being right half the time????  What a half hearted excuse.  If a person who esteems her to be a true prophet never reads the statement in Desire of Ages they would believe the plan was formulated after the fall of man.   This proves she was a false prophet.  In the Early Writings account it was her angel she was quoting.  Why would her angel tell her a fairy tale?

That brings us to the point.  Is it possible to trust any of her writings?   Which ones are the real truth and which ones are blatant lies?  I trust scripture and my guide, the Holy Spirit.   I feel very sorry for those who have put their trust in Ellen and use her as their guide.

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Didn't you notice that God the Father was not one with Jesus in that the Father refused Jesus two times?

You’re obviously either not cognizant of the fact that Scripture portrays Jesus Christ as an intercessor or don’t understand the symbolism. Or are you just doubling down on your antichristian affirmation elsewhere that Christ's intercession for mankind after the cross is completely unessential for our salvation?  You have obviously never read ONE GOD AND ONE MEDIATOR - REFLECTIONS OF JUSTICE AND MERCY.

« Last Edit: Thu Nov 01, 2018 - 07:14:25 by Shubee »

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Well isn't that something.  Which account should we believe.

Indisputably, you need to repent of your antichristian theology and accept the tested teachings of the Seventh-day Millerites.

 

     
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