Author Topic: Hell's Daily Tally  (Read 4387 times)

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Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #105 on: Tue May 05, 2020 - 11:14:53 »
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FAQ: What does Eph 2:3 mean where it says: We were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest.

A: Well; in a nutshell; it means that the sum of all fears is the only option for human nature.

FAQ: But human nature is intrinsic in human beings, viz: human nature is what makes us human. You mean people are missing out on heaven just for being human?

A: Yes. (John 3:3-7, Rom 8:5-8, and 1Cor 15:50)

TALLY UPDATE: 610 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 37,154,490 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #105 on: Tue May 05, 2020 - 11:14:53 »

Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #106 on: Sat May 09, 2020 - 18:38:22 »
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There is a significant difference between pollution and corruption.

Pollution refers to surface contamination whereas corruption refers to internal decay; for example;

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness." (Matt 23:27-28)

The Pharisees were the most righteous men in all of Israel; they were squeaky clean, but their piety was only skin deep. Down in their innermost being there was decay going on not easily detected.

One year a pine tree broke off at its base and fell into my yard nearly striking my house. From all outward appearances, the tree appeared strong, healthy, and sturdy; but when it's trunk snapped open, we could see that it was nearly hollowed out from internal dry rot.

Now, it's very probable there's a number of people in pews, behind pulpits, sitting on church boards, and/or singing in choirs who are shining examples of the Christian way of life; while within themselves yearning for the very things that they have both renounced and denounced. They have escaped the pollutions of the world, but not the corruption.

Jesus labeled those people "hypocrites" which is from a Greek word pertaining to actors, i.e. pretenders: people playing a role, viz: going thru the motions.


TALLY UPDATE: 614 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 37,398,126 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #107 on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31 »
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I've read Luke 16:19-31 all the way thru several times and yet to find where the rich man was curious about how long he could expect to be incarcerated in the fiery sector of Hades.

Well; that's not hard to sleuth. He no doubt encountered lots of people who've been down there since the days of Cain, the Flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, and the Pyramids. Plus, the scuttlebutt would assure him that nobody up to the time of his arrival had ever been released so he shouldn't get his hopes up that he'd be the first.

Something else. The rich man in the story doesn't protest his fate in the fiery sector of Hades. Apparently the man fully understood that he deserved it; and that's not hard to sleuth either.

People down there at the time of the rich man's arrival had access to solid error-free Bible teaching. Abraham wasn't the only prophet across the chasm, all the big guns were over there too; including the man himself: Mr. Moses ben Levi. I know that's true because the Lord said that nobody up to his time had ever been taken to heaven. (John 3:13)

» It's ironic that condemned souls in the fiery sector of Hades might know the Bible better than a good many Christians warming pews, teaching Sunday school, and pounding pulpits.


TALLY UPDATE: 619 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 37,702,671 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
_

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #107 on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31 »

Offline RB

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #108 on: Tue May 19, 2020 - 05:50:55 »
I've read Luke 16:19-31 all the way thru several times and yet to find where the rich man was curious about how long he could expect to be incarcerated in the fiery sector of Hades.
Dear sir, keep reading it, and you will never see it, and the reason why is that there is "no such place"~that is.... the fiery sector of Hades. Sir, Luke 16:19-31 is a parable given based on these words:
Quote from: JESUS CHRIST
Luke 16:13-15~"No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon. And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and they derided him. And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
The lesson being taught in Luke 16:19-31 was given to exhort us to beware of a covetous spirit, for BOTH the rich man and poor man will all die and the ONLY thing they can take with them will be their works that they all produce BASED UPON where their true treasure was. And ONCE we die, there is NO coming back to be given an opportunity to redo our life again, our final state is forever sealed with our works following us. Much more can be said and will if requested, but enough to cause any sincere person to seek their understanding FROM THE CONTEXT of the scriptures, alone.

I will say this~NO poor man goes to heaven just because they are poor and no rich man goes to a fiery sector of hellfire (using your words) just because they are rich. The poor IN spirit is a great price in the sight of God~unlike those wicked religious reprobates seeking to fulfill their sinful lust in the things of this life which in the sight of God is an abomination.  So much more could be added....but enough for now.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
find where the rich man was curious about how long he could expect to be incarcerated in the fiery sector of Hades.
One reason why is that the wicked shall perish when they are cast into the lake of fire after the judgment of THAT DAY~ which will be the second and final death for them.   

Sir, do you really believe that a drop of cold water could truly cool one's tongue? We must look for the truth hidden in this parable spoken AGAINST the covetous Pharisees. Such phrases ought to give us hints that this is a parable with spiritual truths hidden therein for us to learn from.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
Well; that's not hard to sleuth.
Well, so far your investigation is seriously lacking to find the truth that is hidden in Luke 16:19-31, you need God's Spirit to guide you instead of religious beliefs that are against God's testimony of the TRUTH.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
Abraham wasn't the only prophet across the chasm, all the big guns were over there too; including the man himself: Mr. Moses ben Levi. I know that's true  (John 3:13)
No such place has ever existed, only in the minds of folks that have been deceived by religious Pharisees who were not given eyes to see the true teachings in Luke 16:19-31 and for good reasons.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
I know that's true because the Lord said that nobody up to his time had ever been taken to heaven. (John 3:13)
Though Enoch and Elias had, yet not by their own power, nor in the sense our Lord designs; whose meaning is, that no man had, or could go up to heaven, to bring from thence the knowledge of divine and heavenly things; in which sense the phrase is used in Deuteronomy 30:12; Romans 10:6 and John 3.

"The son of man which is in heaven"~ at the same time he was then on earth, so in THIS SENSE, Jesus is the ONLY person that could be said to be in BOTH places at the same time being God incarnate, and being so, taught the pure TRUTH of heaven, that was in the scriptures, yet hidden from the eys of religious folks and certainly from those who made no profession thereof.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
It's ironic that condemned souls in the fiery sector of Hades might know the Bible better than a good many Christians warming pews, teaching Sunday school, and pounding pulpits.
There are many folks that died in their sins that will cast into the lake of fire after the judgment of THAT day, who THOUGHT they were children of God, but their god was truly the things of THIS LIFE where their heart truly was fixed upon just as the religious Pharisees of Jesus' day and many of their children following them under different cults names~but the SAME mystery of iniquity at work.
Quote from: NyawehNyoh on: Thu May 14, 2020 - 15:41:31
TALLY UPDATE: 619 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 37,702,671 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
Zero have checked in, since no such place exists, only in the minds of those whom Catholicism has deceived, who started this lie with their doctrine of purgatory, and from thence most all cults have followed them in teaching the same.           
« Last Edit: Tue May 19, 2020 - 05:57:06 by RB »

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #108 on: Tue May 19, 2020 - 05:50:55 »

Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #109 on: Tue May 19, 2020 - 14:33:58 »
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The Hebrew word for "thoughts" in Ps 146:3-4 is 'eshtonah (esh-to naw') which has nothing to do with either existence or awareness. The word is very ambiguous and refers to quite a variety of meanings to choose from; including, but not limited to: concerns, anticipations, conceptions, opinions, imaginations, visualizations, ideas, epiphanies, plans, schemes, fantasies, arguments, aspirations, deliberations, and the like.

For the rich man in Jesus' parable at Luke 12:16-20; I would choose ideas, plans, and schemes.

For example: consider all those people who perished in the World Trade Center, and in the Japan and Indonesia tsunamis, and the Haiti earthquake. None of them woke that day planning on it being their last on earth. No, on the contrary; they had people to see, places to go, and things to do: but before the day ended; whatever was on their itinerary lost its importance-- their priorities went right out the window and became no more significant than green cheese on the moon.

All their plans, their dreams, their schedules, their appointments, their schemes, their problems, their ambitions, their loves, and their aspirations went right down the tubes as they were suddenly confronted with a whole new reality to cope with.

The fact is: Ps 146:3-4 doesn't mean that people cease to exist when they die, nor do they lose awareness; no, it only means that whatever was on their minds before they passed away is now null and void.

Take for example Michael Jackson. While working on a new world tour, Jackson died in his sleep. As a result; his tour wrapped on the spot.

When my eldest nephew was paroled from prison, he quit drinking, and began going to college with the goal towards becoming a counselor. For 2½ years all went well. His parole officer was happy, and he was on track and getting good grades. My nephew's future looked assured. And then on the morning of Sept 25, 2015, he dropped dead to the floor of natural causes.

My nephew's passing was a terrible disappointment to everybody; but actually we all kind of expected it. He was grossly overweight, had high blood pressure and high cholesterol, rarely exercised, and smoked. But the point is; my nephew's dream ended just as abruptly as flipping a light switch. And all of our hopes for his success ended the same way, viz: our thoughts perished right along with his.

Death is the mortal enemy of human ambitions. It often casts its long shadow when they set about planning their lives. The Scottish poet Robert Burns noticed that life sometimes throws a curve ball that makes all your careful preparations strike out instead of getting you on base.

He was working one day plowing in the field and uprooted a mouse's underground nest who was all set for the oncoming winter. The mouse had picked a fallow field as the site for its winter retreat thinking it would be safe and snug; unmolested during the cold. But it didn't (or maybe we should say it couldn't) know the workings of powers higher than itself-- in this case, farmers and their machinery.

Mousie, you are not alone in proving foresight may be vain.
The best laid schemes of mice and men go often askew,
And leave us naught but grief and pain for promised joy.


TALLY UPDATE: 624 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 38,007,216 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #109 on: Tue May 19, 2020 - 14:33:58 »



Offline RB

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #110 on: Wed May 20, 2020 - 04:45:46 »
The Hebrew word for "thoughts" in Ps 146:3-4 is 'eshtonah (esh-to naw') which has nothing to do with either existence or awareness. The word is very ambiguous and refers to quite a variety of meanings to choose from; including, but not limited to: concerns, anticipations, conceptions, opinions, imaginations, visualizations, ideas, epiphanies, plans, schemes, fantasies, arguments, aspirations, deliberations, and the like.

For the rich man in Jesus' parable at Luke 12:16-20; I would choose ideas, plans, and schemes.
While I may agree with what you said in your post, it does not prove your position on a burning hell at this present time where the wicked go at death according to your teaching. The wicked are in a state of silence, darkness, and unconsciousness, unaware of earth's activity..... there until the resurrection of the last day when they SHALL come forth to be judged and THEN cast into the lake of fire, which IS the SECOND and final death for them. 
Quote
TALLY UPDATE: 624 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 38,007,216 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
I can give you the exact total~"0". Sir, you may mean well and be very sincere, yet you have been deceived by an old doctrine of Catholicism that they invented to boost their coffers~and it worked and still does very well.
« Last Edit: Wed May 20, 2020 - 04:48:37 by RB »

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #110 on: Wed May 20, 2020 - 04:45:46 »

Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #111 on: Sat May 23, 2020 - 13:51:50 »
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Solomon's man under the sun feels there is no conscious existence for people beyond the death of their body; whereas Christ taught that one's soul doesn't necessarily perish with the body.

Matt 10:28 . . Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul.

According to Gen 2:7, the soul is what makes people sentient beings. Christ assures us that part of human existence is able to survive the death of the body; but it's still vulnerable to termination.

Matt 10:28 . . Be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in hell.


FAQ: If the soul and the body are destroyed in hell; what's left?

A: The spirit.

According to Gen 2:7, the spirit is the life force that makes otherwise inanimate materials sentient.

Christ's spirit survived the death of his body.

Luke 23:46 . . Jesus called out with a loud voice: Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit.

People's spirit is just as much a component of their human existence as the soul and the body; for example people currently survive in heaven without a body by means of their spirit.

Heb 12:23 . . the spirits of righteous men made perfect


FAQ: Since the soul doesn't necessarily perish with the body, then what became of Christ's soul when he passed away on the cross?

A: It was taken to Hades. (Acts 2:22-32)

FAQ: Isn't that where the rich man ended up per Luke 16:19-31?

A: Back in Jesus' day, Hades was the afterlife destination of all the dead: the young and the old, and the bad and the good. Abraham and Lazarus were in Hades too, but of course the accommodations in their sector were much better than the rich man's-- they at least had access to water; he doesn't.

TALLY UPDATE: 628 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 38,250,852 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #112 on: Thu May 28, 2020 - 21:28:16 »
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The rich man of Luke 16:19-31 is spoken of as dead, buried, and relocated in a place called-- in the Greek --Haides; and within earshot right across from him are Abraham and Lazarus. (Luke 16:22-23)

Christ is spoken of as dead, buried, and relocated in the very same place as the rich man. (Acts 2:25-31)

Now the interesting thing is: when Jesus passed away on the cross, he entrusted his spirit to God (Luke 23:46) but it wasn't his spirit that went to Hades, rather, it was his soul. (Acts 2:27 and Acts 2:31)

(The Greek word for "spirit" is pneuma, and the Greek word for soul is psuche)

So Christ's afterlife experience was different for the various aspects of his being; viz: his spirit went in one direction while his soul went another, and his body yet another.

From that I think we can safely conclude that the rich man was in Haides by means of his soul, and buried means of his body; while the question remains where went the man's spirit? To whom was that entrusted if not to God?


TALLY UPDATE: 633 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 38,555,397 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
_
« Last Edit: Thu May 28, 2020 - 21:31:14 by NyawehNyoh »

Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #113 on: Sat Jun 20, 2020 - 12:31:28 »
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Matt 5:8 . . Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.

A rough-hewn definition of "pure in heart" is when someone is the same on the inside as they are on the outside; which is just the opposite of dissembling; defined as: to put on a false appearance, i.e. conceal facts, intentions, or feelings under some pretense.

Dissembling is a very common form of dishonesty which is practiced by just about everybody at one time or another. Most of us do not always want others to know what we are actually thinking and/or feeling about certain things. The very opposite of that is transparency, which most of us want from others, but prefer not to reciprocate with transparency of our own.

Here's a really good example of someone pure in heart.

"When Jesus saw Nathanael approaching, he said of him, "Here is a true Israelite, in whom there is nothing false." (John 1:47)

Jesus was pure in heart too.

"No deceit was found in his mouth." (1Pet 2:22)

I think we may safely assume there are no exceptions to the sixth beatitude, i.e. no one is exempt; in other words: sincerity and forthrightness aren't optional with God; they're mandatory

"Who may ascend into the hill of The Lord? And who may stand in His holy place? He who has . . . a pure heart . . . he shall receive a blessing from The Lord." (Ps 24:3-5)


TALLY UPDATE: 656 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 39,956,304 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #113 on: Sat Jun 20, 2020 - 12:31:28 »

Offline EYRose

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #114 on: Sat Jun 20, 2020 - 13:41:01 »
nyawhenyouno how to read the Bible you may come to understand the difference between parable and truth.
Lazarus and rich man was parable.
we know this because when a person dies all thoughts perish.


Offline Choir Loft

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #115 on: Sat Jun 27, 2020 - 11:06:34 »
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According to Jesus Christ's testimony as a credible expert witness in all matters pertaining to the afterlife; most of the world's responsible souls haven't been making it to safety when they cross over to the other side.

Luke 13:22-24 . . And he went through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem. Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

Matt 7:13-14 . . Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Matt 22:14 . . For many are called, but few are chosen.

Webster's defines "many" as consisting of, or amounting to, a large but indefinite number; while "few" is defined as consisting of, or amounting to, only a small number; viz: relative to many then, few is the lesser. Bear with me while I flesh this out.

According to the US Census Bureau: as of Sep 03, 2018 @ 09:44 pm New York Time, the United States population was approximately 328,503,154 with a death rate of approximately one every 12 seconds; which translates to an average of 7,200 American deaths of all ages, races, and genders during just one 24-hour calendar day.

According to 2009 US Census data; roughly 27.3% of America's daily deaths are under the age of 19, which would indicate that approximately 5,234 of the current daily death rate per 24 hours are adults.

Giving the "many" the benefit of the doubt by limiting their maximum percentage to 51%, would indicate a minimum of 2,669 American adults transferring to perdition every day: which translates to roughly 111 per hour.

That's a very conservative estimate as Christ didn't really specify exact percentages to represent the quantities of "few" and "many". But just think: by the time CBS completes its half hour evening news report, a bare-bones minimum of 55 Americans become new arrivals in the fiery sector of the netherworld.

Using the ratio of 2,669 condemned souls per 328,506,154 population: computing the number of condemned souls worldwide from a currently estimated global population of 7,496,798,873 people, would suggest something like 60,909 new arrivals in the fiery sector of the netherworld every 24 hours; which translates to approximately 2,538 global arrivals every sixty minutes on the clock.

That rate would fill Yankee Stadium's 51,800 seats to capacity in roughly 20 hours and 24 minutes. In other words: if the world's daily number of condemned souls started filing into the stadium at 06:00 am this morning, then by 02:24 am tomorrow, the stadium would be full to capacity.

Christmas and New Year are even worse. A study done of 26 years of death certificates shows that coronary fatalities are, on average, 11.9% higher on those days than any other days of the year; with non-heart deaths spiking to 12.2% higher.

The hell I'm describing never closes; no, not at all: it's open for business 24/7/365 nonstop and indifferent to global warming, Wall Street crashes, massive layoffs, outsourcing, school shootings, terrorism, tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, storm surges, nuclear meltdowns, air, water, and soil pollution, a mission to Mars, freeway pile-ups, brown-outs, threatened species, the price of oil, LGBT marriage, student debt, GMO, trade deficits, Obamacare, protests, North Korean nukes, Federal debt, factory recalls, overpopulation, desertification, genocides, revolutions, civil wars, acid rain, road rage, oil spills, conscious decoupling, ISIS, blood diamonds, fracking, twerking, and/or President Donald Trump's tweets.

If classical Christianity's perception of Jesus Christ and the hereafter is correct; then it's apparent that people never stop cascading into the netherworld's dungeons in an endless procession like the unbelievable millions of poultry broilers passing annually through Tyson chicken-processing plants on their way to Wendy's, McDonalds, Carl's Junior, Jack in the Box, Burger King, Chic-fil-A, KFC, A&W, Arby's, Dairy Queen, Taco Bell, et al; and to supermarkets and restaurants all over the USA and wherever else Tyson vends its meats. The slaughtering and the butchering never stop.
_


A nice exercise in statistical analysis of the American death toll.  Your local mortuary would be proud of you except that there is one major flaw in your argument.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS HELL.

The Bible doesn't certify it, admit to it, or even remotely hint at such a dimension.

The Bible DOES say that the just will inherit eternal life.  It says so quite often in fact.   There is no place in the Bible where it states unequivocally that SINNERS inherit eternal life - even in an underworld torture chamber.

God kills. God does not torture.

The idea that Jesus owns and operates a dungeon of horrors in the bowels of the earth was developed to its modern mythical status by the Roman Catholic church.  Specifically the book THE DIVINE COMEDY written by Dante Alighieri is the transmission device upon which much of the popular myth is based.   The book is divided into three sections; Inferno, Purgatorio & Paradiso.  There are descriptive illustrations at the beginning of each chapter of each section.  The popular science fiction movie THE LAST JEDI even features a scene taken out of Dante's Inferno.  It's not in the Bible, however.  Then again nobody reads God's book, so who cares - right??

The modern English word 'hell' is derived from Old English "hel,helle" (first attested around 725 AD to refer to a nether world of the dead) reaching into the Anglo-Saxon pagan period.ˇ - Wikipedia

Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. - Ecclesiastes 3:19

The Bible says ONLY GOD has immortal life.

"who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light" - 1 Tim 6:16

In its first pages the Bible makes a clear statement about death and life and God's spirit in the midst of it all.

Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; - Genesis 6:3a

According to the Bible, there is nothing about man that survives physical death.  There is no eternal spark.   Man dies.  That's it and that's all.

BUT

The good news is that God has chosen to grant of His immortal life to those who accept Him and His lordship in their lives.

SINNERS, who continually reject God's offer of forgiveness and immortality, suffer the Second Death mentioned in the book of Revelation.   Sentence to fire means total destruction.  Nowhere in nature does ANY object survive intense heat.  Fire is used by the Bible to describe annihilation and absolute deletion rather than eternal torment.   The example of Sodom & Gomorrah is of paramount importance.   The five cities of the kingdom of Sodom were destroyed by fire.  Not even ashes remained of the destruction visited upon the 5 cities, though if one visits the site today a mysterious sulfurous residue can be discovered.

The idea of spiritual permanence began in ancient Egypt and Babylon.  The pagan myths were adopted by the Greeks and Roman culture.  As the Catholic church adopted much of its pagan culture from ancient Rome, it too adopted and refined the idea of eternal torment as a form of fear mongering to gain and keep members within its domain.  A good example is the financial advantage gleaned from the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory (also nonexistent).  One prays or bribes God to separate a SINNER from an unpleasant afterlife.  It is entirely unBiblical, but nobody seems to care.  Today, protestant churches march in lock step with Roman Catholic teaching.  Thus the "doctrines of demons" spoken of in 1 Timothy 4:1 have come to be an accepted form of Christian ideology.   Nevertheless it is not so.

There is no hell, but there is a total and final destruction.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
« Last Edit: Sat Jun 27, 2020 - 11:18:28 by Choir Loft »

Offline skeeter

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #116 on: Sat Jun 27, 2020 - 14:31:33 »
A nice exercise in statistical analysis of the American death toll.  Your local mortuary would be proud of you except that there is one major flaw in your argument.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS HELL.

The Bible doesn't certify it, admit to it, or even remotely hint at such a dimension.

The Bible DOES say that the just will inherit eternal life.  It says so quite often in fact.   There is no place in the Bible where it states unequivocally that SINNERS inherit eternal life - even in an underworld torture chamber.

God kills. God does not torture.

The idea that Jesus owns and operates a dungeon of horrors in the bowels of the earth was developed to its modern mythical status by the Roman Catholic church.  Specifically the book THE DIVINE COMEDY written by Dante Alighieri is the transmission device upon which much of the popular myth is based.   The book is divided into three sections; Inferno, Purgatorio & Paradiso.  There are descriptive illustrations at the beginning of each chapter of each section.  The popular science fiction movie THE LAST JEDI even features a scene taken out of Dante's Inferno.  It's not in the Bible, however.  Then again nobody reads God's book, so who cares - right??

The modern English word 'hell' is derived from Old English "hel,helle" (first attested around 725 AD to refer to a nether world of the dead) reaching into the Anglo-Saxon pagan period.ˇ - Wikipedia

Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. - Ecclesiastes 3:19

The Bible says ONLY GOD has immortal life.

"who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light" - 1 Tim 6:16

In its first pages the Bible makes a clear statement about death and life and God's spirit in the midst of it all.

Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; - Genesis 6:3a

According to the Bible, there is nothing about man that survives physical death.  There is no eternal spark.   Man dies.  That's it and that's all.

BUT

The good news is that God has chosen to grant of His immortal life to those who accept Him and His lordship in their lives.

SINNERS, who continually reject God's offer of forgiveness and immortality, suffer the Second Death mentioned in the book of Revelation.   Sentence to fire means total destruction.  Nowhere in nature does ANY object survive intense heat.  Fire is used by the Bible to describe annihilation and absolute deletion rather than eternal torment.   The example of Sodom & Gomorrah is of paramount importance.   The five cities of the kingdom of Sodom were destroyed by fire.  Not even ashes remained of the destruction visited upon the 5 cities, though if one visits the site today a mysterious sulfurous residue can be discovered.

The idea of spiritual permanence began in ancient Egypt and Babylon.  The pagan myths were adopted by the Greeks and Roman culture.  As the Catholic church adopted much of its pagan culture from ancient Rome, it too adopted and refined the idea of eternal torment as a form of fear mongering to gain and keep members within its domain.  A good example is the financial advantage gleaned from the Catholic doctrine of Purgatory (also nonexistent).  One prays or bribes God to separate a SINNER from an unpleasant afterlife.  It is entirely unBiblical, but nobody seems to care.  Today, protestant churches march in lock step with Roman Catholic teaching.  Thus the "doctrines of demons" spoken of in 1 Timothy 4:1 have come to be an accepted form of Christian ideology.   Nevertheless it is not so.

There is no hell, but there is a total and final destruction.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft... 
I find the word hell in my bible.

what's the name on the front of the book you call your bible?

« Last Edit: Sat Jun 27, 2020 - 14:35:04 by skeeter »

Online NyawehNyoh

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #117 on: Sat Jun 27, 2020 - 20:32:00 »
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I obtain quite a bit of useful information from YouTube; for example how to replace a microwave oven's motor, resolve a computer issue, and/or adjust an electric guitar's intonation.

I also tour the world with YouTube, visiting amazing man-made wonders and natural wonders too. I will likely never travel and get to see those wonders for myself as they really are before I'm dead; but out ahead is coming a one-thousand year era on Earth wherein I've no doubt there will be plenty of opportunity to see everything in the next life that I missed in this one.

Rev 20:6 . . Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

I suspect that God is keeping a massive, fully comprehensive library that can satisfy all my curiosity-- an archive of information far exceeding the contents of the great library of Alexandria. For example: how did the ancient Egyptians build the pyramids? How did the people of Easter Island move those massive stone heads into position? Is there an end to space; and if so, what's on the other side? Things like that; but also nature's secrets too. How did nature fashion those remarkable rock formations in Utah? Or carve out the Grand Canyon?

There are many mysteries like those that I sincerely hope to find answers to some day. But people in hell won't be allowed access to God's library. They will never get answers to their deepest questions about the cosmos; nor be allowed to travel to all the exotic places on Earth that they missed in this life before passing on to the next.

Another benefit to the coming era is safety. I will have nothing to fear from the animal kingdom like I do now, and plus; those of us who make the cut will be immortal; so we won't fear heights, nor speed, nor any other risk. I love to explore, but don't like to explore places that might cost me my life, lose an eye, or put me in a wheel chair. Well; in the future, I'll be able to explore every corner of the globe to my heart's content in perfect safety and thoroughly enjoy myself without worrying about hazards associated with the journey like piranha, head hunters, frost bite, hypothermia, violent storms, hijackers, terrorists, bandits, and/or shipwreck.

One thing that prevents many of us from touring the world is old age. Well, diminished capacity will never again be a factor dictating what I can eat and drink, were I can go, nor whether I can make it.

People in hell are not only in terrible discomfort, but they're also missing out on the pleasures of adventure, discovery, and exploration; which are three very stimulating activities that, just about everybody I've ever met would agree, make our existence worthwhile.

Rev 20:5-6 . . But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power.


TALLY UPDATE: 663 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 40,382,667 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #118 on: Sun Jun 28, 2020 - 12:38:22 »
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when a person dies all thoughts perish.

Your opinion is addressed back in reply No.109
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #119 on: Sun Jun 28, 2020 - 13:01:25 »
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Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. - Ecclesiastes 3:19

Some of Solomon's remarks in the book of Ecclesiastes appear to conflict with Christ's teachings in the New Testament. Well; the answer to that is actually pretty simple.

According to 2Tim 3:16, Solomon was inspired to write Ecclesiastes, but the catch is: his comments essentially represent a world view-- a philosophy of life under the sun --rather than a book of either history, revelation, or prophecy.

In other words: Solomon's observations are limited to the scope of empirical evidence and human experience; a perception of reality moderated by what we can see for ourselves going on around us in the physical universe rather than the spiritual-- which is at least one of the reasons why Ecclesiastes appeals to cultists, atheists, and agnostics, et al.

Solomon's world view is punctuated with pessimism; which is basically a mindset inclined to dwell on the negative in human experience rather than the positive. For example:

"You only go around once, so do it with all the gusto you can get!"

That was a Schlitz beer slogan some years ago. It's worldly wisdom thru and thru rather than Christ's. Compare it to a couple of Solomon's remarks:

Ecc 9:5 . . The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.

Ecc 9:10 . . All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.

That wisdom reflects Schlitz beer wisdom, i.e. it's earthly wisdom rather than the wisdom that comes from above.

Solomon was a very wise man; in point of fact, the brightest intellectual of his day. But Solomon's knowledge and experience were limited. He didn't know everything there is to know, nor had he seen everything there is to see, nor been everywhere there is to go. Whereas Christ's knowledge is extremely vast.

Col 2:3 . . Carefully concealed in him are all the treasures of wisdom and of knowledge.

Christ, in his capacity as the Word, created everything existing in the current cosmos.

John 1:3 . . All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence.

So then, it only stands to reason that Christ would know more about the afterlife than Solomon because the Word has actually seen it for himself, whereas Solomon didn't see anything beyond the grave when he penned Ecclesiastes.

A good rule of thumb to apply when the teachings of Solomon and Jesus contradict each other, is to keep in mind that Jesus is Solomon's superior, viz: Jesus' teachings trump Solomon's.

Matt 12:42 . .The queen of the south will be raised up in the judgment with this generation and will condemn it; because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon, but, look! something more than Solomon is here.

John 3:31 . . He that comes from above is over all others.

And Jesus comes highly recommended too.

Matt 17:5 . . This is My son, the beloved, whom I have approved; listen to him.

So then, when encountering remarks in the book of Ecclesiastes that are out of step with Jesus' teachings in the New Testament; my unsolicited spiritual counseling is to ignore the world's view of the afterlife and go with the wisdom of "My son".

John 8:12 . . I am the light of the world. He that follows me will by no means walk in darkness, but will possess the light of life.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #120 on: Sat Jul 04, 2020 - 14:19:57 »
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The apostle Paul, writing to Christians in the ancient city of Colossi, said:

Col 3:9-10 . . Do not lie to each other since you have taken off your old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator.


NOTE: It's interesting that the Colossian believers were lying to each other, and no doubt would have continued had not Paul commanded them to stop it.

Humanity's original self began its created existence in the image of God (Gen 1:26-27). In other words; Adam started off as an honest man. Clearly then; dishonesty does not reflect the image of God, rather, it projects humanity's own image.

Humanity's original self wasn't created bullet-proof, so to speak. It was corruptible (Eph 4:22). Were that not true, we'd all be honest men rather than a pack of liars, deceivers, beguilers, and dissemblers.

The Greek word for "renewed" is anakainoo (an-ak-ahee-no'-o) which means: to renovate; defined by Webster's as: (1) to restore to a former better state (as by cleaning, repairing, or rebuilding), and (2) to restore to life, vigor, or activity, i.e. revive. In other words: regenerate.

That word anakainoo appears in only one other place in the entire New Testament at 2Cor 4:16, which says:

"Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day."

Quite a few elderly Christians, with years of life and personal experience under their belts, can attest to the truth of Col 3:10 and 2Cor 4:16

This relates to one of the tragedies of Hell. People down there never gave God an opportunity to overhaul their spiritual condition; so now they're no better as persons in the afterlife than they were in this life. After all is said and done-- the big judgment of Rev 20:11-15 is completed, and the new cosmos of Rev 21:1 is up and running --Christ caps everything by announcing:

Rev 22:10 . . Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile.

In other words: bad people who end up in the ultimate Hell will remain just as bad there as they were here.


TALLY UPDATE: 670 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 40,809,030 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #121 on: Sun Jul 12, 2020 - 22:09:04 »
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"Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." (Matt 22:36-40)

The Greek verb for "love" in that passage is agapao (ag-ap-ah'-o) which doesn't necessarily imply either affection and/or fondness. It's more about the way we treat our fellow men rather than our personal feelings about them. This is the kind of love that we ought to be extending to everyone-- friend, foe, and stranger alike. It's the very same love that Jesus taught in Matt 5:44 which reads:

"You have heard that it was said: You shall love your neighbor, and hate your enemy. But I say to you, love your enemies,"

In other words; you don't especially have to like your neighbors and your enemies, but you do have to be courteous, kind, charitable, tolerant, patient, diplomatic, tactful, gentle, reasonable, fair, deferent, cordial, genial, affable, sociable, helpful, thoughtful, sympathetic, considerate, and cooperative, etc. And of course those all apply to the way that people associate with God too because the same Greek verb is used of loving God as loving one's neighbors and enemies.

The above tells me that quite a few people are on the road to Hell simply because their manners are uncivil, and insufferable, with both God and Man, viz: they not only aren't nice to their fellow men, but they aren't even nice to God-- they don't care about marginalizing Him, tuning Him out, insulting Him, chafing Him, and/or hurting His feelings. In other words: the most important of all the commandments bounces off their thick skulls like a banana thrown at a Russian tank.


TALLY UPDATE: 678 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 41,296,302 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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« Last Edit: Fri Jul 31, 2020 - 09:30:26 by NyawehNyoh »

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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #122 on: Sun Jul 26, 2020 - 19:12:20 »
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When someone is on their deathbed, in their last moments, sometimes they begin to perceive that Hell is more than just academic; they instinctively know it's coming and likely to become very concerned about ending up there. In moments like that, people don't need religion, no, they need a knight in shining armor, so to speak, and it so happens there's one available; and he's God-given.

Luke 2:8-12 . .And there were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night. An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified.

. . . But the angel said to them; "Don't be afraid. I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people. Today, in the town of David, a savior has been born to you; he is Messiah, the Lord."

The angel announced the birth of a savior; defined by Webster's as one who rescues. We've all seen examples-- lifeguards, firemen, cops, emergency medical teams, Coast Guard units, snow patrols, and mountain rescue teams. Rescue workers typically save people in distress who are facing imminent death and/or grave danger and utterly helpless to do anything about it.

In other words: Jesus Christ is a lifeline, so to speak, that God is all set to throw to anyone and everyone for whom destiny in Hell is a foregone conclusion.

John 3:14-17 . . As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up; that whoever believes may in him have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

The incident to which Christ referred is located at Num 21:5-9. Long story short: Moses' people became weary of eating manna all the time at every meal. But instead of courteously, and diplomatically, petitioning their divine benefactor for a different diet, they became hostile and confrontational; angrily demanding tastier food.

In response to their insolence, and their ingratitude for His providence; God sent a swarm of deadly poisonous vipers among them; which began striking people; and every strike was 100% fatal, no exceptions.

After a number of people died, the rest came to their senses and begged Moses to intercede. In reply; The Lord instructed Moses to cobble a replica of the vipers and hoist it up on a pole in plain view so that everyone dying from snakebite could look to the image for relief.

The key issue here is that the replica was the only God-given remedy for the people's bites-- not sacrifices and offerings, not tithing, not church attendance, not scapulars, not confession, not holy days of obligation, not the Sabbath, not the golden rule, not charity, not Bible study and/or Sunday school, not self denial, not vows of poverty, not the Ten Commandments, not one's religion of choice, no; not even prayers. The replica was it; nothing else would suffice to save their lives.

As an allegory, Moses' replica indicates that Christ's crucifixion for the sins of the world is the only God-given rescue from the wrath of God; and when people accept it, then according to John 3:14-17 and John 5:24, they qualify for safety. Those who reject his crucifixion as the only God-given rescue from a fate worse than death, are already on the docket to face it.

John 3:18 . .Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

» His son's "name" in this case is relative to Moses' replica of the deadly snakes.


TALLY UPDATE: 692 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 42,149,028 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #123 on: Fri Jul 31, 2020 - 09:35:31 »
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Abraham's steward, depicted in the twenty-fourth chapter of Genesis, is one of the most pious men in the Bible; you couldn't ask for a better role model when it comes to speaking with God.

All the prayers I learned as a child were rote; just a memorized litany of chant-like mantras. The first time I overheard someone pray candidly-- outspokenly, and conversationally --like that steward, the experience was very moving.


TALLY UPDATE: 697 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 42,453,573 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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Re: Hell's Daily Tally
« Reply #124 on: Mon Aug 10, 2020 - 22:08:49 »
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Matt 19:17 . . And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments

Seeing as none but God are good, then it's obvious that none but God can enter into life by means of goodness. However, if someone would like to give it a try anyway in spite of the fact that failure is a foregone conclusion; then Jesus suggests they begin their quest with the commandments.


TALLY UPDATE: 707 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 43,062,663 arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 03, 2018.
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