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Author Topic: Was Jesus Always in The Perfect Will of the Father?  (Read 497 times)
gospel
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« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2009, 01:54:45 PM »

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There is no health, wealth or prosperity.Not till we get to heaven.


But Jesus said heaven is in you ...was He wrong?

nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’ because the kingdom of God is within you.”
 Luke 17:21

He also said when people are healed tell them the its because the Kingdom is near


Heal the sick who are there and tell them, 'The kingdom of God is near you.
' Luke 10:9

To Jesus healing and the Kingdom were synonymous

Jesus was going throughout all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every kind of disease and every kind of sickness among the people. Matthew 4:23


Obviously health is here and available now because God is here NOW. God the Holy Spirit is here now. God the Father and God the Son the very Jesus you speak of lives within the hearts of each and every believer

the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:17

I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you
. John 14:18

On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. John 14:20

know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which
is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1 Corinthians 6:19

Quote
But in the meantime we do have the Keys to the Kingdom treasure and power. and they don't work in a supernatural fashion for worldly things...and greed always makes you lose the keys.


Wow that's some scary stuff!

If as you say we have keys now here on earth then ...What in God's name are the keys for?

And you say they don't work in a supernatural fashion? That must mean you have an actual set of physical keys huh?  Pondering  

Sorry but I think just maybe the keys are supernatural

Let me ask you this

Does the devil work supernaturally?

Surely you realize

Salvation is supernatural, Forgiveness is supernatural and the Very Word of God itself is the supernatural Power of God!

 and why does God say

The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. 2 Corinthians 10:4

Is not divine power also supernatural power?  Reading

For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Ephesians 6:12

It takes money to build hospitals, to take care of widows and orphans. It takes money to to assist Katrina hurricane victims, Tsunami flood victims abroad and homeless people here in America.

Sorry but poor Christians can't do any of that!
In reality poor Christians, in fact poor people need the help of Christians who are blessed in abundance and have the wherewithal to help others    

Its sad that some people would argue so much in defense of suffering, death, sickness and poverty as if those things were something desirable to cling to and as if they were part of Gods Will and Plan for man  Doh!

For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. Jeremiah 29:11
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"For I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole purpose of God. Acts 20:27
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« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2009, 01:54:45 PM »

 
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gospel
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« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2009, 02:02:43 PM »

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My son, be attentive to my words; incline your ear to My sayings. Let them not escape from your sight; keep them within your heart.
For they are life to all those who find them, and healing to all their flesh.  -Pro.4:20-22

Luke 9:11, Mat. 9:22, Mark. 5:34, Mar.10:52 Lk.17:19 also Luke 18:42
John 7:43

"And His name, by faith in His name, has made this man strong whom you see and know, and the faith that is through Jesus has given this man perfect health in the presants of you all."  -Acts 3:16

also see: Acts 4:22, Acts 9:34 and Acts 14:9
And Rom 8:11, 1Cr. 12:9 and 12:28  As well as 3John 1:2

Just to name a few. oh yes, Gal. 2:6

Psa. 103:2-5

Excellent post Born to Reign as you said that list only includes a few of the promises of God
 Amen!
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« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2009, 02:02:43 PM »

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Cally
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« Reply #32 on: July 27, 2009, 02:09:28 PM »

Along the same lines, something also puzzles me about today's terminology about Psych disorders.

The Gospels say that many people brought those tormented by spirits--that is, it was a fairly commonplace thing. Who would that be today, if not those locked in a psychiatric ward? (By the way, I happen to think that some psychology is very useful)
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I am in need of being reminded of things that God has already taught me.

Trust me--I'm not like most people. 90% of the time, I'm straight-faced and it really isn't personal.
gospel
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« Reply #33 on: July 27, 2009, 02:19:11 PM »

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Along the same lines, something also puzzles me about today's terminology about Psych disorders.
The Gospels say that many people brought those tormented by spirits--that is, it was a fairly commonplace thing. Who would that be today, if not those locked in a psychiatric ward? (By the way, I happen to think that some psychology is very useful)

I believe all dis-ease, not at ease, lacking "Shalom" wholeness and peace whether in body or mind have its source in some degree, to the unseen spiritual realm

As you so aptly pointed out Jesus always dealt with what we would consider mental disorders in that manner

For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. Colosians 1:16

while we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen; for the things which are seen are temporal, but the things which are not seen are eternal. 2 Corinthians 4:18
« Last Edit: July 27, 2009, 02:42:28 PM by gospel » Logged

"For I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole purpose of God. Acts 20:27
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« Reply #34 on: July 27, 2009, 02:53:51 PM »

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There is no health, wealth or prosperity.Not till we get to heaven.


But Jesus said heaven is in you ...was He wrong?

nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’ because the kingdom of God is within you.”
 Luke 17:21

He also said when people are healed tell them the its because the Kingdom is near


Heal the sick who are there and tell them, 'The kingdom of God is near you.
' Luke 10:9

To Jesus healing and the Kingdom were synonymous

Jesus was going throughout all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every kind of disease and every kind of sickness among the people. Matthew 4:23


Obviously health is here and available now because God is here NOW. God the Holy Spirit is here now. God the Father and God the Son the very Jesus you speak of lives within the hearts of each and every believer

the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:17

I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you
. John 14:18

On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. John 14:20

know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which
is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1 Corinthians 6:19

Quote
But in the meantime we do have the Keys to the Kingdom treasure and power. and they don't work in a supernatural fashion for worldly things...and greed always makes you lose the keys.


Wow that's some scary stuff!

If as you say we have keys now here on earth then ...What in God's name are the keys for?

And you say they don't work in a supernatural fashion? That must mean you have an actual set of physical keys huh?  Pondering  

Sorry but I think just maybe the keys are supernatural

Let me ask you this

Does the devil work supernaturally?

Surely you realize

Salvation is supernatural, Forgiveness is supernatural and the Very Word of God itself is the supernatural Power of God!

 and why does God say

The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. 2 Corinthians 10:4

Is not divine power also supernatural power?  Reading

For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Ephesians 6:12

It takes money to build hospitals, to take care of widows and orphans. It takes money to to assist Katrina hurricane victims, Tsunami flood victims abroad and homeless people here in America.

Sorry but poor Christians can't do any of that!
In reality poor Christians, in fact poor people need the help of Christians who are blessed in abundance and have the wherewithal to help others    

Its sad that some people would argue so much in defense of suffering, death, sickness and poverty as if those things were something desirable to cling to and as if they were part of Gods Will and Plan for man  Doh!

For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. Jeremiah 29:11

The Keys are for access into the treasure house of God's riches and power. All of this is at our desposal. There are no literal keys.

God wants his ecclesia here. Understanding the principle of what he was saying when Jesus passed out the access to the storehouse is every bit crucial to using any of the treasures within. Building the church is exactly what God desires.

One of those things that you either understand or you don't. I have seen hundreds never gain a clue as to how or why they were successful in church planting.

As well as I have seen hundreds fail at church planting...or even growing because it was all about them and their ministry. Pride is a horrible thing.

Ever hear of Todd Bentley?
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« Reply #35 on: July 27, 2009, 03:04:56 PM »

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The Keys are for access into the treasure house of God's riches and power. All of this is at our desposal. There are no literal keys.

Exactly ...therefore the keys are supernatural!

So access to them is also by supernatural means.... by Grace through Faith

Fallen ministries and ministers is another topic altogether and I really don't see what that has to do with the Will and Intent of God except that we have to use discernment in regards to who we follow.

One man's failure doesn't make Gods desire Will or Intent null and void


Its just like non believers always point out the flaws of Born Again Believers as if that's proof Christianity is no good

But the flaws of Born Again Believers do not discount the Truth of Jesus and the Gospel of Christ

Same holds true for fallen leaders.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2009, 05:27:14 PM by gospel » Logged

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« Reply #35 on: July 27, 2009, 03:04:56 PM »

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Cally
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« Reply #36 on: July 27, 2009, 03:12:30 PM »

Jesus was the agent by which creation was accomplished.

Meaning that he was immensely powerful, the maker of all riches, smarter than any group of our best and brightest minds, but He used none of that to gain immense popularity, riches, or power.

Instead He took up a simple, small, and insignificant position. No money, power, or popularity. His home is in Heaven...not here on earth.

In the first covenant there needed to be a people for Jesus to be born in and so because of the promise made to Abraham the covenant included wealth, health, and prosperity for following the Law. Now, with the New Covenant the results are much different for following the Covenant.

There is no health, wealth or prosperity.

Not till we get to heaven.

But in the meantime we do have the Keys to the Kingdom treasure and power. and they don't work in a supernatural fashion for worldly things...and greed always makes you lose the keys.



Matthew:
8:16 When evening came, they brought to him many possessed with demons. He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were sick;
8:17 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through Isaiah the prophet, saying: "He took our infirmities, and bore our diseases."{Isaiah 53:4}


Miraculous healing was one of the purposes of Christ and still is, since Isaiah says "our" infirmities and not just the people Jesus got around to healing, as miraculous signs.

Basically Christ wants us to be FULFILLED. He wants to restore us to who we really are, minus all corruption.

As for us, seek first the kingdom of heaven and all these things will be added unto you.
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I am in need of being reminded of things that God has already taught me.

Trust me--I'm not like most people. 90% of the time, I'm straight-faced and it really isn't personal.
gospel
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« Reply #37 on: July 27, 2009, 04:23:19 PM »

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Matthew:
8:16 When evening came, they brought to him many possessed with demons. He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were sick;
8:17 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through Isaiah the prophet, saying: "He took our infirmities, and bore our diseases."{Isaiah 53:4}

Miraculous healing was one of the purposes of Christ and still is, since Isaiah says "our" infirmities and not just the people Jesus got around to healing, as miraculous signs.
Basically Christ wants us to be FULFILLED. He wants to restore us to who we really are, minus all corruption.
As for us, seek first the kingdom of heaven and all these things will be added unto you.

 Amen!
Hallelujah!!!
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« Reply #38 on: July 27, 2009, 06:45:33 PM »

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Matthew:
8:16 When evening came, they brought to him many possessed with demons. He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were sick;
8:17 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through Isaiah the prophet, saying: "He took our infirmities, and bore our diseases."{Isaiah 53:4}

Miraculous healing was one of the purposes of Christ and still is, since Isaiah says "our" infirmities and not just the people Jesus got around to healing, as miraculous signs.
Basically Christ wants us to be FULFILLED. He wants to restore us to who we really are, minus all corruption.
As for us, seek first the kingdom of heaven and all these things will be added unto you.--Cally


 Amen!
Hallelujah!!!  gospel  Elaine

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« Reply #38 on: July 27, 2009, 06:45:33 PM »

 
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« Reply #39 on: July 27, 2009, 07:13:17 PM »

The problem is us. We cannot imagine someone completely fulfilling the will of God. We have to accept the truth that Jesus fully accomplished everything God sent him to do. It is a part of being justified by faith. Paul's references as well as the others to the work of Christ are very clear. Romans, Corinthians, and so on begin with the work. The beginnings of the letters speak clearly of this.  Paul never implied anything less of the ministry of Jesus Christ. It is our perverted culture and the lies perpetrated by several writers who have degraded the ministry and the person Jesus Christ. Books and movies that spread lies about Christ have corrupted the minds of many.

The church is the failure in following the perfect will of the Father. It is only because of our failures that others may think that Christ or God has failed. God does not fail. God will never compromise what He has promised.  Amen!
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« Reply #39 on: July 27, 2009, 07:13:17 PM »

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