Quote from: 3 Resurrections on Yesterday at 13:43:58
More than having just a thousand years go by of Melchizedek wandering the earth, I see scripture presenting the translated Enoch / Melchizedek, the seventh from Adam, then remaining on this earth until the AD 70 rapture on that year's Pentecost day (according to Daniel's 1,335th day after Jerusalem was surrounded by armies).
Answer from:Wycliffes_Shillelagh « on: Today at 00:56:48 »
That contradicts the text. The Bible says that he "was not." That is the opposite of "remaining on this earth." All of 1Enoch is about Enoch being in the heavens.
The bible says "he was not". But there is certainly no mention that when he was gone he was anywhere else but on earth.
Not to get into that again it is said by some The term taken away (NKJV) or translated (KJV) in Hebrews 11:5 simply means "transferred." Enoch was transferred or conveyed from one place on earth to another to escape violence aimed against him. In this other earthly place, he died like all men. And there is no proof in the four corners of the Biblical Canon... which we know means the English word canon comes from the Greek κανών kanōn, meaning "rule" or "measuring stick".
But Jarrod. When you make this comment....That contradicts the text. The Bible says that he "was not." That is the opposite of "remaining on this earth." All of 1Enoch is about Enoch being in the heavens.
First: just because "he was not" does not mean he was removed from earth. It simply means he could not be seen or found by those that might have been looking for him.
Then you say " All of 1Enoch is about Enoch being in the heavens."
I ask first how many translations of 1 Enoch and others there are.... for I have downloaded just one and the first chapter of
8 verses of my 1 Enoch read....
1. The word of the blessing of Enoch, how he blessed the elect and the righteous, who were to exist in the time of trouble; rejecting all the wicked and ungodly. Enoch, a righteous man, who was (1) with God, answered and spoke, while his eyes were open, and while he saw a holy vision in the heavens. This the angels showed me. Comment....Saw a Holy Vision.... does not require a presence any more then the visions and prophesy
that John saw while on Patmos. He opens his writing with he saw a vision.
2. From them I heard all things, and understood what I saw; that which will not take place in this generation, but in a generation which is to succeed at a distant period, on account of the elect.
3. Upon their account I spoke and conversed with him, who will go forth from his habitation, the Holy and Mighty One, the God of the world: Now we get to some of the important stuff. Enoch is obviously talking of and to Jesus.
4. Who will hereafter tread upon Mount Sinai; appear with his hosts; and be manifested in the strength of his power from heaven.
5.All shall be afraid, and the Watchers be terrified.
6.Great fear and trembling shall seize them, even to the ends of the earth. The lofty mountains shall be troubled, and the exalted hills depressed, melting like a honeycomb in the flame. The earth shall be immerged, and all things which are in it perish; while judgment shall come upon all, even upon all the righteous:
7. But to them shall he give peace: he shall preserve the elect, and towards them exercise clemency.
8.Then shall all belong to God; be happy and blessed; and the splendour of the Godhead shall illuminate them. Comment: This certainly is of things he was shown.... in a vision(s) not in person, for if he was in person when did 1 Enoch get written. and delivered back to earth?
Quote from: 3 Resurrections on Yesterday at 13:43:58Scripture is very clear that Christ - NOT Enoch - was the very first one to stand in God's presence in heaven in a glorified human body. This merited Jesus Christ the title of "the First-begotten". Scripture is also very clear that no one in either a glorified resurrected body (like Lazarus), or a glorified translated body (in Enoch's unique case) could enter heaven's temple and be in God's presence until the seven plagues had been fulfilled and done (Revelation 15:8)
In my Father's house are MANY mansions... not just one singular throne room. I'm not sure why this point is so hard for you. People can go to ONE OF the heavens without going straight into God's presence.
It is difficult for me simply because Daniel, and John were shown things... as was Enoch. No one was needed to be taken off the earth.