author=RB link=topic=105134.msg1055153412#msg1055153412 date=1577095020]
For once I will force you to debate using scriptures in the New Testaments epistles after the death of Jesus Christ.
The religion which preaches that God's Word's can't be trusted unless they were written down after religious men killed Jesus is a phony religion.
Paul instructed us to "Study" the only Scriptures available to Him in his entire life. His letters were not added to the Law and Prophets until long after they were all dead. These are just Biblical Facts.
This is Paul's Teaching Red.
2 Tim. 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived
14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
(Word of God)
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures
, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus
Notice he didn't say words of the Pope, or some worldly recognized "Great Theologian" you pick from the thousands out there. He said "Holy Scriptures", all of which were written down "before" Jesus was killed by men claiming to be God's Children.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God
, and is profitable for doctrine
, for reproof
, for correction
, for instruction in righteousness
17 That the man of God may be perfect
, throughly furnished unto all good works
Do you see Paul's Word's here Red? "ALL SCRIPTURE", not just those words which were not even add to the Holy Scriptures until many years after Paul was dead.
Paul declared to the Jews and the entire World his belief.
Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they (YOU) call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets
You claim to believe Paul's teaching, yet to reject so much of it.
I will listen carefully to any and all scriptures you can provide and those scriptures we will consider which you think binds saints under the New Testament to met on Saturday ONLY, or mainly as the day to worship~ per your many posts.
You are once again, lying. I have never mentioned meeting or gathering together on the Christ's Sabbaths at all, let alone "only". The Sabbath wasn't made for a social get together, or bingo, or pork barbeques, easter egg hunts.
That is the whole "catholic" tradition you promote. I believe that true Believers should prefer one another, help one another, gather together for all manner of reasons. The Apostles gathered to study, and to gather money and supplies for the disciples. The Feast's of the Christ were "Holy Convocations" where like minded believers gathered and reflected on what was to come, like Pentecost.
But none of this has anything to do with the Sanctified Holy, Weekly Sabbath.
Ex. 20:8 Remember the sabbath day
, to keep it holy
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
The Holy Christ, in the Holy Scriptures you have rejected from your religion, the Holy Scriptures which Paul believed in and taught others to "study" also said the following.
Is. 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him
, (The Holy Christ) not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD
; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.
There is no mention here of parties or great social gatherings. And you will not find one post from me that teaches we must all get together on the Christ's Holy Sabbath or else.
What I am opposed to in rejecting the Commandment of the Holy Christ, in favor of some random Pagan High Day that some sun worshipper placed Jesus name on.
The 7th Day of the Week is the Christ's Sabbath. The first day of the week is no sabbath at all. You will not find ONE SCRIPTURE from the entire Bible, old and new testament, that calls the 1st day of the week, the Sabbath. It is a man made High Day, entered into "Christianity" by Constantine, the founder of the Catholic church as we know it today.
To me It's about the warnings of Jesus and His Disciples who warned about "Christians" deceiving "Many". Not Islam, not Atheists, but "Christians". You claim to "believe" in the Christ, but your posts show that you don't. You believe in a religion which uses some of His Words and rejects the rest. That is no different than the Pharisees or the serpent in the very beginning. If you were truly interested in a "debate", you would engage in these topics and examine the warnings. But you seem only interested in justifying your own religious lifestyle.
Which is fine, you are free to preach as you please. But this is a forum which discusses theology, and I am discerning the difference between what the Bible teaches vs. what the varying theologies of the world teaches.
Believers worship God 24/7 not just on Saturday, or Sunday like so many religious people think and practice, maybe you are one of them, I do not know~nevertheless God said that true worshippers worship Him in spirit and truth, without ceasing!
Yes, true "believers" submit themselves to God every day. And pray without ceasing. But this has nothing to do with blatantly rejecting a commandment of God.
Besides, as I said in that post, we DO NOT go to a meeting place to worship God, for God does not dwell in temples made with hands, but in the HEARTS of those that seek them and love him and does his holy will,
Exactly, belonging to some huge social club who provides entertainment one day a week means nothing. But Honoring the Word of God which became Flesh does. And how can I Honor Him if I reject the way in which He instructs me to Honor Him?
Surely flushing HIS Word's down the religious toilet is no way to Honor such a Great God. Rejecting His Word's and Commandments and promoting ancient pagan traditions is no way to Honor the Great God of Abraham.
Truly, for those who deny themselves and Follow Him, His Eternal Truth is Evident. "If you Love Me, Keep My Commandments".
Only hypocrites think that going to a meeting house is well-pleasing to God and is all that they have to do in order to be accepted by Him in that day~
I agree with you 100%.
they are the very ones (among others) that will hear Christ say depart from me ye that worketh iniquity, I never knew you!
Yes, "Ye that work iniquity". Lawlessness. I don't think it is against the laws of God to gather together, but it is iniquity to pick and choose what Commandments of God are worthy of your Honor, and what Commandments of God are not.
Per Matthew 7:21-23[/b].And so should you know if indeed it is taught as you believe "in the New Testament"~please provide proof~at least two or three witnesses, for in the mouth of such shall every truth be established.
I will pick 3 witnesses.
#1. The Christ, The Word of God which Became Flesh, the creator of all things, created for Him and By Him.
Lev. 23:1 And the LORD (The Holy Christ) spake unto Moses, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts
3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
4 These are the feasts of the LORD
, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.
#2. Jesus, the Christ who came to earth as a man, and the Lamb of God.
Matt. 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law
, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.
8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day
Rom. 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:
1 Cor. 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
Col. 2:16 Let no man therefore
judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday
, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days
The rest of your post is the same regurgitated (repeat errors) mess that you bring up without ever analyzing or comprehending what you are saying and what others point out about your corruption of God's truth. You had your chance to take the SAME scriptures that I just took and expounded and do the same, yet you did not even attempt to do so, neither did you take my verse by verse and point out the errors in those verses, which is what any HONEST DEBATE consist of.
I have almost written a book debunking your Constantinian religion.
Prove your case using NEW TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES. Show me where under the New Testament that saints are to keep DAYS, months, years and times, etc. Prove to me and others where in the New Testament are we to OBSERVE days (sabbaths) years, times, etc.
My Jesus is the Christ of the Law and Prophets who came to earth in the Flesh. It was HE that spoke to Cain and Abraham. His Word's are Spirit and they are Life. He lived, walking in His Own Feasts and Sabbaths, not the religious traditions of the mainstream religions of His time. Regarding HIS WORD's in the Holy Scriptures HE DECLARED.
Matt. 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy
, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass
, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled
No matter what the Pope or Oral Roberts preach, the absolute truth is that the Earth Jesus walked, is the SAME Earth that I am walking. Nothing you can say or do will erase this absolute Truth.
No Matter what you or the Pope or Jimmy Swaggart preaches, All of the prophesies pertaining the Messiah, the Christ who became my High Priest, have NOT BEEN Fulfilled.
satan, disguised as a Christian, may deceive you into believing they have, but the absolute Truth is that they have not. I will not reject these absolute Facts just so I can belong to your worldly social club.
Paul also Honored this Same Christ by denying the religious traditions of the Jews, and following the Commandments of God they had rejected.
You do not even understand the reason why there are TWO COVENANTS~I say this based upon your teaching concerning salvation from sin and condemnation. But, for now, let us stay with Use any of Paul's teaching and PROVE YOUR POINT. It is time for you to put up, or shut up! Folks hate barking dogs, who bark JUST TO BE BARKING!
I understand fully that the New Covenant you and Pope Preach, is not the Same Covenant the Christ of the Bible Promised and brought.
I have posted HIS WORDS defining HIS NEW Covenant over and over, and you reject them outright.
Jer. 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel
So here it is Red. Here is the Holy Christ telling this World exactly what HIS NEW Covenant is. All you need now is "Faith" that He isn't lying to us.
After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts
, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
It is the religions of the land which preach Jesus removed His own Commandments. Jesus never did. At least the Jesus of the Bible never did.
On this the entire Word of God agrees.