GCM Home | Your Posts | Rules | DONATE | Bookstore | RSS | Facebook | Twitter | FAQs


Author Topic: Shocking Sermon  (Read 10456 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline James Rondon

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 19760
  • Manna: 1746
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Shocking Sermon
« on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 01:41:32 »
http://media04.sa-media.com/sermons019/52906154239.mp3

Sermon Audio has this to say about this sermon:

Quote
This is a Shockingly Powerful & Biblical message
preached to about 5,000 youth in a day when youth
are appealed to through shallow and worldly means.

At one point in this sermon the 5,000 Youth are
clapping and yelling BUT THEN the preacher makes
a comment that CHANGES THE WHOLE ATMOSPHERE TO
WHERE YOU COULD HAVE HEARD A PIN DROP... As you
can imagine, the preacher was never invited back.

We believe the whole sermon will be a blessing
to many souls. For more info about Paul Washer
go to www.heartcrymissionary.com

Christian Forums and Message Board

Shocking Sermon
« on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 01:41:32 »

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #1 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:28:08 »
Could you give us a hint?

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #1 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:28:08 »

Offline DCR

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11300
  • Manna: 432
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #2 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:49:05 »
I'm about 10 minutes into it.  It's mainly about American Christians being content to just blend into a godless culture.  About nine minutes into it, however, there was a big criticism against the "sinner's prayer", which I found most interesting:

Quote
The greatest heresy in the American Evangelical and Protestant Church is that if you pray and ask Jesus Christ to come into your heart, He will definitely come in.  You will not find that in any place in Scripture, and you will not find that anywhere in Baptist history until about 50 years ago.

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #2 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:49:05 »

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #3 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:51:36 »
I agree with the preacher about the "Sinner's Prayer" among those circles.  Whether the "Sinner's Prayer" or baptism, some folks put their trust in them rather than Christ.

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #3 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 08:51:36 »

Offline mdd344

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3925
  • Manna: 146
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #4 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 10:18:59 »
Very interesting sermon. He mentions many things that are right on target. Some which are not.

He calls "works" 'evidences of faith.' He is making the point that doing as a Christian is neccesary and it is not works theology. He says it is absolutely neccesary. And he is southern Baptist.

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #4 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 10:18:59 »



Offline mdd344

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3925
  • Manna: 146
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #5 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 10:26:14 »
He just said that people live as Christians sometimes act as if Jesus gave no laws at all. He likes law. He also mentioned logic. He has quoted the "if" in 1 John 1:7-9 and has quoted 2 Cor. 13:5. He still hasn't told how to get into Christ. But he has a message that many will think is too hard. But he did it in love. I wonder if all believed it and him?

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #5 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 10:26:14 »

Offline zoonance

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8518
  • Manna: 233
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #6 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 12:24:21 »
Made some great points.  Like most of us, we can begin picking at the details.  Is there a "perfect" sermon?

Offline mandalee65

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 2943
  • Manna: 128
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #7 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 20:47:13 »
Did I understand right that he was talking to kids? I've never heard a sermon aimed at adults that hit that hard.

Offline spurly

  • All glory to God and to Jesus the Son!
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15743
  • Manna: 319
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #8 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 22:10:15 »
Oh that the chuch would begin to live like and for the Lord they profess to follow!  I agree with him especially when he said that there are only two things that will reform the church in America - a love for the Word of God or an intense persecution of the church. 

I pray that the Holy Spirit inside of us will continue to draw us to the one who sends the Spirit!

Christian Forums and Message Board

Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #8 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 22:10:15 »

Offline msbradley

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1938
  • Manna: 153
  • Gender: Female
  • Simply trusting Him
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #9 on: Sat Sep 30, 2006 - 22:48:37 »
I just finished listening to the whole sermon. I love long sermons.
I don't have the knowledge that most of you do, but I thought that sermon was quite moving and real. I'd much rather be told the truth.
I'd love to have to face that kind of teaching everyday rather than the sugar-coated kind anyday.

Offline Dagan

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 181
  • Manna: 12
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #10 on: Sun Oct 01, 2006 - 01:30:44 »
I wish i was preached to like this when i was in youth groups.

Offline msbradley

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1938
  • Manna: 153
  • Gender: Female
  • Simply trusting Him
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #11 on: Sun Oct 01, 2006 - 01:37:22 »
Dagan, is that your real name?

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #12 on: Thu Aug 07, 2008 - 22:17:39 »
I'm about 10 minutes into it.  It's mainly about American Christians being content to just blend into a godless culture.  About nine minutes into it, however, there was a big criticism against the "sinner's prayer", which I found most interesting:

Quote
The greatest heresy in the American Evangelical and Protestant Church is that if you pray and ask Jesus Christ to come into your heart, He will definitely come in.  You will not find that in any place in Scripture, and you will not find that anywhere in Baptist history until about 50 years ago.

Finally watching this on YouTube.  His point on the Sinner's Prayer is something I've long believed.

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #13 on: Thu Aug 07, 2008 - 22:57:24 »
I have actually had people a bit perturbed with me because I told them I hate the Sinner's Prayer.

Offline Terrence

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1258
  • Manna: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #14 on: Thu Aug 07, 2008 - 23:12:41 »
Listen to more Paul Washer sermons...

I thank God for that dude!


Offline JerryW

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
  • Manna: 17
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #15 on: Thu Aug 07, 2008 - 23:17:51 »
The reason people like the "sinner's prayer" is because that is the way the Evangelical Church has taught salvation for many years. The sinner's prayer is not Bibical, neither has it ever saved a single soul! It only has deceived many into thinking they are saved. Their salvation is built on "man's wisdom" and not in the power of the Holy Spirit. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Apostle Paul taught salvation with these words, "repent and believe".  Paul also says "faith comes from hearing".

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #16 on: Thu Aug 07, 2008 - 23:44:43 »
The reason people like the "sinner's prayer" is because that is the way the Evangelical Church has taught salvation for many years. The sinner's prayer is not Bibical, neither has it ever saved a single soul! It only has deceived many into thinking they are saved. Their salvation is built on "man's wisdom" and not in the power of the Holy Spirit. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Apostle Paul taught salvation with these words, "repent and believe".  Paul also says "faith comes from hearing".

I agree, and I equate the five steps as such also.  It is not the Sinner's Prayer or the 5 Steps that save, but Christ who saves us through faith in Him.

The Sinner's Prayer is a sore spot for me, because these folks are my brethren (my traditional brotherhood).  My link to the 5 Steps is through my wife who was raised in "conservative" CofC's.

Offline Bonnie

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8593
  • Manna: 359
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #17 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 06:57:42 »
I've listened to this sermon a couple of times already and I love it.  I believe he is preaching the truth, something we need more of.  Maybe there wouldn't be so much confusion if we had more preachers like him.  I have several of his sermons on my YouTube space and listen to them when I'm hungry to hear the Word.

It's like he said, anyone can repeat a prayer.  But it's takes the drawing power of the Father - urging the individual to repent and believe on Christ to get saved.

I also like that he makes plain that we do have something to do after we are saved.

Offline Terrence

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1258
  • Manna: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #18 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 07:40:31 »
I've listened to this sermon a couple of times already and I love it.  I believe he is preaching the truth, something we need more of.  Maybe there wouldn't be so much confusion if we had more preachers like him.  I have several of his sermons on my YouTube space and listen to them when I'm hungry to hear the Word.

It's like he said, anyone can repeat a prayer.  But it's takes the drawing power of the Father - urging the individual to repent and believe on Christ to get saved.

I also like that he makes plain that we do have something to do after we are saved.

Be careful Bonnie, Paul is Reformed in theology.

Offline Jimbob

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 21536
  • Manna: 439
  • Gender: Male
  • Me fail English? That's unpossible.
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #19 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 07:46:38 »
Be careful, Terrance.  Paul wasn't too much for being labeled.

Offline broach972

  • Defender of the Faith
  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1217
  • Manna: 41
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #20 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 07:55:32 »
I'm about 10 minutes into it.  It's mainly about American Christians being content to just blend into a godless culture.  About nine minutes into it, however, there was a big criticism against the "sinner's prayer", which I found most interesting:

Quote
The greatest heresy in the American Evangelical and Protestant Church is that if you pray and ask Jesus Christ to come into your heart, He will definitely come in.  You will not find that in any place in Scripture, and you will not find that anywhere in Baptist history until about 50 years ago.

He is certainly correct.  Although I would say that it didn't happen just 50 years ago...the roots of this thinking were firmly planted during the Reformation.

Offline Terrence

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1258
  • Manna: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #21 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 07:55:51 »
Be careful, Terrance.  Paul wasn't too much for being labeled.

Dude, my name is like right there. How you misspell it? And whether brother Paul likes labels or not (he says that often), he is still reformed with good theology.

Offline Jimbob

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 21536
  • Manna: 439
  • Gender: Male
  • Me fail English? That's unpossible.
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #22 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:03:20 »
Be careful, Terrance.  Paul wasn't too much for being labeled.

Dude, my name is like right there. How you misspell it? And whether brother Paul likes labels or not (he says that often), he is still reformed with good theology.
Dude, it was a typo.  Dude, ever had one?

Offline Terrence

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1258
  • Manna: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #23 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:04:01 »
Be careful, Terrance.  Paul wasn't too much for being labeled.

Dude, my name is like right there. How you misspell it? And whether brother Paul likes labels or not (he says that often), he is still reformed with good theology.
Dude, it was a typo.  Dude, ever had one?

Not really. ;-)

Offline sopranette

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3775
  • Manna: 107
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #24 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:07:20 »
I don't know.  I guess I'm done with shocking preachers.  They always seem to be inventing stuff that doesn't quite work somehow.  I would just rather have a preacher calmly and patiently explain each verse as we go along.

love,

Sopranette

Offline Dennis

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3869
  • Manna: 116
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #25 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:08:12 »
Maybe "Dude" is a good substitute.

Offline Dennis

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3869
  • Manna: 116
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #26 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:08:54 »
I don't know.  I guess I'm done with shocking preachers.  They always seem to be inventing stuff that doesn't quite work somehow.  I would just rather have a preacher calmly and patiently explain each verse as we go along.

love,

Sopranette
Going verse by verse and ignoring the context is what gets a lot of them in trouble.

Offline Bonnie

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8593
  • Manna: 359
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #27 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:34:55 »
Be careful, Terrance.  Paul wasn't too much for being labeled.

 ::amen::

Offline sopranette

  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3775
  • Manna: 107
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #28 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 08:44:14 »
I don't know.  I guess I'm done with shocking preachers.  They always seem to be inventing stuff that doesn't quite work somehow.  I would just rather have a preacher calmly and patiently explain each verse as we go along.

love,

Sopranette
Going verse by verse and ignoring the context is what gets a lot of them in trouble.
That's not what happens with my Pastor,  We flip through and compare verses to eachother.  Does he make mistakes, yes, but it's very rare, at least to my knowledge, and I have noticed it only happens when he steps out of the Word of God. It's still a lot better than the Cathothic church I  used to attend.  I don't remeber him ever asking us to read the verse for ourselves, although he didn't discourage us, either.

love,

Sopranette

Offline Apollos

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 283
  • Manna: 19
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #29 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 09:08:47 »
The reason people like the "sinner's prayer" is because that is the way the Evangelical Church has taught salvation for many years. The sinner's prayer is not Bibical, neither has it ever saved a single soul! It only has deceived many into thinking they are saved. Their salvation is built on "man's wisdom" and not in the power of the Holy Spirit. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Apostle Paul taught salvation with these words, "repent and believe".  Paul also says "faith comes from hearing".

Jerry,

In your view, is the Sinner's prayer NOT Biblical or UNbiblical?

Did you ever hear anyone using the Sinner's prayer say that the prayer itself saves? I have not. As far as I know, the prayer is just a means to an end, NOT the end itself.  The Sinner's prayer points to Jesus and NOT to the prayer itself. It is usually used at the end of a counselling session with someone who believes in the Gospel. Thus, I have no problem using it.

blessings

Apollos

Offline Bonnie

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8593
  • Manna: 359
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #30 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 09:15:26 »
The reason people like the "sinner's prayer" is because that is the way the Evangelical Church has taught salvation for many years. The sinner's prayer is not Bibical, neither has it ever saved a single soul! It only has deceived many into thinking they are saved. Their salvation is built on "man's wisdom" and not in the power of the Holy Spirit. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Apostle Paul taught salvation with these words, "repent and believe".  Paul also says "faith comes from hearing".

Jerry,

In your view, is the Sinner's prayer NOT Biblical or UNbiblical?

Did you ever hear anyone using the Sinner's prayer say that the prayer itself saves? I have not. As far as I know, the prayer is just a means to an end, NOT the end itself.  The Sinner's prayer points to Jesus and NOT to the prayer itself. It is usually used at the end of a counselling session with someone who believes in the Gospel. Thus, I have no problem using it.

blessings

Apollos

Why is the prayer used with an already believer?

Offline DCR

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11300
  • Manna: 432
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #31 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 09:48:36 »
Why is the prayer used with an already believer?

In my mind, the prayer is only appropriate coming from a believer.

Certainly, a non-believer won't be saying the prayer (and mean it).

Offline Bonnie

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8593
  • Manna: 359
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #32 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 09:57:48 »
Why is the prayer used with an already believer?

In my mind, the prayer is only appropriate coming from a believer.

Certainly, a non-believer won't be saying the prayer (and mean it).

No, the non-believer most likely wouldn't even understand it but I understood that the the sinner is the one who repeats it and believes themselves saved by doing so.

Offline Bon Voyage

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 16049
  • Manna: 408
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #33 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 10:03:15 »
The reason people like the "sinner's prayer" is because that is the way the Evangelical Church has taught salvation for many years. The sinner's prayer is not Bibical, neither has it ever saved a single soul! It only has deceived many into thinking they are saved. Their salvation is built on "man's wisdom" and not in the power of the Holy Spirit. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Apostle Paul taught salvation with these words, "repent and believe".  Paul also says "faith comes from hearing".

Jerry,

In your view, is the Sinner's prayer NOT Biblical or UNbiblical?

Did you ever hear anyone using the Sinner's prayer say that the prayer itself saves? I have not. As far as I know, the prayer is just a means to an end, NOT the end itself.  The Sinner's prayer points to Jesus and NOT to the prayer itself. It is usually used at the end of a counselling session with someone who believes in the Gospel. Thus, I have no problem using it.

blessings

Apollos

Why is the prayer used with an already believer?

The demons believe in Jesus Christ.  I understand that some feel that the Sinner's Prayer is a method to help folks on a journey of faith.  However, the "method becomes the madness" (it becomes a part of the gospel to some folks).  Faith is a bit more than believing in the gospel.

Offline DCR

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11300
  • Manna: 432
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Shocking Sermon
« Reply #34 on: Fri Aug 08, 2008 - 10:06:09 »
I guess I'm missing any kind of example of "Pray this prayer, asking Jesus into your heart, and you will be saved," in how the gospel was preached and how folks were told to respond to it in the Bible.