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Author Topic: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?  (Read 8449 times)

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Offline chandrus

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What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?

Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take
it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his
garment, and buy one.

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CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #1 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 02:04:59 »
I'd like to hear what you think on this one.

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #1 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 02:04:59 »

Offline mistergus

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #2 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 07:46:15 »
Chandrus,

I don't understand this technique of yours.  Dropping these questions without comment and then walking away to watch the show...

Am I the only one annoyed with this?

Robert G
« Last Edit: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 07:59:34 by mistergus »

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #2 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 07:46:15 »

Offline chandrus

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #3 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 08:03:15 »
I want to learn from others . ::groupprayer:: ::destroyingcomputer::

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #3 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 08:03:15 »

Offline Jon-Marc

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #4 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 11:43:54 »
Perhaps He meant what He said, for them to buy a sword. If Jesus said it, that's good enough for me. I don't question or try to analyze it.

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #4 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 11:43:54 »



Offline Lee Freeman

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #5 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 14:41:17 »
The Prince of Peace telling his disciples to buy swords?

This statement was made while he was telling them about his upcoming betrayal and arrest. It might be part of figurative language telling them to brace themselves for violence and disruption ahead.

Pax.

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #5 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 14:41:17 »

Offline Lee Freeman

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #6 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 14:44:25 »
I want to learn from others . ::groupprayer:: ::destroyingcomputer::

That's an admirable trait, it really is, but you've started over 80 threads in a mere three weeks. You gotta give the rest of us time to delve into one thread before you start three more. I wonder how you can keep track of so many at once? Why not limit yourself to one or two threads at a time, then, when those run their course, start a couple of new ones?

Pax.

the J Man

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #7 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 20:15:00 »
Chandrus,

I don't understand this technique of yours.  Dropping these questions without comment and then walking away to watch the show...

Am I the only one annoyed with this?

Robert G

Why be annoyed at him? It really is a good question.

Robert Pate

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #8 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 21:18:01 »
The Lord was saying defend yourselves. Keep in mind that almost all of the apostles died violent deaths at the hands of others.

I live outside of town and keep an automatic shotgun under my bed.

There are wild dogs out there, that would just as soon kill you, as look at you.

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #8 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 21:18:01 »

CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #9 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:02:31 »
Chandrus,

I don't understand this technique of yours.  Dropping these questions without comment and then walking away to watch the show...

Am I the only one annoyed with this?

Robert G

Why be annoyed at him? It really is a good question.

To be fair, I can see Roberts point, its almost like hes just being controversial asking charged questions like tossing hand grenades. It would be different if he would comment, or even make more of a post than just "...............".

Or maybe its just post pumping, something I've seen alot of in my time online.

Or maybe he just has alot of questions, and not much to say after asking.

Who knows.

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #10 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:28:49 »
CSloan wants you to know what my computer is, my net connection and my ISP.
I am running both Safari and Netscape 9.2 so your snoop gets confused.

Pretty graceless, wouldn't one say.
Fact is I don't care what system he uses or what kind of snoop ware he uses.
If you would like to know more I am running a Mac Pro with a 20 inch and 23 inch display.
I also do a G4 for backup so eat your heart out. I can still get on the air with an Apple II and a 300 bps modem.

If you are curious I will tell you my name, address, telephone number.
My prescriptions, weight, wife's name, children's name and how you probably could not stalk me down in the middle of about 2600 acrees of forest.

Sola Gratia means Sola Scripture which means Sola Baptism says Martin Luther.

CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #11 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:44:01 »
CSloan wants you to know what my computer is, my net connection and my ISP.
I am running both Safari and Netscape 9.2 so your snoop gets confused.

Pretty graceless, wouldn't one say.
Fact is I don't care what system he uses or what kind of snoop ware he uses.
If you would like to know more I am running a Mac Pro with a 20 inch and 23 inch display.
I also do a G4 for backup so eat your heart out. I can still get on the air with an Apple II and a 300 bps modem.

If you are curious I will tell you my name, address, telephone number.
My prescriptions, weight, wife's name, children's name and how you probably could not stalk me down in the middle of about 2600 acrees of forest.

Sola Gratia means Sola Scripture which means Sola Baptism says Martin Luther.

If you need an explanation of my signature, its a free graphic that mirrors your IP info to you alone.

So you just blabbed something that only you can see, see why James says be slow to speak?

For more information this is what the site says:

The signature image is generated in real-time for each user that views it.
Your IP address and other information are only visible to YOU, not to others, but because people see their own IP address and computer information displayed in the graphic, they think that their information can be seen by everyone!

(BTW: You really could have PM'ed me and asked.)

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #12 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:48:21 »
I don't feel very foolish letting people know what you snooping when you could have asked.

If you are curious, just ask: everyone knows my name, rank and serial number.

CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #13 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:49:33 »
I don't feel very foolish letting people know what you snooping when you could have asked.

If you are curious, just ask: everyone knows my name, rank and serial number.

Hello?

Didn't you read my post. Its not a snoop.

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #14 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:51:19 »
What message did you intend to send me?

CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #15 on: Sat Aug 04, 2007 - 22:52:50 »
What message did you intend to send me?

Nevermind, I removed it.

Offline spurly

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #16 on: Sun Aug 05, 2007 - 07:53:04 »
Blituri, CSloan's signature only revealed your IP address and other information to you.  I saw something completely different when I saw his signature line - I saw my IP address and information.  Even CSloan didn't have access to your information - when he saw that bar it revealed his information to him.

It was really nothing to get worked up about.

CSloan

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #17 on: Sun Aug 05, 2007 - 20:34:06 »
Blituri, CSloan's signature only revealed your IP address and other information to you.  I saw something completely different when I saw his signature line - I saw my IP address and information.  Even CSloan didn't have access to your information - when he saw that bar it revealed his information to him.

It was really nothing to get worked up about.

Thank you spurly,

But its probably best if I don't use a sig like that since it can be really misleading.

I thought it would be fun, but I should have been more considerate to what people might think.

Sorry everyone.

Offline WileyClarkson

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #18 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 07:22:53 »
Just so everyone will know, moderators see the IP of every poster, in case that is not common knowledge.  That is how an unwelcome poster is blocked from making posts--by IP address.  Also, reference to the free software that displays IP addresses to various parties in the signature.  Be carefull that your free software is not loaded with a spyware routine to record you activities on some server some where in order to creat an address for spamming.  I checked out one a while back because I liked the idea of the IP in the signature and it turned out to be just another spyware tracking style program.  Nothing is ever really free  ::frown::  There are also available shareware and commercial software packages that allow tracking of any IP address you go to or are in contact with to show not only the exact location for the purpose of reporting problems but also showing the actual routing servers back to where the site or message originated and print you a map of the route!.  Of course, you get what you pay for.

The whole point is:  The web is not ever totally private, so treat it accordingly.

Offline AliceLewis

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #19 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 11:19:50 »
I think Jesus meant for us to be aware, to be ready for emergencies, like Katrina, like terror threats. etc. etc.

 It's dumb to do nothing for ourselves and then cry "God help me."  
God does help but he has also given us brains to use for our own good.

 We are in the process of moving out into the country, way out.  The roads sometimes get washed out and impassable.  So the first thing I did (and we are not even living there full time yet) is to buy up a years worth of emergency food storage.  I want to eat even if the roads get immpassable for a day or two.  

A gun is also not a bad idea.  There are packs of dogs wandering the area.  I don't want them to molest the chickens we are going to keep.

Do everything you can to keep yourself reasonable prepared for whatever may happen.  God didn't create us dumb!

Offline WileyClarkson

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #20 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 11:47:07 »
They probably already had very short swords or "long knives" of one type or another that were concealable.  The Romans banned the Jews from carrying regular swords, much like the liberals in the USA are trying to ban honest citizens from carrying a concealed handgun.  There is a lesson in history that can be seen in the Roman banning of swords and what eventurally happened to the Jews!  I doubt such banning did anything but push Jewish men to carry concealed something for protection.  Other weapons would have been the sling, a heavy staff, etc.  Shepherds would have had some form of weapon to fight off lions, wolves, etc.

The typical Roman sword of the Republic was the gladius Hispaniensis, whose blade was approximately thirty inches long. In the first century A.D., the gladius was replaced by the Pompeii-type sword, whose blade was only sixteen inches. The latter type of sword would have been relatively easy to carry concealed, especially under loose garments.

A long knife or dagger would be even easier to conceal than the above common swords but for defense against a Roman sword or lance, it would have been pretty much useless--about like using a Ruger 10-22 .22 long rifle against an opponent using an M-16!  They could also be used for killing animals, cutting food, work, etc.

The greek word for sword in the text does indeed mean a sword in common useage from what I have found.   Jesus did tell his disciples to purchase "swords" which would have referred to the full size popular version, IMO.

Offline GleasonFromCA

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #21 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 19:07:24 »
The immediate successor passage points to the fourth suffering servant song of Isaiah (53:12 Luke 22:37  'And he was numbered with the transgressors.'). Notice that the disciples were armed immediately after passover (any sin here?) and the contrast that this is with the Prince of Peace. Christ has now drawn the contrast between his sacrifice and the desires of the disciples for an earthly kingdom. In verse 38, he demonstrates that he has come to bring peace between man and the Father by contrasting these arms with the disciples subsequent death while preaching that the only true peace is in the body of Christ.
Also, note that the servants ear was cut off with a sword subsequently and Jesus told the disciple to stop - that he could call on legions of angels to defend him if that were the Father's will. This will form an element in the contrast when Jesus will later tell Peter to feed his sheep.
Ultimately, the lesson that Luke is speaking of is that on trust in the world (and its arms) or trust in the Lord. Jesus did not draw the sword nor was one given to him. The focus is as always on Christ; the disciples had still not learned the ultimate lesson of Christocentric faith (e.g. John 2:22).
Just a couple of random thoughts.

Offline janine

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #22 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 20:12:26 »
Of course, you know, just a wild and crazy thought here --

But when Jesus told them to buy a sword, even if it meant selling possessions to do it --

He could have meant that they should buy a sword, you know.

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #23 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 20:41:29 »
Gleason reads CONTEXTS: he gets the prize. I was about to post this wordy version:

There is little raw, factual information in the Bible: Jesus said that the truth had been hidden in parables from the foundation of the world. This was to deprive His superntural enemies of the mysteries they needed to totally destroy Him. He spoke parables to the Jewish masses and clergy.  When Jesus quotes a statement YOU are supposed to rush there and see what's up.

Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them,
            But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: [begging bag]
            and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

The money bag of Judas, the Judas Bag, was always attached to a flute case and was "for carrying the mouthpieces of wind instruments."

Psalm 41 prophesied that Judas would not triumph over Jesus meaning to "blow wind instruments and make a rejoicing sound."

Judas was deprived of his BAG and hanged himself in the BEGGARS FIELD.

The very next verse exlains why there must be at least one sword: the army would bring the Wind instruments:

Luke 22:37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me,
                  And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.

    This is from Isaiah 53 which early on prophesied of the musical mocking by the Levitical Warrior Musicians:

    Isa 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities:
    the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
   
    Wounded is
    H2490 châlal khaw-lal' A primitive root (compare H2470 ); properly to bore, that is, (by implication) to wound, to dissolve; figuratively to profane (a person, place or thing)... denominatively (from H2485 ) to play (the flute): take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.

As in, Lucifer was cast as profane out of heaven. He used wind (flute), string and percussion instruments to steal your wealth and soul

Luke 22:38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
Luke 22:47 And while he yet spake, behold a multitude,
        and he that was called Judas, one of the twelve, went before them,
        and drew near unto Jesus to kiss him.

Luke 22:48 But Jesus said unto him, Judas, betrayest thou the Son of man with a kiss?
Luke 22:49 When they which were about him saw what would follow, they said unto him,
                  Lord, shall we smite with the sword?
Luke 22:50 And one of them smote the servant of the high priest, and cut off his right ear.
Luke 22:51 And Jesus answered and said, Suffer ye thus far. And he touched his ear, and healed him.

That accomplished another SIGN of fulfillment

Luke 22:52 Then Jesus said unto the chief priests, and captains of the temple, and the elders,
        which were come to him, Be ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and staves?
Luke 22:53 When I was daily with you in the temple,
        ye stretched forth no hands against me:
        but this is YOUR hour, and the power of darkness.
Luke 22:54 Then took they him, and led him, and brought him into the high priests house. And Peter followed afar off.

Jesus used Peter but I think Peter was still in the dark: like most who hear the surface words of Jesus.

Paul said that Carnal Weapons (means lifeless instruments) have no value in fighting the principalities and powers in high places--which inhabited Jerusalem. Therefore, we are given the sword of the Spirit or the Words of Christ which are Spirit and Life.  If we use the instruments of the powers of darkness we cannot defeat them. Does that make sense or what?



Offline mike

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #24 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 20:46:19 »
blituri,
Now that's a weird post, even by your standards. And I think you hold the record for peculiar posts.

You might want to check the inside of your hat. I think the aluminum foil may be worn in a few spots.  ::smile::

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #25 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 21:02:49 »
All of those Bible quotes IN CONTEXT twangs yore stranges?

I had a crack about your __ string but I wouldn't dare! (he he)

Haven't you seen my pictures of the Judas Bag which has hundreds of real-life paintings to show you the meaning? Hint: they were always carrying a new wineskin and not rated for GCM.

How about Psalm 41. Ever wondered what TRIUMPH OVER means?
Now, you DO know that PSALLO means "pull with your fingers and NEVER with a plektron?"

Hope you don't do no picking around there. And if you are a professional musicator in church, this gives you the authority to carry your BEGGARS BAG to collect morsels of scraps.

Offline WileyClarkson

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #26 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 21:38:36 »
Mike,

I agree with you about Ken's last post  ::frown::  I'm ???

Janine,

There may have been much more to the context as GleasonfromCA more clearly states than Ken, who aparently agrees with GleasonfromCA, I am kind of of the opinion that jesus knew exactly what he was telling. "Go purchase swords " which could be classified back then as government banned "assault weapons" compared to the personal blades that many men carried for work, personal protection, and general utility use.

Ken,

there is one thing I really wish you would do if your are going to post those essays you write:  Would you please stop using the KJV English version and use something that is at least in modern day English!  This poor old country boy just has alot of problems reading the Old English of 350 years ago!  My brain shuts down after about three sentences   ::faint::

Offline goodman

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #27 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 22:13:32 »
The Prince of Peace telling his disciples to buy swords?

This statement was made while he was telling them about his upcoming betrayal and arrest. It might be part of figurative language telling them to brace themselves for violence and disruption ahead.

Pax.

Great explanation. Excellent. This verse was troubling me, not anymore.

blituri

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #28 on: Mon Aug 06, 2007 - 22:27:16 »
Of course, it is both figurative and literal: Jesus spoke in parables because the clergy had no right to know the true meaning which you cannot get if you dont' read the context and prophecy.

G3162
???????
machaira
makh'-ahee-rah
Probably feminine of a presumed derivative of G3163 ; a knife, that is, dirk; figuratively war, judicial punishment: sword.

Jesus told them to buy a sticky knifey.  Judas was Judas Sicarri: they were the professional assassins known down through history as Hashish Men. They stuck a daggar between the ribes of a CONTRACT in the musical festivals (always in the Agora: never in the ekklesia) and then yelled: Murder, foul murder: stop that murderer, he is getting away.

It was necessary for prophecy to be fulfilled: had NO other meaning. Preachers cannot carry a sword or a stave or ROD as symbol of their authority under Dionysus.

They HAD two swords: Jesus said that is enouth.
The came to fulfil the Judas Prophecy
Peter cut off an ear.
Jesus said STOP

and then chided the Jews for coming out for him like they would dogs.

Simple enough in any version.  Too bad, too sad: I like the KJV because it is connected to all of tham WURDS soze we can understand them. Understand?

The ALARM or TRIUMPH of Judas (Psalm 41) was a MUSICAL MOCKING term which was outlawed for the Qahal, synagogue or church in the wilderness. So simple that that retarded kid in any village know NO PRAISE SERVICE IN THE SYNAGOGUE.

Why NOT? Why, because it is outlawed says John Calvin, Martin Luther and Blituri.
Why NOT? Why, simple simon, you don't DO music in the face of a holy MASCULINE God: only for the mother goddesses (he he).
Why NOT? Why, card class 101aaa, you don't DO music in the CLASS ROOM when Jesus comes to be our ONLY Rabbi.

Is that simple? No. Well, no one in the Bible or the most backward society for about four centuries had any trouble understanding that.



Offline Big Mike Lewis

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #29 on: Tue Aug 07, 2007 - 16:43:17 »
Better question:

Why did Jesus tell them to buy swords and then not let them use the swords (e.g. Peter cutting off Malchus' ear and telling him to stop)?

::swordfight::

Offline GleasonFromCA

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #30 on: Tue Aug 07, 2007 - 23:49:01 »
I'm not a scholar of Luke and can only look to the structural sense of the Gospel. First, Luke establishes that he is writing a history (Luke 1:1-4  ESV Inasmuch as many have undertaken to compile a narrative of the things that have been accomplished among us, just as those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and ministers of the word have delivered them to us, it seemed good to me also, having followed all things closely for some time past, to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, that you may have certainty concerning the things you have been taught.) that would instruct accurately. Again, I am just estimating, but the entire chronology contained in all four Gospels covers at most 1 months time in Jesus' three year ministry. We know that Luke was looking for significant events that tell the story of Christ and him crucified. His Gospel narrative looks constantly forward to the cross.
Here we have the story of the swords. Jesus is looking straight forward to his death on the cross thus fulfilling prophecy. But now, Luke provides a sword for Peter to cut off Malchus' ear and for Jesus to heal it. Luke has now created a contrast between a kingdom established by the violence of men over men to a kingdom established by violence of men against the God-man, Jesus. Why waste precious words on this simple statement?
Paul and Luke both name names in their accounts. These names can be checked against the people living in Judea and Malchus may have been living or remembered. Here we have disciples armed after passover (remember that Thomas siad that they should die by the side of Christ and they all fled) and the Prince of Peace healing a temple guard. It's a simple historical detail that could have been checked by Theophilus (or whoever read the account) for accuracy.
Contextually, then we have an historical detail spun out in precious pages of Scripture and a contrast of kingdoms - the one established by the King of the universe and the other one hoped to be established as David (and the Maccabees) had. The disciples beliefs could not have been in more stark contrast than against Jesus' obedience to the Father.
Again, I'm not really a scholar of Luke and can only infer.

Offline Gracious

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #31 on: Wed Aug 08, 2007 - 05:56:46 »
Yup Gleason from Cali ::clappingoverhead:: I'm right with you brother!!! ::smile::

Quote
22.36 ‘And he said to them, “But now, he who has a purse, let him take it, and likewise a wallet, and he who has none (no purse or wallet), let him sell his cloak, and buy a sword.

Offline normfromga

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #32 on: Wed Aug 08, 2007 - 07:50:37 »
I have no dispute with others who have post, but, as usual, I tend to get a little more pragmatic about the situation.

Thus I shall quote, once again, from II Opinions 3:15...

Jesus knew that for His vow (John 17:12) to be fulfilled, His disciples should not also be rounded up and tried along with Him as co-conspirators. (John 18:8-9)  He also knew that the fact that they were armed may give the guards pause in deciding to round them up also.

Of course, as usual, Peter didn't "get the memo" and decided to proactively defend his Master, and once again, had to be rebuked. (John 18:10-11)

This brings out another wrinkle, of course.  Jesus not only healed the servant because He was the Prince of Peace, but if the servant had keeled over and bleed to death, Peter might have gotten pole position on the cross, really messing up His vow...

I bring back two lessons from this story:

There is nothing unscriptural about arming yourself for self-defense.

There is nothing scriptural about preemptively attacking someone because they don't like you, and they would do the same to you if they had the means (but they don't.)

But that would lead us back to the Political forum...

Good to hear from you, Gleason...

Offline normfromga

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #33 on: Wed Aug 08, 2007 - 08:03:45 »
Oh yeah,

This time from III Opinions:

We know that Jesus was willing to go to the Cross, and that, if He wished, He could have called Ten Thousand Angels, but to the skeptic, he was simply ambushed by the posse, and had no means of resisting nor escaping.

The fact that at least a few of His disciples were armed (which is pointed out in all four Gospel accounts, BTW), and could probably have stirred up enough commotion to allow Him escape once again, supports the contention that He entered His Sacrifice under his own volition.

Offline charlie

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Re: What did Jesus mean when he told his disciples to buy a sword?
« Reply #34 on: Wed Aug 08, 2007 - 08:57:56 »
Gleason reads CONTEXTS: he gets the prize. I was about to post this wordy version:

There is little raw, factual information in the Bible: Jesus said that the truth had been hidden in parables from the foundation of the world. This was to deprive His superntural enemies of the mysteries they needed to totally destroy Him. He spoke parables to the Jewish masses and clergy.  When Jesus quotes a statement YOU are supposed to rush there and see what's up.

Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them,
            But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: [begging bag]
            and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

The money bag of Judas, the Judas Bag, was always attached to a flute case and was "for carrying the mouthpieces of wind instruments."

Psalm 41 prophesied that Judas would not triumph over Jesus meaning to "blow wind instruments and make a rejoicing sound."

Judas was deprived of his BAG and hanged himself in the BEGGARS FIELD.

The very next verse exlains why there must be at least one sword: the army would bring the Wind instruments:

Luke 22:37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me,
                  And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.

    This is from Isaiah 53 which early on prophesied of the musical mocking by the Levitical Warrior Musicians:

    Isa 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities:
    the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
   
    Wounded is
   H2490 châlal khaw-lal' A primitive root (compare H2470 ); properly to bore, that is, (by implication) to wound, to dissolve; figuratively to profane (a person, place or thing)... denominatively (from H2485 ) to play (the flute): take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.

As in, Lucifer was cast as profane out of heaven. He used wind (flute), string and percussion instruments to steal your wealth and soul

Luke 22:38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
Luke 22:47 And while he yet spake, behold a multitude,
        and he that was called Judas, one of the twelve, went before them,
        and drew near unto Jesus to kiss him.

Luke 22:48 But Jesus said unto him, Judas, betrayest thou the Son of man with a kiss?
Luke 22:49 When they which were about him saw what would follow, they said unto him,
                  Lord, shall we smite with the sword?
Luke 22:50 And one of them smote the servant of the high priest, and cut off his right ear.
Luke 22:51 And Jesus answered and said, Suffer ye thus far. And he touched his ear, and healed him.

That accomplished another SIGN of fulfillment

Luke 22:52 Then Jesus said unto the chief priests, and captains of the temple, and the elders,
        which were come to him, Be ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and staves?
Luke 22:53 When I was daily with you in the temple,
        ye stretched forth no hands against me:
        but this is YOUR hour, and the power of darkness.
Luke 22:54 Then took they him, and led him, and brought him into the high priests house. And Peter followed afar off.

Jesus used Peter but I think Peter was still in the dark: like most who hear the surface words of Jesus.

Paul said that Carnal Weapons (means lifeless instruments) have no value in fighting the principalities and powers in high places--which inhabited Jerusalem. Therefore, we are given the sword of the Spirit or the Words of Christ which are Spirit and Life.  If we use the instruments of the powers of darkness we cannot defeat them. Does that make sense or what?

So, blituri... are you going to Night of Joy at Disney?

 

     
anything