Author Topic: God's Will vs God's Desire  (Read 153 times)

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Offline Netchaplain

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God's Will vs God's Desire
« on: Mon Mar 01, 2021 - 08:51:32 »
Everything that transpires in life is supposed to occur, otherwise it wouldn't happen, because nothing happens without God's foreknowledge and Him allowing it to come to pass!

Everyone does God's will, but most do not to do His desires! Even though it has always been that God “desires all men to be saved” (1Ti 2:4; 2Pe 3:9), His will—or way—is that only those who “choose life . . . “will live” (Deu 30:19). Thus, everyone does God's will, but most choose not to do His desires!

We know that our loving God does everything “according to His good pleasure” (Eph 1:9), and that prior to creation, He knew “many” (that is, most) of mankind would choose “the way that leads to destruction,” and that “few” (in comparison to the many) would choose “the way which leads unto life” (Mat 7:13, 14 – becoming more obvious all the time).

I would think it doubtless to conceive that He knew there would be great worth in gaining the “few,” as evidenced by the “joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repents” (Luk 15:10).


Offline 4WD

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #1 on: Mon Mar 01, 2021 - 09:52:19 »
Yes, Netchapain,

I think too often we confuse and conflate the meaning of the English verb will-(followed by an action verb) with what is often translated from the Greek noun θέλημα [thelēma] meaning determination, choice, purpose, decree, etc.  Many, perhaps most, places when the English Bible says God's will or that God wills this or that, it should be translated as God's desire or that God wants this or that or would be pleased with this or that.

Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #2 on: Mon Mar 01, 2021 - 10:38:31 »
Yes, Netchapain,

I think too often we confuse and conflate the meaning of the English verb will-(followed by an action verb) with what is often translated from the Greek noun θέλημα [thelēma] meaning determination, choice, purpose, decree, etc.  Many, perhaps most, places when the English Bible says God's will or that God wills this or that, it should be translated as God's desire or that God wants this or that or would be pleased with this or that.
I agree, and I believe context determines the type usage and meaning.

Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #3 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 07:29:22 »
From the input I’ve received in this thread I realize that I need to better explain what I mean by “Everyone does God's will.” Everyone ends in subjection to God concerning His will for believers and unbelievers. For example, it’s His will (but not His desire) that the latter receive eternal death, and the prior eternal life.

Sorry for not being clear enough and thanks for all who are participating in this thread. It helped me see that I needed to be more explanatory of what I am attempting to share. The articles intent is to reflect on His sovereign control, like He knew man would partake of the “Tree” even when He was commanding not to, because it was obviously the way God desired to begin teaching us.

God bless us everyone, and God be blessed!

Offline 4WD

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #4 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 08:55:22 »
Netchaplain, I really believe that the whole forbidden tree bit was to teach us that He created all of mankind to have free-will.  His purpose for creating the universe and giving mankind free-will was to assemble a people, a body of believers, who would willingly choose to love Him in return for His love of mankind.  There can really be no other fundamental reason for creation.

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #4 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 08:55:22 »



Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #5 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 16:13:58 »
Netchaplain, I really believe that the whole forbidden tree bit was to teach us that He created all of mankind to have free-will.  His purpose for creating the universe and giving mankind free-will was to assemble a people, a body of believers, who would willingly choose to love Him in return for His love of mankind.  There can really be no other fundamental reason for creation.
I think it's also obvious that He has always planned on creating a being that was after Himself, making man second in importance to Himself.

Offline 4WD

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #6 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 16:34:06 »
I think it's also obvious that He has always planned on creating a being that was after Himself, making man second in importance to Himself.
Yes, and I think the essence of being after Himself is in man's conscience, his spirit, which in turn is at the heart of free-will.  I think that is what the whole account of the forbidden fruit reveals.

Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #7 on: Tue Mar 02, 2021 - 18:07:53 »
Yes, and I think the essence of being after Himself is in man's conscience, his spirit, which in turn is at the heart of free-will. 
Pretty much agree! I think that is what the whole account of the forbidden fruit reveals.
I believe for man to be accountable he has to be given to choose, otherwise (impossible in my opinion) where is the justice?

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #8 on: Wed Mar 03, 2021 - 03:51:59 »
Everything that transpires in life is supposed to occur, otherwise it wouldn't happen, because nothing happens without God's foreknowledge and Him allowing it to come to pass!

Everyone does God's will, but most do not to do His desires!
I have read this, but do not believe I have TIME to truly do this any justice in responding, IF I find the time, then I will later on in the week,

Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #9 on: Wed Mar 03, 2021 - 06:39:51 »
I have read this, but do not believe I have TIME to truly do this any justice in responding, IF I find the time, then I will later on in the week,
Thanks for expressing your interest. The subject has to do with the fact that it's not God's desire but His will that unbelievers perish. Many are still not getting the point, but that's ok, it is just my belief.

Offline 4WD

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #10 on: Wed Mar 03, 2021 - 06:56:49 »
I believe for man to be accountable he has to be given to choose, otherwise (impossible in my opinion) where is the justice?
By definition, there is no such thing as sin if there is no free will to choose.  Sin is disobedience. Disobedience is a choice.

Offline Netchaplain

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Re: God's Will vs God's Desire
« Reply #11 on: Wed Mar 03, 2021 - 07:16:08 »
By definition, there is no such thing as sin if there is no free will to choose.  Sin is disobedience. Disobedience is a choice.
All things are via choice, it's what we do about the sin nature and ourselves that matters, thus being accountable for our outcome.

 

     
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