We are new to the area, I've only tried two churches, but the second church i fell in love with. It is the kind of service that you don't want to end, and the praise and worship is awesome. I was really digging it the first 3 weeks, and feeling like this will be my new church. However i am a social person who likes to make social connections but i just feel like another number there. Anyone ever feel like this when you first started going to a mega church?
Never been to a mega church, except when going to conference. The large building concept removes the personal touch. Whereas small groups really along the personal/social interaction and true ministry to flow.
: armywifenmom Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 17:56:56
We are new to the area, I've only tried two churches, but the second church i fell in love with. It is the kind of service that you don't want to end, and the praise and worship is awesome. I was really digging it the first 3 weeks, and feeling like this will be my new church. However i am a social person who likes to make social connections but i just feel like another number there. Anyone ever feel like this when you first started going to a mega church?
Yes...But if you keep sitting in the same place you will start to connect with the people that sit around you. We are creatures of habit...
Or join a women's Bible Study, small group, or start serving.... ::groupprayer::
: armywifenmom Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 17:56:56
We are new to the area, I've only tried two churches, but the second church i fell in love with. It is the kind of service that you don't want to end, and the praise and worship is awesome. I was really digging it the first 3 weeks, and feeling like this will be my new church. However i am a social person who likes to make social connections but i just feel like another number there. Anyone ever feel like this when you first started going to a mega church?
I've been to two...didn't feel comfortable at either. I don't think bigger is better when it comes to churches.
Just my ::twocents::
In Christ,
KP
In such a huge outfit, how can overseers meaningfully oversee?
: k-pappy Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 21:46:52
: armywifenmom Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 17:56:56
We are new to the area, I've only tried two churches, but the second church i fell in love with. It is the kind of service that you don't want to end, and the praise and worship is awesome. I was really digging it the first 3 weeks, and feeling like this will be my new church. However i am a social person who likes to make social connections but i just feel like another number there. Anyone ever feel like this when you first started going to a mega church?
I've been to two...didn't feel comfortable at either. I don't think bigger is better when it comes to churches.
Just my ::twocents::
In Christ,
KP
: farouk Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 21:47:58
In such a huge outfit, how can overseers meaningfully oversee?
Actually similar as a military fashion.
There are groups of deacons each of which has a leader...and those leaders report to another leader.
The paid employees of the church are more about administration and maintenance. There is also a board that is responsible for direction. The pastor is a public speaker and really has no true authority inside of the church. It is a model that actually goes more in line with the original church and principle of Synagogue than anything else currently running.
Small group bible studies and other activities inside of the church are very numberous. There were at least six small group bible studies going on sunday mornings that I could have availed myself of. I checked out several of these and found a couple of these to my liking. (unfortunately it was one that had most of the "Who's Who" inside of Christiandom that I became a part of.) ::shrug:: I seem to have a talent for finding hornets nests inside of any church.
The libraries at these mega churchs is also usually rather extensive. I made good use of mine when I was a member. Granted there are the usual "leftover" books that are in there....but there are also some really good rescources in there as well. The librarians have enough money to make sure that they have some top notch rescources in there.
Intimacy in these churchs can be had...it is a matter of finding it. They are just people...alot of them but people just the same. Parking is usually the most difficult thing to deal with at them.
Right now most of the Mega Churchs are in trouble. Most churchs are experiencing a 10-20% drop in giving at the moment. For a small church this isn't so much a problem although serious....for a mega church this is usually devastating. Like most churchs of smaller natures they are leveraged to the hilt...and this economy has hurt them so severely that...in time if things do not get better many of them are going to have to resort to some kind of radical means to raise money. They all are about broke and going broker by the minute. Usually utility companies and bill collectors will extend a lot of grace to a church...but they need to eat too. And when push comes to shove...
While they exist...take advantage of them...use the libraries...listen in on the bible studies. (the music and production aspect of the services is always a joy to watch and listen to)
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:46:45
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
I didn't say anything negative about them...I have been a member of one and enjoyed my time there. There are issues with them just like there are issues with small churchs. No real difference except in what issues there are to face.
: JohnDB Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:49:07
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:46:45
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
I didn't say anything negative about them...I have been a member of one and enjoyed my time there. There are issues with them just like there are issues with small churchs. No real difference except in what issues there are to face.
I know you didnt. I was responding to the "its not intimate enough, its out of control, cant meet people, just a number"
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:46:45
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
You don't get it. It isn't at all "no growth". When they get "too" big, you break off a group and church plant. Then there are two churches. Two grow, break off, and then there are four. You can do math, right?
Small churches have an intimacy, a closeness to each other connected to a closeness to God, that big churches can never have. And that's just the way it is.
: phoebe Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 11:06:37
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:46:45
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
You don't get it. It isn't at all "no growth". When they get "too" big, you break off a group and church plant. Then there are two churches. Two grow, break off, and then there are four. You can do math, right?
Small churches have an intimacy, a closeness to each other connected to a closeness to God, that big churches can never have. And that's just the way it is.
That flat out isn't true. Where it may be true for you and what you have experienced...it isn't true for everyone. I do happen to have personal experience on this. I have intimate friends that were made from a mega church that I am still close with to this day.
I do believe that someone recently made a case for where it was the plane's fault for flying into the towers instead of the terrorists flying them...the same logic applies in this case too.
It really isn't the church's fault if you can't find the intimacy you are looking for. It is the person looking for the intimacy's fault entirely.
: JohnDB Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 12:27:10
: phoebe Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 11:06:37
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 08:46:45
here we go again.....yea hurray!!! lets all root for NO GROWTH in the church!!! Yippee!!!
I will never get the negativity towards big churches. Do we not pray, each service, someone(s) will accept Christ?
But but but, if hundreds do....or gasp! thousands.......well well, then its just bad its just not right.....
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH
You don't get it. It isn't at all "no growth". When they get "too" big, you break off a group and church plant. Then there are two churches. Two grow, break off, and then there are four. You can do math, right?
Small churches have an intimacy, a closeness to each other connected to a closeness to God, that big churches can never have. And that's just the way it is.
That flat out isn't true. Where it may be true for you and what you have experienced...it isn't true for everyone. I do happen to have personal experience on this. I have intimate friends that were made from a mega church that I am still close with to this day.
I do believe that someone recently made a case for where it was the plane's fault for flying into the towers instead of the terrorists flying them...the same logic applies in this case too.
It really isn't the church's fault if you can't find the intimacy you are looking for. It is the person looking for the intimacy's fault entirely.
"flat out"? "entirely"?
Nope.
You draw some pretty hard lines that are not only judgmental, they are flawed. Your arguments won't hold water.
You want responsibility to only go one way?? ::headscratch:: Yet when it comes to the planes, you make a case
for the terrorist?
I think you just lost any credibility I may have seen in you.
That's like saying that the murder weapon is at fault, and not the shooter. Or the victim is at fault, and not the serial killer.
That came out backwards...LOL
IT wasn't the planes fault...it was the terrorists fault.
(get a grip for a minute...lets apply real logic)
I was trying to say that intimacy can be had at mega churchs...but that if you can't find intimacy at a mega church it is solely your fault and not that of the church. K?
I dont mind the preference, its preference, I DO mind the sort of purist attitude that goes with it, and the comments about relational intimacy are simply not true.
Its DUH that of course you wont have a relationship with EVERYONE IN THE CHURCH. But you DO have with the same number or more.
The superiority comples comes from the small church advocates, not the big ones.
Incidentally, you need to explain how doing math has anything to do with the point you made. I hope I can do math, Im an engineer, now you have me doubting, because I fail to see how math helps me in this. We werent even discussing numbers, specific numbers, we are discusiing reaching a certain point and splitting.....wheres the math in that?
: JohnDB Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 13:16:47
That came out backwards...LOL
IT wasn't the planes fault...it was the terrorists fault.
(get a grip for a minute...lets apply real logic)
I was trying to say that intimacy can be had at mega churchs...but that if you can't find intimacy at a mega church it is solely your fault and not that of the church. K?
I was just going by what you said...
I would never say it is
solely the fault of the guest/member and
zero fault of the church. I could rip that argument to shreds! In mega, small, and every size in-between, there is plenty of
responsibility (rather than "fault" or "blame") for all sizes, and all places.
What you and others have described is a collection of small churches within a mega church.
If that's what you like, more power to you. I prefer knowing and loving the lives of every face I see around His Table.
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
Ms B:
Yes, for a Biblical overseer to oversee Biblically, he has to know the ppl in front of him, to some extent.
Indeed.
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:05:12
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
: farouk Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:06:22
Ms B:
Yes, for a Biblical overseer to oversee Biblically, he has to know the ppl in front of him, to some extent.
Indeed.
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:05:12
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
I think it serves the Pastor and the people well if they know one another on some level. You're right there.
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:05:12
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
I always found one to be available or to anoint me with oil and pray over me.
Ms Bonnie:
Exactly, and it's Scriptural, too, for them to take a personal care.
Take care.
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:23:52
: farouk Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:06:22
Ms B:
Yes, for a Biblical overseer to oversee Biblically, he has to know the ppl in front of him, to some extent.
Indeed.
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:05:12
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
I think it serves the Pastor and the people well if they know one another on some level. You're right there.
: ConqueredbyLove Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 19:26:26
: armywifenmom Wed Oct 14, 2009 - 17:56:56
We are new to the area, I've only tried two churches, but the second church i fell in love with. It is the kind of service that you don't want to end, and the praise and worship is awesome. I was really digging it the first 3 weeks, and feeling like this will be my new church. However i am a social person who likes to make social connections but i just feel like another number there. Anyone ever feel like this when you first started going to a mega church?
Yes...But if you keep sitting in the same place you will start to connect with the people that sit around you. We are creatures of habit...
Or join a women's Bible Study, small group, or start serving.... ::groupprayer::
Been to some, and this is a good post, having found it to be true.
What I've seen is that the mega churches tend to get more into praise singing and that sort of stuff, to make of for the lack of conncetivity, shall we say. It's kind of like a certain atmosphere, which builds upon itself that way, making the singing time better and better. So I would just go for the times of singing, which lasted quite a while, which I like, but I couldn't stand the teaching, such as "Jesus doesn't have a problem with sin". There are so many option out there when you live in the city, one can pick and choose different churches for different things. I did this, going to a few churches every week, for different stuff, depending upon which was strong in the area that I was going to it for.
Been home churching for a number of years now. Getting into the worship and singing happens no matter the size or location or electronics -- it can be incredibly fulfilling and rich anyplace and anytime. I guess that I've changed over the years.
Lets be clear, that one church taught funky stuff doesnt indict mega churches , it indicts THAT mega church.
: phoebe Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 14:37:58
: JohnDB Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 13:16:47
That came out backwards...LOL
IT wasn't the planes fault...it was the terrorists fault.
(get a grip for a minute...lets apply real logic)
I was trying to say that intimacy can be had at mega churchs...but that if you can't find intimacy at a mega church it is solely your fault and not that of the church. K?
I was just going by what you said...
I would never say it is solely the fault of the guest/member and zero fault of the church. I could rip that argument to shreds! In mega, small, and every size in-between, there is plenty of responsibility (rather than "fault" or "blame") for all sizes, and all places.
What you and others have described is a collection of small churches within a mega church.
If that's what you like, more power to you. I prefer knowing and loving the lives of every face I see around His Table.
Then rip it.
I agree with his statement fully. The church can set the table, they cant make you eat. They can have every possible opportunity to know folks, if you show up and sit quietly in back, you will know no one!
Thats what he was getting at. Sure there may be some churches that do not afford a chance to get to know people, frankly I cannot imagine that, nor have I ever seen that....how would it even look when a church is the fault for the people not forging relationships? What possible thing can they do or not do? Im really curious.
Preference is fine, of course, we all have preferences. I dislike the smug purist tone that CAN come out when this topic comes up. Cant we just be glad that all these churches large and small are there? Discussing OUR preference is fine, so long as it is PREFERENCE, meaning there is something GOOD (to you) about where YOU go.....not that you want to run down where others go.
: ConqueredbyLove Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:27:34
: Bonnie Thu Oct 15, 2009 - 19:05:12
I've never been to a mega church. Actually there are none in our region. I don't think I would like them though. I guess I perfer the small little country churches where everybody knows each other or are at least familiar with one another. I also like the Pastor to be available to have conversation with when needed.
I always found one to be available or to anoint me with oil and pray over me.
I'm not saying mega churches are bad just that I like smaller ones better.
I for one am not dogging big or mega churches at all, but looking for experiences of others who may have not liked the feel at first but later loved it. God abides where his ppl are, and size is not a factor.
I was inbetween two ladies yesterday who also attend a mega church. One had been going there for 6yrs, the other 11yrs, and they had never met before. It just blew me away. I guess that could be a good thing if you are an introvert or not a ppl person. Thankfully, I'm involved in a few bible studies at other churches(you would think as big as my church is that they would have a womens bible study, but they dont) but most of the ladies are 50 and older. I don't mind an older crowd, but it's nice to befriend others who are experiencing some of the same things i am experiencing(raising children, going back to school etc)
I haven't read the entire thread, but what defines a Mega Church.
I have gone to many churches of 150 to 250 and only know 20 or so people. I presently go to a church of 1500 or so and know probably a hundred people.
J:
Well, exactly; hard to get to know them all. (Hard for the overseers and pastors to get to know ppl, too.)
Sometimes ppl like to go to church, but with their 'privacy rights' uppermost in their minds, I know. I'm not sure that's the Biblical way, though...
: Jaime Fri Oct 16, 2009 - 17:51:39
I haven't read the entire thread, but what defines a Mega Church.
I have gone to many churches of 150 to 250 and only know 20 or so people. I presently go to a church of 1500 or so and know probably a hundred people.
I don't know exactly what defines one...I went to one that had about 5,000 in attendance every sunday. The Deacons (it was baptist) mostly all had seminary degrees as well is did most of the SS Teachers. When you joined you were assigned a deacon...a complete portfolio about him and how to contact him was sent to you...he might call or not...depends upon a lot of factors when you joined. He was going to be the first one that the pastor would call as well as the two deacon levels of leadership in the heirarchy if anything was reported amiss or positive about you.
(in other words if you wished to remain a deacon you had better do your job...it wasn't a popularity contest here...you had to really work at it...they had a list of replacements a mile long if you didn't want to serve...and considering the membership was a "who's who" of Christiandom...you really didn't want to be demoted by force.
They would have teams that went to hospitals and nursing homes and all kinds of stuff that they did. They were about to ask me to get on the list....and I ran and hid...I don't like sick people and I don't pray what people want to hear...so I ain't much comfort. I have real political correctness issues...often. I do not belong in that role.
But while I was a member I knew many in the administration...they knew me. They were always available ready willing and able...even if it was just to have lunch or dinner and/or hang out for a bit.
My ooint was that I got to know MORE people in a large church than a small one. A small church, in my experience, didn't mean an easier time of meeting folks. I don't feel like I go to a mega church, but a pretty big congregation.
Reminds me of the account of the Lord's feeding of the five thousand...
J:
The knowing ppl thing is vertical and horizontal.
My challenge: how well do I know my hurting brother in Christ?
: Jaime Fri Oct 16, 2009 - 18:26:53
My ooint was that I got to know MORE people in a large church than a small one. A small church, in my experience, didn't mean an easier time of meeting folks. I don't feel like I go to a mega church, but a pretty big congregation.
There are those in a larger church I will never meet, but honestly the most isolated I ever felt was in a church of about 150 mostly older folks.
As a side note, I have always wondered what the scriptural authorization for separate congregations in a city is. For instance Paul never spoke of the East Side Church in Corinth or the charismatic brethren as opposed to the conservative brethren in Ephesus. I would say city-wide elders has more scriptural basis, since everyone met in homes anyway.
God has shown that HIS church will never be a 'mega-church'.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Mega church of small church, a good number of the folks are pew sitters who aren't very much involved. Generalization for sure, but it applies to most (but not all).
I went to a megachurch. In reality it was a much smaller church than the number at services. The real teaching went to this small group of folks. The teaching at the worship services was milk, as it was outreach oriented.
It had it's good points, and bad points as well.
: 3AM Sat Oct 17, 2009 - 10:16:39
God has shown that HIS church will never be a 'mega-church'.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
You have a point there, Brother.
Ms B:
Yes, good point indeed.
Take care.
: Bonnie Sat Oct 17, 2009 - 13:04:20
: 3AM Sat Oct 17, 2009 - 10:16:39
God has shown that HIS church will never be a 'mega-church'.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
You have a point there, Brother.
No, not super mega, large churches, which I find better than very small Churches IMHO, but, as long as the word is balanced, and adds up, they are all people seeking to worship the king.
: 3AM Sat Oct 17, 2009 - 10:16:39
God has shown that HIS church will never be a 'mega-church'.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
wow, this is one of the most vaguely backed assertions I have ever seen made using scripture.
again, wow....talk about mining scripture to fit opinion....this takes the cake as they say
: BAH-BLAH Sun Oct 18, 2009 - 08:29:57
: 3AM Sat Oct 17, 2009 - 10:16:39
God has shown that HIS church will never be a 'mega-church'.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
wow, this is one of the most vaguely backed assertions I have ever seen made using scripture.
again, wow....talk about mining scripture to fit opinion....this takes the cake as they say
Yeah, i defintely think that scripture is being taken outof context here
: armywifenmom Sun Oct 18, 2009 - 11:08:39
Yeah, i defintely think that scripture is being taken outof context here
Out of context ?
Jesus Christ said (If you believe Him).......
Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by
every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
I've had the privilege of being a member in both a small church and two mega churches in my life. I have to say all were wonderful and I am thankful for the enlarged vision God has granted me by rounding me into a well balanced Christian.
With the small church I was involved in the main vision was "stay small and raise up leaders and plant more churches"
Which was wonderful. I seen many couples raised up and sent out to start their own local church where God directed them.
Then when I was a member of the mega churches the vision was "The larger we are the more we can do for Christ".
And they did A LOT for the Lord. Plenty of ministries to benefit from and serve in, to reaching out to the community and supporting lots of missionaries also.
If you join a mega church or a small church my advice is to find out about the home bible studies and get involved with one. It will give you the opportunity to know people one on one instead of just going to church service and seeing different faces each time. In this way, you become a part of the church instead of just going to church.
More Wealth and Riches in your life!
Dexter
: Dexter Sun Oct 18, 2009 - 12:27:04
If you join a mega church or a small church my advice is to find out about the home bible studies and get involved with one. It will give you the opportunity to know people one on one instead of just going to church service and seeing different faces each time. In this way, you become a part of the church instead of just going to church.
There is much truth to what you say.
In a smaller church it is easier to help someone else...because resources are not spread too thin.
In a larger church setting, people get lost in the shufffle, and indivdiual help is often lacking.
You can get "lost" in any church big or small if you do not build relationships.
Also I would suggest getting an accountability partner of the same sex.
Dexter
By their very nature....a mega-church.... does not...have the saving truth of God.
In other words, they do not teach a person the truths, of the Plan of Salvation.
Just look at the Roman Catholic church...now, that is the world's largest mega church.
What is the definition of a mega church in how you understand it?
: Dexter Mon Oct 19, 2009 - 22:54:19
What is the definition of a mega church in how you understand it?
I think a mega church has too many people in it basicly, to provided individual attention to a person's needs.
How many people in a mega church gets individual attention by the Pastor ?
The more people, the harder it is to really get to know to each and every person.
Does that make sense ?
: 3AM Mon Oct 19, 2009 - 22:42:06
By their very nature....a mega-church.... does not...have the saving truth of God.
In other words, they do not teach a person the truths, of the Plan of Salvation.
Just look at the Roman Catholic church...now, that is the world's largest mega church.
Friend we must be misunderstanding each other or something. i still dont follow at all what you meant by the scripture, nor your follow up.....it just doesnt make any sense to me at all in the context of a large church or a small one.
Then this about the Catholic church being mega....maybe you dont realize we are talking about ONE church building with lots of people, not a mega denomination.
I couldnt disagree more that they dont teach the Word of God in very large churches. Sure, some are off into prosperity stuff and Im not into that stuff...but most are VERY effective communicators of Gods salvation. The thing is, smaller churches have equally likelihood to get off kilter, especially in charismata, tons of smaller so called "full gospel" churches out there that are not teaching salvation, but rather engage in a form of holy spirit worship...thats primarily one problem that IS more prevalent in small churches.
it goes both ways, but you wont find scripture to affirm either. Unless, like someone said, folks will talk about the "small churches in the NT"....but were they really? They were a church for an entire city/region....that the population was small is not relevant, if anything they modeled the mega church model.
: BAH-BLAH Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 10:30:45
Friend we must be misunderstanding each other or something. i still dont follow at all what you meant by the scripture, nor your follow up.....it just doesnt make any sense to me at all in the context of a large church or a small one.
Then this about the Catholic church being mega....maybe you dont realize we are talking about ONE church building with lots of people, not a mega denomination.
I couldnt disagree more that they dont teach the Word of God in very large churches. Sure, some are off into prosperity stuff and Im not into that stuff...but most are VERY effective communicators of Gods salvation. The thing is, smaller churches have equally likelihood to get off kilter, especially in charismata, tons of smaller so called "full gospel" churches out there that are not teaching salvation, but rather engage in a form of holy spirit worship...thats primarily one problem that IS more prevalent in small churches.
it goes both ways, but you wont find scripture to affirm either. Unless, like someone said, folks will talk about the "small churches in the NT"....but were they really? They were a church for an entire city/region....that the population was small is not relevant, if anything they modeled the mega church model.
Because of a lack of persecution concerning Christians.....that is the reason large churches abound.
When in past ages it was a death sentence to be a Christian, churches were small.
"There is another and more important question that should engage the attention of the churches of today.
The apostle Paul declares that "
all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution." 2 Timothy 3:12.
Why is it, then, that persecution seems in a great degree to slumber?
The only reason is that the church has conformed to the world's standard and therefore awakens no opposition.
The religion which is current in our day is not of the pure and holy character that marked the Christian faith in the days of Christ and His apostles.
It is only because of the spirit of compromise with sin, because the great truths of the word of God are so indifferently regarded, because there is so little vital godliness in the church, that Christianity is apparently so popular with the world.
Let there be a revival of the faith and power of the early church, and the spirit of persecution will be revived, and the fires of persecution will be rekindled".
(From the book: "Great Controversy", by E. G. White)
3AM:
Some good comments there.
There is a verse in the Bible which says, Woe, when all men speak well of thee. Huge numbers of approving ppl are not healthy, at least, in this life.
: 3AM Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 11:43:53
: BAH-BLAH Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 10:30:45
Friend we must be misunderstanding each other or something. i still dont follow at all what you meant by the scripture, nor your follow up.....it just doesnt make any sense to me at all in the context of a large church or a small one.
Then this about the Catholic church being mega....maybe you dont realize we are talking about ONE church building with lots of people, not a mega denomination.
I couldnt disagree more that they dont teach the Word of God in very large churches. Sure, some are off into prosperity stuff and Im not into that stuff...but most are VERY effective communicators of Gods salvation. The thing is, smaller churches have equally likelihood to get off kilter, especially in charismata, tons of smaller so called "full gospel" churches out there that are not teaching salvation, but rather engage in a form of holy spirit worship...thats primarily one problem that IS more prevalent in small churches.
it goes both ways, but you wont find scripture to affirm either. Unless, like someone said, folks will talk about the "small churches in the NT"....but were they really? They were a church for an entire city/region....that the population was small is not relevant, if anything they modeled the mega church model.
Because of a lack of persecution concerning Christians.....that is the reason large churches abound.
When in past ages it was a death sentence to be a Christian, churches were small.
"There is another and more important question that should engage the attention of the churches of today.
The apostle Paul declares that "all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution." 2 Timothy 3:12.
Why is it, then, that persecution seems in a great degree to slumber?
The only reason is that the church has conformed to the world's standard and therefore awakens no opposition.
The religion which is current in our day is not of the pure and holy character that marked the Christian faith in the days of Christ and His apostles.
It is only because of the spirit of compromise with sin, because the great truths of the word of God are so indifferently regarded, because there is so little vital godliness in the church, that Christianity is apparently so popular with the world.
Let there be a revival of the faith and power of the early church, and the spirit of persecution will be revived, and the fires of persecution will be rekindled".
(From the book: "Great Controversy", by E. G. White)
: farouk Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 11:56:37
3AM:
Some good comments there.
There is a verse in the Bible which says, Woe, when all men speak well of thee. Huge numbers of approving ppl are not healthy, at least, in this life.
: 3AM Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 11:43:53
: BAH-BLAH Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 10:30:45
Friend we must be misunderstanding each other or something. i still dont follow at all what you meant by the scripture, nor your follow up.....it just doesnt make any sense to me at all in the context of a large church or a small one.
Then this about the Catholic church being mega....maybe you dont realize we are talking about ONE church building with lots of people, not a mega denomination.
I couldnt disagree more that they dont teach the Word of God in very large churches. Sure, some are off into prosperity stuff and Im not into that stuff...but most are VERY effective communicators of Gods salvation. The thing is, smaller churches have equally likelihood to get off kilter, especially in charismata, tons of smaller so called "full gospel" churches out there that are not teaching salvation, but rather engage in a form of holy spirit worship...thats primarily one problem that IS more prevalent in small churches.
it goes both ways, but you wont find scripture to affirm either. Unless, like someone said, folks will talk about the "small churches in the NT"....but were they really? They were a church for an entire city/region....that the population was small is not relevant, if anything they modeled the mega church model.
Because of a lack of persecution concerning Christians.....that is the reason large churches abound.
When in past ages it was a death sentence to be a Christian, churches were small.
"There is another and more important question that should engage the attention of the churches of today.
The apostle Paul declares that "all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution." 2 Timothy 3:12.
Why is it, then, that persecution seems in a great degree to slumber?
The only reason is that the church has conformed to the world's standard and therefore awakens no opposition.
The religion which is current in our day is not of the pure and holy character that marked the Christian faith in the days of Christ and His apostles.
It is only because of the spirit of compromise with sin, because the great truths of the word of God are so indifferently regarded, because there is so little vital godliness in the church, that Christianity is apparently so popular with the world.
Let there be a revival of the faith and power of the early church, and the spirit of persecution will be revived, and the fires of persecution will be rekindled".
(From the book: "Great Controversy", by E. G. White)
Yea thats easily applicable
200 approving people...thats OK....er....or....is it 100, or no....must be 50....or what about 2000 people?
Come on folks you let preference on subjective things inform your opinion here.
satan understands the advantage of large churches.
He has greater control over the Christian world thru large churches, than small ones.
Think about it !
I praise God for both large and small churches that are preaching His word! Both have their purpose.
Let's rejoice that we live in a Country that allows freedom of religion. There are many Countries that do not and they have to have secret meetings to even worship together. We are a blessed nation and I pray we continue to be grateful weather we worship in a mega or small church.
Christ's church on the day of Pentecost had 3000 members. Is that a mega church?
: Jaime Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 18:14:41
Christ's church on the day of Pentecost had 3000 members. Is that a mega church?
YEAH...that is a mega church...
everyone is so sure that everyone else is so wicked...or something other than their particular church (if they actually attend regularly) is wicked and sinful...
That is rediculous. Sure they are filled with people who still sin...but that is because they are people. duhhhhh...
We have eyewitness accounts that there exists intimacy and dedication to scripture in mega churchs just like there is in small churchs...as well as there are mega churchs that don't...just like small churchs that don't. (I Know of one burning bibles at the moment,,,and putting out a list of those they think will never be saved and the sins as to why on their website right now)
You don't have to be persecuted to be a Christian...but it helps. Count the cost...can you live a riskier lifestyle than you can now by living out your faith? If not...ok then fine...if you can then get to work.
No browbeating here...them lessons are long old, tiring, and proven to be not right most of the time. We live for the Good News/ Gospel...which is anything but "everyone everywhere is wicked except for me" type thinking.
I went to two different ones for a total of 7 years. I think it cost be about 3 years growth on my journey overall (feel that's what God showed me afterwards.)
I could go on and on about why megachurchs are unhealthy and have done many posts on them in the past, (so don't want to now.)
Basically they don't pastor people because they can't. They claim they do but the numbers of actual pastors on team and people in the church don't tend to add up in your average mega church. And even if they do, you still don't get the kind of personal interaction from the leadership that a christian needs.
They leave the congregation to basically 'pastor themselves' through small groups. Which means it doesn't actually happen.
If a church leader is ethical, when a church gets to a certain size that moves beyond their ability to properly oversee it (which in reality is about 50, but it can stretch with help of lay and co-pastors to about 300 from what I've seen), they need to humble themselves and start splitting the church up under seperate pastors. If the church absolutly loves the first pastor, there can be some sort of arrangement put together where churchs meet in their own small church one week under the eye of someone who knows them (their own pastor) and then go to the other church on alternative weeks.
But in my experience, most mega church leaders have too much ego (and sorry I have to say that but it's true) to do something like that.
Once you stop pastoring your congregation, you arn't a pastor, and if you don't make sure it happens some other way (instead of just claiming it is, when it's not) you arn't deserving the position of leading a church because you've sold out.
And there are many more reasons, but initially that's probably the most obvious.
Mega churches are the Biblical proof ....that they don't teach the WHOLE Gospel message.
Mega churches are based on popularity......and, God reveals that the Biblical concept of TRUE Christianity, will never be popular.
The Lord Jesus Himself spoke of His 'little flock'.
: Jaime Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 18:14:41
Christ's church on the day of Pentecost had 3000 members. Is that a mega church?
Do we need to correct terminology?
"church" is all Christ-followers everywhere.
Maybe we should start using the term "Mega-Congregation".
Ms P:
Yes, there is a distinction between 'general assembly and church of the firstborn which is written in heaven' (Hebrews), and a local church. The difference is important.
I'm suprised at some of the replies. I did not expect to read responses on mega churches being anti-christ[in so many words thats what some are saying]. Could i have a mod lock this since it's not benefiting anyone.
: armywifenmom Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 12:01:25
I'm suprised at some of the replies. I did not expect to read responses on mega churches being anti-christ[in so many words thats what some are saying]. Could i have a mod lock this since it's not benefiting anyone.
I don't think it would be appropriate for me to lock this forum because of things that are being said as of yet.
: 3AM Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:23:38
Mega churches are the Biblical proof ....that they don't teach the WHOLE Gospel message.
Mega churches are based on popularity......and, God reveals that the Biblical concept of TRUE Christianity, will never be popular.
Who tells you this stuff? Do you base much in your life on gossip and inuendo? You must, or you have the gift of omnipresence, because these generalizations are incredible.
I love these claims..."God reveals TRUE Christianity (the unwritten portion of that being YOU found it...right?)
So, how many folks can gather then? Or can we even gather? What is it that measures mega vs not mega? 20, 500, 1000? instead of how it is done wrong, tell us how to do it right please?
: BAH-BLAH Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 12:44:39
: 3AM Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:23:38
Mega churches are the Biblical proof ....that they don't teach the WHOLE Gospel message.
Mega churches are based on popularity......and, God reveals that the Biblical concept of TRUE Christianity, will never be popular.
Who tells you this stuff? Do you base much in your life on gossip and inuendo? You must, or you have the gift of omnipresence, because these generalizations are incredible.
I love these claims..."God reveals TRUE Christianity (the unwritten portion of that being YOU found it...right?)
So, how many folks can gather then? Or can we even gather? What is it that measures mega vs not mega? 20, 500, 1000? instead of how it is done wrong, tell us how to do it right please?
3AM is a Seventh Day Adventist and believes their doctrine. Naturally, he would not agree with an evangelical type "mega-church."
To 3AM the vast majority of churches do not teach the full gospel message. In order to meet that criteria, your church would have to be Seventh Day Adventist.
: armywifenmom Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 12:01:25
I'm suprised at some of the replies. I did not expect to read responses on mega churches being anti-christ[in so many words thats what some are saying]. Could i have a mod lock this since it's not benefiting anyone.
I second that motion Army
My college student belongs to one of those Mega churches, and I visit when he plays the keyboard. I think it's a good thing! Getting the young people into a traditional church would turn out like the 70's and 80's when they completely abandoned Christianity for Rock Festivals. Now they can do their Rock stuff inside and get a watered down version of Christian preaching. There are things that the young people don't want shouted into their faces, like blood, sin, hell, etc. When we walk into that place we are greeted by massive tables of donuts, Baguio, sweet rolls, and coffee. There is also a Starbucks lounge inside the entrance where we sat down and reviewed the Bible Verses for the sermon for that Sunday. Opposite the main auditorium there was a small chapel for the old folks where organ music and hymns were sung. Truthfully, I enjoyed the Praise and Worship Service, and as a Charismatic I was allowed pray in the Spirit. All theology was out the window, and everyone was praising Jesus without any restraints. As a true blue Catholic I would say that the Mega Churches are the only real competition that the Catholics have.
: phoebe Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:34:54
Do we need to correct terminology?
"church" is all Christ-followers everywhere.
AH...and there is the rub !
How many churches in the world are followers of what Jesus said to do ?
The vast majority of the Christian world observes Sunday, as a day of worship, when Jesus Christ never said to do such a thiing as that.
The true followers of Jesus Christ will do, as HE did.......
1 Peter 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us,
leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
: 3AM Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 16:37:29
: phoebe Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:34:54
Do we need to correct terminology?
"church" is all Christ-followers everywhere.
AH...and there is the rub !
How many churches in the world are followers of what Jesus said to do ?
The vast majority of the Christian world observes Sunday, as a day of worship, when Jesus Christ never said to do such a thiing as that.
The true followers of Jesus Christ will do, as HE did.......
1 Peter 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
This is the precise junk that needs to be removed from this thread...
This is a denomination specific comment that is inapropriate for the general forum...
This website is called
GRACEcentered Christian Forums...not the SDA Mandatory forum....meaning we have to extend grace to people who for some reason don't get basic principles of Christianity like you haven't yet there 3am
: phoebe Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:34:54
: Jaime Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 18:14:41
Christ's church on the day of Pentecost had 3000 members. Is that a mega church?
Do we need to correct terminology?
"church" is all Christ-followers everywhere.
Maybe we should start using the term "Mega-Congregation".
Mega Buiding would be closer!
The "churches in Corinth, Thessalonica, Ephesus etc had no church building, but could by some definition be considered Mega
churches. City wide congregations are what is referenced in scripture other than groups only large enough to meet in someone's home (a first century care group, if you will)
: armywifenmom Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 12:01:25
I'm suprised at some of the replies. I did not expect to read responses on mega churches being anti-christ[in so many words thats what some are saying]. Could i have a mod lock this since it's not benefiting anyone.
Hello armywifenmom.
This is a another example of what the reformation has done to Christians. Politics-politics-politics! I read through this thread and it seems like everyone missed the point that we belong to Jesus as a group, and not individually like the World tells us. Every time I hear a Protestant give his testimony about his personal relationship with Jesus, I can't help but remember that we celebrate the Holly Catholic Mass as a community. As a Catholic, when I pray in the Spirit with one of those Protestant Mega Congregations it's awesome. It's not me praying individually, but the body of Christ in the unity of the Holy Spirit praising and worshiping Jesus. The sound of living waters. The sound of Heaven.
b:
What you say is unhelpful.
The Reformation brought an emphasis on the Bible which people could read freely for themselves, instead of having to rely on a hierarchy to tell them what it was supposed to mean.
: Jaime Fri Oct 23, 2009 - 08:16:14
: phoebe Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 11:34:54
: Jaime Tue Oct 20, 2009 - 18:14:41
Christ's church on the day of Pentecost had 3000 members. Is that a mega church?
Do we need to correct terminology?
"church" is all Christ-followers everywhere.
Maybe we should start using the term "Mega-Congregation".
Mega Buiding would be closer!
The "churches in Corinth, Thessalonica, Ephesus etc had no church building, but could by some definition be considered Mega
churches. City wide congregations are what is referenced in scripture other than groups only large enough to meet in someone's home (a first century care group, if you will)
I agree 100%. Ive no issue that some like small and some like big. I do have issues as I said with the sort of purist aura that comes through in the anti-mega church posts....but more...when they start down the NT precident road, they hoist themselves with their own petard. If you extrapolated the early church, into today, with city sizes and populations, we'd be in MEGA GIGA UBER SUPER DUPER churches
...but the Lord saves individuals, and individuals on the way to heaven are on the straight and narrow way; this often means the groups of Christians they meet with are smaller rather than larger.
: 3am1 Peter 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
: johnDBThis is a denomination specific comment that is inapropriate for the general forum...
Actually it's a very true scripture that denominations often ignore (which is consequently one of the main reasons we have denominations in the first place.)
Grace is not a license to ignore scripture. (Although it seems to be used too often as an excuse in that context.)
Interestingly enough, when I was in a mega-church, I didn't want to hear anything bad about them either. However time showed up just why do many people are against them. Hindsight is a helpful thing.
I wouldn't advise anyone else to get it the way I did though. (Just pray if you really care.)
Hindsight is 20/20, yes....
In smaller chuches people most likely realize how much you don't need to worship God.
Personally, I like smaller crowds.
: Flying To Fri Oct 23, 2009 - 22:44:54
In smaller chuches people most likely realize how much you don't need to worship God.
Personally, I like smaller crowds.
Worship lifts us to a higher place. We are like the Angles standing around the Throne of Heaven. Worship in the Spirit is the sound of Heaven. Heaven knows that we were Destined to be together God.
I think churches with paisley patterned curtains are best.
: JohnDB Thu Oct 22, 2009 - 19:19:11
This is the precise junk that needs to be removed from this thread...
This is a denomination specific comment that is inapropriate for the general forum...
This website is called GRACEcentered Christian Forums...not the SDA Mandatory forum....meaning we have to extend grace to people who for some reason don't get basic principles of Christianity like you haven't yet there 3am
You must have missed what Jesus said then ?
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you:
So, tell me...when did Jesus ever tell anyone to keep Sunday, in honor of HIS Resurrection ?
: farouk Fri Oct 23, 2009 - 09:29:48
b:
What you say is unhelpful.
The Reformation brought an emphasis on the Bible which people could read freely for themselves, instead of having to rely on a hierarchy to tell them what it was supposed to mean.
AH...but people, being basicly lazy, do want to read and study (too much work).
They want to be told what to believe.....and, it does not matter to them.
They think that a basic belief in Christ's Death, Burial, and Resurrection, is all they need to know to get into heaven.......BIG MISTAKE !!!
: BAH-BLAH Sun Oct 25, 2009 - 08:58:09
I think churches with paisley patterned curtains are best.
If there was a "Post of the Thread" award...it has to go to this one.
Best post I seen all day. ::tippinghat::
: JohnDB Sun Oct 25, 2009 - 19:52:43
: BAH-BLAH Sun Oct 25, 2009 - 08:58:09
I think churches with paisley patterned curtains are best.
If there was a "Post of the Thread" award...it has to go to this one.
Best post I seen all day. ::tippinghat::
Thanks, I guess you were able to penetrate the superficial, to "drill down" to the deeper meaning, and fling yourself into the rapids of profundity it contained...
or...you like paisley..either way....cool
Hi,
my body is the temple Christ dwells in, I've never been called megga but I guess there's always a first time,lol.
God does not reside in stone buildings, He does however reside in our bodies, those who realise this truth also succumb to the sovereignity of God, knowing their will is not free and that you are no longer of your own. God then comes in a baptism of fire to control and correct you, it's a painful process.