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Women can be big liars also.  I am going through a divorce because my wife decided to cheat.

Texas conservative, no one is saying they cant lie as well.

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 18:57:09
Texas conservative, no one is saying they cant lie as well.

I think women are gaining a lot of equality these days, the sad fact is a lot of this equality is in sinful behaviors.

So basically for 20 years he has been doing this and you have only just found out? Now that is very hard because you must feel that it was all a lie.  Its one thing to go once and to be found out, but when he knew that you felt so strongly and did it anyway that is hard for you. No wonder you are struggling to trust him now because he has not shown himself in anyway trustworthy all your married life.
One thing a friend of mine did once was to ask God if He could reveal what her husband was doing. She was pretty sure he was cheating but had no proof. Well within a short time God showed her proof.  Could you do that? Ask God to show you if he has lied about the cheating and if he is still doing anything like that. At least you will know where you stand then.     Do you know if he is still looking at porn?

Quote from: soterion on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 18:50:46
rmcbdd14,

I work in an environment where I have the opportunity to listen to a variety of women tell me their relationship issues. Not as my profession, but just because I am there and I am a good listener. And sometimes, not very often though, I can give decent advice.

I don't really have any advice now, maybe a bit, but mainly just a point of view. You said something a few posts ago that I concluded to be the greatest sin that can occur in any relationship. You said your husband took you for granted.

Taking a spouse for granted is the greatest sin of all in a marriage. I say this because I hear about the abuse, the cheating, the abandonment, and all the other evils that men do. Women can be just as bad, but it seems more prevalent in men. I had to conclude, from all the years of listening to what all is going on in households, that the husbands just assumed their marriages and they took their wives for granted. I even listen to some of the husbands and the way they talk about their wives, their marriages, and such, and they are despicable. Marriage has lost its value and meaning for so many out there.

This conclusion is also supported by the fact that everything we do and say in life is based on our attitudes. Our attitude toward ourselves and toward others and toward our circumstances determines our behavior. My point is that when a man takes his wife for granted, he feels free to do anything he wants, because he assumes she will always be there. The marriage is no longer treasured, the wife is no longer adored, the family is no longer the focus. He can go and cheat, he can abuse, he can leave and stay out all hours with no accountability, etc. The seemingly harmless attitude of taking somebody for granted leads to all sorts of misery and pain.

If your husband has changed his attitude toward you and what you two have shared over the years, then he will open up and tell the truth, if he hasn't already. Is he a very proud man? If so, opening up will be more difficult for him. He needs to know that he cannot assume your love for him any longer. He has to earn it. If his attitude has truly changed, he won't mess up like that again. You're going to have to look for signs of a changed attitude. Only you will know what to look for.

In the meantime, if you want your marriage to work, go with chosenone's advice in the post just previous to this one. Also, in the meantime, prayer is a powerful gift given to us by God. I'm not talking about just you praying, but us, too. May God give you strength and patience, as well as discernment.

Thank you for your insight.  Yes, he is an extremely proud, private person.  He also can't take criticism.  He is so proud that I highly doubt he tells me the entire truth. He doesn't want to look bad or have me more disappointed in him.  I honestly feel that he is now afraid of losing me.

Is he changing....  I see some changes...  He has shared passwords with me and stopped going out with his friends who aren't holding God's values.  He stopped going to those places.  He said he only went because his friends wanted to go.  Whatever...

I am not at the point of divorce.  I need more time to sort through all of this and see if he truly changes.  I wish there was a way to know if he told me the entire truth or not.  If he cheated on me with another woman...or stripper.... I don't want to stay in this marriage.  He knows this.  This is why I think he will never tell me if he did this, because he knows he will lose me over it.

This has been so difficult.  I would not wish this pain on anyone.

I will pray to the Holy Spirit that he tells my husband to tell me the entire truth.

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 19:04:41
So basically for 20 years he has been doing this and you have only just found out? Now that is very hard because you must feel that it was all a lie.  Its one thing to go once and to be found out, but when he knew that you felt so strongly and did it anyway that is hard for you. No wonder you are struggling to trust him now because he has not shown himself in anyway trustworthy all your married life.
One thing a friend of mine did once was to ask God if He could reveal what her husband was doing. She was pretty sure he was cheating but had no proof. Well within a short time God showed her proof.  Could you do that? Ask God to show you if he has lied about the cheating and if he is still doing anything like that. At least you will know where you stand then.     Do you know if he is still looking at porn?

That is correct. That is exactly how I feel. I will ask God to reveal if my husband is still lying to me.  I hope he isn't still looking at porn.  I haven't caught him looking... But who knows. He has a smart phone...

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

Firesword believe me my life has shown me all too well the low morals and terrible behavior that many have, far more than you have seen in your life I expect, but we dont have to be the same. We dont have to look at porn or watch films with sex and bad language in, or stare at semi naked people, nor read raunchy books, nor watch the ads on tv.
If you look into the history of what was happening in the time of the early church, there was masses of immorality and violence. Porn was around in my parents generation, it was just different porn, in mags. Yes there are many temptations around, which is why we need to do all we can to avoid them. 

I want to thank everyone for their insight, feedback, opinions, suggestions etc... This forum is awesome.

I have been tormented by this for 2 years.  Probably closer to 3 years now.  This is the only way I can sum up my marriage:


I value marriage, but my husband obviously took it for granted.
My husband had bad (friends) influences in his life.
My husband lied to me for many years.
I had to find out on my own. Now that I found out my husband is remorseful and upset he got caught...He wants to try to work things out between us.
I fluctuate between trying to work things out and getting a divorce.  I go back and forth.  The flashbacks, betrayal, lies, and triggers are very hard for me to deal with.
I doubt him now.
I don't believe he told me the entire truth. I think there is more, but he refuses to admit (too proud). He also feels if he tells me that will be the end of our relationship.
I am not sure if I can truly recover from the hurt.
The porn, strip clubs and lapdances (with touching breasts) kills me.  He has destroyed our marriage and I am angry with him that he was so stupid to risk our marriage for this crap.

With that said... I do believe in forgiveness. It is just difficult for me.  I am not sure if I can do it.  It has been close to 3 years now and I still have not forgiven him. I am still angry. 

He refuses to open up more. He is sticking to his story.  If he did open up and tell me the entire truth, then at least I will know everything and I won't feel like I am trying to re-build our marriage on lies. 

I do not think he had an affair.  I do not think he had sex with anyone.  But, I do know those lap dances can get quite physical. (Grinding in the lap & touching breasts with hands and mouth).

I feel that I am not good enough and that I am not special to him. He risked everything for a strip club. I just can't get over that.

I prayed to God last night for help.  I need help.  My depression and anxiety is not going away.

I am so sad.

rmc, have you been able to have any sort of counselling about all this? Have you any close Christian friends who you could tell and who could pray with you? 
The thing is that the forgiveness thing is something that you will need to do whether you end the marriage or not. I believe that you have Biblical reason to end the marriage, and forgiveness doesnt have to mean that you stay, but even if you divorce him you need to forgive, not for HIS sake, but for YOURS. All it is doing is making you ill. Forgiveness doesn't depend on feelings but on a decision. A decision that has to be made over and over sometimes. The reason God wants you to forgive is because if you don't you will not feel better or heal.
Forgiveness doesnt mean taking him off the hook, but it is taking him off YOUR hook, and putting him on GODS hook, so that HE can deal with him in HIS way. If you dont let it go, God cant act.

Yes it is very hurtful and damaging for you. Thats why God so strongly tells us to be faithful and to keep the marriage bed pure, something that your husband never did it seems. I feel for you so much, but for YOUR sake please get help to deal with this and let it go into Gods hands. I am wondering if a set time of separation would enable you to have space to think, pray and get that outside help to deal with this, and to ask God for clear direction for the future.     

I agree with what you are saying. I need to pray, meditate, and clearly think about all my options.  I have a lot of thinking to do.  Thank you for your advice.  I think I will look up a Christian Marriage Counselor in my area. Maybe they can help me.

Yes great idea, maybe your pastor can recommend someone.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
Now that I found out my husband is remorseful and upset he got caught...He wants to try to work things out between us.

I doubt him now.

I don't believe he told me the entire truth. I think there is more, but he refuses to admit (too proud). He also feels if he tells me that will be the end of our relationship.

Dear RMcB,

One thing I would like to interject here is that very often our spouses will love us as much as they are capable of loving at that point in their spiritual development.  In other words, even though your husband was doing this for 20 years, he was probably only vaguely aware of how wrong it was--and how hurtful to you--and he still wanted to think of himself as a good husband.

Your finding out about his behavior was a real "wake-up call" for him, and it's likely that he is still in the process of sorting things out and accepting the reality of his sin.  For a long time he thought what he was doing was OK, and now he has to deal with the fact that he has been telling himself a lie for all these years, and he really wasn't such a "good husband"--this can be harder for a man than you'd think!

What I'm concerned about here is that your pushing him to "come clean" about everything right now is only making this process that much harder for him, and it might just push him to the point of giving up, and saying, "OK, so you don't think I'm capable of repenting and working on our marriage?  Well, now just wait and see just how 'incapable' I can be!"

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
I am not sure if I can truly recover from the hurt.

"... with God all things are possible." (Mt. 19:26)

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
... I do believe in forgiveness. It is just difficult for me.  I am not sure if I can do it.  It has been close to 3 years now and I still have not forgiven him. I am still angry.  He refuses to open up more.  He is sticking to his story.

One thing I can tell you with absolute certainty is that men don't open up in an environment where they sense hostility.  There's no way you can change this.

Now, you did point out that

QuoteHe has shared passwords with me and stopped going out with his friends who aren't holding God's values.

This is good.  This is progress--Rome wasn't built in a day.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
If he did open up and tell me the entire truth, then at least I will know everything and I won't feel like I am trying to re-build our marriage on lies.

I do not think he had an affair.  I do not think he had sex with anyone.  But, I do know those lap dances can get quite physical.

If I'm reading you right here, it's not that you think he's doing anything NOW, nor do you think he actually had sex with anyone, but you would just like him to give you all the "gory details" of his experience during those 20 years.  Can you see where this might actually do more harm than good?

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
I feel that I am not good enough and that I am not special to him.  He risked everything for a strip club.  I just can't get over that.

There's something I think I really need to share with you here.  *Most* men have a much harder time than most women in seeing the right relationship between sex and love.  What I mean is, many of us can understand the connection intellectually, but it isn't second nature for us, the way it seems to be for many women.  What *is* second nature for many of us is to see a woman who is particularly good looking--or even not so good looking, but in skimpy clothes--and have an immediate hormonal reaction.  Some of us will work to overcome this, but many can't see the point--they think, "If my body tells me that sex and love are completely different things, then I guess they are!"  Most of us are somewhere in the middle, which leaves us subject to influences like peer pressure.  This is how decent men get sucked into some bad things--which seems to be what happened with your husband.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Wed Sep 24, 2014 - 09:44:30
I prayed to God last night for help.  I need help.  My depression and anxiety is not going away.

I am so sad.

May He hear and answer your prayers!

Epiphanius,

Thank you for your feedback.  I am very pleased to get so many responses to my original post.  I come here frequently to seek advice, guidance and comfort.  God has drawn me to this forum.

I have made some decisions (Even though I sway back and forth).  I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt. We have a very long history together (married over 20 years).  I have noticed that he is cleaning the house, doing dishes, shopping and cooking to try to make things up to me.  He says I Love You every day to me now.  He is looking for an Anniversary Ring to buy me now.  He started to go back to Church.

I know he is remorseful for what he has done in the past and I truly believe he was negatively influenced by his co-workers/friends.  Peer Pressure can make you do things that you normally don't do.  However, he caused me great pain which I won't ever forget.  He broke trust in our marriage.

I do not think ( I am almost positive ) he ever had intercourse with another woman. My gut tells me this.  However, I know he went to several strip clubs and got lap dances.  I am not sure how many lap dances he has had and I will never no the truth, because he refuses to come clean about this.  I am not sure how many strip clubs he has been to, because he refuses to come clean about this.  I don't believe he went often.  Based on my digging, and remembering the details about the past, I believe he only went to strip clubs when he went out with his Guy Friends...  So, I am guessing out of the 20 years we have been married, I believe he has been to about 15 strip clubs.  I am not happy about this at all. And if I ever catch him walking into another strip club I will file for divorce papers. 

I am giving him another chance to make things up to me.  If he truly loves me he will do what it takes to make things up to me.

He obviously knew I would be upset, because he knew how I felt about strip clubs. This is why he kept it from me.  However, his friends that went with him were also married and his own Father went to strip clubs, so I think he felt it wasn't that big of a deal. I think he felt I was being a prude about it and he lied to me about it to avoid an argument. He wanted to go with his friends and didn't realize how devastated I would be. He knew I would be mad, but not devastated.

Now that he knows how heartbroken I am after finding out, his views have changed about strip clubs.  He now believes that married men should not attend these type of places.

I am waiting to see what happens.  I am giving him a second chance.  I am giving him the benefit of the doubt.  He denies going to more than 3 strip clubs and having more than one lap dance (which I highly doubt) etc... However, he is sticking to his story, because I think if he comes clean now he thinks my depression will get even worse.   I also believe that the "holes" in his story etc... is making me believe the worst... I am imagining the worst.  My fear is making me imagine the worst of the worst... etc...  I think doubt is making things worse for me. 

I would like to here your feedback and suggestions on my new plan.

Thank you!

rmcbdd14,

I think you are being very forbearing to him, more so than many women I have known in the past, and I think that's wonderful.

I would look for two things. One, how much more respectful is he growing toward you? Is he honoring your needs in how he treats you and speaks to you, etc? Is he shunning the bad influences of his friends, etc?

But, much more important is number two: how is he growing spiritually? Some people believe that a person cannot change. I believe people can change, but it will take the power of God to bring about changes. If your husband is going to truly change, he needs to grow in his relationship with God. If he is going to be a more faithful and respectful husband, he needs to grow in Christ.

Look for more time spent in the word and prayer. Look for perhaps more involvement in church (just the fact that he is going back counts as more involvement). Over time, if he is really growing, it will be noticeable in his words and actions. I would focus on growth in Christ first, simply because any true growth in his relationship with you is dependent on the former.

Regarding what all he had done in the past; I think you ought to let it go. More and more pressure will give negative results- on both of you. Let the past go and focus on the present and the future.

Oh, and keep on praying.

You are very sweet to give him this chance, so I hope in time he will appreciate it.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Mon Oct 06, 2014 - 16:04:00
I have noticed that he is cleaning the house, doing dishes, shopping and cooking to try to make things up to me.  He says I Love You every day to me now.  He is looking for an Anniversary Ring to buy me now.  He started to go back to Church.

I know he is remorseful for what he has done in the past ...

Some *very* hopeful signs!  I know you still need to be cautious, and that trust takes a long time to rebuild.  What concerns me here is that you still seem obsessed with digging out all the sordid details:

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Mon Oct 06, 2014 - 16:04:00
I am not sure how many lap dances he has had and I will never no the truth, because he refuses to come clean about this.  I am not sure how many strip clubs he has been to, because he refuses to come clean about this [...] I am not happy about this at all.  And if I ever catch him walking into another strip club I will file for divorce papers.

I assume that his "refusal" means you've been demanding to know.  However, you already know several things:

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Mon Oct 06, 2014 - 16:04:00
I don't believe he went often.  Based on my digging, and remembering the details about the past, I believe he only went to strip clubs when he went out with his Guy Friends...  So, I am guessing out of the 20 years we have been married, I believe he has been to about 15 strip clubs.

RMcB, it sounds as though you have a lot to be thankful for.  No, it wasn't good, but if you've read some of the threads in this forum, you've seen quite a few cases in which Christian spouses have endured worse than this.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Mon Oct 06, 2014 - 16:04:00
I also believe that the "holes" in his story etc... is making me believe the worst... I am imagining the worst.  My fear is making me imagine the worst of the worst... etc...  I think doubt is making things worse for me. 

Let us both pray that you will be able to overcome this fear, which is not of God.  As St. John tells us,

Quote"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear has punishment. He who fears is not made perfect in love." (1 Jn. 4:18)

I have cheated on my wife through porn.  It is adultery and I confess that.

However, I have had multiple chances with beautiful women and I strongly rejected that.  The thought process was there, but I deliberately chose not to.

If I had, I would probably not tell my wife.  It would end our marriage.

Guilt would eat me alive, and my wife is a pretty amazing person. 

So where have you been going to meet all these women who are only too happy to cheat with a married man? Were they prostitutes? Escorts?

Quote from: Rankatha on Mon Oct 13, 2014 - 14:54:12
I have cheated on my wife through porn.  It is adultery and I confess that.

However, I have had multiple chances with beautiful women and I strongly rejected that.  The thought process was there, but I deliberately chose not to.

If I had, I would probably not tell my wife.  It would end our marriage.

Guilt would eat me alive, and my wife is a pretty amazing person.

I am happy to see that you have realized that looking at porn is a form of cheating on your wife.  I commend you for being able to realize this. So many men think watching porn is innocent, but it is not.  Porn degrades women. Views women as a piece of meat and puts lustful thoughts into mens' minds. 

You stated that you had multiple chances to cheat on your wife with beautiful women.  Can you elaborate on this?

Thank you!

Do you think that doubt and fear is put in our minds from the devil?

Quote from: soterion on Mon Oct 06, 2014 - 19:09:22
rmcbdd14,

I think you are being very forbearing to him, more so than many women I have known in the past, and I think that's wonderful.

I would look for two things. One, how much more respectful is he growing toward you? Is he honoring your needs in how he treats you and speaks to you, etc? Is he shunning the bad influences of his friends, etc?

But, much more important is number two: how is he growing spiritually? Some people believe that a person cannot change. I believe people can change, but it will take the power of God to bring about changes. If your husband is going to truly change, he needs to grow in his relationship with God. If he is going to be a more faithful and respectful husband, he needs to grow in Christ.

Look for more time spent in the word and prayer. Look for perhaps more involvement in church (just the fact that he is going back counts as more involvement). Over time, if he is really growing, it will be noticeable in his words and actions. I would focus on growth in Christ first, simply because any true growth in his relationship with you is dependent on the former.

Regarding what all he had done in the past; I think you ought to let it go. More and more pressure will give negative results- on both of you. Let the past go and focus on the present and the future.

Oh, and keep on praying.

You are very sweet to give him this chance, so I hope in time he will appreciate it.

Thank you for your response and feedback. It was extremely helpful. Yes, he is going to Church again! 
He has stopped going to those places and he has stopped being friends with those people who go to those type of places.
I think he got a wake up call and realized what he has done to our marriage.  He didn't have good parents as role models.  Dad was a abusive alcoholic.  Mom was in denial and allowed her husband to do whatever he wanted to do.  His own father would go to strip clubs and stay out till 3:00 a.m.  His Dad was never around for him. Never went to any of his birthday parties or watched the sports he played in...  His father was always at the bar getting drunk.  I have realized that his childhood has influenced his perception of what right and wrong was.  He didn't think he was doing anything "that" bad or "hurtful".  Now he knows the damaged he caused and he is trying to repair it.  Please continue to pray for my marriage.

Thank you!

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Fri Oct 17, 2014 - 11:53:13
I am happy to see that you have realized that looking at porn is a form of cheating on your wife.  I commend you for being able to realize this. So many men think watching porn is innocent, but it is not.  Porn degrades women. Views women as a piece of meat and puts lustful thoughts into mens' minds. 

Do you think it is true the other way around?

I came across a random statistic a couple of weeks ago that 60-70% of the gay male porn (men on men action) in the US was being watched by straight women.

If that is true, then it would seem that it cuts both ways.

I am not sure whether to believe it or not.

Quote from: DaveW on Fri Oct 17, 2014 - 12:23:21

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Fri Oct 17, 2014 - 11:53:13
I am happy to see that you have realized that looking at porn is a form of cheating on your wife.  I commend you for being able to realize this. So many men think watching porn is innocent, but it is not.  Porn degrades women. Views women as a piece of meat and puts lustful thoughts into mens' minds. 

Do you think it is true the other way around?

I came across a random statistic a couple of weeks ago that 60-70% of the gay male porn (men on men action) in the US was being watched by straight women.

If that is true, then it would seem that it cuts both ways.

I do think that a fair number of women look at porn, which is equally wrong, and I cant see many guys wanting their wives/partners to be looking at others guys in that way.

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Sat Sep 20, 2014 - 19:28:57
Hello-

In today's media, articles and multiple headlines have the same old topic sentence: Men will always cheat on their wives given the opportunity, because they are "wired" this way. They just can't help themselves. Even if they love their wives they will cheat on them in certain situations.

Today's divorce rate is close to 55%.  It says that one out of three men will cheat on their wives at least one time during their marriage.  It also said that most men believe cheating on your wife is only if you had intercourse with another woman, but other sexual activities are not cheating (kissing, making out, strip clubs). If men do cheat they usually never tell their wives about it.

What are your thoughts? Is this a myth? Is the media lying about their finding from surveys completed by men?  Do most men cheat on their wives if they knew they wouldn't get caught?  Would most men cheat on their wives given the opportunity with a beautiful woman, and if they were positive their wife wouldn't find out? If you cheated on your wife would you tell her? Would the guilt eat you alive?

I am very curious.  Has the male population been represented in a negative way? Is it a myth or is it true?

Thank you for responding!

All men and women are "wired" to do these things, because of the fall of man in the garden. Man kind is at the mercy of his/her flesh. I does not make any difference whether or not we are able to abstain from doing such things as just thinking about them is the same thing as doing them!!!! The only way to not do them is by "walking in the Spirit"

Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


Gal 5:16  But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

Tossing in another angle --- I believe some people are prone to cheating because it serves a sense of self-gratification. They do not serve The Lord in this thinking, they serve themselves and the enemy. In some of these cases the desire for sex has nothing to do with a lust for beauty. Men are not always tempted merely by a beautiful women, and neither are women for handsome men.

There is one way to end immorality, through repentance. The Holy Spirit is our strength. The two choices are faith, or rejection of the will of God.

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 16:50:47
I dont think we can blame the media and society for what we or our spouses do. You seem to be excusing his sin by blaming others for it. No, strip clubs arent everywhere, in fact they are pretty rare unless you go to a town or city that is known for that sort of thing and seek them out. Porn is there if you want it, but no one is forcing anyone to look at it and there are many ways of blocking those sites.

Do you both have a good church you go to? If not find one so that you can make godly friends. Stay away from ungodly ones who do this sort of thing. Get some good Christian teaching together.

No the Bible doesnt contradict itself. God says to forgive, but forgiveness doesn't always have to mean reconciliation or staying in the marriage if there has been cheating. Forgiveness is a separate issue whether the marriage survives or not. What you do is between you and God, but trust takes a very long time to build up again.  I am not sure you can make an informed decision or truly forgive if he isn't being honest with you. How can you forgive if you dont know what you are forgiving?

Maybe some Christian marriage counseling will help in this process and hopefully ensure that he is being honest.

It is true that we are the ones who choose to sin, but I do believe the media is greatly responsible for encouraging people to sin, especially sexual sin. You can change people's views and values by manipulating their minds. Look up "The Soviet Art of Brainwashing." When you live in a society similar to Sodom and Gomorrah, it's much more difficult to live a holy life.

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 22:54:12

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 16:50:47
I dont think we can blame the media and society for what we or our spouses do. You seem to be excusing his sin by blaming others for it. No, strip clubs arent everywhere, in fact they are pretty rare unless you go to a town or city that is known for that sort of thing and seek them out. Porn is there if you want it, but no one is forcing anyone to look at it and there are many ways of blocking those sites.

Do you both have a good church you go to? If not find one so that you can make godly friends. Stay away from ungodly ones who do this sort of thing. Get some good Christian teaching together.

No the Bible doesnt contradict itself. God says to forgive, but forgiveness doesn't always have to mean reconciliation or staying in the marriage if there has been cheating. Forgiveness is a separate issue whether the marriage survives or not. What you do is between you and God, but trust takes a very long time to build up again.  I am not sure you can make an informed decision or truly forgive if he isn't being honest with you. How can you forgive if you dont know what you are forgiving?

Maybe some Christian marriage counseling will help in this process and hopefully ensure that he is being honest.

It is true that we are the ones who choose to sin, but I do believe the media is greatly responsible for encouraging people to sin, especially sexual sin. You can change people's views and values by manipulating their minds. Look up "The Soviet Art of Brainwashing." When you live in a society similar to Sodom and Gomorrah, it's much more difficult to live a holy life.

Then avoid the media. We dont have to watch certain tv programmes or see films or read magazines if that is an issue. The film industry for example is a very ungodly one with nearly all films having some sort of sexual content in them these days, which is why me and my husband rarely watch them. Also the actors and actresses tend to live very ungodly lives. We need to be careful what we see and hear.   

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience? 

Quote from: chosenone on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:21:12

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience?

It will only be a matter of time before child abuse becomes the norm. Just a few decades ago abortion was illegal, now it's the norm. And I don't go to church. Too much hypocrisy and political correctness.

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:01:22

Quote from: chosenone on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:21:12

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience?

It will only be a matter of time before child abuse becomes the norm. Just a few decades ago abortion was illegal, now it's the norm. And I don't go to church. Too much hypocrisy and political correctness.

There are loads of good churches around, you just have to make the effort to try some. How many churches have you been to? THere will never be a perfect one, because its made up of imperfect people like you and I.  We are told not to stop meeting with other believers.

I don't agree that child abuse will become the norm. In my country the UK, children are far far more protected generally than they were 100 years ago, or even 50 years ago.

Quote from: chosenone on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:23:47

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:01:22

Quote from: chosenone on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:21:12

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience?

It will only be a matter of time before child abuse becomes the norm. Just a few decades ago abortion was illegal, now it's the norm. And I don't go to church. Too much hypocrisy and political correctness.

There are loads of good churches around, you just have to make the effort to try some. How many churches have you been to? THere will never be a perfect one, because its made up of imperfect people like you and I.  We are told not to stop meeting with other believers.

I don't agree that child abuse will become the norm. In my country the UK, children are far far more protected generally than they were 100 years ago, or even 50 years ago.

I also live in the UK and I do not believe children are more protected. Many schools now teach children the joys of anal sex. Children are being sexualized and child abuse is becoming more and more rampant, but remain in denial if it makes you feel better. Christians don't have to meet in church to gather together. Most churches are corrupt and politically correct, which is why I don't go to church.

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 12:09:55

Quote from: chosenone on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:23:47

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:01:22

Quote from: chosenone on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:21:12

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience?

It will only be a matter of time before child abuse becomes the norm. Just a few decades ago abortion was illegal, now it's the norm. And I don't go to church. Too much hypocrisy and political correctness.

There are loads of good churches around, you just have to make the effort to try some. How many churches have you been to? THere will never be a perfect one, because its made up of imperfect people like you and I.  We are told not to stop meeting with other believers.

I don't agree that child abuse will become the norm. In my country the UK, children are far far more protected generally than they were 100 years ago, or even 50 years ago.

I also live in the UK and I do not believe children are more protected. Many schools now teach children the joys of anal sex. Children are being sexualized and child abuse is becoming more and more rampant, but remain in denial if it makes you feel better. Christians don't have to meet in church to gather together. Most churches are corrupt and politically correct, which is why I don't go to church.

No most churches churches arent corrupt and politically correct, there are countless good churches. We have at least 4 or 5 good and godly churches in my small town alone.How many churches have you actually tried going to?

  I have 3 children, 2 step children and a grandson, I think I know a fair amount about kids and schools.
100 years ago most children had a terrible time, working all hours in horrible jobs, little education, abuse was rife, no child protection at all, kids living in the most appalling poverty that we can not imagine today. Many died in childbirth or in early childhood from disease or were crippled by polio. In so many ways things have improved.   

Quote from: chosenone on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 13:24:00

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 12:09:55

Quote from: chosenone on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:23:47

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Fri Feb 06, 2015 - 11:01:22

Quote from: chosenone on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:21:12

Quote from: Mr_Handsome on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 23:02:53

Quote from: FireSword on Tue Sep 23, 2014 - 09:30:32

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Sep 21, 2014 - 12:35:56
Yes there are temptations firewsword, for men and women, but there are many ways of not putting ourselves into that temptation. Blocking programmes for computers, not watching R rated movies, avoiding places where there will be scantily clad women etc. In the early churches time, there was masses of temptation and immorality around, hence much of Pauls teaching on morality, sexual sin and the importance of faithfulness etc.

Unfortunately your attitude is prevalent among the Church of apathy and putting their heads in the sand about the danger society is in. At the rate we are going west will become Sodom and Gomorrah, where people and strange flesh are regularly raped on the streets, how will the Church react then, when it's too late to change things.
Please excuse my graphic rant if you want to.
One guy I know showed me a popular group naked lesbian dance video which included bestiality during lunch hour. The people thought I was crazy for frowning about it and the woman also mocked me for my stance I despised them for their cowardly position, as I then hear them a year later talking about how strange nudists are[/color]. The general population do not have morals any more, you can show them anything, it is the spirit of things, they could be absolutely disgusted but the spirit of compromise prevails. Remember Lot how his soul was waxed great when he camped his tent outside Sodom and Gomorah? Well the righteous are waxed in soul and spirit by simply living in certain areas and it spread like a virus to other places. When I was younger I hardly ever got spiritual attack, hardly any bad sexual language , but now just about every day, because some people dare to be immoral like these pop stars and the rest compromise and think you should tough it out or some nonsense like that, there's a saying which says if you can't beat them, join them. I try my best to avoid this kind of stuff, but it always pops up, out of nowhere like that Tarantino film about Jews killing Hitler, so I greatly fear for todays and tomorrows men, I'm angry that this people has been robbed of their dignity, but God promised his kingdom come as it is in heaven, so more righteousness not less of it, more self control, dignity and contentment.

You said it very well. In the UK there are now MPs who want to lower the age of consent, and there have been politicians in Germany who have said that sex with children and animals should be legalized. Somebody said that when the law becomes this perverted, you are dealing with satanic law. This is where the church has greatly failed. Christianity today--more like pop Christianity--does indeed stick its head in the sand and doesn't like to deal with the dark stuff. Political correctness has taken over most churches and the churches just aren't standing up for the truth.

A tiny number of politicians may want to do those things, nearly all dont. Also your judgement of churches is very sweeping.  I havent been to a church such as you describe in well over 40 years. Many churches are very strong on moral values and such like, maybe you need to look around for a better church if that is your experience?

It will only be a matter of time before child abuse becomes the norm. Just a few decades ago abortion was illegal, now it's the norm. And I don't go to church. Too much hypocrisy and political correctness.

There are loads of good churches around, you just have to make the effort to try some. How many churches have you been to? THere will never be a perfect one, because its made up of imperfect people like you and I.  We are told not to stop meeting with other believers.

I don't agree that child abuse will become the norm. In my country the UK, children are far far more protected generally than they were 100 years ago, or even 50 years ago.

I also live in the UK and I do not believe children are more protected. Many schools now teach children the joys of anal sex. Children are being sexualized and child abuse is becoming more and more rampant, but remain in denial if it makes you feel better. Christians don't have to meet in church to gather together. Most churches are corrupt and politically correct, which is why I don't go to church.

No most churches churches arent corrupt and politically correct, there are countless good churches. We have at least 4 or 5 good and godly churches in my small town alone.How many churches have you actually tried going to?

  I have 3 children, 2 step children and a grandson, I think I know a fair amount about kids and schools.
100 years ago most children had a terrible time, working all hours in horrible jobs, little education, abuse was rife, no child protection at all, kids living in the most appalling poverty that we can not imagine today. Many died in childbirth or in early childhood from disease or were crippled by polio. In so many ways things have improved.

Sure, that's why we now have millions of abortions where millions of unborn children are murdered every year in the womb. That's why we have more and more underage sex and teenage pregnancies with a perverted sex education. That's why child prostitution has sky rocketed. Yes, children today are so protected.

Quote from: Red Baker on Mon Sep 22, 2014 - 05:29:10

Quote from: rmcbdd14 on Sat Sep 20, 2014 - 19:28:57In today's media, articles and multiple headlines have the same old topic sentence: Men will always cheat on their wives given the opportunity, because they are "wired" this way. They just can't help themselves. Even if they love their wives they will cheat on them in certain situations.

"In today's media, articles and multiple headlines"~What do except when that is where one believes what he believes.  I strongly disagree.  Neither men or women always cheat on their spouse given the opportunity to do so~Joseph did not, and most all do not.  I would believe that the number is much lower, specially with those who regularly attend worship services of any type, and very low for those closer to the truth. A godly person rules their spirit not to even allow the opportunity to sin;  they flee from all fleshly lust that wars against the new man.  Godly men and women remove themselves from any situation that may lend itself for them to sin against the God they love and fear.  Godly women dress in a way to keep their brothers, and men in general from lusting after them.  Godly men and women reject any advancing from strangers (which would be any person other than their spouses).  If you do not believe this is so, then you are worshiping in the wrong place.

QuoteEven if they love their wives they will cheat on them in certain situations.

Wrong.  People who commit adultery are in love with themselves more than their spouses.  True love would not do such things.   There are even some people who do not fear God, but do love their spouse more than they would want to hurt them by doing such things.

Men are commanded to love their wives, which means that we should never even think upon a maid!  Neither a virtuous women , or a wise man would give their give their spiritual strength unto fools. Proverbs 31

Godly men will rule their spirits against such temptations.  This does means that they cannot never be overcome, but, most will never fall for such temptations.

Quote Do most men cheat on their wife given the opportunity with a beautiful woman?

No.