Shared Household, Need Fair Split of Bills Help....

[EmmieCA83]

I just let my boyfriend move in with me. Mainly to help financially for both of us as single parents ( I have been a single parent 6 years, he has for 3 years)

I want to know what is a fair amount to make him pay for rent. I have a 3 bedroom apartment. I have two kids and he has one. His daughter and mine share a bedroom and my son has his own room.

My income is steady at $3200 a month gross (net $2400 as medical is $350, taxes, 401k, etc), and he works as a car salesman making a minimum of $1200 a month up too $7000 per month. Lately it has been on lower side due to slow sale of cars right now.

My Rent: $1127
Utilities: $300
Internet & Home Phone: $90
TOTAL: $1517 a month for our shared costs, all other bills is our own responsibility

Right now he is paying $250 and I am responsible for rest. Is this okay, since it is my apartment, not his and I have two kids full time, while he see's his daughter every other weekend. Please help on how I can make what we each owe fair. I am house poor, and he gets to eat out all the time at work and spend money on clothes, etc. I don't get that luxury. Help please!

Thanks!

[Lively Stone]

Let me get this straight. You have come to a Christian message board to get advice about the arrangement to be made regarding you and your boyfriend living together?

Do you really think we would actually give you the advice you are seeking?

Whether or not you know Jesus Christ as your Saviour or not, it is sin to co-habit with a man outside of marriage. You do harm to yourself and to your children to live outside of God's ways for families. If you need financial help in meeting your housing needs, then pray and ask the Lord for His help in deciding what to do rather than trying to find solutions on your own. It is obvious you are living above your means.

[chosenone]

Emmie are you a Christian? if you are, didn't you know that living together outside marriage is disobeying God? God makes it clear that sex outside marriage is a sin, and therefore you shouldnt be living with this man until you are married(if you get married).If he isn't a believer and you are, then it would be very unwise and in fact extremely foolish to marry him anyway.
I was a single mum for 6 years and I know its hard, but this isn't what God wants for you.

[RoninJedi]

I really don't think I can sum it up any better than Lively Stone and chosenone already have.  Essentially, you're asking how you can make living in sin "fair" on your wallet and his.  This is a terrible situation for all involved, especially the children.  This just sends the message that shacking up with someone is okay without being married, and - without trying to bash too harshly - messages like that will ruin your children's worldview.  This is a very foolish decision, and it needs to be undone.

I've never been a single mother, but I have been a single (separated) father for over a year not that long ago.  Yeah, it's the hardest job on the planet, but it's also one worth doing correctly.

[EmmieCA83]

Yes, of course I am Christian. I know living together outside of marriage is not what God wants. Just because I do, does not mean I am not Christian. I go to church and am very aware. I as a Christian do not judge people and being brought up in a private school and church every Sunday, was taught not to be so judgemental as well. I am actually a very great person, loving and kind to everyone. I don't agree with being judged for my decision to live with a man before marriage.

[RoninJedi]

Yes, of course I am Christian. I know living together outside of marriage is not what God wants. Just because I do, does not mean I am not Christian. I go to church and am very aware. I as a Christian do not judge people and being brought up in a private school and church every Sunday, was taught not to be so judgemental as well. I am actually a very great person, loving and kind to everyone. I don't agree with being judged for my decision to live with a man before marriage.

We are not judging you.  We are judging your decision, which is a foolish one.  You can't rationalize sin.  Period. 

Does that mean you don't agree with God judging you for decision to live with a man before marriage?  Because from your own mouth...well...fingertips..."I know living together outside of marriage is not what God wants."

Don't you realized we are judged by God for those things we do which He doesn't want?

[Lively Stone]

Yes, of course I am Christian. I know living together outside of marriage is not what God wants. Just because I do, does not mean I am not Christian. I go to church and am very aware. I as a Christian do not judge people and being brought up in a private school and church every Sunday, was taught not to be so judgemental as well. I am actually a very great person, loving and kind to everyone. I don't agree with being judged for my decision to live with a man before marriage.

A Christian would feel convicted about this sin, and not be at peace having chosen rebellion rather than God's way.

[fassopony]

We are not to judge unbelievers but we are to hold other "Christians" accountable.  You know what a fair split is and are looking for a place to gripe about how "unfair" it is.

Well, guess what, even a kept whore gets her expenses paid ;)  You only get $250, no respect, and what?  Some sex every so often?  What happens when he meets the girl he wants to marry?   It's certainly not you or he would have already asked.  Or some other girl he feels like banging, why wouldn't he, you are an easy lay, pay his way, he is not obligated to be monogamous just because you let him do whatever whenever, right?

This is harsh but I mean every word.  I used to have that life like you before Jesus, I know the score and I know the detriment you bring by living as you do.  Good luck with that.

Luke 6 46 "Why do you call me, 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do what I say? 47 As for everyone who comes to me and hears my words and puts them into practice, I will show you what they are like. 48 They are like a man building a house, who dug down deep and laid the foundation on rock. When a flood came, the torrent struck that house but could not shake it, because it was well built. 49 But the one who hears my words and does not put them into practice is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. The moment the torrent struck that house, it collapsed and its destruction was complete."

[chosenone]

Yes, of course I am Christian. I know living together outside of marriage is not what God wants. Just because I do, does not mean I am not Christian. I go to church and am very aware. I as a Christian do not judge people and being brought up in a private school and church every Sunday, was taught not to be so judgemental as well. I am actually a very great person, loving and kind to everyone. I don't agree with being judged for my decision to live with a man before marriage.

As fassopony says we are to hold each other accountable, and your pastor should be doing the same, or he is not doing his job.
Why would you know what Gods says but go completely against it? Is this guy even a Christian?  If he isnt then why are you with him?
Do you want to live in Gods blessing and protection? Or outside it? I am not sure what you expect us to say. If God says that something is wrong, and that we shouldnt do it, then He says that for a very good reason. Think about what example you setting your children on marriage and keeping sex in marriage.

[Alan]

As others have said, you should not be living with your B/F and you'll not likely find a Christian that will tell you it's okay and you can do things at your own pace.

I am very attracted to my G/F but I would not could not allow her to entice me to live with her, nor would I present the idea to her. We will be married when God puts us together. That said, it's not easy being celibate, but I believe God will reward me in the end 


As for your dilemma with sharing the expenses, the fact that he has not offered up his half (as a gentleman would) tells you something right there.

[chosenone]

As others have said, you should not be living with your B/F and you'll not likely find a Christian that will tell you it's okay and you can do things at your own pace.

I am very attracted to my G/F but I would not could not allow her to entice me to live with her, nor would I present the idea to her. We will be married when God puts us together. That said, it's not easy being celibate, but I believe God will reward me in the end 


As for your dilemma with sharing the expenses, the fact that he has not offered up his half (as a gentleman would) tells you something right there.

I have to agree with Alan, the amount he is paying is very small. Surely if you are living together as equal partners, he should be paying half of the bills. If you were married, then all the money is joint anyway.
PLease think again, this is not what God wants for you. God wants you to be with a godly Christian man who waits till marriage before he moves in with you. I fear this will end in tears.

[Nevertheless]

Aside from the real issue in the situation, which has already been pointed out to you, why would you question the agreement after allowing him to move in? Were you just so desperate to have him move in that you didn't think about the financial aspect ahead of time?

[HannahT]

Right now he is paying $250 and I am responsible for rest. Is this okay, since it is my apartment, not his and I have two kids full time, while he see's his daughter every other weekend. Please help on how I can make what we each owe fair. I am house poor, and he gets to eat out all the time at work and spend money on clothes, etc. I don't get that luxury. Help please!

It seems he is taking advantage of you personally.  Where else can he go and live for $250 a month plus perks?

If he can't make a commitment you may have your answer as to WHY he is a single parent at this point.  No responsible human being would move in with someone, and pay $250 a month and feel that is being responsible.

No offense, but now you have three children.

Find yourself a responsible female roommate, and share the bedroom with your daughter.  They basically will be renting a room, and they need to supply their own food.  Yes, they still owe you more than $250 dollars a month EVEN with their own food. 

He doesn't need a live in girlfriend - he needs a mommie!  Yikes!

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

Clearly it's not equitable.  $250 a month rent with utilities included?  Where can I get that deal?

[MyFathersGirl]

Okay I just saw this thread and have got to jump in here in defense od Emmie.  All she was doing was asking a simple question and you guys jumped down her throat without even having any real scriptural backing to do it. 

Everybody is saying that living with her boyfriend is a sin.  I did an online search and all the verses that are used to say it is a sin talk about sexual immority.  She never said that she was having sex with her boyfriend and I wouldn't  be one to judge eveb if she was.  A person can live with somebody and not habe sex with the other one.  I've known couples who have done exactly that. 

[Nevertheless]

Seriously, MFG? They share a bedroom.

And if you don't know that sex outside of marriage is a sin, then you need to do some more study. This time use a Bible instead of Google.

[FireSword]

Okay I just saw this thread and have got to jump in here in defense od Emmie.  All she was doing was asking a simple question and you guys jumped down her throat without even having any real scriptural backing to do it. 

Everybody is saying that living with her boyfriend is a sin.  I did an online search and all the verses that are used to say it is a sin talk about sexual immority.  She never said that she was having sex with her boyfriend and I wouldn't  be one to judge eveb if she was.  A person can live with somebody and not habe sex with the other one.  I've known couples who have done exactly that.

I agree, they pounced on her like a roaring lion. Half of these guys are probably divorced multiple times in any case.

[RoninJedi]

Okay I just saw this thread and have got to jump in here in defense od Emmie.  All she was doing was asking a simple question and you guys jumped down her throat without even having any real scriptural backing to do it. 

Everybody is saying that living with her boyfriend is a sin.  I did an online search and all the verses that are used to say it is a sin talk about sexual immority.  She never said that she was having sex with her boyfriend and I wouldn't  be one to judge eveb if she was.  A person can live with somebody and not habe sex with the other one.  I've known couples who have done exactly that.

I agree, they pounced on her like a roaring lion. Half of these guys are probably divorced multiple times in any case.

Just for the record - happily married here.  Never divorced.  Pushing a decade.  And have survived a marital hell I would not wish upon anyone.

"Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. " - Genesis 2:24 (ESV)

A man should leave his father and mother to be with his wife.  NOT his girlfriend.

"But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart." - Matthew 5:28 (ESV)

So, even assuming they're not sleeping together, I find it nearly impossible to believe living in the same house isn't causing lustful thoughts for the both of them which - as stated by Christ Himself in the verse above - is already committing adultery (fornication), which we obviously know is a sin.

So for those of you who try desperately to tell us we're wrong - get in your Bible and know what it says before you condemn our opinions.  What we have said stands solidly on the Word of God.

Thank you very much.  I'll be here all week.  Be sure to tip your waitress. 

[FireSword]

How is that helping the financial situation?
I think its hard to defeat multiple sins and easier to defeat one obstacle at a time.
Both of these single parents have already passed the point of no return, having kids n all.

[RoninJedi]

How is that helping the financial situation?
I think its hard to defeat multiple sins and easier to defeat one obstacle at a time.
Both of these single parents have already passed the point of no return, having kids n all.

I didn't say it did.  The financial situation has been addressed.  It's atrocious, and makes absolutely no sense.  But it was also what she agreed to.

However, in all seriousness I'm confused by your last statement.  When you say "passed the point of no return" - am I to take that to mean you believe there's no "fixing" their situation?

Not fishing for conflict.  Honestly confused and seeking clarification.  Thanks.

[MyFathersGirl]

Seriously, MFG? They share a bedroom.

And if you don't know that sex outside of marriage is a sin, then you need to do some more study. This time use a Bible instead of Google.

You know, it is possible to share a bedroom without having sex.  For all you know they have twin beds and even if they don't it is possible to cuddle and not have sex.  I also didn't say that sex outside of marriage isn't a sin, I know it is.  As far as using the Bible instead of Google it was Bible verses that were listed.  It's not like there isn't Bible tools available online to do a search in.   

[MyFathersGirl]

Runninjedi, as far as the verses that you quoted.

Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. " - Genesis 2:24 (ESV)

1.  Notice it says father and mother so you could also take that to mean it is a sin to get your own place before you are married which it clearly is not.
2.  "And they shall become one flesh"  again this verse is talking about sex.


"But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart." - Matthew 5:28 (ESV) 

It is possible to live with somebody and not think lustfully toward them.  There is a big difference between lust and love as I am beginning to learn since I've confused lust with love for awhile now.  You can think something like "She is beautiful" and that isn't a lustful thought.  A lustful thought would be something like "I want to bang her", big difference between the two.

It is this type of assuming that people know what is in their minds and the fear of being judged that keeps one of those couples I was  talking about from going to church.   

[Bitter Sweet]

Seriously, MFG? They share a bedroom.

And if you don't know that sex outside of marriage is a sin, then you need to do some more study. This time use a Bible instead of Google.

You know, it is possible to share a bedroom without having sex.  For all you know they have twin beds and even if they don't it is possible to cuddle and not have sex.  I also didn't say that sex outside of marriage isn't a sin, I know it is.  As far as using the Bible instead of Google it was Bible verses that were listed.  It's not like there isn't Bible tools available online to do a search in.   

It's really hard to imagine a man that isn't responsible enough to take care of his own family actually cares about the morality of this situation. He's clearly taking advantage of her, she's just telling us the part she wants us to hear.

You don't have to defend someone only giving us a quarter of the truth.

[Alan]

I think everyone's assumption here that this couple is engaged in intimacy is likely true since the OP stated it was her boyfriend, applying alternative reasoning is grasping at straws.


Trying to find scripture to justify a man and a woman cohabiting and sharing a bed without having sex is pedantic.....it's just wrong!!

[DaveW]

It is possible to live with somebody and not think lustfully toward them.  There is a big difference between lust and love as I am beginning to learn since I've confused lust with love for awhile now.  You can think something like "She is beautiful" and that isn't a lustful thought.  A lustful thought would be something like "I want to bang her", big difference between the two.

Possible - yes.  So is winning the Mega BaJillions Lotto 10 times in a row.  The odds may be about the same.

If they are NOT having sex, then they are both dealing with unfulfilled libidos. Just seeing the right kind of smile can trip you over into lust.  It is like having not eaten in days and your favorite meal is sitting on the table and you are not allowed to even taste it.  But you can smell it.  And believe me both sexual desire and self-release can dump a lot of pheromones into the air.

While it may be possible; it would be extremely difficult to be that close to someone and to keep your mind from "going there."

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

Just ask for an increase.  You should be able to ask for double the amount pretty easily without any danger of him moving out.  $500 / month utilities included is still a huge bargain in California.

Jarrod

[RoninJedi]

Runninjedi, as far as the verses that you quoted.

Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. " - Genesis 2:24 (ESV)

1.  Notice it says father and mother so you could also take that to mean it is a sin to get your own place before you are married which it clearly is not.
2.  "And they shall become one flesh"  again this verse is talking about sex.


"But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart." - Matthew 5:28 (ESV) 

It is possible to live with somebody and not think lustfully toward them.  There is a big difference between lust and love as I am beginning to learn since I've confused lust with love for awhile now.  You can think something like "She is beautiful" and that isn't a lustful thought.  A lustful thought would be something like "I want to bang her", big difference between the two.

It is this type of assuming that people know what is in their minds and the fear of being judged that keeps one of those couples I was  talking about from going to church.

You took my Genesis quote out of context.  It clearly says the word "wife".  That was my point.

And yes, it's possible that they're not having lustful thoughts, though highly unlikely - especially for men.  I know.  I am one.  Stopping lustful thoughts isn't something you can just stop overnight.  It took me years - literally - to train my mind to ignore the outer appearanc of women.

And your last statement (the one I bolded) is a fair enough statement, in all honesty.  However, it is also the justification of sin and situations which create the potential for sin (like this one), and the coddling with the "Well maybe they're not sinning, or maybe this, or maybe that - that keeps people from knowing the truth about what the Word says. 

And frankly, I'm of the mind that people in general need to develop a thicker sin.  Just because you're doing something wrong and I tell you so doesn't mean I'm judging you.  I'm judging your actions, and there's a big difference.  People need to dial back their sensitivity just a hair, and hear the message instead of just the words.

Think of it this way.  Let's just say that you're a recovering alcoholic, and I'm one of your close friends.  Say you've had just an unbearably bad day, and I can tell you're about 12 seconds away from literally tearing your hair out.  Say because of that, you ask me to get you a drink.

If I get you the drink - even though you're not doing anything wrong by having one drink - I have still created the temptation for it to turn to sin.

You sincerely think there's nothing wrong with that?

I think there definitely is.

[MyFathersGirl]

And yes, it's possible that they're not having lustful thoughts, though highly unlikely - especially for men.  I know.  I am one.  Stopping lustful thoughts isn't something you can just stop overnight.  It took me years - literally - to train my mind to ignore the outer appearanc of women.

And your last statement (the one I bolded) is a fair enough statement, in all honesty.  However, it is also the justification of sin and situations which create the potential for sin (like this one), and the coddling with the "Well maybe they're not sinning, or maybe this, or maybe that - that keeps people from knowing the truth about what the Word says. 

And frankly, I'm of the mind that people in general need to develop a thicker sin.  Just because you're doing something wrong and I tell you so doesn't mean I'm judging you.  I'm judging your actions, and there's a big difference.  People need to dial back their sensitivity just a hair, and hear the message instead of just the words.

Think of it this way.  Let's just say that you're a recovering alcoholic, and I'm one of your close friends.  Say you've had just an unbearably bad day, and I can tell you're about 12 seconds away from literally tearing your hair out.  Say because of that, you ask me to get you a drink.

If I get you the drink - even though you're not doing anything wrong by having one drink - I have still created the temptation for it to turn to sin.

You sincerely think there's nothing wrong with that?

I think there definitely is.

Good point about the addiction aspect and fleeing temptation.  Addiction is right up my alley because I have dealt with a gambling addiction and know how easily it is for something to drag you back in.   Like you said the one drink is okay but with an alcoholic it would turn in to 2 then 3 then 4 and so on. 

[RoninJedi]

And yes, it's possible that they're not having lustful thoughts, though highly unlikely - especially for men.  I know.  I am one.  Stopping lustful thoughts isn't something you can just stop overnight.  It took me years - literally - to train my mind to ignore the outer appearanc of women.

And your last statement (the one I bolded) is a fair enough statement, in all honesty.  However, it is also the justification of sin and situations which create the potential for sin (like this one), and the coddling with the "Well maybe they're not sinning, or maybe this, or maybe that - that keeps people from knowing the truth about what the Word says. 

And frankly, I'm of the mind that people in general need to develop a thicker sin.  Just because you're doing something wrong and I tell you so doesn't mean I'm judging you.  I'm judging your actions, and there's a big difference.  People need to dial back their sensitivity just a hair, and hear the message instead of just the words.

Think of it this way.  Let's just say that you're a recovering alcoholic, and I'm one of your close friends.  Say you've had just an unbearably bad day, and I can tell you're about 12 seconds away from literally tearing your hair out.  Say because of that, you ask me to get you a drink.

If I get you the drink - even though you're not doing anything wrong by having one drink - I have still created the temptation for it to turn to sin.

You sincerely think there's nothing wrong with that?

I think there definitely is.

Good point about the addiction aspect and fleeing temptation.  Addiction is right up my alley because I have dealt with a gambling addiction and know how easily it is for something to drag you back in.   Like you said the one drink is okay but with an alcoholic it would turn in to 2 then 3 then 4 and so on.

Exactly.  That was basically the point I was trying to make.  Apologies if I didn't explain properly.

[FireSword]

How is that helping the financial situation?
I think its hard to defeat multiple sins and easier to defeat one obstacle at a time.
Both of these single parents have already passed the point of no return, having kids n all.

I didn't say it did.  The financial situation has been addressed.  It's atrocious, and makes absolutely no sense.  But it was also what she agreed to.

However, in all seriousness I'm confused by your last statement.  When you say "passed the point of no return" - am I to take that to mean you believe there's no "fixing" their situation?

Not fishing for conflict.  Honestly confused and seeking clarification.  Thanks.

I mean they have already committed adultery, by having kids out of wedlock, so they have to make the most of the situation their in.

But I agree with your advice I think to live apart and find another woman, for the sake of the kids. When 2 kids share the same bedroom that results in a close bond, and they could be like familly after a while. It would be tough for the kids if they had to seperate after having lived together in the same flat and bedroom.

[chosenone]

How is that helping the financial situation?
I think its hard to defeat multiple sins and easier to defeat one obstacle at a time.
Both of these single parents have already passed the point of no return, having kids n all.

I didn't say it did.  The financial situation has been addressed.  It's atrocious, and makes absolutely no sense.  But it was also what she agreed to.

However, in all seriousness I'm confused by your last statement.  When you say "passed the point of no return" - am I to take that to mean you believe there's no "fixing" their situation?

Not fishing for conflict.  Honestly confused and seeking clarification.  Thanks.

I mean they have already committed adultery, by having kids out of wedlock, so they have to make the most of the situation their in.

But I agree with your advice I think to live apart and find another woman, for the sake of the kids. When 2 kids share the same bedroom that results in a close bond, and they could be like familly after a while. It would be tough for the kids if they had to seperate after having lived together in the same flat and bedroom.

So if they have had sex outside marriage its ok to carry on? So if a man cheats on his wife he may as well carry on? If a man murders one person he may as well carry on? There is such a thing as stopping sin and repenting.

[Jean74]

As long as they do not have sex outside of marriage it is ok. That is the key to it. As Emmie just needs some help. Give her the benefit of the doubt. What if the roles were reversed here? How would you like it if she jumped down your throat? Give her a break you all!

[Nevertheless]

A woman limps in the door dragging an obviously broken leg and asks for help deciding if she must wear a dress to church or if it's okay to wear pants. Shall we just give her the advice she asked for and wish her well, or "jump down her throat" convincing her to let us take her to a hospital to get her leg fixed?

[chosenone]

A woman limps in the door dragging an obviously broken leg and asks for help deciding if she must wear a dress to church or if it's okay to wear pants. Shall we just give her the advice she asked for and wish her well, or "jump down her throat" convincing her to let us take her to a hospital to get her leg fixed?

I agree totally.Does she want advise that will keep her outside Gods blessing? Or does she want advise that will ensure that she gets back on the right path? Sometimes straight talking is what is needed.