Grace-centered article: Is Your Church Worship more Pagan than Christian?

[SwordMaster]

This article appeared yesterday on Grace-Centered...

http://www.gracecentered.com/church-worship-pagan-or-christian.htm

The problem with the article is the author centers his criticism on "music"...worship is far more than music, it is magnifying and exalting God in words set to music. Because the premise of the article is wrong, he makes other wrong assumptions also.

The fact is, Scripture demonstrates that we enter into God's presence through worship and song, worship is a man's invitation to God to descend from on high and spend time with us where we are...worship in music and song is the highest form (next to obedience) of making love to God.

The author does not seem to know or understand these key facts.

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

Making love to God?  ::eyebrowraised::

[SwordMaster]

Making love to God?  ::eyebrowraised::

Yes, I always get the raised eyebrow when I use that term, but it is the best term that I can think of to describe worshiping God in song. From what I understand, that is the highest form of worship, followed by loving obedience.

Blessings!

[Nevertheless]

Why do you put song above obedience?

[SwordMaster]

Why do you put song above obedience?

Hello NTL!

I understand that serving God is done with our spirit also (Rom. 1:9), but worship in song is more personal and intimate. When we worship God in song (songs that HE considers worship, not always what we think is worship), His presence descends to meet with us for relationship. Because the whole purpose for our being here is to worship Him and enter into relationship with Him here and now, not just for the future consummation of all things.

That is the only reason.

Blessings!

[Nevertheless]

Hmmm..... That makes a great deal of sense from a human perspective, but I'm not sure that it fits God's priorities. I'm reminded of God's words to Saul (through Samuel) in 1 Samuel 15 -

Has the Lord as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices,
    as in obeying the voice of the Lord?
Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice,
    and to listen than the fat of rams.

And of our Lord's words in John 14:15 -

If you love me, you will keep my commandments

I believe He thinks obedience is the most important. Of course, it's not something to argue about, and I'm not insisting that you are wrong, simply expressing a different opinion. 

[SwordMaster]

Hmmm..... That makes a great deal of sense from a human perspective, but I'm not sure that it fits God's priorities. I'm reminded of God's words to Saul (through Samuel) in 1 Samuel 15 -

Has the Lord as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices,
    as in obeying the voice of the Lord?
Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice,
    and to listen than the fat of rams.

And of our Lord's words in John 14:15 -

If you love me, you will keep my commandments

I believe He thinks obedience is the most important. Of course, it's not something to argue about, and I'm not insisting that you are wrong, simply expressing a different opinion. 

I understand...and you may be right, there isn't a passage that supports my opinion, with the possible exception of two (IF one takes the word worship  mean worshiping in song)...

Luke 10:27
And he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself."
and...

John 4:23-24
23   But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.
24   God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth."

While obedience to God is important...people can be walking in obedience to Him and not really be loving on Him from the heart. When I worship God at home in song, and when we have some good worship songs in church (far and few in-between for my taste), I eventually begin to weep in His presence...I get the same feelings that I had when I first began courting my wife. Granted, we are not to go by our feelings...but I have never been in the presence of God and my feelings (emotions) not be stirred.

We do not enter the presence of God through obedience (that I have read or experienced)...we only enter into His presence one of two ways...prayer, or worship... predominantly worship...and that's what it's all about here today. God doesn't want to wait until we get to heaven to have an intimate relationship with us, He wants to have that with us now...today...and He wants us to experience that in this life.

thanks for your opinion...I enjoy conversing with you!

Blessings!

[Nevertheless]

I think we have a tendency to swing to one of two extremes regarding emotions. Either emotions become supreme - "If you don't feel it, it's not real" - or they are completely disregarded, usually in favor of knowledge - "It doesn't matter what it feels like, stick with the facts." As with most things, neither extreme is correct.