Creation scientists

[Amo]

If you have no faith in science, then why do you not simply jumped out of a tall building rather than taking the slow way of stairs or elevators?

You continue to intimate that anyone who "has faith in science" is devoid of the "real faith in God". You are wrong.

I am not attacking science at all, just science so called. Faith in the theory of evolution as the mechanism of our present existence is not science at all. Nor has it or can it be proved beyond a doubt as scientific fact, any more than YEC can. Even if it could be proved to be observed all around us, as some falsely claim it is, this would still not prove it as the mechanism of our present existence. As such could easily be by created design, as the ability of life to adapt and change most obviously is. Broken down to its simplest form, the argument here is largely about special creation in six days as scripture plainly states it, or deep time processes of evolutionary change unto ever greater complexity as the imaginations of men have determined. Science has nothing to do with one's choice regarding either of these faiths. Scientific evidences of what actually is and can now be observed, are presented by both sides as evidence, of their already chosen faith concerning either or. Each side interpreting the evidence according as their faith directs them.

[pppp]

Thank you readers for your replies.
Just wanted to share this with all the readers.

Can believers have faith in God & believe in Science at the same time?
Please allow me to humbly answer this question.

It's not that people can't believe in God & study Science at the same time.
But its easy to believe in both when the answers to the issues concerned are similar.

But when the answers are differing, (as in the cases of Evolution & the Creation of the earth),
then the believer should know whom to believe in?
Whether in Scripture or Science?
Science appears like authority because it gives numerous complex formulae, explanations & theories & laws based on experiments.

Whereas The Holy Bible may not directly give laws & theories,
but the verses mentioned clearly state & explain that God is perfect & knows what He does.

Science is very interesting but reverence is for Father God & Scripture.
In the cases of Evolution & the Creation of the earth,
Scripture & science have conflicting viewpoints.
So how can people believe  two contradictory things at the same time???
God has given a free will to everyone,
so people can choose what explanation fits their questions, but for those
who trust God more, will eventually believe in God.
Because God is trustworthy, wise & supreme.


Does science believe in Resurrection of Christ??
Can science explain about the resurrection of Christ???
Does science believe in the miracles & supernatural happenings given in the Bible & in every era??
Will science believe that Prophet Elijah went up in Heaven in a Chariot of fire (2 Kings 2).
Can Science bring back to life, a person who has passed away??

But Father God can do the impossible.
He is outside of time & space.
And so when a Perfect God can bring back Christ to life (Resurrection), perform miracles & supernatural happenings,
so God can also make a perfect world.
Which He has made.
So, when there are contradictory statements reg., evolution & the creation of the earth,
its up to every believer to either believe in Father God or science.
But believers should believe in Father God as He is perfect,
Amen.

Deuteronomy 32:4 : "He is the Rock, his works are perfect, and all his ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is he."

Psalm 19:7 says: "The law of the Lord is perfect, refreshing  the soul. The statutes of the Lord are trustworthy, making wise the simple."

"As for God, his way is perfect: The Lord's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him" Psalm 18:30

[Amo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j49ir8Ey00

A perfect example of deep time evolutionary faith in action, presented as scientific fact, concerning a great amount of detail regarding what was taking place 90,000,000 years ago. Based upon evidence buried deep under the ocean floor, containing all kinds of things evolutionary scientists tell us can last apparently for 90,000,000 years buried under the intense pressures of countless tons of water and ocean floor. You know, kind of like dinosaur soft tissues and stuff, lasting for millions and millions of years.

Stories created in the minds and imaginations of men, concerning the unobservable and knowable events which occurred countless millions of years ago, which left these things behind. This as opposed to accounts of Holy Scripture telling a very different story about how these things came to be, thousands of years ago. Which others take it by faith, is the truth given to us by the prophets of God. Who also do not believe at all, that such evidences would still exist after countless millions of years. If they were, it would most certainly be due to catastrophic rapid burial processes of preservation, as buried fossils and other evidences are observed all over the world. Just how long such evidence would actually last, we do not know. Apparently opinions concerning such vary greatly.

[4WD]

Thank you readers for your replies.
Just wanted to share this with all the readers.

Can believers have faith in God & believe in Science at the same time?
Please allow me to humbly answer this question.

I didn't see your answer.

[4WD]

Does science believe in Resurrection of Christ??
Can science explain about the resurrection of Christ???
Does science believe in the miracles & supernatural happenings given in the Bible & in every era??
Will science believe that Prophet Elijah went up in Heaven in a Chariot of fire (2 Kings 2).

Those are not rational questions. Science is not a conscious being to either believe or not believe.  Science is a field of study.

You might ask the question, "Do scientists believe in the resurrection of Christ?"  The answer is some do, some do not.  But that has nothing to do with science per se.

You could also ask the question, "Do theologians believe in the resurrection of Christ?"  The answer is the same as for scientists.  Some do, some do not. 

[The Barbarian]

Does science believe in Resurrection of Christ?? Can science explain about the resurrection of Christ??? Does science believe in the miracles & supernatural happenings given in the Bible & in every era??
Will science believe that Prophet Elijah went up in Heaven in a Chariot of fire (2 Kings 2).

Science is too weak a method to assess the supernatural.  No, science can't do that.  But scientists can.

You might as well criticize plumbers because plumbing can't explain the resurrection.   Plumbing can't assess the supernatural.

But plumbers can.


 

[pppp]

Thank you 4WD for your replies.
The Question ...
Can believers have faith in God & believe in Science at the same time?
That's exactly what I had written about earlier.
Science is a different field of study & Scripture is The Word of God.
Believers can believe in both Scripture & Science,
but only up to a certain point.
As long as both science & Scripture have similar view points,
so its easy to believe in both,

but when there are views which are contradictory,
then a believer has to choose ....Will the believer, trust science or Scripture?
Again, the question arises ...Will a believer trust in what is seen or what is unseen?
Usually some people will trust, what they see.
But again the question arises ...what is the source behind what is seen or unseen?

 And then another question ...Will a person consider Scripture above Science or vice versa?
The answer to these questions arises in the word ... 'TRUST''
If a person will trust Science more, then he will believe more in it.
Wheareas if a believer will trust God more, then he will trust  Scripture more.
Just like in both the cases of how old the earth is & evolution.
The believer has two options,
either to choose between science or Scripture.

Scientists have been giving many theories which support evolution & how old the earth is & then other scientists have been contradicting them.
Whereas God is perfect, He is all knowing, so why would He contradict Himself.
He knows for certain what He does & so is sure of His works.
So anyone who respects & trusts God, will believe Scripture more than science.
For we live by faith, not by sight.
2 Corinthians 5:7

But blessed is the one who trusts in the Lord,
whose confidence is in him....
Jeremiah 17:7-8

Whoever gives heed to instruction prospers,
and blessed is the one who trusts in the Lord.
Proverbs 16:20


Scripture teaches believers about Elijah praying & calling down fire from the Heaven (1 Kings 18).
But since God was supporting Elijah, believers will believe & trust in the miracle of Elijah.
So what was seen, was supported by God.
So, the source that was God, was reliable & trustworthy.
And even if anything is unseen, if the source is God,
all those who trust in God will believe in it.
Like HOPE, MERCY, COMPASSION & the KINDNESS of God.
These can't be seen but they have been given by God,
so believers trust in them.

2 Corinthians 4:18
"So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen, since what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal."

Similarly, it has been seen that those who pray to Christ & take medicines healed faster than those who simply took medicines.
Then there are those people who could not be cured even with the best treatment, but when they prayed to God or Saints  or went to places where miracles performed by god take place, they were healed.
But science has no answer to this.

That is why generally, believers can believe in both science & Scripture at the same time.
But when there are contradictory views,
then those who have reverence for God should trust God more than science.
Because God is a God who is trustworthy, reliable, all knowing & supreme & can perform even what might seem impossible to others.

God made the earth & its inhabitants.
He made the sun & the moon,
the skies & the oceans.
And He has supreme control over them.
That is why in Heaven, His light will replace the sun & the moon.
And there will be no oceans.
This shows how perfectly God can create everything.

Science is interesting & gives valuable information about medicines, cures etc., but it is God who is truly supreme,
Amen.

[pppp]

Thank you The Barbarian for your reply.
As I wrote earlier, in  my posts, that science is interesting giving good information on cures, medicines, etc.,
but nothing & absolutely nothing can be greater than God.
God, His Word, His Miracles,
the graces which He bestowed on His Chosen,
through which they performed spectacular miracles & healings,
can't be replicated by anyone without the power of God, Christ, & The Holy Spirit,
Amen.
Thus proving that God & only God is the supreme creator & for believers, He is the True Living God,
Amen.

[The Barbarian]

A perfect example of deep time evolutionary faith in action, presented as scientific fact, concerning a great amount of detail regarding what was taking place 90,000,000 years ago. Based upon evidence buried deep under the ocean floor, containing all kinds of things evolutionary scientists tell us can last apparently for 90,000,000 years buried under the intense pressures of countless tons of water and ocean floor. You know, kind of like dinosaur soft tissues and stuff, lasting for millions and millions of years.

Physical chemists say that's the case for organic molecules. No one has ever found tissue that old.   Perhaps you don't know what "tissue" means in biology.   What do you think it means?

Stories created in the minds and imaginations of men, concerning the unobservable and knowable events which occurred countless millions of years ago, which left these things behind. This as opposed to accounts of Holy Scripture telling a very different story about how these things came to be, thousands of years ago.

Here, you've confused your interpretation of God's word with His actual word.

[Amo]

Physical chemists say that's the case for organic molecules. No one has ever found tissue that old.  Perhaps you don't know what "tissue" means in biology.  What do you think it means?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_dinosaur_specimens_with_preserved_soft_tissue

List of dinosaur specimens with preserved soft tissue

https://www.history.com/articles/scientists-find-soft-tissue-in-75-million-year-old-dinosaur-bones

Scientists Find Soft Tissue in 75-Million-Year-Old Dinosaur Bones

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/dinosaur-soft-tissue-recovered-eight-cretaceous-era-fossils-180955538/

Dinosaur Soft Tissue Recovered From Eight Cretaceous-Era Fossils

https://iknowdino.com/breaking-down-beyond-bones-soft-tissues-in-dinosaurs/

Breaking Down Beyond Bones: Soft Tissues in Dinosaurs

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/traces-dino-blood-soft-tissue-found-even-junk-bones

Traces of dino blood, soft tissue found even in junk bones

https://www.theverge.com/2015/6/9/8751897/dinosaur-cells-tissue-bones-75-million-years-old

Soft tissue found in 75 million-year-old dinosaur bones is a big deal for paleontology

https://dstri.org

Dedicated to locating and identifying dinosaur soft tissues from around the globe.

https://www.discovermagazine.com/dinosaur-soft-tissue-found-in-the-strangest-place-17728

Dinosaur Soft Tissue Found in the Strangest Place

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REJk9cuXG98

Scientists Find SOFT, STRETCHY TISSUE In Dinosaur Bones!

https://crev.info/2025/01/dinosaur-original-collagen-confirmed/

Dinosaur Original Collagen Confirmed

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/dear-mummy-rare-fossil-reveals-common-dinosaurs-soft-tissue

Dear Mummy: Rare fossil reveals common dinosaur's soft tissue

https://www.snexplores.org/article/more-dinosaur-bones-yield-traces-blood-soft-tissue

More dinosaur bones yield traces of blood, soft tissue

https://www.cnn.com/2017/02/03/world/dinosaur-rib-195-million-year-old-collagen-history/

Ancient tissue found in 195 million-year-old dinosaur rib

https://www.discoverwildlife.com/dinosaurs/plesiosaur-scales

Prehistoric soft tissue from a 183-million-year-old dinosaur reveals what it really looked like - shocking scientists

I could of course go on and on.

[Amo]

Here, you've confused your interpretation of God's word with His actual word.

At least I can easily give or share my "interpretation" of what Holy Scripture plainly and exactly states. I've been waiting for any Christian evolutionist to do so for many years now. Including yourself, as I have asked for your and others on these boards, simple explanation of your interpretation. Some have tried to send me to other internet sites for someone else's explanation of their interpretation. Why can't or won't you simply state it here for us? Quote the scripture, and explain how it means what you believe. Shouldn't be that difficult.

[The Barbarian]

List of dinosaur specimens with preserved soft tissue

Wikipedia has confused organic matter with tissue.

Tissue is a group of cells organized to do a function.
What is tissue in the body? The body tissue is an aggregation of cells that function together and have a similar function.
https://www.biologyonline.com/dictionary/tissue

  Your links don't even have cells.   They just have bits of organic matter, which organic and physical chemists have shown to be able to last for millions of years under specific conditions.

I could of course go on and on.

Being wrong a lot isn't much difference than being wrong once.  It's not surprising; the term is very specific in biology, and if you weren't paying attention in high school, you probably missed it.  If you're skeptical, pick one of the links above, and I'll pull it up and show you.

[The Barbarian]

At least I can easily give or share my "interpretation" of what Holy Scripture plainly and exactly states.

If it was plain, the vast majority of Christians would agree on it.  But there is wide disagreement on those verses.   And you surely know that your personal interpretation is not the most common one among Christians.

I've been waiting for any Christian evolutionist to do so for many years now. Including yourself, as I have asked for your and others on these boards, simple explanation of your interpretation.

Several people have done just that over the years.  My interpretation?   Adam and Eve were real individuals who were the first humans to have been given living souls directly by God.   Since verses indicate that there were other humans around in the time of Adam (otherwise who would Cain be afraid of, and who would populate an entire city he built?)