Gluttony

[BrianInChrist]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

[Jaime]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

I'm short on time, but the body is the temple of the Lord. Over-eating is abuse of the temple. By necessary inference anyway.

In my pea-brain, overeating is consuming way more than your body needs to maintain itself.
BtW, being obese is not necessarily a result of over-eating.

[Chrestian]

Now you've quit preaching and gone to meddlin'.

C.

[BrianInChrist]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

I'm short on time, but the body is the temple of the Lord. Over-eating is abuse of the temple. By necessary inference anyway.

This seems to be long on common sense but short on Scripture.  I would make the argument that putting anything ahead of God is idolatry, so in that sense (relying on food to meet needs instead of God), gluttony could be a form of idolatry.  For example, going to Häagen-Dazs when you are lonely or heart broken would be gluttony, using this definition.

[Chrestian]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

I'm short on time, but the body is the temple of the Lord. Over-eating is abuse of the temple. By necessary inference anyway.

This seems to be long on common sense but short on Scripture.  I would make the argument that putting anything ahead of God is idolatry, so in that sense (relying on food to meet needs instead of God), gluttony could be a form of idolatry.  For example, going to Häagen-Dazs when you are lonely or heart broken would be gluttony, using this definition.

I think that definition is flawed. God gave us food to enjoy as well as to nourish our bodies. Being comforted by food is not necessarily anymore wrong than being comforted by doing any activity that brings you joy when you are feeling blue. Replacing God with food is another matter altogether.

C.

[Jaime]

Food is no more a sin than good wine. However the abuse of both is. (or is that both are?) and equally so, by necessary inference of course.

Most every elder and deacon selection questionaire have a question about alcohol use. My opinion equal time should be given to the abuse of food on the questionaires.

To me there is nothing more hypocritical than to see an overweight preacher with a 55 inch waist railing away from the pulpit on the evils of alcohol.

[Harold]

Being over weight can cause major health issues.

FTL

[johnnyQ]

There's not much in the Bible and I wondered how Gluttony got on the list of the 7 deadly sins.

The 7 Deadly Sins:  I found this information on deadlysins.com:

According to Sacred Origins of Profound Things, by Charles Panati, Greek monastic theologian Evagrius of Pontus first drew up a list of eight offenses and wicked human passions:. They were, in order of increasing seriousness: gluttony, lust, avarice, sadness, anger, acedia, vainglory, and pride. Evagrius saw the escalating severity as representing increasing fixation with the self, with pride as the most egregious of the sins. Acedia (from the Greek "akedia," or "not to care") denoted "spiritual sloth."

In the late 6th century, Pope Gregory the Great reduced the list to seven items, folding vainglory into pride, acedia into sadness, and adding envy. His ranking of the Sins' seriousness was based on the degree from which they offended against love. It was, from most serious to least: pride, envy, anger, sadness, avarice, gluttony, and lust. Later theologians, including St. Thomas Aquinas, would contradict the notion that the seriousness of the sins could be ranked in this way. The term "covetousness" has historically been used interchangeably with "avarice" in accounts of the Deadly Sins. In the seventeenth century, the Church replaced the vague sin of "sadness" with sloth.

I found this information on bible-topics.com:

Gluttony


Christ was falsely accused of.

Matthew 11:19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.

The wicked addicted to.

Philippians 3:19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

LEADS TO

Carnal security.

Isaiah 22:13 And behold joy and gladness, slaying oxen, and killing sheep, eating flesh, and drinking wine: let us eat and drink; for to morrow we shall die.
1 Corinthians 15:32 If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.
Luke 12:19 And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry.

Poverty.

Proverbs 23:21 For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags.

Of princes, ruinous to their people.

Ecclesiastes 10:16-17 Woe to thee, O land, when thy king is a child, and thy princes eat in the morning! Blessed art thou, O land, when thy king is the son of nobles, and thy princes eat in due season, for strength, and not for drunkenness!

Is inconsistent in saints.

1 Peter 4:3 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:

Caution against.

Proverbs 23:2-3 And put a knife to thy throat, if thou be a man given to appetite. Be not desirous of his dainties: for they are deceitful meat.

Pray against temptations to.

Psalms 141:4 Incline not my heart to any evil thing, to practise wicked works with men that work iniquity: and let me not eat of their dainties.

Punishment of.

Numbers 11:33-34 And while the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the wrath of the LORD was kindled against the people, and the LORD smote the people with a very great plague. And he called the name of that place Kibrothhattaavah: because there they buried the people that lusted.

Danger of, illustrated.

Luke 12:45-46 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.

Exemplified.

Esau,
Genesis 25:30-34 And Esau said to Jacob, Feed me, I pray thee, with that same red pottage; for I am faint: therefore was his name called Edom. And Jacob said, Sell me this day thy birthright. And Esau said, Behold, I am at the point to die: and what profit shall this birthright do to me? And Jacob said, Swear to me this day; and he sware unto him: and he sold his birthright unto Jacob. Then Jacob gave Esau bread and pottage of lentiles; and he did eat and drink, and rose up, and went his way: thus Esau despised his birthright. ...
Hebrews 12:16-17 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright. For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

Israel,
Numbers 11:4 And the mixt multitude that was among them fell a lusting: and the children of Israel also wept again, and said, Who shall give us flesh to eat?
Psalms 78:18 And they tempted God in their heart by asking meat for their lust.

Sons of Eli,
1 Samuel 2:12-17 Now the sons of Eli were sons of Belial; they knew not the LORD. And the priests' custom with the people was, that, when any man offered sacrifice, the priest's servant came, while the flesh was in seething, with a fleshhook of three teeth in his hand; And he struck it into the pan, or kettle, or caldron, or pot; all that the fleshhook brought up the priest took for himself. So they did in Shiloh unto all the Israelites that came thither. Also before they burnt the fat, the priest's servant came, and said to the man that sacrificed, Give flesh to roast for the priest; for he will not have sodden flesh of thee, but raw. And if any man said unto him, Let them not fail to burn the fat presently, and then take as much as thy soul desireth; then he would answer him, Nay; but thou shalt give it me now: and if not, I will take it by force. ...

Belshazzar,
Daniel 5:1 Belshazzar the king made a great feast to a thousand of his lords, and drank wine before the thousand.

Nice call Brian.  I guess I have always assumed it was well documented in the Bible, but obviously not.

jq

[Chrestian]

Good post.

Nice research.

C.

[BrianInChrist]

Food is no more a sin than good wine. However the abuse of both is. (or is that both are?) and equally so, by necessary inference of course.

Most every elder and deacon selection questionaire have a question about alcohol use. My opinion equal time should be given to the abuse of food on the questionaires.

To me there is nothing more hypocritical than to see an overweight preacher with a 55 inch waist railing away from the pulpit on the evils of alcohol.

Jamie,

I can't find any Scripture which condemns 55 inch waistlines.

[BrianInChrist]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

I'm short on time, but the body is the temple of the Lord. Over-eating is abuse of the temple. By necessary inference anyway.

This seems to be long on common sense but short on Scripture.  I would make the argument that putting anything ahead of God is idolatry, so in that sense (relying on food to meet needs instead of God), gluttony could be a form of idolatry.  For example, going to Häagen-Dazs when you are lonely or heart broken would be gluttony, using this definition.

I think that definition is flawed. God gave us food to enjoy as well as to nourish our bodies. Being comforted by food is not necessarily anymore wrong than being comforted by doing any activity that brings you joy when you are feeling blue. Replacing God with food is another matter altogether.

C.

When you turn to Häagen-Dazs instead of the Lord, I think you are replacing God with food.  There is another way that we could define gluttony, as well:  hoarding food (not necessarily eating lots of it) to be self-sufficient and live at ease, instead of sharing the food that God has given to you in abundance with those who have nothing to eat.

[phoebe]

Also, Eze 16:49 - "Sodom's sins were pride, laziness, and gluttony, while the poor and needy suffered outside her door."

The reason it was a sin was that it was self-centered and neglected the needs of others.

I believe gluttony most definitely falls under the category of "idol", which, IMO, is much, much broader than the graven image, but anything that is more important than God or following His will.

[Jaime]

Food is no more a sin than good wine. However the abuse of both is. (or is that both are?) and equally so, by necessary inference of course.

Most every elder and deacon selection questionaire have a question about alcohol use. My opinion equal time should be given to the abuse of food on the questionaires.

To me there is nothing more hypocritical than to see an overweight preacher with a 55 inch waist railing away from the pulpit on the evils of alcohol.

Jamie,

I can't find any Scripture which condemns 55 inch waistlines.

There isn't any! My point was he would have no place to condemn a sin that is at least as bad as the sin of gluttony (eating more than your body needs for whatever reason.) A sin I openly admit to, and constantly try to repent of. 

[BrianInChrist]

I'm not following you.  What sin would that be?

[Jaime]

If

I'm not following you.  What sin would that be?

If a preacher who has a problem with gluttony gets up and rails righteously against the sin of alcohol then his credibility would suffer is all i'm saying. We just need to call sin what it is and not ignore the ones that we are guilty of in order to gore someone elses ox.

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

You are apparently equating having a 55 inch waistline with the sin of gluttony.  I don't see that equation in Scripture.

[l.a.providence]

Excellent post!!!

i gained 45 pounds as a result of a drug i started taking in '99....

i'm not obese but need to lose that 45 pounds....i was pretty thin before...

now, that could be a different case, but i don't think so....
still, that 45 pounds is unhealthy for me....

thanks for the post:  i have a new perspective and will try to lose a few...!!

Jesus couldn't have been obese..... it would have been a matter that his disciples could have scoffed at or straightened him out on the matter.... he wouldn't have been perfect then.....

[Jaime]

Jamie,

You are apparently equating having a 55 inch waistline with the sin of gluttony.  I don't see that equation in Scripture.

Sorry Brian, I am not trying to make this difficult. My hypothetical example of a 55 inch waistline is irrevelant to anything. Again, the point is it doesn' t make sense to get in the pulpit and pick on other peoples splinters in their eyes, when one has an obvious oak beam in his eye or under his belt. 

PS on a previous post I said not all fat people are gluttons, but it is a good indication. I am fat, and I am a glutton. I have a 42 inch waste and I deal with the sin of overeating. I am 70 to 100 pounds overweight depending on which doctor you talk to. MY sin is gluttony, a person with a 60 inch waste may not be a glutton.

[BrianInChrist]

What oak beam under his belt are you referring to?  It would help if you would name the sin that you are referring to.

[Jaime]

Brian I am talking about the sin of gluttony vs the sin of alcohol (or the abuse thereof). If that don't get it for you, I can't help you.

Obviously oak beam refers to his gluttony. (again a hypothetical example, please remember)

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

Why do you believe that the preacher with the 55 inch waist is guilty of glutony?

[yogi bear]

Brian.
That was a given example and did not mean it was set in stone but as for an example it was used to compair a view. Why do you always make everything into an argument?

[BrianInChrist]

bvaug,

Here is how I understand the example that Jamie is providing:

The preacher had a 55inch waist.  He was clearly overeating.  Overeating is the sin of gluttony, so the preacher is guilty of the sin of gluttony.

The reason that I started this thread was to think about whether or not the sin of gluttony is simply overeating.  So I'm asking questions that I hope will lead to that discussion.

[Jaime]

Jamie,

Why do you believe that the preacher with the 55 inch waist is guilty of glutony?

He doesn't exist Brian. I was making a point. I have seen examples of this in real life. I know a  huge man who believes he is pure as the driven snow because he doesn't drink alcohol, but he has no qualms about sitting down and gorging himself at a church dinner until he practically passes out, and is comfortable with his righteous view of himself. I simply believe in this particular real life case (no more hypotheticals) this man is deluding himself.

I struggle with his sin of overeating, no doubt. I just don't pretend that abusing alcohol is somehow worse. Both are equal.

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

Did you read my post to bvaug?

[BrianInChrist]

Why do you always make everything into an argument?

BTW, it is a selection effect.  When I agree with someone, I usually post something like .  There isn't a need for me to make extended comments when I agree with them.

[Jaime]

Jamie,

Did you read my post to bvaug?

I did after I posted.

Maybe this will clarify my position:

IMO, all overeating is gluttony, but not all gluttony is due to overeating. A person can be a sex glutton I guess. Someone might be a shopping glutton, someone might be a glutton for punishment..............no, nevermind. That's what my mother used to say about me.



Sorry for being snippy before!

Jaime

PS, and for God's sake everyone please note that I am not saying that all obesity is due to gluttony.

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

No problem.  I've been snippy before, too.

Is it just your opinion that overeating is gluttony?

[Jaime]

Jamie,

No problem.  I've been snippy before, too.

Is it just your opinion that overeating is gluttony?

Is it your opinion that overeating is not gluttony? If it's not gluttony, what is it?

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

I've given a couple of different ideas of what gluttony can be in this thread:  a special case of idolatry and a special case of greed.

[Jaime]

Jamie,

I've given a couple of different ideas of what gluttony can be in this thread:  a special case of idolatry and a special case of greed.

Exactly, those are the 2 main reasons for overeating I would say.

So overeating is not a sin in your opinion?

If it is not a sin, would you agree that it is at least a bad idea, and a possible stumbling block for a weaker brother or sister?

[Jimbob]

The traditional meaning of gluttony is overeating.  Where in Scripture is overeating forbidden?  And what does God mean by overeating?

I'm short on time, but the body is the temple of the Lord. Over-eating is abuse of the temple. By necessary inference anyway.

In my pea-brain, overeating is consuming way more than your body needs to maintain itself.
BtW, being obese is not necessarily a result of over-eating.

Now you done gone and hit my soapbox button, Jaime.  Read 1st Cor. 6 and tell me why you think it applies and makes overeating is sexual sin.

[BrianInChrist]

Jamie,

I've given a couple of different ideas of what gluttony can be in this thread:  a special case of idolatry and a special case of greed.

Exactly, those are the 2 main reasons for overeating I would say.

So overeating is not a sin in your opinion?

If it is not a sin, would you agree that it is at least a bad idea, and a possible stumbling block for a weaker brother or sister?

Jamie,

Those are not the only reasons why someone might overeat.  For example, someone might overeat because they still feel physical hunger after they have already consumed what their body requires.

[Bon Voyage]

Jamie,

I've given a couple of different ideas of what gluttony can be in this thread:  a special case of idolatry and a special case of greed.

Exactly, those are the 2 main reasons for overeating I would say.

So overeating is not a sin in your opinion?

If it is not a sin, would you agree that it is at least a bad idea, and a possible stumbling block for a weaker brother or sister?

Jamie,

Those are not the only reasons why someone might overeat.  For example, someone might overeat because they still feel physical hunger after they have already consumed what their body requires.

There are many reasons.  However, if you take away exceptions, and focus on the marority:

Most of us Americans just eat too much.

[Jimbob]

Yup.  That I'll agree with.  And you didn't even have to stretch Scripture to say it.